With Bush in charge, taxes may still rise

[RamboLiberal]

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0319/p02s02-usec.html

Taxes are headed up.

That provocative prediction is likely to pan out, some economists argue, whether American voters reelect George W. Bush or choose John Kerry in this fall's presidential contest.

You certainly won't hear it from Mr. Bush on the campaign trail. And it's possible that Republican tax-cutting fervor could hold sway for some time, given enough electoral support.

But there's a new budget reality that even some conservative economists can't ignore. A massive and growing federal budget deficit now looks increasingly hard to tame without raising more government revenue. That's another word for tax hike.

"It's inevitable," says Bruce Bartlett, a senior fellow at the conservative National Center for Policy Analysis in Washington.

[camero]

1. Taxes will rise without a doubt

The deficit will demand it. Just whose taxes will be raised depends on who gets elected. We all know whose taxes Bush will raise.

[liberalpress]

4. You don't have to raise taxes...

...if you eliminate entitlements. Top priority for second term. Vote Kerry.

[camero]

5. And just which "entitlements" .....

do you want to eliminate? Come on, let it all out. You know you wanna say it.

[liberalpress]

6. OK I will...

The Bushitas will eliminate SOCIAL SECURITY. There. I feel better, thanks.

[camero]

7. We all know that

But do you want them to?

Edit: left my sarcasm radar off, sorry.

[liberalpress]

9. No, That's why I'm working to get them out...

[camero]

11. I forgot you were being sarcastic

:) I'd rather Kerry made the rich pay more of thier fair share than Bush raising them on the middle and lower classes. Which is exactly what will happen.

[NuttyFluffers]

2. bizarre thinking i have....

perhaps this doesn't make much sense, but if any of you have taken some political science courses you might get what i'm trying to mull over.

ever heard of "realigning election?" y'know, not maintaining or critical election, but the bigger more important one? the one that supposedly occurs around every 50 so years? how realigning elections involve a political shift of the entire bell curve along the spectrum to one degree or another?

well, yeah. that's what i'm thinking about. how we are in a 50 year period of conservative (almost reactionary) political debate in USA. and it was kickstarted around Reagan election. well, that'd leave us around 30 more years of stuff like this unless we can shift the entire bell curve from one end of the spectrum to the other. it explains why the democrats seem to be playing the "me too!" game with republicans.

well, if a democrat wins the elections and is forced into raising taxes (to keep the nation solvent) wouldn't that just rally the conservative/reactionaries and justify their call that all democrats are out to raise taxes. and due to the bad fiscal policy of this administration will take several years of cleanup, wouldn't the lean years kerry would have to do to clean this up also further convince them (and maybe the swing moderates) that yeah, maybe their attacks on democrats were right (though they should really pay attention more).

thinking about all this, i'm wondering do i really want kerry to inherit all this mess. granted i can't stand bush and his policies, but would we be better off in sucking up 4 more years, nearly flinging us off the edge into complete destruction, just to prematurely stop the perpetuation of 30 more years of this yo-yoing on the precipice? i dunno, maybe we are at the crisis of all crises, but if this is just a band-aid that'll allow the american people to not wake from until all their precious delusions are shattered by near catastrophe, wouldn't it be better to end this conservative cycle outright? sounds insane, but i'm thinking that in the future we will probably have to deal with the same misconceptions and delusions we are dealing with now. i want bush to deal with his mess, i want him to raise taxes during his tenure, i want him to ride his party into shattering every false merit they pride themselves on. i want them to face the music essentially.

and oddly enough i'm wondering whether letting have another term would be enough of the rope to not only take him out, but the entire neo-con movement for this generation. but then there's the thought: are we really on the cusp of complete destruction of everything that's good about america. can it be afforded to let bush face his music... musing.

[Mountainman]

3. We can take out the whole repub government if enough of us vote

I'm too old to wait until the rest of the country decides that conservatives are ruining the country. I want them out now.

[teryang]

8. Interesting thought but...

...I'll say upfront I don't think it is the way to go. The way to go is to get Kerry in there and then prosecute (or otherwise stigmatize) everyone at the top of the chimp junta for all their crimes. That will end the trend.

They were all let off the hook after Reagan. Their crimes (violating the Constitution) were portrayed as some kind of patriotric effort (Iran Contra). That is what has emboldened them to hitherto unequalled levels of fraud, theft, and treason. They were never called to task for looting the S&Ls of tens of billions of dollars.

I have to give you credit for this line of thought though, because this is what I've always imagined Nader's motivation to be. The problem is that increasing radicalization of political discourse and the attendant damage to the social and economic infrastructure leads to even further extremes rather than resolution. This is what historians learned from the European experience in the first half of the twentieth century. I don't think tens of millions of Americans are willing to again peacefully stand in souplines like they did in the thirties.

[The Zanti Regent]

12. Is there a 36 year realignment cycle in American politics?

Look at this:

1788--Constitution ratified
add 36
1824--Jefferson's Democratic-Republican Party dissolves
add 36
1860--Lincoln elected
add 36
1896--Bryan and Populists take over Democratic Party
add 36
1932--FDR Elected
add 36
1968--Democrats self destruct over Vietnam and Nixon ushers in a GOP majority
add 36
2004????????????????

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

10. Taxes are already rising for the middle class.

State and local taxes have gone up to maintain services due to the come piss on it conservatives' cuts on taxes on the national level.