Armageddon is closer than most Americans realize

[Demeter]

http://www.worldnewstrust.com/wnt-reports/commentary/mesmerized-by-melodic-rhetoric-joel-s.-hirschhorn.html


Mesmerized by Melodic Rhetoric (Joel S. Hirschhorn)

Armageddon is closer than most Americans realize. Beyond catastrophe lies mob rule, a doomsday post-democracy, disintegration, collapse, chaos. Americans sucked into the economic abyss where violence replaces politics...

So what are ordinary Americans doing? Are there massive crowds of screaming, sign-carrying Americans in city streets from coast to coast? No. Or outside congressional buildings and the White House? No. Are there riots and looting by hoards of hungry and angry people who have lost a decent lifestyle? No. Do we see anything like the anti-Vietnam War protests? No. Do we see anything like the urban riots after the assassination of Martin Luther King, Jr.? No. Do we see anything like the rebellion against the British that created our nation? No

What do we see? Millions of people getting notices that they have lots their jobs, getting eviction notices, applying for bankruptcy, trying to get unemployment benefits, standing on long lines to get a shot at few jobs, filling crowded hospital emergency rooms to get medical help, taking their children out of child care they no longer can afford, and buying fewer and cheaper foods or seeking free food.

Compared with rioting Europeans, Americans seem like docile, drugged-out sheep herded towards the economic cliff, mesmerized by melodic rhetoric of political messiah Barack Obama.

No wonder our politicians look like dithering, confused idiots arguing among themselves as we continue falling into economic hell. We simply are not demanding enough of those we elected.

It’s as if most Americans are patiently waiting to be rescued by winning the lottery. Is it hope or stupidity?........

[ChairmanAgnostic]

1. I'lll answer later. I'm waiting in line for the lotto ticket.

[liberal N proud]

2. I guess I had better run out and get my lottery ticket

[IADEMO2004]

3. We just elected hope. Remember November?

[Tace]

4. Demeter -- Thanks For Posting

I'm sure Joel appreciates it, too.

[Demeter]

19. You are entirely welcome

[Tace]

5. Dupe

[mr1956]

6. A modicum of hope mixed with pragmatism

Maybe we're acting like adults. If this scenario didn't play out in the last 5 years, why would we go there now?


(Edited to say thank for the heart from a secret admirer!)

[DUlover2909]

7. It's because no matter how bad it gets here, it ain't shit compared to how it is elsewhere.

People is the US have no idea what real desperation looks like, yet. Real desperation is people drilling into gasoline pipelines for fuel and people eating other people, and that actually happens in other countries. Our hardest times are marginal compared to the poverty experienced in other countries every day. That's why we seem like doped up sheeple.

[ixion]

9. the doped up sheeple are in for quite a surprise then

when they find themselves looting for food.

Just because we haven't experienced that level of desperation recently, doesn't mean it will never happen here...again.

[DUlover2909]

10. I agree, but I don't think it will happen here unless global warming does it.

Just my opinion of course. We're a very wealthy country. We have crazy amounts of resources. If our food supply was really threatened then other countries would suffer greatly, but we wouldn't.

[DemReadingDU]

13. People is the US have no idea what real desperation looks like, yet.

Very true. It's coming, maybe sooner than we think.

:scared:

[shellgame26]

33. Have you ever travelled outside of the US?

I've travelled quite extensively (in fact I live in Asia now) and I can tell you there are places in terms of infrastructure, public education, healthcare and technology that make the US look like a third world country.

[DUlover2909]

35. Yeah, I've been to Canada and Mexico.

I don't doubt that there are other countries that have higher standards of living per capita. But, absolute destitution in the US is very rare. I am just saying that since such a large majority of Americans find it rather easy to feed and clothe themselves that real poverty is something alien to most.

[shellgame26]

36. It's true

that most people living in the urban US are 'comfortably poor'. But I remember back when I served in the military, I was stationed in a place called Ft. Polk in Louisiana and believe me..there were people there who were desperately poor! I'm talking 'looking for roadkill to eat' poor (no kidding), there were trailer park communities hidden away deep into the woods that would make a Brazilian favela look like Club Med

[readmoreoften]

45. Check out Europe and Dubai if you want to feel like a poor relation.

[byrok]

43. Because I do not have the stomach

for arguing, I will only post this reply.

