Holy Crap-Sam Harris article. Man does 180

[imfreaky]

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-harris18sep18,0,1897169.story?coll=la-opinion-rightrail

I read a good portion of this guys last book. He is/was quite a progressive. However, he seems to be drinking the proverbial kool-aid. Please don't shoot the messanger. But I am curious to see how to respond to this.


Head-in-the-Sand Liberals
Western civilization really is at risk from Muslim extremists.
By Sam Harris, SAM HARRIS is the author of "The End of Faith: Religion, Terror and the Future of Reason." His next book, "Letter to a Christian Nation," will be published this week by Knopf. samharris.org.
September 18, 2006

TWO YEARS AGO I published a book highly critical of religion, "The End of Faith." In it, I argued that the world's major religions are genuinely incompatible, inevitably cause conflict and now prevent the emergence of a viable, global civilization. In response, I have received many thousands of letters and e-mails from priests, journalists, scientists, politicians, soldiers, rabbis, actors, aid workers, students — from people young and old who occupy every point on the spectrum of belief and nonbelief.

This has offered me a special opportunity to see how people of all creeds and political persuasions react when religion is criticized. I am here to report that liberals and conservatives respond very differently to the notion that religion can be a direct cause of human conflict.

This difference does not bode well for the future of liberalism.

Perhaps I should establish my liberal bone fides at the outset. I'd like to see taxes raised on the wealthy, drugs decriminalized and homosexuals free to marry. I also think that the Bush administration deserves most of the criticism it has received in the last six years — especially with respect to its waging of the war in Iraq, its scuttling of science and its fiscal irresponsibility.

But my correspondence with liberals has convinced me that liberalism has grown dangerously out of touch with the realities of our world — specifically with what devout Muslims actually believe about the West, about paradise and about the ultimate ascendance of their faith.

On questions of national security, I am now as wary of my fellow liberals as I am of the religious demagogues on the Christian right.

More at link....

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[blm]

1. Beware of moles. David Horowitz was set up to snooker the left decades ago

It's standard as a tactic for the RW machine.

[imfreaky]

2. good point

[Freedom_from_Chains]

3. Sam has always had the position that liberals who insist on

putting up with excepting theology as reality gives credibility to those who use religion against others (Christofascist). That is nothing new.

[Dhalgren]

4. This guy is braindead...

[Demeter]

5. Say Rather The Major Religions Are Intolerant

many of them in spite of their fine words and teachings......in that they are all quite comparable and compatible...

[LisaLynne]

6. imfreaky ...

Please be aware that DU copyright rules require that excerpts of copyrighted material be limited to four paragraphs. Thanks.

[imfreaky]

9. thanks for the heads up

only trying to make it easier. but understood.

Thanks
imfreaky

[oncall247]

7. Maybe if we stopped trying to stuff "democracy" and western civilization

down other peoples' thorats, and left them alone, maybe they would leave us alone?

[tanyev]

8. So fascism will be our salvation?

The people who speak most sensibly about the threat that Islam poses to Europe are actually fascists.

I don't think it's liberal denial to recognize that jihad vs. crusade didn't work so well several centuries ago, and it accomplished nothing. There has to be another way.

[carolinayellowdog]

10. Harris just destroyed his credibility for me

All these unsupported generalizations about "liberals"-- which he never defines or gives a single example of-- are symptomatic of a simplistic mind. Namecalling, scapegoating, BS. Which was probably apparent already in his treatment of religion.

This is an age in which the simplistic namecallers get all the attention.

[stopbush]

11. Is Harris crazy like a fox? New book releases today.

His new book (Letter to a Christian Nation) is releasing today. So what does he do? He writes
a column that's sure to piss off the constituency that would be predisposed to buy his book.

OR - maybe he's trying to show that he's not such a big lib'rul after all in the hopes that RW
Christians will buy his book on why they should reconsider their belief system. In politics and
marketing, timing is everything. I could see him writing that column in the hopes that some liberal
bashers would think, "hey. Here's a liberal atheist who's bashing liberals as soft on terror. I think
I'll check out his new book."

I agree with Harris when it comes to matters of religion being a bunch of hooey, but he is
a major Muslim basher and a major apologist for Israel if not Judaism. Those perspectives
certainly colored "End of Faith," and they certainly colored his op-ed in the LA Times. In that respect,
he's being consistent with his views...if not necessarily consistent with mine or - apparently -
the views of many posters on DU.

[bloom]

12. I was just thinking earlier today about Sam Harris

and how it seems to me that he is responsible for much of the discord between atheists and liberally religious people.


I know his ideas - as they have been cited on DU have been the source of problems. "Sam Harris: Why Religion Must End"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=214&topic_id=68983


He has also been a vocal defender of torture.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=214&topic_id=74019


I agree about being wary of moles - and of Harris in particular.

[shrike]

13. This guy always seemed a little hinky to me

And now I know why.

Though I always had to be careful on DU, because I am a believer, and I'm looking at him through that lense. However, most non-believers I've met don't have Harris' views, which I regard as a bit extreme. They may regard us believers as delusional, but for the most part they have a live and let live attitude. For the most part, they expect the same attitude in return; it's only when we treat them otherwise that they get angry.
I can deal with them. And I think they can deal me. But, I don't know if I can deal with him.

Although I agree with him on the dangers of fundamentalism, I am alarmed by his categorization of Islam.
Also, these kinds of statements ignore the long history of injustice in the Mideast -- colonialism, disastrous interventionism, policies (via outsiders) that are downright racist. The roots of fundamentalism. People who turn to fundamentalism oftimes have nothing else to lose. No one else to follow. They've been f*cked by everyone and everything else.

I am also disturbed by his categorization of Israel. Israel holds the high ground re Hamas and Hezbollah?? After Lebanon??

[bloom]

14. I have to wonder about his defense of Israel

He seems to be pro-Israel and anti-all-religion. It's not rational.

[shrike]

15. 'Specially after what's happened recently n/t/

[yurbud]

16. at best, Harris has limited the scope of causes he is willing to explore

at worst, he is willfully ignorant of history and how religion and politics interact.