Do Dems lack the courage to expose Enron-Bush role in Calif. deficit?

[RichM]

The coming fiasco in the California Recall is going to be, IMHO, an unusually literal example of the expression "they can't tell the truth to save their own lives."

The California Democrats are in a perfect position to expose Bush-Cheney for what they really are: gangsters & looters, intent on destabilizing & destroying democratic institutions. The only pretext offered by the rightwing to justify the Calif Recall is the budget fiasco. There are 2 main factors that created the budget deficit: the popping of the high-tech bubble, & the raiding of the Calif Treasury in 2001 by Enron & Reliant -- which was DIRECTLY ABETTED by Bush & Cheney, who went to bat for their Enron pals.

I'm sitting here in the Bay Area, & just watched all the Sunday talk shows. NOT A SINGLE DEMOCRAT dared to get anywhere near this subject of the Enron-Bush link, in explaining the $38 billion Calif budget deficit.

Are we going to see a repeat exhibition of the Democratic cowardice witnessed in the face of the Stolen Election, where the filthiest & most antidemocratic tactics are used to deprive Democrats of legally won high office -- and where the Dems themselves don't have the guts to expose the dirty dealings? I believe we will.

In 2001, the Democrats did not accuse Bush of "stealing the election." Rather, the Republicans publicly accused GORE of trying to steal the election -- and the Democrats generally failed to counter this outrageous standing of reality on its head, despite the fact that all the evidence was on their side.

In the current Calif Recall, it would be a simple matter to prove that Bush & Cheney helped Enron rip off the state for tens of billions of dollars in 2001. But if the party is too frightened to pose that direct a challenge to Bush -- if they lack the courage & truthfulness to expose the looting of 2001 in the current campaign (perhaps calculating that "attacks on the president might backfire," or some similar rationalization for failing to bring out the heavy artillery) -- we may well see Governor Schwarzenegger in 8 weeks, elected with 25% of the vote.

I can just imagine the pow-wows going on among Democratic Party bigwigs in Washington today. I would bet that the subject has been raised, "Well, should we talk about Enron and Bush?" And the Dem strategists, and the famous gutless "moderates," are doubtless saying, "No, no, we could get in a lot of trouble if we raise that issue. The Republicans could accuse us of unfairly attacking the president in a time of war. They could paint us as unpatriotic. Let's STAY THE HELL AWAY from that issue -- it could blow up in our faces."

If the Dems follow this advice, they will lose, and they will deserve to lose. It will one day be said of them, "They couldn't tell the truth to save their own lives."

[madfloridian]

1. Ha Ha, I was thinking the same thing, but couldn't think how to post.

You said it very well.

:hi:

[BayCityProgressive]

2. I don't think they can..

Republicans will just say "look, Democrats took money from Enron too". Which is completely true. I realize the Democrats need money to run campaigns but until their is new campaign finance reform or the Dems can find a new form of raising cash or getting their message out, they will not be able to criticize big business because they take their handouts too.

[TankLV]

7. Uh - won't work.

Repukes SOUGHT OUT & took MILLIONS, while dems were GIVEN unsolicited a million times less dollars. THAT is the FAct.

This was purposely done so they could make that false accusation you made.

Look it up. It's true.

[phillybri]

49. Carville said....

Of the money Enron gave, 72% was for Repugs, 28% for Dems.

72-28 is not a tie....

[Sophree]

11. That's a good point

But the issue isn't just about ENRON- the criminal activity that created the "Energy Crisis" was unknown to everyone excluding the people involved and, I would wager, the White House.

They could at least point out that *'s inaction during the "Crisis" contributed greatly to the budget woes of CA.

[knight_of_the_star]

35. I heard

That the Attorney General of Cali was ready to press charges when things were in full swing but then asscrack stepped in and said that this is a federal issue and my DoJ tops yours. Its common knowledge on the street that that happened and if ANY dem candidate takes advantage of that, then I can say with total certainty that any and every Repub candidate remotely ties to Bush and Cheney and Enron will be punished for what their backers did. People out here in California want blood for what was done to us, and that issue SHOULD be used. If the Party won't use it, then we will have to find another way to bring it to the fore.

[Cha]

13. Yeah! TankLV is right! Look it up!

No way Dems need to be cowering in the freakin' corner!

