Orwell and 1984

[dolgoruky]

The other day I had an very interesting conversation with an aquaintence of mine. We we're talking about George Orwell, and she commented about how he was one of the few writers in the post-war period to describe the totalitarian nature of the Soviet state in books like "1984" and and "animal farm".

What struck me most about her comments, was 1) How unlike the Soviet Union "1984" was, and 2) How similar "1984" is to the United States today.

Just a thought.

[Loonman]

1. Good point

Although I object to your Soviet apologism.

[dolgoruky]

2. Did I apologise about the Soviet Union?

I said that life in the Soviet Union was nothing like Orwell describes in "1984".

Is that apologism?

[gandalf]

3. I am not sure if the NSA appreciates your opinion

... or my post, or my letter to the editor that will show up via CAPPS II the next time I try to enter the US.

BTW, 54 years and 3 days or so ago Orwell died.

[non sociopath skin]

4. I'd be interested ...

in why, exactly, you think the USA today is like Orwell's 1984, dolgurky.

The Skin

[dolgoruky]

5. Many similarities

Paranoia, use of fear to control the population, double-speak, growth in surveillance.

All a bit Big Brother, really. (and I don't mean the game show!)

[Cat Atomic]

10. Therer are many similarities.

Look at the way Oceania's population goes from hating one enemy to another with ease. "We are at war with East Asia. We have always been at war with East Asia". This rewriting of history to control the present is big in America- and it's not just a product of the Bush Administration.

For instance, we were first told that we had to be in South America to fight communism. When the Soviet Union fell apart, suddenly we had to be in South America to fight drugs. Now they're already saying it's to fight terrorism.

The whole Iraq invasion rationale is another example. Bin Laden was morphed into Hussein, and we were told he was a threat to the US. After we invade, suddenly we've got the leadership and the media chanting that it was never about that. If you think so, you're just imagining things- it was about democracy all along.

Look at the way this administration in particular whips up American hatred for their political opponents. Why should we hate the French? We shouldn't- but our leaders and their whoring media outlests constantly tell us to.

Granted, Orwell only had a 2 minutes hate, while we get it pretty much 24-7.

There are many other comparisons.

Also, Animal Farm was an allegory for Stalinist Russia, of course- but 1984 was never supposed to be Russia. Didn't Orwell say in the original preface that part of his point was that it could happen anywhere?

[amber dog democrat]

6. Fascism may be the natural

form most governments will lean towards, but that said I agree there are some very disturbing points of comparason.

I think we may be headed in that direction - yet I have a hard time seeing the Chimp as Big Brother.

[prolesunited]

7. I agree there are many similarities

Between Orwell's dystopian vision and the present-day U.S. I think he accurately captured the use of language and rhetoric to alter the meanings of things and the rewriting of history. He also pinpoints the use of an interchangeable enemy that the government uses to channel hate and anger.

Here's my favorite passage (and the origins of my screen name):
If there was hope, it must lie in the proles, because only there in those swarming disregarded masses, 85 per cent of the population of Oceania, could the force to destroy the Party ever be generated. The Party could not be overthrown from within. Its enemies, if it had any enemies, had no way of coming together or even of identifying one another. Even if the legendary Brotherhood existed, as just possibly it might, it was inconceivable that its members could ever assemble in larger numbers than twos and threes. Rebellion meant a look in the eyes, an inflexion of the voice, at the most, an occasional whispered word. But the proles, if only they could somehow become conscious of their own strength, would have no need to conspire. They needed only to rise up and shake themselves like a horse shaking off flies. If they chose they could blow the Party to pieces tomorrow morning. Surely sooner or later it must occur to them to do it? And yet-!

Here's the entire keyword-searchable text online:
http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/

[muriel_volestrangler]

8. 'Animal Farm' was directly aimed at the Soviet Union

while '1984' was about a totalitarian state - set in Britain as a satellite of the USA - drawing from both the Soviet Union and Nazi experiences. Much of what you mention - propaganda keeping the populace in fear of the other side, paranoia, state surveillance - applied to the Soviet Union as well.

[rman]

9. well, despotism can take a hold anywhere.

i don't think 1984 was specifically about the ussr.