One can take any idea, thought, or situation and always find a way to compare it to "something worse'. It's straw.

People everywhere, even the US know what desperation looks like. Maybe not everyone and maybe not in your world, but that statement is crazy.

I've been homeless. Do you know what its like to lay on the back grate of a factory to gather the warmth from the boiler room below, in upstate NY in January? Do you know what it is like to be so cold that your tears freeze on your face? Do you know what it is like to be so hungry that when you finally do find some discarded, barely edible food, your body rejects even that treat? Do you know what its like to suffer complete agony, knowing that there is no doctor and no help coming?

I could go on, but you get the picture. I don't want to hear all of the wonderful things that I could have done different or better. Cold lonely nights gave me time to think of my options.

Those days are far away now. Although just writing this has me shaking and just a little bit frightened of what could be.

People everywhere know desperation. One person's nightmare can not in fairness be compared to another's. It doesn't work that way.

Many "sheeple" do not act because they feel isolated. Yeah, we know people that feel the same way we do. However, the thought of getting all those people together, in one voice is arduous and scary for many people. Typically, if someone organizes something, many will participate if they can. Organize, sign petitions, spread words. There are tens of millions of people, not "sheeple" who did come together to make a difference. If you build it, we will come. Tell us how.

We don't have to eat our young to know desperation. Desperation, I think we feel it enough. Don't you?

[readmoreoften]

44. Upper middle class white people may have no idea what desperation looks like

But if you're certain combinations of black, latino, working class, uninsured or underinsured, hungry, unemployed, or LGBT, you may very well know what desperation looks like. And I've stayed for long stretches in both the outback of Nicaragua, Mexico City, and Europe. It's comparing apples to oranges. Being poor in a poor community with land is one thing. Being poor alongside hateful middle class and wealthy people who spit on you and pity you has a patina all its own.

[ixion]

8. I was just talking to someone about this yesterday...

so many people seem to just be pretending like nothing is happening, ignoring the gaping maw before us. It's amazingly sad to witness, IMO.

[waiting for hope]

11. Baaaa!

[loudsue]

12. The first thing we need to do is GET OUT OF OUR FEAR....

Armageddon is YET ANOTHER state of mind/fear that is being touted as a reaction to the mess we're in, and the one it seems the dark forces appreciate the most.

Let's try using sanity to figure out ways to get out of a "SYSTEM" of economics in this world that makes masses of people either "controllable" or "uncontrollable", and pull together. There will always be elements of robbers, thieves, and liars. We don't have to be them.

[DemReadingDU]

15. That's easier said than done

We need to start using sanity, now, before the herding behavior takes over where people are fearful because other people are fearful because everyone is fearful.

I'm doing some things, and trying to get my family and friends to think sanely, now. But to no avail. They don't see it coming. And believe me, it's next to impossible to change their minds. Not until they are directly affected. Then, it's too late. And that's when they will become part of the herd, and fearful, panicky.

[Demeter]

18. the First Thing We Have To Do Is Get Out of IRAQ and AFGHANISTAN!

and then liquidate the big zombie banks.

[bertman]

25. Don't you worry. We'll be getting out of IRAQ and AFGHANISTAN quite soon.

Bet on it. They'll need all the firepower available when the shit hits the fan here at home. And the Pentagon's already planning for it. you betcha.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

24. Agreed totally

and furthermore Armageddon is a Judeo-Christian invention meant to scare the masses. I am not buying into it.

[readmoreoften]

46. Fear is reasonable in frightening situations.

As long as we're under the control of capital, we've got every reason for fear. Get rid of it, and we've got every reason to hope.

[starroute]

14. There's some kind of cognitive dissonence in the OP

The author seems to be saying "we're threatened with mob rule and social chaos -- so why aren't we out there rioting in the streets to prevent it?"

That does not precisely compute.

One difference in this country may be that Americans remember Roosevelt/1933 and are hoping we're on the same track now.

Things were really bad in 1931-32, people. The mood was bleak. The Bonus Marchers had been shot down by the US Army (see below). There was a widespread belief that democracy itself had failed. Even Hollywood was turning out gangster movies and monster movies -- people were angry and just wanted to lash out -- and bank robbers had become popular heroes.

Then Roosevelt came into office and things changed. By 1934, that mood of desperation was gone. Things weren't that much better right away, but people had faith that something was being done.

I think we're all just holding our breath and waiting for a reprise -- and we're not ready to start throwing yogurt like they do in Iceland until we know how that turns out.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonus_Army

On 28 July, 1932, Attorney General Mitchell ordered the police evacuation of the Bonus Army veterans, who resisted; the police shot at them, and killed two. When told of the killings, President Hoover ordered the U.S. Army to effect the evacuation of the Bonus Army from Washington, D.C.

At 4:45 p.m., commanded by Gen. Douglas MacArthur, the 12th Infantry Regiment, Fort Howard, Maryland, and the 3rd Cavalry Regiment, supported by six battle tanks commanded by Maj. George S. Patton, Fort Myer, Virginia, formed in Pennsylvania Avenue while thousands of Civil Service employees left work to line the street and watch the U.S. Army attack its own veterans. The Bonus Marchers, believing the display was in their honour, cheered the troops until Maj. Patton charged the cavalry against them — an action which prompted the Civil Service employee spectators to yell, "Shame! Shame!"

After the cavalry charge, infantry, with fixed bayonets and adamsite gas, entered the Bonus Army camps, evicting veterans, families, and camp followers. The veterans fled across the Anacostia River, to their largest camp; President Hoover ordered the Army assault stopped, however, Gen. MacArthur—feeling this free-speech exercise was a Communist attempt at overthrowing the U.S. Government—ignored the President and ordered a new attack. Hundreds of veterans were injured, several were killed — including William Hushka and Eric Carlson; a veteran's wife miscarried; and many other veterans were hurt.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JDPriestly]

21. In the 1930s, most people lived on plots of land and had gardens

In the 1930s, women could sew.

The percentage of people living on farms was much greater than it is now. Those who lived on farms had animals, which meant they had feed sacks, which meant they could sew ordinary, everyday clothes out of the feed sacks. Back then, an ordinary woman had a couple of house dresses and a dress for Sundays at church. (If you live in an old house, you know that closets were small.)

There were not TVs, computers. If a family had a car, it probably had only one car. The living standard was a lot lower. In some respects they were better equipped to handle a recession/depression.

Today, Americans have a lot of stuff they haven't been using. Most Americans could survive for a while just on the junk they stored in the garage (or in the attic or in the basement). That's why we aren't panicking. In some ways, we are better equipped.

People who are out of work should be given the opportunity to stake out a small garden and plant it for their family. The most important thing when you are having a hard time economically is to empower yourself. Do something positive to improve your life. We humans are given tremendous energy, but when we don't use it in a positive way -- like work, we become depressed and angry. Gardening and positive community organizing such as to make sure your neighbors are OK are positive ways to use your anger.

[Are_grits_groceries]

17. There has always been an Armageddon around the corner.

If you don't think the Depression and WWII or the Civil War were scarier then I don't think you have read much and used your imagination.

My friends and relatives and I have formed networks. Those that can are growing large gardens. We are trying to help each other now. We are also working with other people who are trying to help those that are in a lot of trouble. This is besides the attempts by the overburdened government.

In my view, the only way we will get out of this in a quicker and efficient way is to help each other. We can become insular and dare anybody to approach or reach out now and try to build a community framework that may help. I am no starry eyed idealist. However, I prefer to do this than make plans to ransack the Piggly Wiggly.

Protests help, but there has to be more. I'm not counting on the politicians to help a lot. I hope they can come up with more, but I won't count on it. The other option for me is to become terribly depressed and apathetic and let the forces of anarchy start to run. After anarchy running will be the military running after them. The hounds of hell will be unleashed, and they won't be chained again easily if at all.

[DCKit]

20. Always, always just around the corner. Send your donations.

Sorry, but Joel is calling for an uprising about seven years too late. Nine, if we were to have prevented * from stealing the WH.

We finally got the President and (mostly) the Congress we should have had in 2001 and NOW we're supposed to begin agitating? Sorry Joel, but it's either too late or too early to rise up. Right now we're just waiting to see what happens with the current plan. At least Obama hasn't got us into another war (or three) in his first few weeks.

