BBV - more lawsuits bubbling to the surface soon - QUESTION

[BevHarris]

and one of the lawyers, busy, pro bono, asked me if I could post this question and obtain your excellent input:

"Is ballot processing in Florida subject to that state's Open Public Meetings Act? Can someone cite me the law or, better yet, a court decision? My question is not limited to contested ballots but all ballot processing."

That's for the lawyer. For myself, I was wondering about that in California. Mischelle Townsend used that as an excuse to tell Andy Stephenson that he could not videotape.

Another QUESTION: We will need to bring the law with us that allows us to videotape. My daughter, who is a reporter for the Los Angeles Times, tells me their investigative reporters have to bring the law with them every time or public officials just try to shut them down. Any ideas where we should look for the statute that allows videotaping on public property?

And, speaking of videotaping -- for a British documentary, filming next week, who would like to go with me to serve lawsuits on various California Registrars of Elections -- specifically, Los Angeles, San Diego, Alameda, Marin, and we need volunteer process servers for all 18 Diebold counties.

Please e-mail me at [e-mail] PRONTO if you would like to join in. I'd say the more the merrier, but in fact, a more appropriate description of what I'd like to see would be "a horde of determined citizens."

Who shall join me in this endeavor?

Bev Harris

P.S. The other counties are: Kern, San Joaquin, Solano, Plumas, Fresno, Humboldt, Lassen, Mendocino, Modoc, San Luis Obispo, Santa Barbara, Placer, Siskiyou, Trinity and Tulare.

Paranoid Pat -- you up for videography on any of this? It's about time we met!

[TacticalPeek]

1. Larry Klayman did it, so there's precedent (Judge Jorge La Barga).

Printed from JudicialWatch.org
Nov 27, 2000
Contact: Press Office
202-646-5172



JUDICIAL WATCH TO BEGIN FLORIDA RECOUNT TODAY IN PALM
BEACH

Court Orders Access for Judicial Watch To Palm Beach Ballots

Accounting Firm to Oversee Judicial Watch Counts

Over 400 Judicial Watch Volunteers to Count Ballots Throughout Florida


(Miami, FL) Judicial Watch will begin counting disputed ballots from the presidential election in Palm Beach today. Circuit Court
Judge Jorge La Barga ordered Palm Beach to give access to Judicial Watch under Florida state law, which allows citizens to
inspect ballots. Johnson Lambert & Co., a public accounting firm with expertise both in counting ballots and in fraud, will oversee
the Judicial Watch effort. Over 400 citizens from across the country have volunteered to help Judicial Watch count the disputed and
other ballots, such as absentee military ballots. Judicial Watch plans to conduct an independent analysis of disputed and other
ballots throughout the entire state of Florida.

http://www.judicialwatch.org/archive/2000/printer_747.shtml

[BevHarris]

8. Thanks. And found this...

Under Florida law, “The proceedings of the election board at the precinct after the polls have closed shall be open to the public; however, no person except a member of the election board shall touch any ballot or ballot container or interfere with or obstruct the orderly count of the ballots.” ‘If any absentee ballot is physically damaged so that it cannot properly be counted by the automatic tabulating equipment, a true duplicate copy shall be made of the damaged ballot in the presence of witnesses and substituted for the damaged ballot.” “The county canvassing board shall meet in a building accessible to the public in the county where the election occurred at a time and place to be designated by the supervisor of elections to publicly canvass the absentee electors' ballots .... Public notice of the time and place at which the county canvassing board shall meet to canvass the absentee electors' ballots and provisional ballots shall be given at least 48 hours prior thereto by publication once in one or more newspapers of general circulation in the county or, if there is no newspaper of general circulation in the county, by posting such notice in at least four conspicuous places in the county....”

The county canvassing board may begin the canvassing of absentee ballots at 7 a.m. on the fourth day before the election, but not later than noon on the day following the election. Furthermore, Florida law allows for public inspection of ballots.

[arcane1]

2. Nothing for Contra Costa county?

that's reassuring.... I emailed the sec of elections (?) last year on this issue and he assured me that it was a concern. I voted in the mid-terms and this month using the optical scan w/paper receipt :)

[BevHarris]

3. This particular suit is just Diebold

You can find the text of the lawsuit on this page:

http://www.blackboxvoting.org/source-documents.html

[nostamj]

4. everytime I see a reference to 'receipt'

I think of that duck from the "AFLACK!" commercials...

but, somehow, it's Andy's voice: "BALLOTS!"

;-)

[shance]

5. Keep this kicked**

:)

[nostamj]

6. ack!

kick this!!

[Andy_Stephenson]

7. I sound like a duck?

Is that what your saying?


Pat I want a copy of any incriminating video...as well as full length videos of "naked time."

