What is happening to colleges in Florida

[UFForDean]

This is the dribble printed in the normally respectable Alligator.
http://www.alligator.org/edit/opinion/issues/stories/040329col2.html

Islamic teachings, history suggest it’s not quite so peaceful

Every day, I feel bombarded by someone telling me Islam is not the violent, hate-filled religion it seems to be but, instead, the religion of peace.
I don’t see how anyone logically could say Islam is a religion of peace. The terrorists who attacked this nation on Sept. 11, 2001, were Islamic fundamentalists, terrorists following the teachings of the Quran and doing Allah’s bidding in bringing down the great Satan.

Islamic leaders have pushed forth the notion that every good Muslim must fight and destroy the non-believers.

The Quran makes it very clear Muslims “must” present non-Muslims with only three choices: conversion, submission to second-class status under Islamic rule or death.

The problem is not strictly the directive to convert or kill non-believers, but instead the degree to which it is carried out. Islam is not the religion of peace it claims to be. It instead appears - through the actions of its followers - to be a religion of intolerance and violence toward non-believers.

EDITED BY ADMIN: COPYRIGHT

Here is a link to more of his garbage.
http://www.google.com/custom?q=Dale+Griffin&cof=AH%3Acenter%3BGL%3A0%3BAWFID%3A177dba7e5bf7d691%3B&domains=alligator.org&sitesearch=alligator.org&cof=LW%3A350%3BL%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2F%3BLH%3A50%3BAH%3Acenter%3BGL%3A0%3BAWFID%3A177dba7e5bf7d691%3B&sa.x=31&sa.y=9

[drhilarius]

1. uhhhh

what three choices do fundamentalist Christians give people? Also, why is it that most repugs have such difficulty grasping how untenable "every/all" positions are. yes, some Muslims celebrated in the street on 9/11, want to see Israel chased into the see. Not all. Some "Christians" celebrate when abortion clinics are bombed,an act which maims and kills innocents. Does that mean all Christians do this? Christ, apparently Fl. colleges don't require their students to take symbolic logic classes.

[Name removed]

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[drhilarius]

6. Sheesh

I have neither the time nor the patience to respond to your first lovely paragraph, so how about the second.

1. You say "only liberals" make every/all statements (a totalizing statement).

2. Your contention is itself a totalizing statement (you actually make two totalizing statements. The second is implicit-you suggest conservative do not make totalizing statements).

3. Therefore, I s'pose, since you made a totalizing statement, and since liberals are the "only" ones who make totalizing statement...well then i guess you're a librul. Welcome to DU!

[ithacan]

9. Religious Right ARE expanding the power of the govt...

in order to impose their will and "morality". Are you brain-damaged or haven't you been paying attention to how the Republican Party's been hijacked by the religious right. Go here and educate yourself: http://www.TheocracyWatch.org/

The real danger to this world are the so-called "Christian" fundamentalists who are trying to hijack this country and drive the entire world over the cliff of armageddon.

[zonmoy]

18. so

The real danger to this world are the so-called "Christian" fundamentalists who are trying to hijack this country and drive the entire world over the cliff of armageddon.

are you saying that armageddon, basically the destruction of humanity, is a bad thing.

[RainDog]

14. Are you stupid?

"So-called fundamentalist Christians--unlike leftists of every stripe, from secular Marxist-socialists to Islamofascists--don't seek to expand the power of the government in order to impose their will, their morality"

1. who has been bombing abortion clinics in this country for years now?? Abortion is legal, remember, and the anti-abortion faction in this country has been led by religious extremists who want to impose their idea of when life begins upon every person in this nation.

2. who is getting Bush to fund their churches in this country to pay for education which allows them to teach children the lie that evolution is "only a theory." (And if you don't know why this is a lie...what can I say...)

3. who has spent years and years now infiltrating the Republican Party with theocrats who claim that our nation was founded as a "Christian nation" --when the documents of our founders, from Washington's speech at that Baptist church long ago, to quotes from Jefferson in his autobiography, and more, explicitly DENY THIS.

4. Who has tried to impose their religious beliefs on every child in this country by constantly seeking to deny scientific fact and replacing it with religious belief by their opposition to the teaching of evolution, and by trying to make a religious idea an issue which should be included in science curriculum?

5. Who has tried to equate secularism with Marxism?

6. Who is now trying to equate secularism with Islamicfascism?

[RainDog]

16. I forgot to add

-who is trying to alter the Constitution to DENY rights, which goes against the entire thrust of the amendments which, except for brief period of prohibition, has been a vehicle to expand democracy/rights, via an amendment which would make an entire group of citizens excluded because of a religious belief about homosexuals?

-who is trying to erase the history of the pledge by forgetting that the phrase "under god" was added in the McCarthy era? For most of its existence, the pledge did just fine without that addition, but fundamentalists act like the pledge originated with the Constitution, and that it also originated with the phrase under god

-who is trying to claim that god has "chosen" a particular presidential candidate, as though god chooses sides and is, in fact, a Republican???

