Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

I know a lot of people don't like Tom Friedman but this

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Editorials & Other Articles Donate to DU
 
MISSDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-03-05 02:56 PM
Original message
I know a lot of people don't like Tom Friedman but this
piece is good and I believe that I agree with him.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/03/opinion/03friedman.html?hp
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
papau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-03-05 04:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. Given the Food ration incentive I suspect he is reading more into
the vote than is there.

But no matter - there is still a lot there - and I agree with him that it was good to see the vote came off quite well with only 35 dead.

But what has really changed?

Are we now going to let the Iraqi folks choose their theocratic government - I don't think so.

Can the new Iraq gov go negative on Israel? - I don't think so.

So what was elected? - Just the folks that are to rubber stamp the federation of states plan the US has for Iraq.

Sorry, Tom.

Our being in Iraq is still wrong, no matter how nice it is to see Saddam out of power.

And we do not seem about to right that error until corporate america has cashed all its welfare checks from Bush. Daddy Bush and his Carlye Group needs the checks to send to their hidden overseas corps where our rich hide their money.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-03-05 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. The "food ration" incentive is a possibility. But unproven. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-03-05 04:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. Concurring in part and dissenting in part
From The New York Times
Dated Thursday February 3

A Day to Remember
By Thomas Friedman

As someone who believed, hoped, worried, prayed, worried, hoped and prayed some more that Iraqis could one day pull off the election they did, I am unreservedly happy about the outcome - and you should be, too.

Why? Because what threatens America most from the Middle East are the pathologies of a region where there is too little freedom and too many young people who aren't able to achieve their full potential. The only way to cure these pathologies is with a war of ideas within the Arab-Muslim world so those with bad ideas can be defeated by those with progressive ones.

We can't fight that war. Only the Arab progressives can - only they can tell the suicide bombers that what they are doing is shameful to Islam and to Arabs. But we can collaborate with them to create a space in the heart of their world where decent people have a chance to fight this war - and that is what American and British soldiers have been doing in Iraq.

President Bush's basic gut instinct about the need to do this is exactly right. His thinking that this could be done on the cheap, though, with little postwar planning, was exactly wrong. Partly as a result, this great moment has already cost America over $100 billion and 10,000 killed and wounded.

Read more.

I've done my share of raking Friedman over the coals on these forums in the last couple of years. His pieces leading up to the invasion were, I thought, deluded with the idea the Mr. Bush and his neoconservative aides were motivated by noble ideals of spreading freedom and democracy to Iraq, when, in fact, they are just a bunch of colonial pirates.

In an election where so many people were threatened by nihilists with death for voting, it is heartening to see so many went to the polls. Calling Zarqawi "Charles Manson with a turban" is only a slight exaggeration. That does not excuse the shortcomings of an election being held under a foreign occupation, under conditions where candidates did not campaingn in public their very names were often not listed due to security concerns, and with a significant number of people not voting because they felt they had nothing for which to vote.

Friedman is right that only Arab progressives can fight the war that needs to be fought. He is wrong about Mr. Bush's "instincts". Bush wants American troops to remain in Iraq and enforce a colonial arrangement in which Iraq's wealth will be sent, in liquid form, to New York City and Houston. In spite of the noble rhetoric in which Bush cloaks his war, it was nothing more than gunboat diplomacy with Cruise missiles.

Democracy was not on the ballot in Iraq on Sunday. The main choices were a slate of candidates running under the auspices of Ayatollah Sistani which seems to want to turn Iraq into Iran-lite and a slate of candidates headed by Iyad Allawi, the Iraqi quisling who remains in power with the support of foreign troops and would do little more than legitimize the colonial occupation of his own nation. Neither or these slates can be said to embody democratic principles.

What was on the ballot was a referndum on Mr. Bush's occupation of Iraq. In that, a vote for Sistani's slate was a vote against Bush and a vote for Allawi's was a vote for it. To almost no one's surprise, the preliminary reposts indicate that Sistani's slate has about a 3:1 lead over Allawi's.

Regrettably, the Iraqi people could not vote for democracy last Sunday. But they could vote for sovereignty -- freedom from neoconservative occupation. That, it appears, is what they have done.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Cocoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-03-05 04:56 PM
Response to Original message
3. a typical Friedman column
tells us once again that this war is good, and that Bush's intentions are as pure as Bush tells us they are.

Throws in a little Zarqawi demonization for good measure.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Martin Eden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-03-05 08:19 PM
Response to Original message
5. Friedman is blind
The following sentence, in my opinion, demonstrates his blindness.

"President Bush's basic gut instinct about the need to do this is exactly right."

Friedman then states that Bush was "exactly wrong" in thinking this could be done "on the cheap" with little planning, but the main point is that Friedman believes the motives were honorable and that "this" needed to be done.

What Friedman fails to see is exactly what "this" is.

He would have us believe what the Bush propaganda machine wants us to believe -- that oil, military domination, and corporate greed had absolutely nothing to do with "this" war that was sold to the American public with demonstrable lies regarding a nonexistent threat.

So what? The fact is we're there now and it's in everybody's interests for democracy to prevail over Saddamism and Zarqawism, and a successful election is something all of us should applaud.

I agree, though the applause is far greater than the integrity of the election or its ultimate impact. Sunday's events prove that we have the power to conduct an election (however flawed) in the face of a violent insurgency and that a substantial number of Iraqis prefer democracy to what Zarqawi has to offer, but it does not guarantee that Iraq will become an independent democracy or that the U.S. really intends to withdraw from the permanent military bases we're constructing there.

Most definitely, for progressive democracy to succeed in the Arab region it must be led by progressive Arabs, but what's happening in Iraq is widely viewed as an American-led operation for American interests, and the overall effect of our actions there has been a boon to the world view espoused by the radical jihadists.

Friedman turns a blind eye to the reality that the United States is fueling the terror we are supposedly trying to vanquish, and that we are not spending all this blood and treasure for the benefit of the Iraqi people. The agenda of the Bush neocon administration has not changed, no matter how much spin is applied to Sunday's event.

Democracy can be a power unto itself and the desire of the Iraqi people to control their own destiny is a good thing, but let's not get so caught up in the aspirations of the Iraqi people that we forget that the architects of this war may have different ideas.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Tue Jan 14th 2025, 02:12 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Editorials & Other Articles Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC