Minnesotans: BOYCOTT STORES IN ANOKA COUNTY...

[Deja Q]

http://www.startribune.com/stories/1331/4669388.html

Anoka County, with its Blaine site, now remains the only community actively pursuing a Vikings stadium. The Anoka County finance plan, as passed by its county board, pledges up to $240 million in countywide sales taxes for a new $600 million stadium. The county and Vikings are currently negotiating a possible exclusive agreement.

(snip)

...when Gov. Tim Pawlenty released his stadium framework Monday it didn't include provisions for regional or metrowide taxes and required that local communities be prepared to shoulder a significant share of a new facility's pricetag.


But some good news:


Neither Minneapolis nor St. Paul, which are vying for a new Minnesota Twins ballpark, have expressed any interest in funding a new football stadium. The University of Minnesota wants to build a $222 million football stadium on campus; the Vikings and Gophers haven't been able to marry their divergent plans and needs and agree on a single football facility.


Okay, it's still crappy news because taxes (and fees!) WILL go up in the city that wins the stadium.

[SmileyBoy]

1. Give it up, man. The Vikes and Twins need new stadiums.

This Anoka plan is the best thing to happen to the Vikes. No other plan offered in the future will be better. I'm surprised you don't understand how much tax money this will bring into the Minnesota coffers. This thing will pay for itself in less than FIVE YEARS. It took the Metrodump more than twice that time.

The Metrodump is a 22 year-old obsolete piece of shit that's costing the Vikings and Twins millions of dollars a year. Look, I'm on the NDSU football team, and I tell people time and time again that the Fargodome (Cap. 19,287) is a better football stadium than the Metrodome (Cap. 64,121). Likewise with Newman Outdoor Field (Cap. 4,600 and Home of the Red Hawks)

The next time you go to that piece of shit stadium near the Mississippi River, you give me an update on how nice it is.

[Deja Q]

6. Compare these and tell me in the eye you want public funds to pay for it:

Pawlenty wants to privatize roads: Something the vast majority of us need. The state and county and local governments should be paying for things the public NEEDS.

Pawlenty wants to build a stadium, in the guise of keeping these teams here. Now (1) these teams cater to a small amount of the public. (2) We've seen it before, these teams will play the idiots running the state as far as they can before they leave for more lucrative territory anyway. Result to the state? An even bigger mess that the Democrat who'll win in next election will get blamed for. A stadium is a WANT. Nothing more.

Okay, the Metrodome is shit. Fine. I never go to the place. I could care less. Why should my tax dollars go to a fucking stadium for two sports teams WHO CAN AFFORD THE DAMN THINGS 100 TIMES OVER when MN has lost social programs and is about to lose the roads?

Please tell me where the priorities are: People? Or some wealthy jerkoff's bank account because he doesn't want to support the infrastructure, he only gives a fuck about himself?

[ButterflyBlood]

2. good thing I don't ever go north of the Twin Cities anyway

n/t

[x-g.o.p.er]

3. MN needs professional baseball and football...

The Blaine site will be an economic boon to the people of Anoka county. It's not just a stadium, it's a full housing and office development site, which will bring jobs and prosperity, IMHO.

Losing the Vikings and Twins would be disastrous to Minnesota, financially and otherwise. I say build the stadiums

[Deja Q]

9. Full office development site? Homes? Wal-mart village?!

What sort of offices? More Super Targets and Wal-Marts paying $6/hr jobs that can't even begin to meet the needs of one person, let alone a family of 3?

You know more than I do on this. Tell me more about this perceived prosperity. What types of homes? What price ranges? What types of offices? (Lots of cities in the metro area have LOTS of buildings ready for people to use. Why abandon and junk them? They'd cost less too, and wouldn't make the need to increase taxes for everybody - which means people can more likely afford...)

Yes, losing the Vikes and Twins would upset the fans. But I'm into gambling, and I bet Pohlad and Combs will ultimately sell REGARDLESS if they get their stadiums and latex pacifiers or not. Indeed, the stadiums WILL increase their value - which is precisely what they want.

My ultimate point: They're jerkin' us with their jive. They do not care about us or the state of Minnesota. That's why they want us to pay for it when we all know they can pay for it, several times over. They are playing a game with us, that's all there is to it.

[x-g.o.p.er]

21. Townhomes...no Wal-Marts....

Look,

I can appreciate the fact that MN has a lot of issues that need to be dealt with, and like it or not, this issue is as important to a majority of Minnesotans as is education, roads, etc. Just because it is sports doesn't make it inconsequential. Losing the Vikings and Twins would be an economic disaster for the state. Both are in the top 10 of revenue producing businesses, and you cannot ignore that professional sports is a business. Is public financing of stadiums essentially nothing more than subsidizing billionaires? Yes. Do I like that fact? No, it bugs me. But the bottom line in all of this is that if we lose the Twins and Vikings, our budget deficit will only rise due to lost tax revenue of people coming out to the ballgame. I've attached the Viking stadium proposal in the link below. This is just the Vikings; I haven't even included the Twins proposal, because one location hasn't been finalized. Not only is it a stadium, but it includes the Viking front offices, a shopping center, a corporate district, and a town home/condominium development. This plan will bring in a lot more money to the state every year in property, corporate, and sales taxes, which will help fund education, roads, etc. So think about that the next time you want to reflexively say no to a new stadium.

http://www.co.anoka.mn.us/stadium/anoka-county-blaine-proposal.pdf

[madrchsod]

4. do a little research

on bud Selig's on going scam concerning the sale of the brewers. there`s a possibility he make make tens of millions on the sale because of the new stadium. nice way to make money....

[Deja Q]

7. I heard lots of things... and it only helps to make Pawlenty look bad too

Oh, you can bet your bippy that Pohlad and/or Combs will sell when the time is right. It's been done before, and Selig's the eunuch I was thinking of.

Pawlenty is a spineless shill and his supporters of this nonsense are mindless followers, forgive me but this issue is an unholy insult given what Pawlenty said we all had to sacrifice for during the $4 BILLION shortfall.

I love the people who'll say it'll help the economy by adding jobs. Uh-huh. I wish they'd tell me ONE job that pays more than $10/hr that is a common person's job (aka non-management/CEO)?

I hope these cities have good traffic routes... they shouldn't repeat the mistake they made with the Metrodome... but human history is replete with repeating the same atrocities... yet I'm not desensitized for some reason...

[Wickerman]

5. I regrettably think the Pro teams need the new stadiums but hate Timmy's

backhanded way of financing it sucks. Like everything else he holds to that ridiculous no new taxes pledge by increasing fees for those who can least afford it. :puke: This will always leave a bad taste in my mouth.

[Deja Q]

8. Especially after he told we'd all have the take part in the $4 billion ...

shortfall.

This is a big insult aimed at the people of Minnesota.

It's freakin' bizarro world that we have to dump social programs, cut back education, privatize roads, police, firemen, and lots of other things the majority of people do rather NEED.

It's not just backhanded. It's underhanded. Pawlenty's 5 years of tax cuts he supported directly led to the budget shortfall. He then tells us all we have to make sacrifices (except for the rich people he already helped.)

Now he wants to do this. No way. It's another case of mixed-up priorities. Indeed, it's the same thing as being a mother with a child who'd rather buy a new HDTV set instead of food for herself and her child (and, sadly, there are far worse examples of this same scenario. Replace "HDTV Set" with "crack" and that makes an even more appropriate assessment. Entertainment is a drug. Survival is mandatory, surely? There is NO difference, except that Pawlenty is the proverbial mother of 300,000 children. And it seems he'd rather smoke crack. He obvious acts as if he's doing so. x(

[Wickerman]

14. Well said

however, I can see the economics of the stadium deals - though it amounts to nothing more than blackmail. And yes, Red McCombs has no qualms about that kind of tactic. I lived in San Antonio before I moved to MN so I have been blessed by having Red in my local news most of my adult life. :eyes:

Timmy is doing nothing more than growing the businesses of his friends, the health and welfare of average Minnesotans be damned.

Hey, I am going to cover a town meeting with Steve Swiggum tomorrow night - what should I ask him?

[Lydia Leftcoast]

10. Sports teams are private businesses owned by billionaires

Why should tax dollars fund them?

That's what it boils down to. Those owners could build their own damn stadiums with their loose change.

Instead, they want to stick the taxpayers with the bill, but if they feel like it, they'll take off for another city without a by-your-leave.

Was it the Indianapolis team that left for Baltimore (or vice versa?) in the middle of the night some years back?

If you like sports, fine, but they're not IMPORTANT, at least not as important as schools, highways and other transportation, law enforcement, a living wage for public employees, conservation and land management, and social services.

Schools are being closed, teachers are being forced to spend hundreds of dollars a year to buy classroom supplies that the school district used to provide, poor people are being thrown off medical assistance, and tax money is going to help billionaires build stadiums that only a minority of the population will ever attend?

This state is morally bankrupt.

ON EDIT: If the state is into funding private businesses now, maybe I should ask Pawlenty if I can have some tax dollars to buy new computers.

[Hotler]

11. Pro-sports should pay their own way.

The first step towards stopping corporate greed at pro-sports level is at the stadium seat.

[Nobody]

12. MN voters voted no three times

and Pawlenty is ignoring that no. If I were on a date and I said no three times and that no was just as ignored, a criminal lawsuit would be in order...

The teams are greedy as all hell. No other business has the state pay for building its places of business to the extent of the teams. If Joe's Garage wanted the taxpayers to pay for a new building, we'd rightfully tell Joe to go to the bank and get a loan. He could do that and get a nice interest rate and not cost the taxpayers one penny.

We voted no in referenda three times. Pawlenty is not letting it go to the voters this time. He knows we'll say no again.

The teams are claiming that they'll move. I say we call their bluff. They're blackmailing the public so they can avoid paying for something they can well afford.

First it was the Twins, now the Vikings want to climb aboard the gravy train.

Minnesota is laying off police and firefighters and closing schools and libraries. Some schools have no heat. Why the hell are we even entertaining the notion of paying for something so that billionaires don't have to?

[wellst0nev0ter]

13. Gee I Never Knew The Frei Market Privatized The Profits

While socializing the costs.

Not saying that I wouldn't feel a bit of remorse if the Vikings or the Twins leave, but that how PRIVATE sport teams screw the communities that adopt them in the first place.

I'll never forget how the North Stars hightailed probably the ONLY place that is crazy about hockey as this place in order to exploit some chimerical "bigger TV market". Whatever non-cynical feelings about sports teams I held at that time were dashed for good.

I'd still root for the sports teams, but if they feel that they don't owe this place, then I say don't let the door hit ya on the way out!

[dflprincess]

15. But, but, but

Timmy signed that no new tax pledge

"Anoka County, with its Blaine site, now remains the only community actively pursuing a Vikings stadium. The Anoka County finance plan, as passed by its county board, pledges up to $240 million in countywide sales taxes for a new $600 million stadium. The county and Vikings are currently negotiating a possible exclusive agreement."

I guess the pledge only applies to education and social services.

[nicecakes]

16. Why not use the money for the homeless, hungry, sick and unemployed?

With that much money you could help every downtrodden individual and family for life. House the homeless, feed the hungry, mend the sick and hire those able and willing to work. We are Democrats before we are sports fans!

[canuckagainstBush]

17. No Gov't funding for pro sports

I don't understand how these right-wingers can skimp on public school funding, want to privatize things like welfare/prisons and be in favour of public money to build professional sports stadiums. Something just doesn't compute here. :crazy:


Edit:

I should mention that I'm a huge baseball (Seattle Mariners) fan.

[kispoko]

18. nope

i don't care about the twins, they can continue playing in the dome for all i care.... but the vikes need a new, and much larger facility. they've been selling out every game for about 7 years or so, i believe. the dome has outlived its usefulness to viking football.


now i'm not a red mcombs fan, and this billionaire will benefit a good deal from a new stadium, but overlooking that, the state of minnesota, for the long-term, will benefit many times more.

were i in the same position, i wouldn't mind at all having my taxes raised for such a venture.... it'll pay for itself soon enough, and just keep paying in thereafter, in a multitude of ways.


i do get what you're saying about the funding of other programs, but place the blame for that mismanagement where it belongs, instead of where it doesn't, which would have to include the state fundraising machine that is the minnesota vikings..... you could consider a new stadium, as a way to make that machine run more efficiently, and produce better, as a money magnet, and not some black hole for state revenue.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

20. My point stands

If the state subsidizes the Vikings, whose owners can well afford to build their own stadium, why shouldn't they subsidize every business that "needs" something?

Otherwise sensible people lose all sense of perspective when the subject turns to the Religion of Pro Sports.

[Nobody]

19. David Strom of the MN Taxpayers League has been strangely silent on this

For those who aren't familiar with David Strom and the Taxpayers League, these are people who virtually bought and paid for Tim pawlenty and Norm Coleman. They spent tons of money for both campaigns, and put out lots of questionable ads.

David Strom has been active on the editorial pages of the Mpls Star Tribune having conniption fits in print about how he thinks public transportation is a huge waste of money that should be gutted and the bus drivers (now on strike over health care benefits) should be grateful for one lump of figurative coal. After all since he doesn't ride the bus, no one else does.

He has not uttered one peep about tax money going to fund stadiums that the billionaire owners can easily afford.