Sacrilege at Ground Zero C. KRAUTHAMMER

[azurnoir]

No German of good will would think of proposing a German cultural center at, say, Treblinka.

A place is made sacred by a widespread belief that it was visited by the miraculous or the transcendent (Lourdes, the Temple Mount), by the presence there once of great nobility and sacrifice (Gettysburg), or by the blood of martyrs and the indescribable suffering of the innocent (Auschwitz).

When we speak of Ground Zero as hallowed ground, what we mean is that it belongs to those who suffered and died there – and that such ownership obliges us, the living, to preserve the dignity and memory of the place, never allowing it to be forgotten, trivialized or misappropriated.

That’s why Disney’s early ‘90s proposal to build an American history theme park near Manassas Battlefield was defeated by a broad coalition fearing vulgarization of the Civil War (and wiser than me; at the time I obtusely saw little harm in the venture). It’s why the commercial viewing tower built right on the border of Gettysburg was taken down by the Park Service. It’s why while no one objects to Japanese cultural centers, the idea of putting one up at Pearl Harbor would be offensive.

<snip>

Even New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who denounced opponents of the proposed 15-story mosque and Islamic center near Ground Zero as tramplers on religious freedom, asked the mosque organizers “to show some special sensitivity to the situation.”

Yet, as columnist Rich Lowry pointedly noted, the government has no business telling churches how to conduct their business, shape their message, or show “special sensitivity” to anyone about anything. Bloomberg was thereby inadvertently conceding the claim of those he excoriates for opposing the mosque, namely, that Ground Zero is indeed unlike any other place and therefore unique criteria govern what can be done there.

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/Article.aspx?id=184863


X posted from I/P

[closeupready]

1. Oh, bullshit, Krauthammer.

:eyes:

[The Wizard]

2. Krauthammer is a failed psychiatrist

whose nuts will be hanging from his chin if he gets one more face lift.

[Zoeisright]

3. Oh, just go away and suck your thumb, you spoiled brat.

What a dipshit.

[Vinnie From Indy]

4. Krauthammer is a fuckwad supreme

His comparisons are laughable examples of a bigot trying and pathetically failing to explain his bigotry.

[mlevans]

5. You have the right to your own opinions certainly.

And I agree wholeheartedly with your right to hold and express them. Even if they are sheer and utter nonsense. Which this is.

[baldguy]

6. A Mosque at Ground Zero is not only appropriate - it is necessary.

given the stupid, insane RW apoplexy about it.

[roxiejules]

7. Opinion from Canadian Muslims....

Mischief in Manhattan: We Muslims know the Ground Zero mosque is meant to be a deliberate provocation

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Mischief+Manhattan/3370303/story.html - Ottawa Citizen

New York currently boasts at least 30 mosques so it's not as if there is pressing need to find space for worshippers. The fact we Muslims know the idea behind the Ground Zero mosque is meant to be a deliberate provocation to thumb our noses at the infidel. The proposal has been made in bad faith and in Islamic parlance, such an act is referred to as "Fitna," meaning "mischief-making" that is clearly forbidden in the Koran.

So what gives Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf of the "Cordoba Initiative" and his cohorts the misplaced idea that they will increase tolerance for Muslims by brazenly displaying their own intolerance in this case? Do they not understand that building a mosque at Ground Zero is equivalent to permitting a Serbian Orthodox church near the killing fields of Srebrenica where 8,000 Muslim men and boys were slaughtered?

It's a repugnant thought that $100 million would be brought into the United States rather than be directed at dying and needy Muslims in Darfur or Pakistan. If this mosque does get built, it will forever be a lightning rod for those who have little room for Muslims or Islam in the U.S. We simply cannot understand why on Earth the traditional leadership of America's Muslims would not realize their folly and back out in an act of goodwill.

As for those teary-eyed, bleeding-heart liberals such as New York mayor Michael Bloomberg and much of the media, who are blind to the Islamist agenda in North America, we understand their goodwill. Unfortunately for us, their stand is based on ignorance and guilt, and they will never in their lives have to face the tyranny of Islamism that targets, kills and maims Muslims worldwide, and is using liberalism itself to destroy liberal secular democratic societies from within.



