Expensive Fun- Howard Dean Needs t o Grow Up

[RUexperienced]

... He told an audience that to win the White House, he would need support from all Democrats, "even the Democratic Leadership Council, which is sort of the Republican part of the Democratic Party … the Republican wing of the Democratic Party. We're going to need them too."

Republican wing? The Democratic Leadership Council is the organization Bill Clinton co-founded in 1985 to represent moderate and conservative Democrats. Clinton called this constituency "us." Dean calls it "them."

But after a while, telling people where they can take it becomes a problem. The list of constituencies to whom you've given the finger grows. "Them" starts to outnumber "us." Clinton warned of such self-destruction when he accepted the Democratic presidential nomination in 1992: "For too long, politicians have told the most of us that are doing all right that what's really wrong with America is the rest of us: them. … We've nearly them'd ourselves to death. Them, and them, and them. But this is America. There is no them; there is only us." ...

That's what Dean needs to learn. Being big means rising above the mischievous glee of mocking your adversary. It means not hitting back when you don't need to. It means focusing on those you can help, not those you can punish. It means representing the whole party and eventually the whole country. If Dean can't absorb that lesson, his party will indeed need a character transplant. And the character that will have to come out is his.

-Slate

http://politics.slate.msn.com/id/2093303/

-----------------------------
Dr. Dean is insulting the people like me, the ones whose vote he is going to desperately need in November. He is making it very hard.

[dodgerartful]

1. so cast yer for vote for

some one else. I feel he calls it as he see's it, the DLC laid down and rolled over a long time ago.....so did a bunch of others, I like a guy who tells the truth-no matter how ugly.....

[bowens43]

2. The DLC has been screwing our party for years.

'Conservative Democrat' is or at least should be an oxymoron. Like it or not , there is an 'us and them' and the divide between 'us and them' is growing rapidly. The party has been shoved steadily to the right for years. Any further right and there will be no reason to have more then one party. The drift toward conservatism needs to stop NOW!! It's time to make a stand. If we lose, we lose , but at least we will have done what is right.

[Democrats unite]

5. Watch the video, you might learn what the DLC is actually about

Also since it's at their website, it is very informative.


http://www.ndol.org/ndol_ci.cfm?kaid=86&subid=85&contentid=251988

[bowens43]

10. I know what the DLC is about,

it's about elitism. It's about keeping the inner circle in power to the exclusion of everyone else. It's about transforming our party into a generic entity that stands for nothing, indistinguishable from the Republican party. Those who voice disagreement with the DLC's steady movement to the right were doomed to obscurity, until now. Some of us have had quite enough of the DLC thank you very much.

[Democrats unite]

12. It's a shame that you are misinformed of the DLC

But the DLC will beat Bush this year despite some people.

[bowens43]

13. Te DLC isn't running.

See, it's this attitude that turns so many away. The DLC will beat bush? The DLC isn't the Democratic party. Your elitist statement proves my point.

[Democrats unite]

16. The DLC will beat Bush and Yes they are not running...

Like the rest of us who are Democrats and are not running. There are attitudes out there that will be the Democratic downfall and it is safe to assume I don't have to point out the one's I am talking about.

It's about unity, and until some people grasp that concept, they will be waiting for a train that never shows up.

Any bashing any Bashing of any Democratic group should not be tolerated here.

[bowens43]

17. Wow....

YOu just keep proving my point. Thanks.

[dodgerartful]

33. I watched the video, one thumb

down, the dlc is still repuke "lite"....

[RUexperienced]

6. Which conservative Democrats in the Senate

are you willing to see replaced by a Republican?

[bowens43]

11. None of course (only because of the close numbers)

but there are some I would like to see replaced with an actual Democrat instead of a pseudo-Democrat, starting with Zell Miller.

[RUexperienced]

14. That's my point

Dean needs moderates like Zell Miller. But poking them in the eye is not going to help him.

[bowens43]

15. Moderate?

You're kidding right? Zell Miller is more conservative then bush. No, Dean doesn't need him to win the presidency .

[salin]

18. Besides - Zell has already all but endorsed Bush - regardless of the

democratic candidate - be it Dean or even Lieberman.

[RUexperienced]

24. But Dean needs the people Miller represents

Without moderate Georgia Democrats Dean will lose Georgia.

And throwing in a few "I found Jesus" remarks into each speech isn't going to do it.

[Design8edGrouch]

38. what is left

"If we lose, we lose , but at least we will have done what is right." Actually that should be what is left. We need to stop referring to them as right. I find myself wondering if the right is so powerful (and hard to defeat) because of their connection to being right as in correct/righteous. If those on the right were called leftist and those on the left were called right (correct/righteous) would this be a different country?

[mkultra]

3. The DLC never liked him

and has made that clear from the beginning. Who gets elected is really not their decision. Its the voters decision. The democratic party needs new ideas instead of old ones. Their weakness was only effective for Clinton because Clinton was so charismatic. As far as I'm concerned, when the DLC tries to tell us who to vote for, they have slipped into a republican trance. If your insulted by someone telling you to start acting in a democratic fashion, maybe you should be offended at your actions.

[Democrats unite]

7. Excuse me, but please show me where the DLC...

is saying who to vote for in the Primary? I have yet to be able to find it.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

40. Only who not to vote for.

Makes it easier.

[liberalmuse]

4. He's telling the truth.

Some people just hate that.

[RUexperienced]

9. The red meat he is throwing out

is from the bodies of people in his own party.

Just wait for the convention. He will come off as good for the Democrats as Pat Buchanan did for the Republipukes in 1992.