They should come out with both barrels blazing, so to speak! :kick:

[salin]

40. With regards to the WH - there are some documentable facts

about HOW the WH worked to try to "save" Enron - and in doing so allow the continued pillaging of California's economy. CHeck out this very well documented piece from The Consortium:

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2002/052902a.html

Bush Did Try to Save Enron

By Sam Parry
May 29, 2002


Since Enron Corp. plunged into bankruptcy six months ago, George Bush's defenders have said the administration's refusal to bail out the sinking energy trader is proof of Bush's integrity, given that Enron's Chairman Kenneth Lay was one of Bush's top financial backers.

The story line has been that all of Ken Lay’s millions couldn’t buy George W. Bush. For that reason, Enron has been called a financial scandal, not a political scandal.

Growing evidence, however, shows that this Bush-can’t-be-bought story line isn’t true.

It is now clear that prior to Nov. 8, when the Securities and Exchange Commission delivered subpoenas to Enron, the Bush administration did what it could to help Enron replenish its coffers with billions of dollars. Enron desperately needed that money to prevent the exposure of mounting losses hidden in off-the-books partnerships, a bookkeeping black hole that was sucking Enron toward bankruptcy.

As Enron’s crisis worsened through the first nine months of the Bush presidency, Ken Lay got Bush’s help in three principal ways:

--Bush personally joined the fight against imposing caps on the soaring price of electricity in California at a time when Enron was artificially driving up the price of electricity by manipulating supply. Bush’s rear-guard action against price caps bought Enron and other energy traders extra time to gouge hundreds of millions of dollars from California’s consumers.

--Bush granted Lay broad influence over the administration’s energy policies, including the choice of key regulators to oversee Enron’s businesses. The chairman of the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission was suddenly replaced in 2001 after he began to delve into Enron’s complex derivative-financing schemes.

--Bush had his National Security Council staff organize an administration-wide campaign to pressure the Indian government to accommodate Enron, which wanted to sell its generating plant in Dabhol, India, for $2.3 billion. Bush administration pressure on India over the Dabhol plant continued even after Sept. 11, when India’s support was needed for the war on terrorism. The administration’s threats against India on Enron’s behalf didn’t stop until Nov. 8.

(long article- goest through each of these cases... read it!)

Tie California Recall effort to Bush.

Then look at Bushco's work ala Enron.

THEN (Here is the big kicker) Tie to the WH renewed efforts to get Cheney's designed Energy Bill passed - which includes all sorts of doozies - and was developed by the WH Energy Taskforce (much still secret) that not only included LAY, but many other key players with companies involved in Market Manipulation.

NEXT: WHO is best equipped to prevent California Energy Crisis 2 and a second pillaging of the economy???????

[bahrbearian]

3. With a never ending war, there will never be a time.

[grasswire]

4. Dennis Kucinich does

If you didn't happen to catch him with Wolf Blitzer today, watch for the transcript that I'll post when it comes up on CNN.

[RichM]

6. OK, KUCINICH is willing to tell the truth. He's the exception that proves

the rule. It's not KUCINICH wing of the party that worries me -- it's the rest of them!

[bahrbearian]

9. Yes thank you

he seems to be the 1st to point out the obvious,,maybe Dean will be next.

[Sophree]

5. Regular people are talking about it

I'm thinking of Janeane Garofolo on Real Time, callers on CSPAN, etc.

It's SO obvious to anyone paying attention what happened. Are they afraid of being laughed at for calling the * Cabal criminals? Or are they following the unwritten rules of politics and behaving in a civil manner?

Don't they know that if we never attack them, we'll never win? We need a really strong fighter directing the DNC, for the good of the nation.

[F.Gordon]

8. Finally!!

A Dem bashing thread. My less-frequent visits to DU have been sadly void of these thoughtful missives. Thanks for filling this badly needed gap......

Oh, and since this is such a "simple" matter; it would be a simple matter to prove that Bush & Cheney helped Enron rip off the state for tens of billions of dollars in 2001.... can you explain it to me? I'm a little slow........and please be specific. Provide me with documentation that Bush* and Cheney "helped Enron" nail California for billions of dollars.

And why you are at it, can you explain...this subject of the Enron-Bush link, in explaining the $38 billion Calif budget deficit.??

