African American Crisis

[Sweetpea]

Last night I watched "Upfront with Jesse Jackson" and was saddened to read the statistic that there are over 900,000 black males in prison and a little over 600,000 in college as oppose to 1980 when there was a 3 to 1 ratio with more black men being in college. If these figures represent a trend, I shudder what 2020 will bring. With unemployment being at 7 Percent, they were saying black unemployment is up at 21 percent. I won't even go into the AIDS crisis in America and it's impact on blacks too. For me as an african american, these stats are bone chilling as we spend 4 billion a month to rebuild Iraq.

[brokensymmetry]

1. It should be chilling to everyone.

What a sad waste of human potential.

[grasswire]

5. a cynic would say....

.....that a concerted effort has been made to neutralize the vote and the power of the minority community by imposition of draconian laws that fill prisons. Once "felonized", always in jeopardy. Once felonized, often embittered. The damage isn't just that so many are incarcerated, it's also that the social cost is enormous.

(A deeper cynic might say that the enormous number of prisoners is calculated to tighten the labor pool. More people in prison means fewer people on the street unable to find work.)

[mitchum]

18. Well...I must be a cynic then...

because that is also my analysis of this travesty

[Boudicea]

2. Based on responses here looks like no one cares

I've wondered, being a newbie, if there are many AA's on DU. Hmmm, maybe not.

[Sweetpea]

4. It would be interested to find out the number of AA in DU

[angee_is_mad]

33. here's one

[Wonder]

3. The AIDS crisis has been state of Emergency

according to the CDC morbidity reports since 1997 that I know of. As chilling as it should be, apathy seems the status quo there as well. That was another reason I felt so cynical about Bush's big apology about slavery and all the lip service he gave to AIDS in Africa. The issue is hardly mainstream in america in terms of the black communities.

[grasswire]

7. I care a lot

...and I'm not AA. But then I have toured many prisons and even seen the hellish administrative segregation units in some southern prisons. And I've read 12,000 letters from prisoners in a former job in a nonprofit in Washington. (I've also interviewed Jesse and was at his 50th birthday party.)

This is a civil rights issue. But it won't be changed until there is a president who sees it as one and provides leadership. It was hard for me to understand how Clinton could approve some of the "get tough on crime" agenda without addressing the racial disparity.

[Wonder]

13. I hate to wax cynically...

I guess he figured all was resolved behind his apology for Tuskeegee, you know the unethical CDC syphillis study. Maya Angelou's poetics and his saxophone shennigans aside, in regards to African American issues, he lost me on Loni Guenier (I probably butchered the spelling of her name). After he withdrew his recommendation on her, I wasted the vote on Perot. Afro American leadship at the entrepeneurial and grass roots level seems the only savior in regards to much of the subtle racism evident within some of these pressing issues. I am not AA either.

[Muddleoftheroad]

6. Damn right this is a crisis

But there is more to it than sending black men to prison for stupid ass drug crimes.

I hate to admit this, but there IS a culture that Uncle Toms blacks who try to succeed in society, who try get educated. The venerazation of the gangsta world just makes it worse.

We have lost probably a couple generations of African-American males. We need to act now (or after 2004) to try and save the next generation.

[grasswire]

8. What would happen if AA mothers got mad?

I would think that a movement of AA mothers could gather some attention. The image of the solid, hard-working, no-nonsense AA mother is pretty good in America.

[Sweetpea]

11. Very good idea ...almost like MADD

[Wonder]

14. entrepeneurial and grassroots involvement

seems the way to go. AA issues have been laid to waste by US Leaders. AA community, business, and celebrities, et al, have to dig in here. Group empowerment programs non-profit charitable and grant organizations. The neighborhoods have been sabatoged by black market booze and drugs since prohibition. No one ever wants to consider the conspiratorial aspects here, and perhaps it is counterproductive to dwell on those.

But the abandonment of what can be named the disenfranchised is quite evident. Of course it isn't all racial motivated or calcuated. Social programs have general taken a back set. The Affirmative Action debate has many sides. AA's have got to take the bull by the horn.

