LATimes - Is Islam to blame? -Koran offers cover for acts of terrorism.

[papau]

From the Koran: "Whoever kills a human being, except as punishment for murder or other villainy in the land, shall be regarded as having killed all humankind." Should moderate Muslims join with the moderates of Judaism and Christianity in confessing some "sins of Scripture," as Episcopal Bishop John Shelby Spong has said of the Bible, with regard to some Imam's interpretations of the "except as punishment for murder or other villainy in the land"?

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-manji22jul22,0,1065833.story?track=tottext

Is Islam to blame?
Despite claims of moderate Muslims, a literal reading of the Koran offers cover for acts of terrorism.
By Irshad Manji
Irshad Manji is the author of "The Trouble with Islam Today" (St. Martin's Press, 2005).

July 22, 2005

I believe thursday's bombings in London, combined with the first wave of explosions two weeks ago, are changing something for the better. Never before have I heard Muslims so sincerely denounce terrorism committed in our name as I did on my visit to Britain a few days ago. We're finally waking up.

Except on one front: the possible role of religion itself in these crimes.

Even now, the Muslim Council of Britain adamantly insists that Islam has nothing to do with the London attacks. It cites other motives — "segregation" and "alienation," for instance. Although I don't deny that living on the margins can make a vulnerable lad gravitate to radical messages of instant belonging, it takes more than that to make him detonate himself and innocent others. To blow yourself up, you need conviction. Secular society doesn't compete well on this score. Who gets deathly passionate over tuition subsidies and a summer job?

Which is why I don't understand how moderate Muslim leaders can reject, flat-out, the notion that religion may also play a part in these bombings. What makes them so sure that Islam is an innocent bystander?<snip>

[Chico Man]

1. I think the bombers play too much Grand Theft Auto, to tell you the truth.

:eyes:

[leveymg]

2. And, maybe, not everyone adopting that cover is Islamic? n/t

[wli]

3. Islam my arse

Most of the "international incidents" are false flag attacks. The suicide bombings by Muslims themselves are primarily resistance to military occupation.

[bemildred]

4. Tsk, a self-hating muslim. nt

[iconoclastic cat]

5. Pfffft. As with Christianity, religion can be a convenient cover

for many kinds of crime.

[K-W]

7. I still dont see how the word cover is justified.

What is it covering for exactly?

I know im being nitpicky, but there is this insidious myth that somehow these people are really just evil and that all thier ideology, etc, are excuses to do what they wanted to do already, kill people, because they are evil.

Im certainly not suggesting that you are saying this, just pointing out how the word cover is misleading.

[K-W]

6. Someone motivated to kill will find an ideological justification anywhere.

The Koran doesnt provide cover, that is absolute bullshit.

There isnt an ideology in this world that hasnt been twisted to allow or support killing by people who have made the decision to kill.

The decision to kill is the issue, not the details of the ideology, which are pretty much incidental.

The idea that if the Koran was explicitely anti-violence they wouldnt be attacking is laughable considering the remarkably pacifist nature of the new testament and the incredibally violent things that have been done by devout christians.

[Emendator]

8. Good points

I believe it's a combination of factors. Our foreign policy is a big problem. But religion plays a big role too. Islam is more overtly intolerant than other religions. Just from a cursory look at the Koran, this is obvious.

[CJCRANE]

9. I don't think it's any

more violent than the Bible. Plus every chapter begins with the phrase "In the name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful". If you actually look into Islam most of it is about doing good deeds, helping the poor, looking after your family, being an honest businessman etc.

The main difference between Islam and Christianity (but not Judaism) is that muslims genrally believe in reciprocity and self-defence (rather than turn the other cheek).

[Emendator]

10. Sorry

but I have to disagree with you there. The Koran is a big mess. It's really hard to understand and follow. And there is a lot more violence and condemnation of unbelievers than in the other religions. This is very frequent in Islam. Obviously most Muslims don't live according to their religion - fortunately. Most of them don't read or understand Arabic and don't know what the Koran says. For them Islam is more a part of their cultural heritage than a religion and way of life. Those aren't the ones who are a problem.

But overall, I no longer believe it to be a religion of peace. There have been a lot of crimes in the name of Jesus, but his message is a good one. Compare it to Mohammed, who was a brutal conqueror. What good there is in Islam can be found in the other religions. But there's a lot more that is bad.

Eventually the West is going to have to deal with this reality. The Republicans would have us bomb the entire Middle East.

Take a look at the Skeptics Annotated Koran and judge for yourself.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/

[CJCRANE]

11. To be honest

I'm no expert on the Bible, Koran or Jewish scriptures but I personally don't think there's much difference between them.

For instance, as far as we can tell, Jesus was a kind man, yet strangely the fundamentalist Christians take Jesus' message to mean they are the chosen ones and above the law (i.e. they have been chosen by "grace" not "deeds") and the rest of us are condemned to hellfire. Pretty much all religion is full of contradictions and different kinds of people take the messages they want from it.

If the Christian fundamentalists manage to take over America, Islam probably will seem like a religion of peace compared to them.

[Emendator]

12. You don't need

to be an expert. But it would be a good idea to become familiar with Islam because this issue, whether it can be reformed or not, is likely going to dominate the rest of the century. Do take a look at that site and at least read the comments in the margins. It's well done and funny at times.

There's no comparison between American Christian fundamentalists and Muslim ones. The ones here are an annoyance, often ignorant, and very misguided. But they're not going to kill you for not following the Bible. And we're a very long way from that ever happening.

[CJCRANE]

13. "They're not

going to kill you for not following the Bible"...but their leader lied his way to an illegal pre-emptive war which killed tens of thousands of civilians, sanctioned torture etc etc.

I think you may forgive me for thinking that Christian fundamentalists are also a threat to world security.

edit to remove the 911 reference (save that for a different discussion).

[Emendator]

14. Yes

Of course you are right about Bush lying to start a war and his evangelical followers wanting to start a war. We in the US need to defeat our radicals.