Thanks in advance for your help in this matter.

[bahrbearian]

15. Secret energy meetings.

turning their backs..Kenny boy... El Paso... theres no link.

[Cha]

19. Here's a couple of links for ya!

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/may2002/enro-m10.shtml

http://www.truthout.org/docs_01/02.22C.Enron.Manipulated.htm

http://money.cnn.com/2002/05/07/news/enron_feinstein/

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/story.hts/special/enron/1656288

[Karmadillo]

22. Alleged: Enron bilked California out of $30 billion

1. http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/may2002/enro-m10.shtml

<edit>

For its part, the US media, which spent the Clinton years giving credence to every right-wing campaign to destabilize the government—from Whitewater to the Monica Lewinsky affair—has also sought to downplay Bush’s ties to a company that wreaked havoc in California, defrauded its investors and threw thousands of workers out of work, while its executives made millions in compensation.

California officials are seeking to recover some of the $30 billion Governor Gray Davis says Enron “extorted from the state.” But that will be difficult because the company has filed for bankruptcy and sold off its energy-trading division. USB Warburg, the investment bank that bought the division in February, said it had no liability for any violations carried out by the former management. “We did not inherit the liabilities,” a spokesperson said.

more...

2. The Bush Admin is sitting on tapes proving at least one key energy company manipulated supplies:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/09/17/eveningnews/main522332.shtml

<edit>

But the companies denied allegations of manipulation.

"It's preposterous. It never happened," said Duke Power Company's Tom Williams in June 2001.

And they're still denying it today.

But CBS News obtained records showing federal regulators have power plant control room audio tapes that prove traders from Williams Energy called plant operators and told them to turn off the juice. The government sealed the tapes in a secret settlement and still refuses to release them.

more...

[F.Gordon]

25. Thanks.......again...........

Trust me. In my heart of hearts I believe that Bush* and the gang have conspired, plotted, and distorted everything in pursuit of one goal. Run this country into the ground and turn the power over to a select group of Bush* friends.

Problem is........proving it. There are some sharp Democratic Lawyers working in California, and if they thought they had sufficient evidence to pursue the shithead*, they would. Covering the entire dem party with this "spineless" blanket is neither fair nor accurate.

...oh, and I don't think the 38 billion mentioned in the original post has anything to do with the 30 billion mentioned in your link. Did it contribute to? Yes, indeedee.........but it isn't what this 38 number is all about.

[Karmadillo]

33. Not that I'd claim expertise here, but the costs imposed on CA

by the manipulation of the energy companies would appear to have contributed to the budget deficit at least to some degree if this is accurate:

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/may2002/enro-m10.shtml

<edit>

In addition, state officials imposed severe budget cuts due to a rise in energy costs from $7 billion in 1999 to $27 billion in 2000, and after laying out $6 billion to buy daily power and another $40 billion to secure long-term contracts and stabilize the state’s energy supply.

more...

I guess one could argue the resulting budget cuts the expenditures necessitated reduced the energy companies' contribution to the debt, but the cuts would probably have been made anyway given the bust of the tech boom.

On this issue, I think RichM is persuasive. The budget deficit can in part be tied to Enron et al and it's hard for me to see why we should let the matter slide. I hope nothingshocksmeanymore (#21, 31) is right about the delayed pounce strategy.

[F.Gordon]

23. Thank you

I'm aware of the Enron/California connection, but there were a few things here that I was unaware of. So, thanks...but.....

Nothing here proves that Bush* and Cheney were directly connected. The suggestion is made, but there is nothing to prove it. If you can't convince me, a member of the choir, then how the hell does anyone expect the Dems to prove it to Mr. and Mrs. Average Californian?

[govegan]

30. Try this one on

http://www.yuricareport.com/PoliticalAnalysis/FraudinWhiteHouse.htm


In April of 2001, Ken Lay handed Dick Cheney a two-page memorandum recommending national energy policy changes. The memo contained Enron’s positions on specific, rather technical issues, which were presented as a “fix” for the California crisis. (Enron brazenly advised the administration not to place price caps on energy, which would be precisely the request California officials made to the President, and which the President and the Vice President would just as brazenly deny until public pressure forced them to capitulate.)