The AIDS crisis has been virtually ignored, but it is not new news.

Check out Jonathan Kozol's books.

"Savage Inequalities": on Public Education inequalties in the inner cities vs higher income neighborhoods

snip from conversation with Kozel:
http://www.ascd.org/readingroom/edlead/9212/scherer.html

Have you read Savage Inequalities? It's a question that comes up at most educational conferences these days. The best-selling book by Jonathan Kozol has touched many of the nation's educators and riled others, including some notable politicians. In it, he compares rich and poor schools located within a few miles of one another. The stark contrasts of physical surroundings and learning environments—in cities and states from St. Louis to Detroit, New Jersey to Texas—bring home a startling realization of just how different school can be for poor and minority-race children as opposed to middle-class and white children. In this interview with Educational Leadership, Kozol, a public school advocate since his early teaching days, describes the conditions that face our nation's urban students and suggests what we can do to eradicate the inequities.

Savage Inequalities the book and reviews: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0060974990/104-8286562-6768767?v=glance

"Amazing Grace": Poverty and AIDS in the South Bronx, Washington Hgts, Harlem (I believe Heroin began come into america through harlem in the 40's at the time of this book the HIV epidemic was raging in these neighborhoods -- I haven't followed it -- but -- cannot imagine it has gotten much better).

Book Excerpts: http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Third_World_US/AmazingGrace_Kozol.html

snip
The 600,000 people who live and the 430,000 people who live in Washington Heights and Harlem, which are separated from the South Bronx by a narrow river, make up one of the largest racially segregated concentrations of poor people in our nation.

What is it like for children to grow up here? What do they think the world has done to them? Do they believe that they are being shunned or hidden by society? If so, do they think that they deserve this? What is it that enables some of them to pray? When they pray, what do they say to God?

"Amazing Grace" book and reviews:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0060976977/o/qid%3D935727191/sr%3D2-3/104-8286562-6768767

I read them both when they came out. I haven't yet checked if he has written anything in the way of updates on either topic. I have often thought both topics warranted documentaries. Worth checking on if he has revisited the topics or on anything new he might have written. His research is well founded.

[Sweetpea]

15. I just bought Amazing Grace from Amazon and can't wait to read it

[Wonder]

40. It was written just after Reaganomics hit NYC.

The states were left to fend without federal assistance. As a consequence many of the the welfare hotels and subsidized housing projects were closed down in Manahattan with no real planning in place to appropriate other living arrangements. It was also around the time the state mental institutes opened their doors and let pour onto the street many of the psychotics and schizoprenics they could no longer afford to take care of.

That led to the incident on the staten Island ferry. One of the recently freed Bellevue residence slash to death a tourist on the ferry (my memory might not be remembering it exactly). Certain choice subway stops at night you swore you had walked into a looney bin had to be very careful not to stand too close to the tracks lest one of the crazies might mistake you for someone he did not like much and throw you in front of the uncoming express train.

Those that it looked like they were going to remain disenfranchised indefinitely, Koch put them on amtrak headed for Santa Monica. I guess he figured since the city budgets could not afford them any comfort, the climate at west would be easier on their souls.

The book is quite ... moving ... and yet ... I read it it a long time ago. It is still on the shelf.

[Sweetpea]

10. I guess another problem is black life has been so

ghettoized in the media that if you don't fit into that status quo you aren't considered black.

[jagguy]

9. legalize drugs and education will be the only option to make money

without drug money paying for this silly and hate filled hip hop crap maybe that will go away too and yong AA's can realize that it takes a little effort to have a real life.

[Yupster]

12. My opinion -- number one problem to solve

is how to bring father's back into African - American families. I think so many of the other problems stem from this one main problem. A rate of 70 % of African-American children being born into unmarried families is a recipe for disaster, and we see it every day.

There really aren't any debates in the nation being waged on what can be done about this though.

To quote from the great Enino Montoya from Rob Reiner's all-time classic, "The Princess Bride," (Andre the Giant's best movie BTW), when he catches the Six fingered man, Enino is ready to run him through with the sword.