:hi:

[BevHarris]

9. You know you're invited, Andy.

But you've been barreling along with your campaign in Washington. However, there is no one better at asking tough questions than you.

Bev

[Andy_Stephenson]

10. Hmmmmm

hmmmmmm

[ParanoidPat]

11. The Naked Truth About Voting, a shocking expose!......

.....Coming soon on DVD! :evilgrin:

See your local dealer. :)

[BevHarris]

12. LOL - The emperor (in his new clothes)

buys us all voting machines (with invisible ballots)

Who shall play the role of the emperor?

[ParanoidPat]

14. I'll stay behind the camera thank you......

.....this is a drama, not a comedy. :evilgrin:

Andy's a politician! He'd be well suited for the role! We have to have Andy. :)

[Andy_Stephenson]

19. ooo oooo can I pre-order?

can I huh huh?

[nostamj]

16. no!

I'm saying a duck sounds like you!

;-)

[Andy_Stephenson]

18. Hmmmmm

ok...I think :7

[shance]

13. California law - the Bagley-Keene Act

Spoke with an attorney about ballot processing and the public is allowed to watch however cannot engage in any of the ballot processing. Im sure you already know that, but thought I would throw that out here as far as California law is concerned.

Dont have case law to cite (yet), but will continue to research later.

:)

[BevHarris]

20. Good! I would like to confront Mischelle with that

and if we can get evidence that she prevented videotaping unlawfully, that would be great.

[shance]

25. Here is what I understand about the videotaping, (which is very little*)

I was told by an attorney at the SOS office that you cannot video within 100 ft (?) or so of a polling place because of privacy issues?

Then I asked him how does one monitor (and prove) a questionable voting procedure?

[BevHarris]

26. I would assume that is while people are casting live votes

on election day.

That would make sense, because the new touch screens have very weak privacy.

However, that would not make sense if they are just sorting piles anonymized absentee ballots. In fact, I have suggested putting a webcam in so anyone can watch the processing of the absentee ballots -- why not? It would be worth the paltry amount of money it would cost -- nothing, compared to the millions spent for touch screens and "support"

I wonder if the requirement for a meeting to be "public" (i.e. a Logic and Accuracy test) means it can be videotaped?

According to a former elections supervisor here in Washington, they have to let you videotape if you are standing in the public area.

When Andy visited State Elections Director David Elliott in Washington, Elliott said, gritting his teeth, "I wish we could do this less formally...WITHOUT the camera!" but did not stop the taping, which leads me to believe he had no choice. When we did a citizens audit of the Thurston County elections office, we videotaped the whole thing, as we did an interview at the state ethics board.

Maybe that's clearer in the Washington law. Apparently it is in effect in California, but maybe what the reporter is bringing with him is a lawyer's opinion on the law, or something.

Bev

[RedEagle]

27. Taking the Law with Them

Maybe in California the "Little Napoleon" bit from county election officials is more in evidence and reporters have had to carry a copy of the law around to reference to.

If you decide to cover something and know that an official will tell you you can't, according to law, then best be able to whip out that law under their noses- and preferably on camera.

If you have to leave and go research the law and bring it back, the story is gone by then.

Finding out exactly what the law says, and distributing that to the media before pre-election tests and L&A's, might help those in the media not in the know.

Probably another exercise of DU'ers and voting advocates- researching the rights of observation and video taping. Video taping is just another observation tool. Used in banks to help ID robbers, same validity in vote counting. What the eye misses in real time, can be slowed down on tape. ;-) (Or whatever the prevelent media is nowdays)

[shance]

30. I agree. There certainly needs to be a way

to show that the process is being implemented fairly and videotaping would help in that arena.

The attorney I spoke with did not provide any statute or law so I dont know if there is a California law or even what that law would be.

Hmm....perhaps theres an attorney here at DU that could help us?

[annagull]

15. Off topic: Great pic and article in Vanity Fair, Bev!

Just got it today, congrats! :toast:

[leftchick]

17. I agree...

Just passed on a copy to my local Dem. Headquarters to digest!

Go Bev, Dave, Andy and company!

:bounce:

[althecat]

22. Still trying to buy this downunder...

... is a bit of a struggle. :)

[gristy]

21. I volunteered symbolman to help you in Santa Barbara

I emailed him, and hopefully he'll be in touch.

[BevHarris]

23. That would be mighty cool

--flash!

consider yourself served.

Would love to hear from Symbolman for Santa Barbara!

Bev

[RedEagle]

24. Keep this going

Kick!

Is there a difference in counting ballots and the L&A test? I don't think either should ever be unobservable by the public, but just know that some official will decide that there is a difference.

[RedEagle]

28. Remember to help out Clean Voting

www.blackboxvoting.org.

Donations greatly appreciated!

[nostamj]

29. uh.... sorry but, he moved to Hawaii....

last I heard. :shrug:

hi Bev!