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Something about Haiti really brings out the Bush apologists!

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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 08:46 PM
Original message
Something about Haiti really brings out the Bush apologists!
What in the world could it be?

I'm just saying...
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displacedtexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. I noticed that, too.
Their instructions must read:

Post no facts.
Post only generalizations.
Repeat fact-less generalizations.
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Mika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #1
20. Just like the anti Cuba w* policy apologists
Post no facts.
Post only generalizations.
Repeat fact-less generalizations.
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Demonaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
41. nicely put
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SadEagle Donating Member (664 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
2. Perhaps people just don't want to believe their country would do this.
I have a lot of this feeling myself. I don't want the stories about Aristide being overthrown by our troops to be true, although I wouldn't be at all surprised if they were :-(
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 08:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. no, I don't think that is it
after Iraq and all of BushCo's criminal actions, who wouldn't believe it?
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. I feel like that.
If they did this, anything is possible.
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. if they get away with this, it is another very bad sign
2004 is going to be a rough rough ride
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rusk2003 Donating Member (224 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
38. Hello Think People And Iam Not Surprised At All
From a country or should I say from a line of Republican Rulers Regan Bush I and Bush II of overthrowing Countries and Leaders Lets go over them. Regan Overthrew I believe Greanda and surrported the Anti Government Guerilla Groups. of Nicaraga then started a massive campaing by surplying money and arms to the anti government fighters to overthrow that Governmnet. All Becasue he did not liike the types of governmets they had and their practices.

Bush I

He overthrew Panama and Arrested that countries President Manul Noriega

Bush II
He ordered Liberia President to resign and Leave
He Overthrew Iraq's Government
and now the Whole Hati Thing And God Only knows What is Next

But that is my point Republicans think they OWN the World and want to tell every one to mind their own business yet Do the opposite. When Dems like Clinton invade or send troops is it becasue of stuff like ethical cleansing and mass murder not oil business and political phlosophy. I do not even see dictators invade countries on the levels REpublicans do.
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knight_of_the_star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
6. I'm not shocked by it
Although other people will be.
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Moonbeam_Starlight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:04 PM
Response to Original message
7. We've done it before and we'll do it again
Chile, September 11, 1973 ring a bell for anyone?

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billbuckhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Haiti is a warning to Venezuela and others
Like most everything Bushco does, it's more high stakes poker playing.
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #7
47. it does now
two years ago, no.

but i'm awake now and very very pissed off.
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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
9. read some truely incedible shit on DU today.
:eyes:
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. it was amazing today
morans!
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onecitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. did you happen to catch........
Washington Journal this morning? The first call-in segment was wild!! They were ripping bush apart! Caller after caller. I loved it!! It woke me up big time. One caller said bush better look out that they were mad as hell and they weren't gonna take it any longer. The host was stunned I think. I really think it upset him (upset him for bush I mean).
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wellstone_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. today? its been about a week
the clever disruptors and what I call "sleeper disruptors" (run those counts up and send your five bucks for the star and then just gnaw away at the membership with divisive posts)

Today is a peak experience but the weekend was bad as well
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Kathy in Cambridge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Last night was really bad
I wonder how these idiots manage to escape the tombstone...
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wellstone_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #14
42. hey, I've done MY part
I've been "alerting" as though I was getting paid by the complaint. And yet the same people keep posting flamebait
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Kathy in Cambridge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #42
45. Me too-but it doean't seem to be doing any good
I think they just continue to fly under the radar...
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JasonBerry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #45
48. poor thing
:cry:

Isn't it just AWFUL when everybody doesn't agree with you?

:cry:
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Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. I've been shaking my head a lot lately
when I read DU.

And it does seem as though a coup emboldens them.
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #16
26. especially when it happens in Haiti
:mad:
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Demonaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #9
46. good shit? bad shit?
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jonnyblitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
11. its predictable. usual suspects.
n/t
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Kathy in Cambridge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Ain't that the truth
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bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:47 PM
Response to Original message
17. I get this feeling every time people of color are in the cross-hairs
Maybe it's just my own paranoia and insecurity, but majority black countries and their leaders aren't given the same status by the media, our government, or even by most Americans. I guess I shouldn't be surprised when a majority white power structure here in the U.S. crushes and discredits the voices and concerns of the black minority.

I am more concerned that some here in this gathering of Democrats seem content with making backhanded smears of lifelong leaders of our black community who would defend one of their own in Haiti, and in turn provide aid and cover for the Bush cabal's manufactured revolution and coup. Kind of a one-two punch.