The six-fingered man says I'll give you money, I'll give you land, I'll give you all that you want and more if you don't kill me. While Enino Montoya runs through the six-fingered man he answers, "I want my father back you son of a bitch!"

[Sweetpea]

16. Yes, but if your father is in jail or strung out, it is hard to get him

back.

[BevHarris]

17. Stereotypes. Fathers are alive and well in the AA community

The bigger problem is that, like the rest of middle class America, as folks "get theirs" they stop being vigiliant and are unwilling to spend time and effort (and risk) to make sure the system stays healthy.

That, and there has been a degradation of leadership in many of our black churches, which used to be prime movers in social justice. Some say the mighty dollar was extended by the Bush folks to the black bishops. It is true that in many key areas where political organizing is traditionally strong, weak and sometimes very unsuitable pastors are being assigned.

It isn't just African Americans that need to wake up, it's all Americans. By the way, much of what I'm seeing in this thread is just stereotyping. "If your dad is in jail or strung out..." Do get out of the 60s, please, and understand that that picture is not reflective of average black America.

There are more African Americans on DU than I used to think; I participated in several threads a couple months back and found that quite a few DUers are AA and just don't blab it around.

Bev Harris

[Yupster]

20. So what can be done?

to bring that 70 % number down?

I think pretty much everyone agrees it's ruinous. So what should be done about it?

[alaine]

22. Furthermore...

All the hype about the role of fathers in families draws the eroneous conclusion that the problems these families face are because of lack of a male figurehead, when in reality their problems have more to do with, ta da, POVERTY.

The Bush admin is apparently working on a plan to give cash incentives to women to marry, which is just asking for fraud, as happens in the military alot as people marry just to get the marriage benefits but have no relationship. I've known gay people who have done this.

I'm curious if African culture is just not more traditionally matrilineal, there are tribes in Africa today that are still practicing matrilineal descent. If patrilineality and patriarchy were such cure-alls then the problems wouldn't exist in the first place. In matrilineal cultures, usually it is the mother's brother, not the biological father, that acts as the male role mode. This was the social organization of the Cherokee Indians, and it has been practiced all over the world in various cultures since the dawn of the human race. I bring this up because the whole argument of fatherless black families just seems like one more stage in the propaganda campaign of the powers that be to demonize black males.

[Yupster]

27. I would think there would be a lot less poverty in a family if

there was a dad bringing home a paycheck each month.

I know my family would become instantly poor if it asn't for mine.

[Sweetpea]

23. Not stereotypes

Several of my friends have fathers in jail or are strung out. To ignore the statitics is to say they don't exist and it is a reality for many of my friends and family.

Don't get my wrong, I had a great father but I have close relatives who have been in and out of prison and are substance abusers. Substance abuse does affect all communities but when you see the stats now, they are alarming and I think it means that AA's have to go into crisis mode. One thing Jesse said is when priviledged people have substance abuse issues and are arrested, they get a slap on the wrist and are put into treatment.

[Sweetpea]

24. Plus I sense a little hostility by saying that I am african american

Explain please.

[Sweetpea]

25. When the stats are saying there are more blacks in prison

than in jail, and these are quotes from AA leadership, it is not stereotyping. It is taking a look at a serious issue.

Plus I have seen gays say they are gay on an issue that relates to them in discussion. Also people of various cultures have said their nationality or religious affiliation. When you say, they just don't blab it around, it sounds like it is a problem to state your race.

[BevHarris]

28. No, but you'll find there are many African Americans on this list

If you haven't been here long, you may be surprised who they are.

In case it matters, I'm white, husband black, kids black and biracial. I attend a black church and primarily live/socialize in the black sector of my family (because they live closer and it is a large, close-knit family with extensive church and youth mentoring going on.)

What I object to is the automatic assumption that fathers aren't around if unmarried. In my experience, most of the fathers are around and involved, whether or not there is a marriage. Thus, the 70% figure may be misleading.