[Cocoa]

8. I'm going to be bigger than Dean

I consider elements of his campaign a personal insult to me, a dem voter who prefers other candidates to him.

But if he gets the nomination, I will find some way to become an enthusiastic Dean supporter, because he's approx. 1 zillion times better than Bush.

i.e. my vote is transferable towards Dean.

[billbuckhead]

20. Dean is needlessly divise for an ABB agenda

but he's usually on target for a Dean or nobody agenda.

[bemildred]

19. All of you who want to get offended and vote for Bush, go ahead.

I'm going to vote for whoever the Dem's nominate, and the
scrappier he is the better. Al Gore, who won the last election,
thinks Dean can do it. It is certainly true that the way to
the true Democratic promised land is through re-mobilization of
the Democratic base, which Mr. Dean seems to be attempting.
And that is a hell of a lot more important than all these bruised egos.

[Cocoa]

21. I agree

that's the attitude I'm going to take.

And an observation, that magnanimous approach that you and I are taking is directly opposite to much of the spirit of the Dean campaign. Just an observation.

[Nancy Waterman]

25. Dean needs to start watching his nouth

Almost daily there are now character smears about his penchant for shooting from the lip. I will vote for him though he isn't my first choice, and I do like his feistiness a lot. But I think he needs to watch what he says. Here is a column from Novakula, widely read, that says it all.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/novak/cst-edt-novak01.html

[bemildred]

27. I don't entirely disagree, but you must realize that

Mr. Dean is going to be tarred and feathered in the press
in a plethora of ways from now until November (unless he somehow
loses the nomination), whatever he says. Remember the treatment
Mr. Gore got? Mr. Dean might as well mix it up. At least he will
be trashed for what he thinks instead of stuff that is imaginary.

[KoKo]

32. He's pointing out flaws in Dem Party which need to be discussed, I

applaud him for that. Many of us are angry over why the "Party/DLC" didn't support Gore against the attacks from the Media, and the failures since to stand up to the Repuglicans. Dean is very effectively starting a dialog. It needed to be done. There are too many differences over where the Democratic Party has been and where it's going in the future.

As much as many here may feel he's divisive, he's talking about it. Just as we do here. He's trying to shift the power structure from the Lobbyists and Corporate Whores back to the issues. And while the issues may be painful, they aren't going away. Covering the "divide" up only makes it grow worse.

[RUexperienced]

23. Be careful what you wish for

Many moderates may vote for Bush. And Dean can't win without them.

[bemildred]

26. Mr. Dean seems to be upsetting the applecart.

As did, for instance, Mr. Carter and Mr. Clinton in their
time. I don't think anyone knows what's going to happen, but
I suspect that business as usual will not be what occurs this
time.

Like I said, any "moderates" that find themselves preferring
Mr. Bush to the Democratic nominee should vote that way. That
is what democracy is all about.

[RUexperienced]

28. If Dean's campaign message is, "Vote for the other guy

if you are a moderate" many people will. And he will be as remembered as Mondale, Dukakis and McGovern.

[bemildred]

29. Sir, I was there.

His is not Mondale, Dukakis and McGovern,
and that is not his message. If that is your message
then good luck to you.

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bemildred]

31. LOL. Did you make that up all by yourself?

[Design8edGrouch]

39. I'm going to vote for whoever the Dem's nominate

I'm going to vote for whoever the Dem's nominate, and the
scrappier he is the better. Amen! Amen! Amen!
I, however would go one step further--if he is scrappy enough, I might even vote twice for him!

[October]

22. We all need to grow up

Clinton upset me many times over the years with his stupid (albeit personal) decisions, and his conservative leanings. But the truth is -- I'd vote for him tomorrow if I could!

Dean has faced more attacks from his "own" than any other candidate --let him fight back! Dean IS moderate -- what is the DLC's problem with him any way?

BTW, I'm undecided on candidates -- just sick of all the in-fighting.

[wabeewoman]

34. One of the things I've noticed about Dean

is that he talks about the 'unmentionables' in and out of the party and it leads to publicity about the issue which then leads to some discussion. Besides the DLC(who I have hear many times at DU as being out of touch with the democratic party), there was the catching Saddam hasn't made America safer. Obviously true but bush and the media were going on like it had made us safer. Dean started the discussion. I'm for Dean but sometimes when I hear the news reports about what he said or did, I pause, wondering why or if he said THAT! Then I read what he said and in the context he said it and I find I almost always agree. He has common sense which is quite uncommon in Washington. I don't know about Carville...I never really understood how he could marry Matlin. Personally I couldn't love someone who believed the polar opposite of what I believe. I'm rather surprised by all the venom aimed at Dean especially by our own party. And I'm positive the repugs are worried about him-the party line repug columnists are all attacking him. And when the moderates actually hear what he says they will vote for him over bush. Don't buy the fear or the smear.

[whirlygigspin]

35. *

from the article: "Being big means rising above the mischievous glee of mocking your adversary. It means not hitting back when you don't need to. It means focusing on those you can help, not those you can punish."

--Reading that just reminded me of *

Good article if the names were changed from Dean to *

But would the fearless press hold * to the same accounting?

Not a chance in hell.

[luisao]

36. Well Put, But..

I agree fully. But that doesn't negate the truth in what Dean said. The DLC needs to see that grassroots dems reject their corporatism through letters to ed., talk radio, etc.

[takebackthewh]

37. Yeah I know

I want to vote for him, but sometimes I get the feeling that if he knew me, he would think I was a jerk.

How are supposed to win the WH with this guy?:wtf: