Bill Moyers and Thomas Frank: America's Demented Politics Let the GOP Off the Hook for Their Mess

[marmar]

from Bill Moyers' Journal, via AlterNet:



....(snip)....

BILL MOYERS: Okay, they compiled the worst track record on jobs in decades. And they ended up with the worst stock market in decades. I mean, it was a decade of conservative failure. And yet, Obama's their villain?

THOMAS FRANK: Think of all the crises and the disasters that you've described. And I would add to them things like the, what happened in New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina. And the Madoff scandal on Wall Street. And, you know, on and on and on. The Jack Abramoff scandal. The whole sordid career of Tom DeLay.

All of these things that we remember from the last decade. I mean, some of them that we're forgetting. Like who remembers all the scandals over earmarking, anymore? And who remembers all the scandals over Iraq reconstruction? All that, you know, disastrous, when we would hand it off to a private contractor to rebuild Iraq. And it would, you know, of course, it would fail.

Those things have all sort of been dwarfed by the economic disaster and the wreckage on Wall Street. But I would say to you that all of these things that we're describing here are of a piece. And that they all flow from the same ideas. And those ideas are the sort of conservative attitude towards government. And conservative attitudes towards governance. Okay?

BILL MOYERS: That government is a perversion.

THOMAS FRANK: Government is-- yeah, government is a perversion. And to believe that the federal government can be operated, you know, with all of its programs, can be operated well and do things that are good for the people, is, as you say, is a perversion.

And they look at someone like Barack Obama and it makes them seethe. Because that's, you know, that's what he's trying to do. What conservatism in this country is about is government failure. Conservatives talk about government failure all the time, constantly. And conservatives, when they're in power deliver government failure.

BILL MOYERS: Not merely from incompetence, you say, but from ideology, from philosophy, from a view of the world.

THOMAS FRANK: And sometimes from design. ...............(more)

The complete piece is at: http://www.alternet.org/story/145249/bill_moyers_%26_thomas_frank%3A_how_america%27s_demented_politics_let_the_gop_off_the_hook_for_their_giant_mess?page=2

[fasttense]

1. Thanks for posting this. It is very interesting.

But, I think, one thing they didn't touch on. On why don't Democratic leaders and think tanks defend government consistently is because they half believe what the conservatives are selling. They still believe in "free" markets. The Democratic majority for the most part still believe in the magical mystery cure of trickle down and supply side economics.

Remember when President Obama's press office claimed he was reading
Tom Friedman’s environmental bestseller Hot, Flat, and Crowded? I mean to even consider reading, let alone advertise you are reading it, a book by the master of conservatism and the architect of this 2nd RepubliCON Great Depression suggests you have bought into what he is selling.

[snagglepuss]

5. Its as if legitimacy is conferred if one is receptive to repuke idiocy .

The only reason why democrats don't want to defend governmet is that they have bought into the notion of privatization.

[TankLV]

17. But it's NOT "free markets" and "unregulated"!!!

It's really a CORPORATE WELLFARE STATE!!!

Privatize the rewards and socialize the RISKS and PENALTIES!!!

[democrank]

2. K & R

for truth

[Overseas]

3. K&R. Great article.

Republicans of recent decades have been trying to prove that government is bad, appointing incompetents to key government positions, practicing shameless war profiteering, socializing risk while privatizing profit, etc.

That's another reason all the bipartisan posturing bothered me so much. Trying to cozy up to the party of alleged war criminals and privatizers who wrecked our economy.

I wanted more Roosevelt style teaching about how the Republicans had pushed us into plutocracy again and how we needed to restore the balance through strong financial regulations, millions of productive jobs (green energy, conservation and addressing deferred maintenance on our infrastructure), de-privatization, and giving taxpayers a real bailout to match the Bush gift to Big Finance after the Bush Stock Market Crash-- Medicare for Everyone.

[zeos3]

13. +1

[Tippy]

4. K&R...Good catch marmar, thanks.

I am sending links to this transcript to the Putnam County Democratic Party...

[Gman2]

6. This is why we have to get loud and pissed, look dangerous.

[nightrain]

7. when I saw this segment of the program, some aspects resonated as being

true for me and some did not.

For instance--"And they look at someone like Barack Obama and it makes them seethe. Because that's, you know, that's what he's trying to do. What conservatism in this country is about is government failure. Conservatives talk about government failure all the time, constantly. And conservatives, when they're in power deliver government failure."

To a degree, I think Obama represents an attempt to have a successful governing system, and on the other hand, when I hear about Rahm and Zeke's attempts to privatize, reduce, and destroy Medicare and SS, I don't agree with Frank. Rahm and Zeke's plans, and to the degree that Obama promotes their ideas and efforts, have more in common with Republican ideals than traditional Democratic values.

I am often astounded that these efforts, done by Dems, are sacrosanct, but if done by Republicans would be considered a scourge. Something is terribly amiss with these New Dems and the DLC advocates.

[MisterP]

11. that's the other thing that's wrecking America:

if one's opponent is rancid enough, that automatically makes one golden: by this logic, Romania's Antonescu is a Good Guy because the Iron Guard tried to depose him in 1941

"X is opposed by Republicans," so we should throw our weight behind them/it

[zeos3]

14. +1

[Doctor_J]

8. Think of how media reorientation might be accomplished

and you will begin to see the rebirth of democracy. Under no other circumstances will we get the country back from Palin/Boner/Beck fascists.