We should be supporting and defending our leaders here. Instead, I fear that the hatred and contempt, or misunderstanding that persists here for some of our nation's black leaders has kept some from embracing their concerns and protestations regarding Haiti.
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. that is what i am perceiving as well, bigtree
the zeal of racism...
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. I was wondering how far down.....
... the thread I would get before someone would mention the 800 lb gorilla sitting on the table.

What's Haiti's main feature? It's population is black. For that reason and that reason alone there are way too many Americans and ONE is too many DUer willing to look the other way.

What other explanation can there be?

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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. that's also why CNN and others LOVE to show the riots
POS bastards

and I goto nytimes.com and see "How can we help Haitian democracy?"

How about we stop undermining and overthrowing it?

grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #24
29. EVERY black leader in America has had their guts ripped out to weaken them
Edited on Mon Mar-01-04 10:14 PM by bigtree
Then ignorant, fearful folks come behind and pick up their cleverly planted attacks whenever these leaders stick their heads up to protest. We don't often enough consider the source of the attacks.

Don't forget Cointelpro:

COINTELPRO: The FBI's Covert Action Programs Against American Citizens
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/churchfinalreportIIIa.htm

Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., Case Study
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/churchfinalreportIIIb.htm

The FBI's Covert Action Program to Destroy the Black Panther Party
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/churchfinalreportIIIc.htm


FBI COINTELPRO Documents
__________________________________

Communist Party, USA
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/cpusa.htm

- Smith Act prosecutions, Security Index, "disillusioned comrades," development of anonymous mailing technique, use of Socialist Workers Party against, use of La Cosa Nostra against, IRS investigations of members, Teamsters, Howard Fast, William Z. Foster.
____________________________________

Socialist Workers Party
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/swp.htm

Creating disputes with Communist Party, followers of Malcolm X, anonymous letters to newspaper editors, NAACP, UAW-CIO, peace groups, employers, open letter to Trotskyites, Armageddon News, Notes from the Sand Castle, Fly United, CAMD, YSA, Morris Starsky, campaigns to discredit political candidates: John Clarence Franklin, Sam Jordan, Clifton DeBerry, George Weissman, Berta Green, Barbara Taplin, Howard Wallace, Fred Halstead, Ralph Levitt, Paul Boutelle, Nelson Rockefeller's anti- Judy White bill.
______________________________________

New Left Students for a Democratic Society
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/newleft.htm

, MOBE, NMC, LNS, REP, National Lawyers Guild, Columbia University, Princeton University, anonymous letters to students' parents, university officials, members of state legislatures, press, use of drug charges against, BPP informants create rift, split with YSA and SWP, FBI use of astrology and mysticism, Kaleidoscope, Key Activists, Tom Hayden, David Dellinger, Jane Fonda, John Lennon, Jean Seberg, David Herreshoff, David Simpson.
_______________________________________

COMINFIL -- SCLC blackmailing Martin Luther King with tape.
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/sclc.htm
________________________________________

Black Nationalist 'Hate' Groups
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/blacknationalist.htm

"prevent the rise of a black messiah," use of Jewish Defense League against, use of La Cosa Nostra against, cartoons, "Blackboard", Rabbi Kahane, William O'Neal, and numerous victims including: Southern Christian Leadership Conference, Revolutionary Action Movement, the Deacons for Defense and Justice, Congress of Racial Equality, SNCC, Nation of Islam, Poor People's Campaign, Republic of New Africa, US organization, Black Liberators, Martin Luther King, Malcolm X, Stokely Carmichael, H. "Rap" Brown, Elijah Muhammad, Maxwell Stanford, Dick Gregory, Huey Newton, David Hilliard, Ron Karenga, Charles Koen, Sylvester Bell, Bobby Seale, Eldridge Cleaver, Fred Hampton, Mark Clark, Geronimo Pratt, John William Washington, Richard Henry, Muhammed Kenyatta, Jeff Fort.
________________________________________

Groups Seeking Independence for Puerto Rico Juan Mari Bras
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/pr.htm
_________________________________________

MPIPR, FUPI, FEPI, APU, mass media program, anonymous mailings of cartoons.
__________________________________________

Border Coverage Program Communist Party of Mexico (PCM)
http://www.icdc.com/~paulwolf/cointelpro/borcov.htm
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. thank you---bookmarked and I will read later
:mad:
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KG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. you aren't far off the mark, bro.
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T Bone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #19
40. The truth is Haiti would probably establish a Socialist Democracy
if left to themselves. No government in Washington REALLY wants to allow the will of all the black people there to happen, do they ?