Authors:
Raheel Raza is author of Their Jihad ... Not my Jihad, and Tarek Fatah is author of The Jew is Not My Enemy (McClelland & Stewart), to be launched in October. Both sit on the board of the Muslim Canadian Congress.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raheel_Raza

[baldguy]

10. The RW thinks bombing weddings & torturing children will bring an end to the jihad.

Yet opening a religious community center dedicated to peace & education is "a deliberate provocation"? Only to those looking for any reason to be provoked.

The building is more than two blocks from the WTC site. How far away do they need to be? 6 blocks? 12 blocks? 5 miles?

[Alcibiades]

11. It was written by two people, who claim to be Canadian Muslims

"The fact we Muslims know the idea behind the Ground Zero mosque is meant to be a deliberate provocation to thumb our noses at the infidel."

The authors apparently speak for all Muslims.

"Do they not understand that building a mosque at Ground Zero is equivalent to permitting a Serbian Orthodox church near the killing fields of Srebrenica where 8,000 Muslim men and boys were slaughtered?

Do Fatah and Raza not understand that this mosque is not to be located at Ground Zero, but at a former Burlington Coat Factory? Are Burlington Coat Factory stores some sort of sacred ground?

"When we try to understand the reasoning behind building a mosque at the epicentre of the worst-ever attack on the U.S., we wonder why its proponents don't build a monument to those who died in the attack?"

It's not at the epicenter of anything other than a former Burlington Coat Factory. There is going to be a memorial to the victims of 9-11, of course, but the authors apparently don't understand that, either, probably because they are Canadian.

"If this mosque is being funded by Saudi sources, then it is an even bigger slap in the face of Americans, as nine of the jihadis in the Twin Tower calamity were Saudis."

Guilt by association. The authors must really be mad that the Bush regime flew leading Saudi nationals, including Osama bin Laden's brother, out of the country following 9-11. In today's globalized world, there are few degrees of separation between anything and anything else. If I don't take offense that slave labor was used to make the stuff I buy at Wal-Mart, why would it bother me that Saudis are building a mosque in Manhattan? Many churches in this country stand on land taken from Native Americans by Christians. Where's the outrage over that?

"Most Americans are wary of mosques due to the hard core rhetoric that is used in pulpits."

Most Americans are also wary of churches due to the hardcore rhetoric that is used at the pulpit.

"As Muslims we are dismayed that our co-religionists have such little consideration for their fellow citizens and wish to rub salt in their wounds and pretend they are applying a balm to sooth the pain."

Sooth the pain? Really? No, you say the sooth, and soothe the pain. Hard to believe that this was written by supposedly literate persons.

It's a little ironic that Reza is on the board of the "Canadian Muslim Congress," because that organization--which may have had as many as 300 members at one time--claims to support "progressive, liberal, pluralistic, democratic, and secular society where everyone has the freedom of religion." A progressive, liberal and pluralistic interpretation of our first amendment (again, something I wouldn't expect an outsider to understand) means that folks are free to buy land and build churches, mosques, or any other religious structure they desire, wherever they desire.

[roxiejules]

12. People who have been victims of 9/11 need consideration, too

I highly recommend watching this CNN video:

http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-482501?hpt=Sbin

'I know it’s a very difficult issue. I’m hoping that the whole thing will be resolved where people who have been victims of Sept. 11 will feel that they were considered and the people who want to build it would hold off and build it somewhere else'.



P.S.
Oh, by the way - your home is standing on land taken from Native Americans, who were my ancestors.

[Alcibiades]

17. Mine, too.

Though I'm only 1/16th, common enough in the Carolinas, though I will never register, because tribal benefits, whatever they may be, ought to go to folks who are actually native, not white folks with some tiny bit of native ancestry.

That's the point, though. In 1688, my ancestors fled Tours and the tender mercies of His Most Catholic Majesty, Louis XIV. I was brought up to remember the long laundry list of sins of the Catholic Church, a terrorist organization for much of that period. To this day, this universal, infallible institution maintains virtually the same dogma it did back when it was burning people at the stake and conducting inquisitions. In 1572, Catholics massacred thousands of protestant reformers in Paris, yet dozens of Catholic churches have been built there since that time.Whenever anyone says anything good about Catholicism, I immediately think of its persecution of my ancestors, Jews, and many religious minorities the Church has claimed, at various times, to be heretical.

And yet what, if anything, does this have to do with anything? Why take umbrage at a mosque/community center and not individual Muslims? How about not invading Iraq on false pretenses? If I had lost a loved one, I'd be offended as hell that George Bush sent US forces to kill and die on a false pretext. If the families of victims need to be outraged, let them be outraged at how the blood of their families was used to justify more killing.