[Blue Owl]

9. No shit!

Who keeps propping up that crashed, smoldering heap of shit known as the Republican Party?

The M$M just can't keep applying enough lipstick to that rotting turd.

[NecklyTyler]

16. Republican props

Exxon Mobile
Conoco Phillips 76
Lockheed Martin
Boeing
Northrop Grumman
General Dynamics
Raytheon
L-3 Communications
United Technologies
SAIC
ITT
KBR
Honeywell
GE
Navistar
Computer Sciences Corp
Booz Allen Hamilton
Textron Bell
Elbit Systems

[nightrain]

20. lest we forget that Dems are on the corporate teat too.

[Martin Eden]

10. "conservatism in this country is about is government failure"

That phrase pretty much nails it.

They are anti-government, but they want to be in charge of it. They don't belive in the underlying pricipal of government for, by, and of the people -- so when they do get their hands on the governmet they use it to enrich themselves and their corporate cronies, and leave the people's government in shambles.

[Miss_Underestimated]

12. It's the 'ol transference trick - people switched the blame for the disaster

Dubya created to Obama (a Rovian scheme most likely). We have to come up with a countertransference plan if we as democrats are going to implement change for the better

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transference

[TankLV]

18. Just like they did with 911!!!

Criminally incompetant and negligent bush* and his dick WERE RESPONSIBLE for 911 and GET TO USE IT AS THEIR SUCCESS!!!

That's when I began spitting blood when I became angry and haven't calmed down since...

[zeos3]

15. More from Thomas Frank

Check out his book "The Wrecking Crew"

[mwb970]

19. BTW, the link is to Page 2.

I always try to remember to go back to Page 1 before copying a link and posting it. Sometimes I even succeed.

:)

[marmar]

22. I remember going to page 2, but for some reason I thought I went back to 1....

..... before posting the link.


Aging GenXer.....I'm losing my faculties. :)

[JohnWxy]

21. thanks for this post. Moyers deserves another "fighting to get the truth out" prize.

[Blue_Tires]

23. kick for truth

[JDPriestly]

24. If Obama is taking the blame, it is his own fault.

He has failed to prosecute the criminals in the Bush administration. Thus, the American people think they just imagined that crimes occurred and have suppressed the thought as untrue and irrelevant.

And just wait, Obama appears weak and wounded. The Republicans will grab some insignificant mistake by someone in the Obama administration -- someone having an affair or someone who did not disclose something. Any kind of small mistake will do.

And the Republicans will smear the entire Obama administration and start suing people and stealing headlines.

Whey can't the Democrats learn how politics is done?

If Democrats don't point the finger at the crooks in the Republican Party and out them in the criminal courts, the finger will be turned toward the Democrats. This is elementary politics. People pay attention to scandals. The Obama administration is foolish to play so nice and clean. After all we are talking about people who stole the treasury blind -- Halliburton -- proved to have cheated on contracts. And who got a share of the Halliburton profits -- Cheney.

Then there is the torture, the illegal renditions, etc.

Then the economic crimes on Wall Street from fraud in selling mortgages to fraud in selling derivatives.

But how many indictments do we have?

Democrats need to read the history of the U.S. The American people want justice. If they don't get it from one government, they will elect another one. Obama is not giving us justice. He is ignoring the crimes of the mighty.

[certainot]

25. what the fuck do americans expect? 1000 radio stations spewing coordinated UNCONTESTED

repetition, beating the crap out of all progressive causes and candidates 24/7/365 while the left that pledged to get they back turn the dial and plug in another CD and whine.

until the left starts picketing those stations and calling their local sponsors they will continue to give the corporate GOP a free speech free ride, the biggest soapbox in the country with call screeners to make sure no real calls get through to challenge the RW blowhards.

and the pundits and media experts have no clue because they read and watch, they don't listen. fox? it's a tick on limbaugh's ass. the visual whipped cream on the talk radio lie turd pie.

talk radio is the perfect political weapon because the left thinks it's just a minor incovenience.

[olegramps]

27. You are right on.

People fail to see that the most powerful weapon in any society is control of the media. Our Forefathers were acutely aware of this most primary of requirements and realized that if a democracy was to function it was imperative that the citizens be keep fully informed of the issues. Unfortunately, the Fourth Estate has become, for the most part, little more than a propaganda mill for the ultra-right to destroy progressive causes. There is only one way for this to be rectified. That is massive boycotts of sponsors products.

However, the neo-cons know that they have little to fear from the liberal camp. A lot of smoke and no fire. You only have to see the lack of unity in the leadership of the Democrats in congress to abandon any hope for significant improvements for the working class who they claim to represent. The have been given control of both houses of congress and the presidency and have demonstrated they are powerless to effect any significant changes. The situation is so disheartening that millions of working class Democrats have abandoned any hope for the change they believed they were voting for when they elected Obama.

[h9socialist]

28. Better yet . . .

Let's start an US version of "Radio Rebelde"* . . . Just a few minor tweaks to Air America and more power transmitters and we'll be on our way . . .

* If unfamiliar, look it up . . .

[certainot]

29. the new curt ruling makes RW radio even more profitable- they will soon

become wholly owned subsidiaries, won't even have to sell ad time.

[h9socialist]

30. Oh, I'm sure that the Rush-man will always be amicable . . .

. . . to profiting off the stupidity of his listeners by selling ad time. He's a tried and true capitalist, don't ya know?

[certainot]

31. and they were going out of biz, ad time will be icing

[democracy1st]

26. Kick