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Conservative Voice: If You Love Your Country, You Should Question 9/11

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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-04-06 02:24 PM
Original message
Conservative Voice: If You Love Your Country, You Should Question 9/11
"Charlie Sheen likes prostitutes.

On March 20th, the aforementioned actor appeared on the Alex Jones radio show to discuss his thoughts on 9/11.
He said he didn’t believe that a plane hit the Pentagon, and added the Twin Towers looked like they were imploded.
And the best response anyone could come up with was to say he was nuts and likes prostitutes.

Interesting.

Not that I’m arguing the guy’s predilection for hookers here. I have no doubt that the man who once played Wild Thing Vaughn likes paying for sex from time to time. It’s just that that’s totally irrelevant to his 9/11 theories. Bringing it up seems like a specious way of proving a plane ever hit the Pentagon."

http://www.theconservativevoice.com/article/13605.html

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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-04-06 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
1. Exactly! At this point, you shouldn’t really know what to believe.
From the article...

Again, I’m not saying you should believe that’s the case. Nor am I saying you should believe 9/11 was an inside job. But there are reasonable questions that haven’t been answered yet. And at this point, you shouldn’t really know what to believe.

All things considered, it’s easy to see why folks would suspect the worst here. A number of men in the Bush administration pushed for war in Iraq before 9/11, and pushed for it afterwards—in spite of Iraq not attacking us. This alone doesn’t prove a conspiracy. But the fact that the White House likes secrecy as much as Charlie Sheen likes hookers doesn’t exactly help.

Since 9/11, the Bush team has implemented a number of policies—such as torture, domestic spying, and the capture of enemy combatants—all from behind closed doors. Toss in two controversial elections, and tie it all together with the “Unitary Executive” theory (which effectively gives the president power to rewrite laws during wartime), and it’s no wonder people have their suspicions about 9/11. Our government’s undergoing fundamental changes. It’s not nutty to notice this. It’s nuttier not to.

:bounce:
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-04-06 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. even when the known/obvious evidence is thoroughly researched
so much of it does not make sense or add up (and I am not going into detail here, there's plenty of pro/con on the net), NOT to question the inconsistencies and gross mistakes pre-911 and on 9-11 is embracing the 'head in the sand' POV.
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FtWayneBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-04-06 04:44 PM
Response to Original message
3. check out g.w. blog
Edited on Tue Apr-04-06 04:45 PM by FtWayneBlue
The below appears on George Washington's Blog:

Monday, April 03, 2006
9/11: a 7-Man Job
A common objection to the argument that 9/11 was an inside job is that the conspiracy would be too big to keep quiet. In other words, the argument is that it is impossible that so many people could have kept quiet for so long. SOMEONE would have talked or made a mistake, so that the conspiracy would have been discovered.

Is that true? Maybe.

But anyone who's seen a Tom Clancy or Robert Ludlum movie, or even watched enough Stargate, Star Trek or Alias, knows that a handful of bad guys can pull off big conspiracies, especially when they've got a high-level military or government person on board.

Moreover, to anyone who knows how covert military operations work, it is obvious that segmentation on a "need-to-know basis", along with deference to command hierarchy, means that a couple of top dogs can call the shots and most people helping won't even know the big picture.

(more at)

http://georgewashington.blogspot.com/2006/04/911-7-man-job.html
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ovidsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-04-06 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. What?
"But anyone who's seen a Tom Clancy or Robert Ludlum movie, or even watched enough Stargate, Star Trek or Alias, knows that a handful of bad guys can pull off big conspiracies, especially when they've got a high-level military or government person on board."

I'm sorry, but anyone who uses works of fiction to "prove" that real conspiracies might exist has no credibility.