[Downtown Hound]

22. I'm not exactly sure what you want

Maybe you aren't aware of what happened in St. Paul during the RNC only six months ago. Or the DNC in Denver. Or in Oakland just a little while ago. If it's riots or protest you want, they're there. Maybe not as many as you'd like, but they're definitely there. There have been thousands of people arrested for protesting the Iraq War. There have been massive protests. There have been major electoral changes.

For myself, I don't think rioting or chaos is the answer. Protest? Sure, always a good thing. Civil disobedience? Again, always a good thing. Rioting? How is destroying the infrastructure of a community going to help the economy? Frankly, I'm glad that we don't have more of that going on here. It really doesn't solve anything except give the government an excuse to behave even more repressively. If that makes me a sheep, then so be it. But I've done enough protesting and choked on enough tear gas to where I can honestly say I don't think that applies to me.

We just had a major power shift in this country. Have a little patience and don't stop your activism. I'm curious. What kind of protest activities have you done lately? Have you rioted? Did you go to the RNC and break windows with the anarchists? If so, then at least you're practicing what you're preaching. If not, then why are you here asking others to do what you won't do yourself? Talk is cheap. Lead by example and stop criticizing others for not doing what you won't do yourself, if that is in fact what you are doing. I don't know you and don't know what you've done. But that's just my take on it. Peace.

[BeFree]

23. Heh

Land of the Free, and Home of the Brave!

Free to ignore the truth and brave enough to ignore it!

We're number 1!

[debbierlus]

26. People get VERY nasty when you point out things they don't want to hear

If you point out that throwing TRILLIONS at banks that we could have bought outright for less and decry the pick of Tim Geithner as a Wall Street insider who was appointed to revive a system that doesn't and won't work...

You are an Obama hater and basher.

If you tell people that Obama's economic team consists of insiders who are vested in keeping the status quo even though it will sink the economy...

You get called school children names such as downer debbie.

I really am not looking forward to being right about this horror. I am trying to wake up my fellow 'liberals' who should be contacting the White House and protesting instead of posting pictures of Obama and Michelle kissing. I will keep trying.

[Are_grits_groceries]

27. I have read a lot of the bad news

about a lot of sectors. I think things are probably a whole lot worse than people realize. They are probably a whole lot worse than even the people who think they know what is going on.
I have no problem with protesting. BTDT.
But again, what would you have me do?? Stay up all night or hide under the bed? Stay glued to the computer for every bit of bad news? Go live with my brother where I could barely be found in the country?
I have contacted the WH and elected officials. However, panic is a waste of energy. If I am going to use as much energy as panic will take, then I am going to put it to good use.
Panic for 15 minutes and then get on with it.

Resisting Home Evictions Becomes a Group Effort
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/18/nyregion/18foreclose.html?hp

This kind of effort makes sense.

[truedelphi]

30. Boy, do I ever hear you

It would be so nice to have the luxury of giving Obama the benefit of the doubt. To say, "okay but he just got in, and if he makes blunders his first six months, at least we aren't at war against Iran."(As Mccain probably would have gotten us socked into immediately)

But there is only so many trillions of dollars President Obama can give out or have printed up - the more money distributed to the looney tunes on wall Street, the worse off we will be.

He needs to be making better choices. He is listening to the wrong people, and the reason that the likes of Rubin, Summers and Geithner are advising him is because they are his appointees.

[crimsonblue]

28. We just don't care anymore. n/t

[Juche]

29. Thats why we had an election

I agree we should be protesting more, but one of the major benefits of democracy is that when things go bad, you have non-violent ways to try to address them (lawsuits & elections). Hence 2006 and 2008 were historically lopsided election. I think most people are just waiting to see if something is done. And young people are getting more and more involved in politics, and more and more progressive. Not by alot by any means (40% to 51% turnout).

Now if 4 or 6 or 8 years go by and Obama and the dems push for pussified half measures and/or allow themselves to be intimidated into doing nothing, then you may see rioting as people will realize the peaceful means aren't working.