Most of us have some experience with family or friends who have been involved in substance abuse -- of various types, including alcohol. It isn't limited to any particular race.

Prison, though, is another matter, and this is definitely taking a huge social cost, but not necessarily because African Americans commit more crimes; there is absolutely no question that AA are arrested more often, for more minor violations, and imprisoned more often, than whites. Also no question whatsoever that AA are killed by the cops much more often. Likewise, the driving while black thing is real and an abomination. Actually, driving while "of color" -- one of my daughters, who is Asian, gets stopped and harassed regularly if she is with a group of her Latina friends.

It's a problem, but when I say stereotype, it is the impression many whites have that African Americans live in the "ghetto" and are mostly poor, fatherless, and prone to substance abuse. Actually, the middle class is more the norm for African Americans nowadays, and in general, family units are very much intact. I'm not sure I buy into that 70% statistic either. Got a link?

Bev Harris

[DagmarK]

31. I don't have actual statistics.....but 70% sounds about right.....

from all the documentaries and stuff I have read over the last 15 years or so. I think it's safe to say that only 25% of black children have both parents living with them.

The apt house behind me is Section 8. The tenancy is 99.9% black -- and there are no men around. Except on the weekends. During the week...just moms and kids. On the weekend.....there's a bunch of men around.....I guess they are the fathers. I don't know.

And I just can't resort to using African American as a designation. That's another problem.....I feel like I am saying a bad word when I say BLACKS. But only sometimes. It's confusing. But I *do* know that the blacks in my neighborhood are a whole mix of Africans and African Americans. Lots of immigrants here, in other words.

It's confusing......and we don't mix and we don't talk to each other and we are all so suspicious of each other.......and at this rate, I don't know how we are going to harmonize our society...

[BevHarris]

35. Now that's an example of skewed reasoning

Don't assess how many African Americans live with both parents by watching documentaries or looking at Section 8 housing.

Go where most of the black community goes on Sundays: to the black churches. You'll find double-parent middle class households with kids going to college.

You live near section 8 housing; I live in a suburb. In my neighborhood are dozens of African American two-parent families with good jobs and kids going to college. Like our family.

By the way, there are a whole lot of single moms who are white. Like I was until I married my husband several years ago.

Bev

[Sweetpea]

37. I do think it is important to look at issues on a regional basis

I would think that problems facing urban environments would be different than suburban ones. There may be regions that are in need of more mentoring.

As far as Sharpton and Jackson not being credible these days, the sad thing is if you asked most people who would be considered a black leader, not too many new names come up. I saw Sharpton speak in NY a couple of weeks ago, and I have to say , he is a great speaker. His history may be sorted but he was quite moving. He inspired me to get more involved.

[Sweetpea]

34. Here is a link to rainbow push

<http://www.rainbowpush.org/FMPro?-db=RPOfrontpage.fp5&-format=rainbowpush/frontpage/results.htm&-lay=front&constant=1&-find>

The transcript of the show that I watched is not available yet but he is talking about these issues on the front page of the website.

[TheDonkey]

19. A shame that should be on the front page of US Politics

There has been increasing apathy in the African American community as well as the political community on these issues.

As for AA's the new generation is being blinded by "false freedom and success" I call it. With the rise of the hip-hop era many are forgetting that it takes education and good health to make it big... not bling bling, a fast car, and a music deal.

Politican's are just as quick to ignore African American problems now with there being little anger over the way things are plummeting.

Hopefully in the near future we all can begin to bring these issues back into the light and have them solved asap.

[Ein]

21. I imagine it's the BS War on Drugs

No doubt, it's rascist, b/c of the institutional boundaries (bigotism) in American life!

[Dob Bole]

26. Very Bone Chilling indeed...

The Bush administration hasn't helped matters. They have attempted to cut the free lunch program, from which many black students, and me, have benefited. They have cut unemployment benefits, tried to reform welfare reform, and cut pell grants substantially.

I am pleased at least that Bush committed some money to fighting AIDS in Africa- a Dem president would never have been able to push the issue through a Rep congress. But more could be done here in the US. "The rich stay healthy and the sick stay poor?" You bet.