Zero.
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. If you clicked on the link
you would have seen that in addition to mentioning the examples of how false flag terror has been used in works of fiction, the author does present actual historical precedence for false flag terror, i.e. actual historical cases of false flag terror attacks (including at least one particpated in by US and allied intelligence agencies in which the desired goal of scapegoating the assigned patsies was successfully achieved while the cover was maintained for some 20 years after the terror attacks in question).
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. concur-and this is ALWAYS the main point of this argument, be
it Pearl Harbor, JFK, et al-they assume that a 'whole bunch of (low level)people' would be 'in on the plan' and would individually (or several)simply go to their superiors in government and 'spill the beans'- it's a preposterous argument. These have been events that changed the world, thus, it is certainly plausible that the few people that may have known or worse, participated (in some manner) in such horrific, dramatic events were in and would certainly remain in extreme danger AT ALL TIMES. If/when 'regular' people unwittingly interact (or are told anything at all)- with this 'dangerous element' they are promptly and effectively threatened and muzzled or, as in the movies-taken care of. This knocks out that tired argument that dramatic events, of historic proportion, randomly happen because of 'one or a few' crazy, dangerous, nutjobs who do ALL the PLANNING AND actually carry out these horrific acts by themselves.
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MasonJar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-04-06 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
5. If these thugs would bomb the twin towers, they certainly would
have the wherewithall to dispense with the ones in the know. Rub 'em out! There's the rub.
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-05-06 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
6. What makes me go "hmmm" about 911
Back in 1980 when Italians opened their newspapers to hear about a terrorist bomb blowing up the train station in Bologna Italy killing 85 people, I am sure they all were dutifully outraged at the callousness and murderous savagery of the bloodthirsty terrorists responsible for this act of mass murder.

Too bad it takes 20 years for it to come out that this terrorist attack, in addition to others taking place in Europe in that time frame, were part of the NATO/CIA/MI6 formulated Operation Gladio designed to use terror attacks against civilian targets for propaganda purposes and to cause the civilian victims to turn to the state for greater "protection."


You had to attack civilians, the people, women, children, innocent people, unknown people far removed from any political game. The reason was quite simple: to force ... the public to turn to the state to ask for greater security."

This was the essence of Operation Gladio, a decades-long covert campaign of terrorism and deceit directed by the intelligence services of the West -- against their own populations. Hundreds of innocent people were killed or maimed in terrorist attacks -- on train stations, supermarkets, cafes and offices -- which were then blamed on "leftist subversives" or other political opponents. The purpose, as stated above in sworn testimony by Gladio agent Vincenzo Vinciguerra, was to demonize designated enemies and frighten the public into supporting ever-increasing powers for government leaders -- and their elitist cronies.

SNIP

Among the "smoking guns" unearthed by Ganser is a Pentagon document, Field Manual FM 30-31B, which details the methodology for launching terrorist attacks in nations that "do not react with sufficient effectiveness" against "communist subversion." Ironically, the manual states that the most dangerous moment comes when leftist groups "renounce the use of force" and embrace the democratic process. It is then that "U.S. army intelligence must have the means of launching special operations which will convince Host Country Governments and public opinion of the reality of the insurgent danger." Naturally, these peace-throttling "special operations must remain strictly secret," the document warns.

Indeed, it would not do for the families of the 85 people ripped apart by the Aug. 2, 1980 bombing of the Bologna train station to know that their loved ones had been murdered by "men inside Italian state institutions and ... men linked to the structures of United States intelligence," as the Italian Senate concluded after its investigation in 2000.

Sword Play: Attacking Civilians to Justify "Greater Security"


As for 9/11 itself, here are just a few of the anomalies surrounding 9/11 that were not properly addressed by the Kean Commission's report:

1) There was the massive insider trading in the airline stocks affected by the hijackings which we were told would be rigorously followed up as undoubtedly it would lead back to the hijackers. The investigation went nowhere and was quietly dropped with little or no attention paid by the media.

Buzzy Krongard managed firm that handled put options on UAL

2) There were multiple war games and hijacking exercises which drew fighter aircraft away from the North East air corridors and caused confusion and delay in responding appropriately to the first reports of hijackings.

The War Games of September 11th

Dr. Robert Bowman former head of Star Wars for the DOD and a retired fighter pilot and Lt. Col in the USAF (Viet Nam era) has come forward to state publicly that the 9/11 operation looks like an inside job, especially the initial delay in fighter response to the hijackings. Bowman is calling for a new investigation since the Kean Commission was obviously such a coverup as to what really occurred that day. Speech by Bowman posted at youtube.com: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LG64t73Yo94


3) Sibel Edmonds the fired FBI whistleblower (still under an official gag order) who started work with the FBI shortly after 9/11 testified under oath before the Kean Commission about breaches of security and procedure she personally observed within the translation department which were preventing or blocking ongoing investigations into the 9/11 terror attacks from proceeding.

The following is an extract from Ms. Edmond's open letter to the Kean Commission asking why they had not followed up or addressed her concerns (paragraphing is my own for ease in reading. Original was all one paragraph before the SNIP and all one paragraph after the SNIP):


After the terrorist attacks of September 11 we, the translators at the FBI’s largest and most important translation unit, were told to slow down, even stop, translation of critical information related to terrorist activities so that the FBI could present the United States Congress with a record of ‘extensive backlog of untranslated documents’, and justify its request for budget and staff increases.