Also I'd guess in the US we are more afraid of the police than in Europe (as a guess), so that dampens protests. The police here are probably more violent. Plus I guess we've gotten used to protests doing nothing. People protested vietnam like hell, and the war still lasted 17 years. Its fairly easy for politicians to ignore protesters.

[readmoreoften]

47. If politicians ignore protesters, where is the democracy?

We had an election, a choice between two people, who, beyond rhetoric, are pretty similar on the political spectrum. We still have secret executive orders. We still have black hole CIA sites and a president who has OK'd loopholes to keep them open. We have an election system financed by banking interests and insurers.

The police here are violent for a reason. We allow it. We condone it. We make excuses for them. In Greece, the entire nation riots when a young person is shot and killed unjustly. Here, we kick and rec the article and shake our heads.

[Juche]

49. I don't think they are similiar on the political spectrum

Obama may not be a diehard progressive, but he is decently left. As an example, Obama has supported public financing of campaigns by matching small donations. That would help fight the banks and insurers from controlling politics.

You are right about the police, and it is sad. When I read about what happened in Galveston where the police beat up a 12 year old girl, then tried to intimidate her and make up false charges against her it filled me with rage, but I didn't do anything about it. I tried to email the DA in Galveston, TX but he took his email down. But email isn't the same as what happened in Greece.

[The Hope Mobile]

31. Better to be over prepared than under prepared. That's not doomsaying.

And far fewer people have ever regretted being TOO ready. As far as those who don't do a lot to be prepared . . . my guess is that quite a few of those don't have any resources left to plan ahead. They're already flying by the seat of their pants.

[many a good man]

32. Our job is to vote Obama out of office in four years if he doesn't fix everything

Until then we are just supposed to keep our mouths shut!

:sarcasm:

[robinlynne]

34. You know, your last line really reminds me of something. I lived in Brazil for

20 years. as an adult. I'll never forget the cultural lesson of my lifetime there. I went to see "the day after" in the movie theater. The one where an atomic bomb explodes, maybe 20 years ago?
At the very end of the movie, I sat there waiting for help to arrive. Everyone else left the theater. I was still sitting there. My culture, American, had taught me that someone would come and save the day. Every other person in that theater knew full well that you cannot rely on a government for help. and that is how the third world lives their lives. We rely on each other, family and friends. Americans wait for help.
There are hundreds of examples, but that one came to mind because of your last sentence.

[Blue_Tires]

50. good insights...

how did you like living in Brazil? I've always wanted to go

[robinlynne]

51. My heart is still there. I go whenever I can. It was a wonderful life. I only came back

to be closer to my mother in her old age. But we here do not really know how to live. We know how to be productive, very productive....

[robinlynne]

52. P.S, go by all means! email me first and I'll give you some suggestions.

(like don't take your passport to the beach....)

[OneBlueSky]

37. what's lacking in today's crises is Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. . .

the uprisings during the 60s did indeed percolate "from the bottom up," but not without the considerable heat provided by Dr. King and others . . . today King is remembered for his commitment to non-violence, particularly en route to political change . . . what many may not realize is that by encouraging non-violent demonstrations and peaceful change, he was simultaneously encouraging demonstrations and change -- a critical point often overlooked . . . what we had in Dr. King was a respected (by most) national leader who was also respected internationally and who was on the side of the people, rather than the corporations . . . the "have-nots" rather than the "haves" . . .

that's what we need today: a national leader who is respected both nationally and internationally and who is on the side of the people, rather than the corporations . . . is that leader Barack Obama? . . . only time will tell, but he certainly seems to have the potential . . . I believe that his heart is in the right place, and that he has the requisite skills, and he's certainly in the right position . . . unfortunately, he's allowing political considerations to color his thinking . . . as one would expect from a politician -- and particularly a successful politician . . . but those times have passed . . .

what Obama has yet to realize, imo, is that our current state of affairs is so critical as to be far beyond whatever "post-partisan" implies . . . it now has to become "post-political" . . . our leaders have to get beyond the politics of making nice with the corporations (and their reps in Congress) that have already driven this nation so far into the toilet, and continue to do wo . . . Obama has to stand firmly with "we, the people" if he is to have any chance at all of succeeding . . .

what this means is taking on the corporations, head first and at full throttle . . . and doing things like . . .