Sadly, people do not take people like Jackson and Sharpton seriously, and they're some of the only proponents of fiscal liberalism out there. I think Kucinich may be the only liberal candidate- maybe Gephardt.

[Aaron]

29. I heard a figure the other day on 'America's Black Forum'

On CBS at 4am or something like that on Sundays for 15 minutes - I never figured out why that show is so short. It's a good program.

The figure was regarding the length of time the money someone earns stays in their community. For blacks it was 4 hours. In the WASP community it was 19 days, in the Jewish community it was 22 days, and in the Asian community it was 24 days (IIRC). If someone has a source on the length of time it stays in the other communities I'll trust them over my memory.

There's also the homeownership figures, Black Enterprise had an article on homeownership last issue or the issue before that with the most recent rates.

The best I found in a quick google was "Over 48 percent of blacks owned their homes in 2002, up from 42 percent in 1990. However, black homeownership still trailed the national rate of 68 percent."

Here's a souce confirming the 4 hours: http://www.laweekly.com/ink/printme.php?eid=2115

Here's one with the homeownership rate info: http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/business/5719218.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp

Those figures you posted are very bad - the one about college versus jail is especially horrendous in my mind. Like some others have said I'm sure the drug laws have some effect on that, like the disparity between cocaine and crack sentencing etc.

[DagmarK]

32. Aaron......I love that show!!!!!!!!

yes, it's on at like 4am.....absurd.

You and I are in the same city...we should write the network and ask them to play it during REAL hours. (Isn't it NBC, though?)

[Aaron]

36. I think you're right - It's probably NBC

I'll see about writing them about changing the time. There's also a show on around that hour called "America's Farm Report", but I think that's on Saturdays.

[DagmarK]

30. I feel enlightened on the subject after seeing Bowling for Columbine

I can't do a replay in words of the clip in the movie that gives a history of the US -- and the black man is a central focus throughout our history. By "central focus" I mean "central fear on the part of the white man of the black man getting ahead, taking power, etc."

And I wonder, on a soul level...is all this fear on the part of the white man really just an attempt to mask the massive guilt that the white man has for slavery? Like, we have to keep the black man as the BAD GUY (the boogieman) in our minds just so we don't have to deal with OUR overwhelming and certain guilt.

Not that anyone can ever change history and make the proper amends, but no real attempt has been made to even try......

It's an animation -- I am sure many people have seen the movie.


Sweatpea -- I don't think the poster was being hostile by saying "a lot of AA just don't blab" about being AA on DU. Not at all. It's probably true. If you haven't noticed.....blacks and whites aren't real integrated in the USA on the whole. And......when we do mix, we kind of keep a low profile. So, if I (I am white) go into my favorite soul food restaurant here, I am a lot more sedate and withrawn. And when AA come into my (former) VERY WHITE law firm for whatever reason, I am pretty sure they are also being rather sedate. We are uncomfortable with each other......we don't know what to say to each other. Heck, a lot of my neighbors are black -- and I don't get the impression that they want anything to do with me whatsoever. (their kids come over to pet my dogs.....but kids don't seem to see color).

Anyways, DU.....I can safely say is a pretty WHITE community. I don't like that, but it's the truth.

I don't know what I am saying.....but I don't think the poster was trying to be hostile. And I will probably get into trouble for jumping into that part of the conversation. But I did because I DO care about how segregated we are.......it bums me out.

[grasswire]

38. I have to say that....

...I often envy black folk their sense of community, because that just doesn't exist for me as a white person. When I watch an NAACP meeting or something similar on C-span and see the giants of the civil rights movement and Jesse and Cornel West and Kweisi Mfume and Charlie Rangel and all these other wonderful people together, I just want to be part of that kind of history and tradition. Jesse made me cry at Maynard's funeral. The moral authority is theirs. The high road is theirs. I am just in awe of so many who have suffered so much and persevered.

[Sweetpea]

39. Yeh, Cornel West was on Al Sharpton presidential exploration

committee.