I remember reading a pretty thourough discussion on DU a year or two ago that explained that Aristide was forced out originally (back in 92 wasn't it?) by real social democrats and revolutionists. Then we backed the military government that overthrew them, and allowed that military government to kill off a lot of them, before Clinton got Aristide back in there. So Aristide was a centrist at best and benefitted from the killing spree that the last military government went on against the people who threw him out then.

Washington DC couldn't handle a black socialist democracy in the Carribean, regardless of who is in DC.

That's why DC is always meddling, to stop that eventuality everytime it tries to reassert itself. I think these revolutionaries Bush is backing are probably extreme right wing thugs. They were worried Aristide was weakening and that any overthrow of him would lead to a reassertion of the left in Haiti, now it is more right wing thuggery being guaranteed.

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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. Damn straigt, and that comes from a WASP.
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slinkerwink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
23. I don't want to believe that the Bush cabal is capable but they ARE
capable of doing this, so I believe this is what had happened with horror in my eyes. What does this say about the upcoming general election?
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. it says 2004 is going to be buckwild, slinkerwink
a rough rough rough ride, for sure
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Kool Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:53 PM
Response to Reply #25
50. You said a mouthful there, frank.
And if you think this year is going to be wild, wait, WAIT 'til you see what they do when they lose (I pray) in November. Can you even imagine what kind of shit will get done between November and January?
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ret5hd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
27. Just a bunch of paid operatives practicing for the real performance...
Cuba, of course.

I think that groups like CANF, ex-Duvalierists, and anti-Chavez groups are making their first clumsy attempts at disrupting educational efforts such as this board. See what's effective, refine, test again re-refine ad infinitum. Also some long-time exploratory efforts at discovering the most effective ways to disrupt groups like this.

Most obvious and least effective: Low post count, brand new, inflammatory remarks hoping for a flame war.

Less obvious: Brand new poster racks up 2000 posts in a couple of days, lived in (insert hot spot here) thru his teens, knows all about the situation and how (insert latest hot spot ruler here) is a totally fascistic dictator that killed his own daughter to sell her liver, kidneys, lungs, heart, and corneas on the black market.

Least obvious and probably most effective (so far): Long time poster that makes their career out of disagreeing with every platform of the democratic party, often posting dozens of replys in a thread arguing the smallest of points with anyone that disagrees with them, feigning gross indignation at the very smallest of slights. In short, these persons tactics seem to be to waste as much time of as many people as possible.
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. interesting...
we are in such big trouble
but we will not lose
no way
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WhoCountsTheVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #27
35. yup
you said it

"I think that groups like CANF, ex-Duvalierists, and anti-Chavez groups are making their first clumsy attempts at disrupting educational efforts such as this board. See what's effective, refine, test again re-refine ad infinitum. Also some long-time exploratory efforts at discovering the most effective ways to disrupt groups like this"
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WarNoMore Donating Member (530 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #27
36. I know I'm certainly not
a prolific poster, but I've lurked here forever. I've been trying to figure how posters get such a high number of posts; I just told myself that I wasn'r reading enough threads?
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wellstone_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #27
43. Amen ret5hd
This is just what I have been railing about for a month. There are paid posters from RNC, from lobbying and advocacy groups and they are not the drive-by-disruptors. These fit the usual suspects on this to a T.

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JanMichael Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:17 PM
Response to Original message
30. Spent the last few days w/o internet because of a move. I come on tonight.
...and basically get nausiated with all of the fledgling neo-ConDU'ers.

I guess it's good for flushing out the crap.
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:34 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. i hope some of the garbage was flushed out
either way, they are huge dillbags
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
33. Monday nights at DU
gotta luv it!
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
34. Colon
Anybody hear what this guy has been saying regarding Haiti?
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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. he is a POS
they are war criminals

and rummy combs his hair with bacon
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wellstone_democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #37
44. jeez, I spit coffee all over the screen
at that "rummy" remark. Hilarious and true!
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markses Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-01-04 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #34
39. He's been lying his ass off, as per usual
He's a liar, and he's lousy at it. His absurd anthrax vial at the UN was too big to hold what's left of his reputation. A disgraced and disgraceful man, this faux Secretary of State.
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Lindsay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-02-04 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #39
49. Mr. Powell reprimanded members of the
Black Congressional Caucus...specifically, Maxine Waters, Charlie Rangel and Barbara Lee...for speaking out publically about what they knew (Waters and Rangel talked to Aristide by phone after the coup) instead of first consulting with the administration.

His attitude of being able to decide which American citizens are allowed to say what had TOTALLY ticked me off.
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