Paul Krugman (NYT): Buying Into Failure

[Dudley_DUright]

As the Bush administration tries to persuade America to convert Social Security into a giant 401(k), we can learn a lot from other countries that have already gone down that road.

Information about other countries' experience with privatization isn't hard to find. For example, the Century Foundation, at www.tcf.org, provides a wide range of links.

Yet, aside from giving the Cato Institute and other organizations promoting Social Security privatization the space to present upbeat tales from Chile, the U.S. news media have provided their readers and viewers with little information about international experience. In particular, the public hasn't been let in on two open secrets:

Privatization dissipates a large fraction of workers' contributions on fees to investment companies.

It leaves many retirees in poverty.

more...

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/17/opinion/17krugman.html?oref=login&pagewanted=print&position=

[vinnievin777]

1. He was for the war in Iraq too

I don't buy the liberal NY Times line.

Vinnie Vin
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932852344/qid=1086103239/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/103-2852423-2023849?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

http://www.vinnievin.com

[breadbox]

2. Krugman was? I thought he was one of those opposed from the start

I don't think that Krugman was for the war in Iraq, even at the
beginning, and certainly not after the disaster it became.
He has been one of the most effective thorns in the side of the
* administration.

He is one of the only reasons to read the NYTimes, and his absence
since the election is the main reason I have been unaware of their
coverage of anything since then.

Seriously, Krugman is great. Check out his past takes on unverified
voting....

[Red State Blues]

4. KRUGMAN ABSOLUTELY AGAINST PRIVITIZATION!!

PERIOD.

On the war I was a little surprised that I didn't find more against it (pre-war) but:

"The shifting rationale for war with Iraq — Saddam was behind Sept. 11 and the anthrax attacks; no, but he's on the verge of developing nuclear weapons; no, but he's a really evil man (which he is) — has a similar feel."

"None of this should deter us from invading Iraq if the administration makes a convincing case that we should do so for security reasons. But it's foolish and dangerous to minimize the potential economic consequences of war, let alone claim that it will be good for the economy."

Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

[Dudley_DUright]

5. And this from an article just before the war started:

"We all hope that the war with Iraq is a swift victory, with a minimum of civilian casualties. But more and more people now realize that even if all goes well at first, it will have been the wrong war, fought for the wrong reasons — and there will be a heavy price to pay.

Alas, the epiphanies of the pundits have almost surely come too late. The odds are that by the time you read my next column, the war will already have started."

more...

http://www.pkarchive.org/column/031403.html

[Red State Blues]

7. Good Find

I knew there was more.

The link for my quotes is:

http://www.pkarchive.org/column/091302.html

[wabeewoman]

3. Too???

He isn't for privitizing social security. Krugman has been outspoken against the bush administration from the start and I do not remember him being for the war. Sources????

[vinnievin777]

6. I saw him on an interview

He said he is a hawk. He may be against Bush going into Iraq but he is not against going into Iraq. At least that is what I gathered from the interview.
I think it was an interview with someone on MSNBC.

Vinnie Vin
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932852344/qid=1086103239/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/103-2852423-2023849?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

http://www.vinnievin.com

[Red State Blues]

8. Hey

I checked out your website, we're both too cool to waste time arguing with each other. I agree with you that the NYT was the "liberal" paper of record that really, really helped Bush get us into Iraq. Their apologies don't really do us or dead Iraqis much good now. Krugman wasn't one of the ones pushing the war however.

Anyway, I don't know what else to say other than you are somehow mistaken, Krugman is so intelligent that he can be easily led off topic or go to far into a hypothetical (if that makes sense). I'm very confused about all that's going on in this country and with this board. I am not unsure when I say that Krugman is NOT a hawk.

Check out the 2 links we've provided from the archive on his war views and if you have any doubts about his stance on SS privitization go here: http://www.nytimes.com/top/opinion/editorialsandoped/oped/columnists/paulkrugman/

Yes, they charge for the older articles but they can all be found in the archive.

Krugman is the MAN! There is NO ONE that I would rather have running statistics on Votergate. I hope he finihes up his textbook soon.

[vinnievin777]

15. Yeah

It's cool I mean everyone has something we disagree with. No big deal I am not arguing.

Vinnie Vin
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1932852344/qid=1086103239/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/103-2852423-2023849?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

http://www.vinnievin.com

[Red State Blues]

9. Nuanced position

"He may be against Bush going into Iraq but he is not against going into Iraq."

Remember back when you were a traitor if you disagreed with the administration? Krugman was already catching all kind of hell for disagreeing with the administration twice a week/every week.

""None of this should deter us from invading Iraq if the administration makes a convincing case that we should do so for security reasons."

This is quite safe to say if you don't think there is a chance in hell that the administration can make a convincing case. (After 9/11 wouldn't you have been ready to go in if they HAD made a convincing case? Even if your answer is no, I don't think a yes answer makes you a hawk.)

Hopefully this resolves the issue with Krugman.

It's very important that the Social Security discussion that this thread was starting continuees though.

[rodeodance]

10. Most have already bought into the "crisis" myth put out by Bush and

agree that things need to change. Fear is being promoted also. The jaugernaut rolls on, and on and ........

[Red State Blues]

12. Hope

I remember a week or so ago I saw Lindsey Grahm start an interview with "We all agree that the system is in crisis ..." or some such non-sense, in fact all the republicans were starting out their discussions as if it was accepted fact (some Dem's too - we've either got to get rid of these losers or force feed them "framing") AND the media or opposition blindly accepted the statement as fact. Here in the last week I haven't seen them getting away with this so easily. Maybe the media is in the process of descending its first testicle.

[tngledwebb]

11. How NYT has kept Krugman on a tight leash

on almost everything except economic issues shows how the 'liberal' MSM operates. NYT regular 'liberal' is M.Dowd, a spineless fool. Also compare their number and type of NYT 'liberal' voices to to those on the right.

Or read the Daily Howler.com and their archives for the full story.

(I know this is old news to most of us, but this is for newbies and moderate Dems.)

[Jason Bradfield]

13. Krugman - solid mainstream centrist economist

Krugman is an excellent writer and even better economist. however, it is important to keep in mind that the radical conservatives have so shifted the economic debate that Krugman appears liberal. In fact, he is very much a moderate on economic issues. Nothing wrong with that, it's just important to keep in mind.

Anyone who is interested in solid liberal economics written by superb writer should check out Doug Henwood's "After the New Economy."

As for Social Security privatization I am curious to see how quickly the right will move on this. Could this end up like Clinton's health care plan - sabatoged by an otherwise friendly Congress? I doubt it. We need to start thinking seriously about what to do when social security privatization passes.

Jason Bradfield

jaybradfield.blogspot.com

[MISSDem]

14. Don't say anything bad about Paul Krugman. He is a

national treasure.