While FBI agents from various field offices were desperately seeking leads and suspects, and completely depending on FBI HQ and its language units to provide them with needed translated information, hundreds of translators were being told by their administrative supervisors not to translate and to let the work pile up (please refer to the CBS-60 Minutes transcript dated October 2002, and provided to your investigators in January-February 2004). This issue has been confirmed by the Senate Judiciary Committee (Please refer to Senator Grassley and Senator Leahy’s letters during the summer of 2002, provided to your investigators in January - February 2004).

This confirmed report has been reported to be substantiated by the Department of Justice Inspector General Report (Please refer to DOJ-IG report Re: SibelEdmonds and FBI Translation, provided to you prior to the completion of your report). I provided your investigators with a detailed and specific account of this issue and the names of other witnesses willing to corroborate this. (Please refer to tape-recorded 3.5 hours testimony by Sibel Edmonds, provided to your investigators on February 11, 2004).

SNIP

Only one month after the catastrophic events of September 11; while many agents were working around the clock to obtain leads and information, and to investigate those responsible for the attacks, those with possible connections to the attack, and those who might be planning possible future attacks; the bureaucratic administrators in the FBI’s largest and most important translation unit were covering up their past failures, blocking important leads and information, and jeopardizing on going terrorist investigations. The supervisor involved in this incident, Mike Feghali, was in charge of certain important Middle Eastern languages within the FBI Washington Field Office, and had a record of previous misconducts.

After this supervisor’s several severe misconducts were reported to the FBI’s higher- level management, after his conducts were reported to the Inspector General’s Office, to the United States Congress, and to the 9/11 Commission, he was promoted to include the FBI’s Arabic language unit under his supervision. Today this supervisor, Mike Feghali, remains in the FBI Washington Field Office and is in charge of a language unit receiving those chitchats that our color-coded threat system is based upon. Yet your report contains zero information regarding these systemic problems that led us to our failure in preventing the 9/11 terrorist attacks. In your report, there are no references to individuals responsible for hindering past and current investigations, or those who are willing to compromise our security and our lives for their career advancement and security.

This issue, as with others, is systemic and departmental. Why does your report choose to exclude this information and these serious issues despite all the evidence and briefings you received? Why does your report adamantly refrain from Sibel Edmonds assigning any accountability to any individuals responsible for our past and current failures? How can budget increases address and resolve these intentional acts committed by self- serving career civil servants? How can the addition of a new bureaucratic layer, “Intelligence Czar”, in its cocoon removed from the action lines, address and resolve this problem.


Complete letter posted on Edmond's web site www.justacitizen.org at:
Edmond's letter to Kean Commission (pdf format)


To sum it all up, the words of an ex-Special Forces Master Sergeant and West Point instructor, Stan Goff:


The Story we Hear on the News and Read in the Newspapers is simply not believable


I'm a retired Special Forces Master Sergeant. That doesn't cut much for those who will only accept the opinions of former officers on military matters, since we enlisted swine are assumed to be incapable of grasping the nuances of doctrine.

But I wasn't just in the army, I studied and taught military science and doctrine. I was a tactics instructor at the Jungle Operations Training Center in Panama, and I taught Military Science at West Point. And contrary to the popular image of what Special Forces does, SF's mission is to teach. We offer advice and assistance to foreign forces. That's everything from teaching marksmanship to a private to instructing a Battalion staff on how to coordinate effective air operations with a sister service.

Based on that experience, and operations in eight designated conflict areas from Vietnam to Haiti, I have to say that the story we hear on the news and read in the newspapers is simply not believable. The most cursory glance at the verifiable facts, before, during, and after September 11th, does not support the official line or conform to the current actions of the United States government.

But the official line only works if they can get everyone to accept its underlying premises. I'm not at all surprised about the Republican and Democratic Parties repeating these premises. They are simply two factions within a single dominant political class, and both are financed by the same economic powerhouses. My biggest disappointment, as someone who identifies himself with the left, has been the tacit acceptance of those premises by others on the left, sometimes naively, and sometimes to score some morality points. Those premises are twofold. One, there is the premise that what this de facto administration is doing now is a "response" to September 11th. Two, there is the premise that this attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon was done by people based in Afghanistan. In my opinion, neither of these is sound.

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/wtc_media.htm
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