-- strictly re-regulating industry (particularly industries that provide necessities like healthcare, banking services, and utilities) . . .
-- abandoning NAFTA, or fixing it so that it doesn't harm American workers . . .
-- punishing corporations that move their factories to foreign nations with lax (or no) labor or environmental laws in order to increase their profits . . . as well as those who move their operations offshore to avoid US taxes . . .
-- ending corporations' standing as "persons" in legal proceedings . . .
-- instituting an excess profits tax on obscenely excess profits (see, for example, the oil companies) . . .
-- setting limits on executive compensation . . .
-- etc. etc. etc. . . .

all while creating and nurturing policies and programs that 1) strengthen the middle class, and 2) restore the nation's manufacturing base . . . probably in new and emerging industries like alternative energy, energy conservation, hemp products, and small farming . . .

does Obama have it in him? . . . does he fully understand and appreciate exactly where we are and where we are heading, absent some very radical changes? . . . can the humanitarian idealist in him overcome the political pragmatist? . . . I really, really, really hope so . . .

[Demeter]

39. It's Kind of Hard to Agitate for Groundswells When You Are At the Political Pinnacle

A President cannot do community organizing--it's a different game with different rules that need to be broken.

If Obama wants the public on his side, he's got to stop waffling on his campaign policies and start revoking Bush policies broadly. And prosecute Bushbots.

[OneBlueSky]

40. "A President cannot do community organizing" . . .

I agree, and that's not what I was implying . . . if that's how it came across, my apologies . . .

obviously, Obama's approach will have to differ substantially from King's . . . Dr. King was on the outside looking in, while Obama is (as you noted) not only on the inside, but at it's very peak . . .

what I was trying to say is that we need a new national leader who is squarely on the side of the people in the great American class war, as was Dr. King . . . if that person is on the inside, all the better . . . if that person happens to be president, better still . . . much, much, much better, in fact . . .

Dr. King made things happen working outside the system (demonstrations, strikes, sit-ins, resistance, eventually legislation, etc.) . . . given his new positon, Obama can make things happen working within the system (universal healthcare, alternative energy, hemp industries, bankruptcy reform, etc.) . . .

Obama is positioned to accomplish much that is good for the nation and its people -- but only if he chooses wisely and does what's right for the many, not for the wealthy few . . . whether or not he becomes the kind of leader we so desperately need remains to be seen . . .

[wuvuj]

38. Replace some of the religious symbols with $ signs and the flag..

...and you've got it?





And I think you even get a free ticket! What a bargain. :woohoo:

[southernyankeebelle]

41. What the Hell do you Suggest We do?

The middle lower class and the working poor have been in the spiral of going down for a long while. Know no than seemed concerned about it. There were no help for the working poor to get affordable healthcare, housing etc. This is where government should be helping people. All they got from the republicans was shut up pull your boots up work. If they only would give the people a living wage maybe they could have worked to better themselves and their families. Now that it is effect upper middle class and the wealthy now we hear from them. The lower middle class and the working poor are to damn tired to go out in the streets. They are to busy struggling to make it day to day. They don't have any savings at all. Most people want help not charity. Forgetaboutit marching in the streets. They don't listen to us.

[readmoreoften]

48. Well, first of all, we should've been more courageous around strike-time.

Second of all, we shouldn't've listened to the arguments of greedy rich people.
Now we're in a pickle.

It's a fight. It's a struggle. There's an enemy. You're right marching in the streets isn't enough. But striking our labor is the most power we have. We're still the people who make the actual wealth of the world. We'll need solidarity for that. A return to neighborliness. An ethic of sharing with strangers--that way most won't get hurt too badly.

[relayerbob]

42. Not so sure riot would help

Like the riots of the 60s and after King, the damage will be done to the working classes, the rich will simply have rationalizations for cutting us out, or cutting us down (with bullets, that is)

[Waiting For Everyman]

53. That guy's ambition to remake the Constitution doesn't thrill me.

I'll stick with the original. And how are these "destitute" people able to buy all these guns he writes about? He strikes me as a RWer in disguise. And just why should we copy the violence in other countries just because other countries are doing it? The copiers are the sheeple in my book... like him, for example.