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Stephen Walt, the "Israel Lobby" paper, and Academic Freedom(WASH.NOTE)

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laststeamtrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 04:29 AM
Original message
Stephen Walt, the "Israel Lobby" paper, and Academic Freedom(WASH.NOTE)
Stephen Walt, the "Israel Lobby" paper, and Academic Freedom

<snip>

Now, I have just received the following communication sent by the Dean of the Kennedy School suggesting that there is no connection between Walt's stepping down as academic dean at the natural end of his term and this "Israel Lobby" paper.

<snip>

http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/001322.php
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 04:36 AM
Response to Original message
1. and?
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laststeamtrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 04:48 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. "and?"...the frank & far-ranging discussion at the link.
:hi:
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 05:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. it's a piss poor product...long as hell, but still academically lacking
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laststeamtrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 05:44 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Ok. I'm sure the people who already agree with you, agree with you.
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 06:00 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. I don't agree with him much, other than linguistic issues...
Edited on Sat Apr-01-06 06:25 AM by Behind the Aegis
M-W focus on AIPAC and the evangelicals, but they recognize that the Lobby includes most of the political-intellectual class -- at which point the thesis loses much of its content. They also have a highly selective use of evidence (and much of the evidence is assertion). Take, as one example, arms sales to China, which they bring up as undercutting US interests. But they fail to mention that when the US objected, Israel was compelled to back down: under Clinton in 2000, and again in 2005, in this case with the Washington neocon regime going out of its way to humiliate Israel. Without a peep from The Lobby, in either case, though it was a serious blow to Israel. There's a lot more like that. Take the worst crime in Israel's history, its invasion of Lebanon in 1982 with the goal of destroying the secular nationalist PLO and ending its embarrassing calls for political settlement, and imposing a client Maronite regime. The Reagan administration strongly supported the invasion through its worst atrocities, but a few months later (August), when the atrocities were becoming so severe that even NYT Beirut correspondent Thomas Friedman was complaining about them, and they were beginning to harm the US "national interest," Reagan ordered Israel to call off the invasion, then entered to complete the removal of the PLO from Lebanon, an outcome very welcome to both Israel and the US (and consistent with general US opposition to independent nationalism). The outcome was not entirely what the US-Israel wanted, but the relevant observation here is that the Reaganites supported the aggression and atrocities when that stand was conducive to the "national interest," and terminated them when it no longer was (then entering to finish the main job). That's pretty normal.

Another problem that M-W do not address is the role of the energy corporations. They are hardly marginal in US political life -- transparently in the Bush administration, but in fact always. How can they be so impotent in the face of the Lobby? As ME scholar Stephen Zunes has rightly pointed out, "there are far more powerful interests that have a stake in what happens in the Persian Gulf region than does AIPAC , such as the oil companies, the arms industry and other special interests whose lobbying influence and campaign contributions far surpass that of the much-vaunted Zionist lobby and its allied donors to congressional races.

<snip>

I won't run through the other arguments, but I don't feel that they have much force, on examination.

The thesis M-W propose does however have plenty of appeal. The reason, I think, is that it leaves the US government untouched on its high pinnacle of nobility, "Wilsonian idealism," etc., merely in the grip of an all-powerful force that it cannot escape. It's rather like attributing the crimes of the past 60 years to "exaggerated Cold War illusions," etc. Convenient, but not too convincing. In either case."

The Israel Lobby? by Noam Chomsky
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laststeamtrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 06:22 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. "Error Executing Database Query"--I got this message when I clicked...
...on the Chomsky/Z MAG link...

...And whatever...

You're right, I'm wrong.

You're always right, I'm always wrong.

Feel better now?

Comfy?
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 06:26 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. link corrected....
"You're always right, I'm always wrong.

Feel better now?
"

False assertion?

Feel better now?
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laststeamtrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 06:57 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Last tag.
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Behind the Aegis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-01-06 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. so you didn't read it?
:shrug:
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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-03-06 01:24 AM
Response to Reply #5
10. very interesting article by Noam

I knew that he did not subscribe to commonly held notions in some circles regarding the "Israeli Lobby" dominating U.S. policy in the Middle East and since no one in their right mind can possibly accuse Dr. Chomsky of being an apologist for groups like AIPAC his critique of the paper does carry some weight. And if anyone had a complaint against certain Zionist organizations it would be Professor Chomsky.

Thanks for posting the article.
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