It's easy to throw the Constitution out the window when you're talking about unpopular people. It's also wrong. As a freethinker, I'm offended by the stupidity of people who believe that their old bearded guy in the clouds takes a personal interest in whether you eat little wafers, pork, or who requires you to wear special magic underpants. Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities, so there is always somebody being victimized by someone who believes in a different magical system. Should these people then have the right to veto any given house of worship? Honestly, I'd be for it, because there are more than a few that offend my sensibilities. But it's not in the Constitution. This is yet another "oh, think of the children" moment of mock outrage. It's common in law to use the standard of what a reasonable person would do. Would a reasonable person take umbrage at this? Not unless they were so sensitive that it would be surprising that they could get through their daily life. There are probably thousands of Muslims living and praying to their god five times a day within a two block radius of the WTC. Are we to declare that area a Muslim-free zone, simply because someone might be offended? Christian missionaries have used our invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan to proselytize there, but no one take offense at that, even though we have killed far more than died on 9-11-01.

[roxiejules]

18. Good points...thanks for the discussion

Six degrees of separation...English side of family arrived in VA around 1690 and ended up in NC.

[Alcibiades]

20. It was one province at that time

Depending on how long it took them to get here--the crown didn't officially decide that the Province of Carolina was too big to manage effectively until 1729, when the bifurcation took place. North Carolina is, was, and always will be the better of the two. :hi:

[emilyg]

13. Good read.

[Douglas Carpenter]

19. a NYT article about Imam Feisal and his plan for the center written before the crazy hate campaign

Muslim Prayers and Renewal Near Ground Zero

By RALPH BLUMENTHAL and SHARAF MOWJOOD
Published: December 8, 2009

snip:

“ As a Sufi, Imam Feisal follows a path of Islam focused more on spiritual wisdom than on strict ritual, and as a bridge builder, he is sometimes focused more on cultivating relations with those outside his faith than within it.

snip:

Those who have worked with him say if anyone could pull off what many regard to be a delicate project, it would be Imam Feisal, whom they described as having built a career preaching tolerance and interfaith understanding.

“He subscribes to my credo: ‘Live and let live,’ ” said Rabbi Arthur Schneier, spiritual leader of Park East Synagogue on East 67th Street.

snip:

The mayor’s director of the Office of Immigrant Affairs, Fatima Shama, went further. “We as New York Muslims have as much of a commitment to rebuilding New York as anybody,” Ms. Shama said. Imam Feisal’s wife, Daisy Khan, serves on an advisory team for the National September 11 Memorial and Museum, and Lynn Rasic, a spokeswoman for the memorial, said, “The idea of a cultural center that strengthens ties between Muslims and people of all faiths and backgrounds is positive.”


snip:

“ Building so close is owning the tragedy. It’s a way of saying: ‘This is something done by people who call themselves Muslims. We want to be here to repair the breach, as the Bible says.’ ”

The F.B.I. said Imam Feisal had helped agents reach out to the Muslim population after Sept. 11. “We’ve had positive interactions with him in the past,” said an agency spokesman, Richard Kolk. Alice Hoagland of Las Gatos, Calif., whose son, Mark Bingham, was killed in the hijacked plane that crashed in Pennsylvania, said, “It’s quite a bold step buying a piece of land adjacent to ground zero,” but she said she considered plans for the site “a noble effort.”

snip:

Joy Levitt, executive director of the Jewish Community Center, said the group would be proud to be a model for Imam Feisal at ground zero. “For the J.C.C. to have partners in the Muslim community that share our vision of pluralism and tolerance would be great,” she said.

Mr. El-Gamal agreed. “What happened that day,” he said, “was not Islam.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/09/nyregion/09mosque.html?_r=1

link to the cordoba intiative:

http://www.cordobainitiative.org /

link to Imam Feisal Press Conference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfIPO7CVflA

.

[COLGATE4]

8. Charles Krauthammer

The only talking head as ugly on the inside as he is on the outside

[marmar]

9. He is clearly insane.

nt

[Jefferson23]

14. Who but the neocons and the other RW idiots could pervert the word

"sensitivity" in such a short period of time.


The man has no shame.

[katty]

15. Dracula's valet, Krauthie--whackjob

[ElectricLightDem]

16. Correct me if I'm wrong, but...

...didn't Muslims die in the 9/11 attacks, too?