The coming acquital of Martha Stewart will sound death knell for Bush.

[Solomon]

When the jury considers the outrageousness of prosecuting Martha Stewart while Ken Lay sips pina coladas somewhere, we will smell that fresh air of jury nullification. Jury nullification every once in a blue moon is good to show the bastards who is really in charge.
Jury nullification means, "don't bring us bullshit like this."

It's going to screw Bush good because it's going to be talked about and talked about and the KenLay/enron/halliburton/energycrisis will once again rear its ugly head and pop the balloon.

Serves the bastards right. The bastards.

[brokensymmetry]

1. I hope you're right...

but do you really expect this?

[Solomon]

4. Oh they'll get it alright.

She will testify and the jury will wonder what the big fucking deal is. Sure it wasn't completely kosher what she did, but if she makes a good salad on the stand, they're going to aquit. The prosecution better hope they filed some lesser included charges or they'll go bust.

[aquart]

2. IF the jury gets it. If they realize they're being used.

I want her acquitted too.

[T Bone]

7. I heard this on NPR the other day as just a sentence in a report

One of the obstruction of justice charges comes from Martha "proclaiming her innocence to the press" in the IMCLONE matter ?

The charge states that by doing this she was attempting to reduce the harm to her own company. Her lawyers have attempted to have this charge thrown out due to her freedom of speech to proclaim her innocence if she wants to, however the judge has allowed this charge to stay in?

This is beyond comprehension. We have a legal system that ASSUMES innocence until guilt is proven, yet a potential defendant cannot proclaim they are innocent even before charges are brought? WTF is that about ? If this stands you might as well say a defendant is not allowed to speak in court on their own behalf. I would think any half-assed lawyer can get a jury to see it is harrassment and persecution on this construct alone.

When Martha gets off, and I think she will quite easily, because she is not guilty of anything, nothing. The spotlight will be on Enron. By the way, has Ken Lay proclaimed his innocence in the press on any potential charges ? Will it be an obstruction charge when he comes to trial, if ever?

[Solomon]

12. Ahhh TBone!! I been bitching about this point ever since they

charged her. After taking away our right to a lawyer, our right to even be charged, now they are saying you are not allowed to say "not guilty". It's surreal. I can't believe the lawyers in this country haven't raised an uproar over these developments.

[hang a left]

29. Please, remember Coby's press conference with his wife

[sendero]

3. I'm no fan...

... of Ms. Stewart, and I think she could have nipped this whole problem in the bud early on - but this prosecution is political and I sure hope the jury smites the prosecutor with a stinging rebuke.

[DemoTex]

5. I wouldn't bet the farm on "jury nullification."

That's a tough nut. It was a tough nut for DC Mayor Marion Barry in his entrapment trial in Washington, DC. Barry did time and everyone knew he was set up.

[Solomon]

15. Barry did time because of the fucking judge. Anybody else convicted

of a misdemeanor drug possession charge and a first offense at that, would not have served any jail time. The jury fixed the prosecution, but the judge fixed the jury. He was definitely out of line with the sentence.

[DemoTex]

21. So, what's the diff?

Barry was among friends, so to speak. Martha Stewart might not be. Can you name a high-profile jury nullification case other than Marion Barry's? I'm racking my brain and cannot. I'm open, however.

[Solomon]

22. The difference is the Barry trial was not true jury nullification.

The jury did convict in that case. In Martha's case, they'll be no conviction for the judge to fuck with.

[DemoTex]

27. My point is, or was ...

If ever there was a jury for nullification, it was Barry's. Martha, as much as I support her, had best not put one single egg of hope in that basket. That is not to say, of course, that her attorneys should not push like D-8 bulldozers for nullification. I hope they do! Go Martha. Screw Kenny-boy! Can you picture Ken Lay getting J.N. in Houston? Bwaa haaa haaa!

[rumguy]

6. I also think she'll be acquited - this whole thing is absurd.....

[Lorien]

8. The case is flimsy as hell

all built on the fact that the number "60" (her sell point number) was written in a different color of ink. The media will demonize her and milk the trial for all it's worth. The real test will be on the public; will they swallow the corporate anti-dem propaganda, or will they think for themselves? Will they even remember Ken Lay? Will they see that there are one set of rules for democrats (women democrats, especially) and another for repug corporate CEOs who knowingly bankrupt their corporations and employees for personal profit? We'll see....

[Solomon]

10. When she gets acquitted they'll be an uproar from the repugs

and the controversy will bring all that shit back out of the closet they've been shoving in there for three years. I can't wait.

[freespeechhere]

9. Martha should fry

You know she was a trained stock broker before she got into cake making didn't you?

Just because she's not a big Ken Lay fish doesn't mean that she didn't break the law.

Personally, I think she's just as creepy. She never smiles on her shows and she controls all of her guests...nobody is having any fun; they're afraid they are going to incur her wrath by accidentally knocking over the salt shaker.

[HawkerHurricane]

11. If Martha should be executed...

what punishment do you suggest for Ken Lay? Death by slow torture?