--and who is trying to influence foreign policy by their religious beliefs by claiming that support for Israel's expansion is necessary to bring about their wished for end of the world??

seems to me that if you've got a group of people who hope to destroy this country based upon their religious beliefs, you are talking about a dangerous and cultic religious group with Jim Jones-like group think...and that this group has so much influence on one party is a truly sick phenomena.

[thexanman]

2. Alligator is pandering to the right

That's why there's one liberal column and TWO with "right" in the title. Hunter Williams' articles are just regurgitations of the crap he heard on Faux News - or at least that's how they read.

All in all, I don't mind the Alligator letting a few right-wing morons write columns, especially if it's going to be total crap like the ones Dale and Hunter write. Reveals right-wingers for what they really are: psychos.

[OneBlueSky]

3. if anyone would like to explore what Islam is really about . . .

you might start here . . . most people commenting on Islam have no idea what the religion is all about . . . if you do a little work, you'll at least have some basic understanding of the tenets of Islam when someone brings the topic up . . .

Discover Islam

http://www.islamonline.net/english/discover/discover.shtml


on edit: another useful site consists of a series of posters about the Islamic religion . . .

http://www.discoverislam.com/

one of the posters is entitled "What Does Islam Say About War?" . . .

Like Christianity, Islam permits fighting in self-defense, in defense of religion, or on the part of those who have been expelled forcibly from their homes. It lays down strict rules of combat that include prohibitions against harming civilians and against destroying crops, trees and livestock. As Muslims see it, injustice would be triumphant in the world if good people were not prepared to risk their lives in a righteous cause.

One reads in the Qur'an: "Fight in the cause of God against those who fight you, but do not transgress limits. God does not love transgressors." (Qur'an 2:190)

"And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for God. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrongdoers." (Qur'an 2:193)

"If they seek peace, then you seek peace. And trust in God for He is the One that hears and knows all things." (Qur'an 8:61)

War is therefore the last resort, and is subject to the rigorous conditions laid down by the sacred law. The often misunderstood and overused term jihad literally means "struggle" and not "holy war" (a term not found anywhere in the Qur'an). Jihad, as an Islamic concept, can be on a personal level--inner struggle against evil within oneself; struggle for decency and goodness on the social level; and struggle on the battlefield, if and when necessary.

[Name removed]

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[RainDog]

12. gee, Islamic fundamentalists sound like Christian ones

here in this country.

..and the Christian Reconstructionists in this country want to impose theocracy here...have no problem with the idea of a civil war to do so, think America should be ruled by "old testament" law...

and they think Bush is their man.

I do not want to be ruled by any theocracy, which is why I support the Constitution, with its strict separation of church and state, because the founders knew the abuses of power in western europe which took place in the name of god.

But, of course, it's crazy to associate all Christians with the right wing nutcases who bray the loudest and who interpret the Bible in such a way to support their theocratic fascism.

...but apparently it's okay to do that if the religion in question is Islam.

It seems to me, though, if you want to help spread liberal democracy around the world, you don't start by demonizing an entire religious group in the region you feel needs reforms.

And if republicans really want to spread democracy, they should also support programs which allow women control over their own reproduction, and support reforms for the education of females, because an across-the-board indicator of greater democracy is a falling birth rate and higher rates of literacy for females.

What is really a joke about this entire discussion is that I bet this same person would have been writing about how important it was to support the Taliban against the Soviet Union when the right was propagandizing against the Soviet Union's foray into Afghanistan back when we funded bin Laden...becase the Soviet Union was full of godless communists...

[rogue11]

7. women's rights

When Islam starts supporting women's rights, then we can talk about it being a religion of peace.

When Islam encourages all of its believers to gain literacy, then it can talk about being a religion of peace.

[teryang]

8. Solution invade their countries, take their resources

...and bomb their homes and families. This is the peace loving Christian alternative.

[donhakman]

10. I WILL SPEAK ONLY FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE

Five years ago a young, proud and unusually loquacious black muslim Washington DC cab driver told me, "There will be no United States within ten to fifteen years from now".

[teryang]

11. Now that was probative

Now I'm really persuaded. That must have been very traumatic.

[RainDog]

13. Christian Fundamentalists

also claim that the world is coming to and end...soon!!

Maybe they're plugged into the same god as that cabbie...the one that spreads hate under the guise of religion.

[OldCurmudgeon]

15. Re: I WILL SPEAK ONLY FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE

That cabbie may be right. In ten years we might be living in the Holy Christian Theocratic Republic of America(TM), rather than the US. Hell, we might be there in less than a year.

[zonmoy]

17. like the other monotheistic beliefs are any better

they all worship the same demon/god.