Interesting LTTE today - re RWer going to China for Stem Cell medicine

[zbdent]

http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/2005/01/03/news/editorial/letters/10542997.htm

Sorry, you have to register. First letter. But here's the gist:

<snip>

As I started to read the article, however, my sympathy turned to anger. A devout Catholic who opposes stem-cell research travels to China to take advantage of that very same research? What amazing hypocrisy. But after thinking about it for the better part of the day, I realized that this was not a story of moral bankruptcy but of hope. Indeed, it belonged on the front page and was properly headlined.

Although it wasn't said explicitly in the article, the story's essence was that, in a time of crisis, a deeply religious man had abandoned his religious principles in order to place his life in the hands of the science he previously derided. I choose not to view this as hypocrisy, but, instead, to see it as a ray of hope.

<snip>

The article also brought a sharp focus to the moral issues involved in stem-cell research. Basically, there are only two morally defensible positions: You oppose the research, in which case you are unable to accept the benefits of that research without being a morally bankrupt hypocrite; or you support the research, in which case you must accept responsibility for the unpleasant moral implications it entails.

There is no middle ground -- you cannot have your cake and eat it, too.

<snip>

[AllegroRondo]

1. To Conservatives, the rules never apply to *them*

stem cell research is wrong, unless its to help my dad get cured of parkinsons disease

abortion is wrong, unless my girlfriend gets pregnant

[wtmusic]

2. Oh those crazy RWers...

Convictions are solid as a rock until the moment they are affected personally

[Ian David]

5. Here's the original article

And keep in mind this is FETAL stem cells, not EMBRYONIC stem cells!

I have no problem with embryonic stem cells. They're undifferentiated cells no more alive than your bone marrow.

FETAL stem cells, on the other hand, come from something that has a head, limbs, and maybe a brain.

This doctor in China is using fetuses that "should be 16 weeks old to
achieve the best results."

This is far, FAR different than what is being done here in the US.

I consider this a heinous and un-proven procedure.

This doctor is "the first in the world" to do this.

"Among them is Van Golden, a Christian, anti-abortion Texan who has sold his house so that he can travel to communist, atheist China and have Huang inject a million cells from the nasal area of a foetus into his spine."

"I don't agree with abortion, but it will happen anyway. In the US, we do abortions but don't use the cells. In China, they don't just take life and destroy it - they give something back. It's like lemonade out of lemons. You take something bad and you make it good." Such reasoning requires a moral somersault, but it is one that can be done easily in China. That is enough to generate hope.


'I don't know how it works'

Dr Huang Hongyun cultivates the cells of aborted foetuses and injects them into the brains and spines of his patients. His method is controversial, but his results have led hundreds of westerners to his Beijing surgery. Jonathan Watts was given unprecedented access to the doctor and his patients

"Four thousand a day. That's a waste. Something good should come out of something bad. The people who don't believe that aren't in a wheelchair." The day after we meet him, Golden takes his turn in the operating room, where Laura Fairrie, a film-maker with Guardian films, has been given a rare chance to film the controversial procedure.

Huang does not decompress the spinal fluid or decouple the vertebrae, which, some critics have speculated, may be the reason for the temporary improvement in patients after surgery.

The cells, harvested from the olfactory bulbs inside the noses of foetuses, seem to have unusual properties, which may include the ability to stimulate change in the nervous system. Ideally, says Huang, the foetuses should be 16 weeks old to achieve the best results.

The rest:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/china/story/0,7369,1363339,00.html

Guardianfilms' exclusive TV report on Huang's work goes out on Newsnight
tonight on BBC2 at 10.30pm. For a short trailer, go to
guardian.co.uk/guardianfilms/china

[Spacemom]

7. It's like lemonade out of lemons.

Did someone really say this concerning an aborted fetus??

I'm pro-choice, but that just struck me as a seriously bad choice of words. :eyes:

[yellowcanine]

8. Yeah that one got me as well. If a pro choice person had said that they

would be rightfully skewered.

[Liberty Belle]

9. China has forced abortions as part of its 1-child only policy.

These four-month old fetuses may not even have been from voluntary abortions, but forced ones. What a hypocrite!

[BrklynLiberal]

3. Amazing the excuses they can come up with when they are caught with their

"values" down around their ankles!!!!!!!!!
This is not a brand new story. I read about this a month or two ago, and I was incensed!!!!! This guy is way more than a f**king hypocrite. As was said above...when it comes to their own damned life, all of a sudden stem-cell research is not such a sin. If you read the original story, in China, they were NOT using stem cells from very early-term abortions. They were doing very late-term abortions (in some cases 6 month pregnancies!) because they wanted to get the stem cells from fetal nasal cavities which they felt were the most useful for what they were doing, therefore they needed fully formed fetuses!!!!!! It was way beyond hypocrisy!!!!
Here is the original article
http://www.guardian.co.uk/china/story/0,7369,1363339,00.html
Here is the quote I was talking about (it is 4 months, not 6 months)

Once the desired area adjacent to the damaged segment is located, Huang, looking through the keyhole incision with a microscope, inserts the cells using an ultra-fine needle to minimise the risk of damaging nerve fibres. The cells, harvested from the olfactory bulbs inside the noses of foetuses, seem to have unusual properties, which may include the ability to stimulate change in the nervous system. Ideally, says Huang, the foetuses should be 16 weeks old to achieve the best results. He says the mothers all give their consent for the embryos to be used in this way and do not receive payment. The Guardian asked to be shown where they come from, but was told this information was too sensitive.

[fob]

4. "You can't have your cake and eat it, too" - That saying is backwards,

or more appropriately SHOULD be backwards! Of course I can eat my cake if I have it, how else does anyone eat cake? It should be said thusly; "You can't EAT your cake and HAVE it, too". See? Written that way it implies that some people not only have cake, that once it's eaten they STILL HAVE cake! Sorta the rich get richer with more imagination.

If I have cake, you can bet I'm eating too!

/rant


As for the ethically challenged rw'er, what else is new?

[Ian David]

6. I would love to find out how the guy's fetus is doing in his spine

I would love to find out how this treatment has worked out for him:

Van Golden
9989 County Road 2448
Royse City, TX 75189-7311
972-635-6696