[freespeechhere]

13. Slow torture for Ken Lay sounds great!

}(

[ncrainbowgrrl]

16. Nah- not slow torture

But he should have to make each and every recipe in each and every cookbook that Martha's ever contributed to. These meals will be served to the families of troops sent abroad to fight in Bushy's Iraq/Oil Conquest

[HawkerHurricane]

18. Agree except...

vice feeding the families of the troops, he should be sent to Iraq where he can actually feed the troops...

It would put him closer to combat than he has ever been.

[hang a left]

30. So you think she doesn't smile enough?

I wonder if they will give her the death penalty?

[Imajika]

14. Nonsense

"It's going to screw Bush good because it's going to be talked about and talked about and the KenLay/enron/halliburton/energycrisis will once again rear its ugly head and pop the balloon."

I think this is one of the most optimistically foolish predictions I've seen recently on DU. Whether Martha Stewart is convicted or found not guilty will have absolutely, positively no impact whatsoever on Bush. None, zero, nada, zilch. Enough time has passed from most of the corporate scandals that much of the nation has simply moved on and are not paying much attention to it anymore. Whatever happens to Martha is just not going to be able to bring the story back front and center. The shelf life on scandals like this are sadly, very limited. This story is well passed its sell date.

I do however agree with you about jury nullification being a good thing every once in awhile. Sometimes, and quite possibly in this case, prosecutors become ridiculously overzealous. Every so often the citizens of a given community need to slap the State/Federal Government in the face and do precisely as you said - say "don't bring us bullshit like this".

Imajika

[Solomon]

17. I respectfully disagree with you and

note that I said I "respectfully" disagree. Jury nullification is huge. It will be a controversy and it will be talked about. And if it's talked about, it will only be in the context of all the bigshots who got away.

[Imajika]

20. We will just have to agree to disagree

And after reading my post again, I realize I shouldn't have written it in such an obnoxious way. You were indeed respectful and I wasn't. Calling your post optimistically foolish was uncalled for and I apologize for that.

I do completely disagree with you though. I honestly don't think what happens to Martha Stewart will have even the slightest effect on Bush. Time will tell.

Cheers

Imajika

[Unforgiven]

23. Which made

me think about what if any parallels there are between what Lay did and what Stewart did or is being accused of. I know, I know. but listen, if Stewart walks you know damn well the (R's) are going to spin this to death until they make Lay look like a god.

Christ they might even run Lay for veep, for the goddamn chimp!

And yes,

They are that arrogant!

[Solomon]

24. You have a point, especially when you consider that Bush did the

exact same thing at Harkin. I don't think they'll try to go down this road though. Too many potholes there.

[Poiuyt]

32. Neil Bush, too

He just made a ton of money in a one day trade.

[Solomon]

25. Imajika. You're a class act.

:loveya:

[Old and In the Way]

19. A political show trial.

Martha's real offense? Being a hi-profile financial supporter of the Democratic Party.

What she is guilty of is something that has gone on since markets were 1st made. Yes, it's dirty, but we'd need to build another 1000 prisons to house all people who are guilty of getting inside stock tips.

She claims she had a standing agreement to sell if it got to a certain level....that sounds pretty normal.

Regardless, her sale still lost her money (I think). Her "crime" has cost her millions in the value of her publicly traded company. But, to your point, it is the unfair application of the law that disgusts me.

Hey, but at least her Republican Inquisition won't lead to impeachment.

[cid]

28. She is not charged with selling stocks illegally..she is charged

with obstruction of justice. they couldnt get her on the stock thing so they made something up. I cant stand the woman either, but she is getting a bum deal on this I think.

[jokerman93]

26. I think Marha Steward is hot

Is that gay?

[forgethell]

31. martha is being screwed good

What is this, a perosn can't say they are NOY guilty and get hauled into court for it? I hope the judge makes them PROVE that she was lying before letting them go further with this, but I am not hopeful.

But I am not quite sure how this can be pinned on * ?

[Solomon]

33. I didn't say it would be pinned on Bush. What I'm saying is that the

whoop and wailing of the repugs from an acquital would lead to people discussing all the other bigwigs who are far more guilty and have not been prosecuted.

[chookie]

34. Hey Sol -- what's your take on the Fastow deal?

What they're telling We the Sheeple is that the cute little deal that Fastow got -- a mere ten years in Club Fed, and a warm fuzzy Family Values arrangement so one of the indicted Fastow parents can be at how with their children while the other serves time (awwwww!) -- means that Fastow is going to sing about Skilling and Lay.

I think I've heard "this matter will be investigated by Justice Dept professionals" one too many times to believe that justice will EVER be done in this case.

I think His Chimperial Majesty hath commanded Ashcroft to put lickspittles on the case who will "find" that Kenny Boy is utterly, totally, absolutely innocent of any wrong-doing -- and that some lowly bureaucrat is the "evil-doer" of Enron. I think that the chance of Kenny Boy being exonerated are better than those of Martha -- who has to depend on the execution of justice, and can't be guaranteed a certain outcome, as Georgie Boy was when his Dad appointed one of his pals to look into his sale of Harken stock a week before the company vaporized.

Do you think my reading between the lines is correct, or can we still entertain the fantasy that Ken Lay will ever face the consequences of his crimes?