According to a special report prepared for Rep. Henry A. Waxman, over seventeen energy policies recommended by Enron made their way into the official White House National Energy Policy report.
How could the author and the editors have inserted an accurate assessment of the causes of the California energy fraud in May 2001 without having inside knowledge and or without being part of the scam, when it took the FERC two years of investigation to release virtually the same findings as those published in the national energy report?

[knight_of_the_star]

36. Don't have to

Human nature will take care of the rest. Criminals are convicted in trials all the time with nothing but circumstantial evidence. We DO have that, and enough of it. That and the people here WANT someone to pay for what was done to our state. It seems almost too easy.

[RichM]

24. I agree that you "are a little slow." This however is your problem, not

mine.

Anyone who reads the papers knows that Davis begged Bush & Cheney to allow the imposition of price caps on energy in the spring of '01. Everyone knows Bush arrogantly refused -- this was front-page in the LA Times in the spring of that year.

Why don't you learn how to use Google? It isn't really so hard. Here, I'll give you a hint how it's done: Type words like "Enron" and "Bush" and "Gray Davis" and FERC and "price caps" into the little box. Hit the "Enter" button. You'll see results like these (but too many for me too list here):

LA Times, July 16 2002: http://www.commondreams.org/views02/0716-01.htm
"...Now comes the smoking gun, the Enron internal memos disclosed by FERC that show clear evidence of market manipulation. The documents indicate that not only Enron, but other companies were fleecing Californians by driving up prices and triggering blackouts....

And: http://www.greenleaf-publishing.com/pdfs/jcc8clar.pdf page 6:
"Yet public records confirm that on 17 April 2001, for example, then chief executive
officer (CEO) of Enron, Kenneth Lay, made eight recommendations to Vice President
Cheney regarding federal energy policy. One of those recommendations was continued
opposition to price caps. A memo containing those recommendations was released the
week of 20 March 2002. On 18 April 2001—the very next day—Cheney told The Los
Angeles Times that the White House emphatically opposed price caps..."

The first of these items establishes that Enron ripped off California -- a point that no one really disputes. The second item establishes that Cheney & Bush helped them do it.

I merely grabbed these few listings off the top of the Google results. They are not the "best" proof -- they are simply representative of hundreds of similar items.

[madfloridian]

28. Here are some links about the "death star" and "fat boy" projects.

http://www.corpwatch.org/news/PND.jsp?articleid=2530

SNIP...."Energy traders for Enron used elaborate schemes with nicknames like "Death Star" and "Get Shorty" to manipulate California's electricity market and boost profits, according to internal company memos released by federal regulators Monday.

The memos -- jaw-dropping in their frank descriptions of how a sophisticated operation exploited California for financial gain -- enraged consumer advocates and state officials and prompted Sen. Dianne Feinstein to call for a federal criminal investigation of the company's behavior as the lights went out in California.

A state senator who has spent a year investigating the energy crisis called the documents "tremendous" proof that California's power debacle had been caused by companies looking to make money and not by energy shortages.

"The veneer has been broken," said Sen. Joseph Dunn, D-Santa Ana...."

More:
http://foi.missouri.edu/usenergypolicies/mystenron.html
SNIP...."One of the deepest mysteries in the collapse of Enron has been the role that the power crisis in California played in the company's rise and fall.

This spring, as authorities focused their attention on the off-balance-sheet partnerships that Enron used to inflate its profits, it seemed that the question might be forever buried under more pressing inquiries.

Now, though, newly released documents about Enron's practices during the crisis in 2000 and 2001 are causing regulators and prosecutors to re-examine the connection. Some outside experts say they may find that California played a crucial role in the company's demise.

Fallout from the documents — memorandums that appear to offer the first proof that Enron deliberately manipulated California's energy market — widened yesterday. Federal regulators demanded that other power trading companies acknowledge whether they used strategies similar to those mentioned in the documents, while the secretary of the Army, Thomas E. White, who has already been criticized for his role as a former Enron executive, faced a new call to resign from Public Citizen, a liberal public interest group...."

These articles are from 2002. Though it hit the mainstream a little, it did not sprout wings. I remember trying to explain to my uncle there in CA that it was more than Gray Davis, and in spite of about ten stories from reputable sources......he still said it was Davis's fault.

[CWebster]

38. PBS did an excellent "Frontline" report on it

which connected all the corrupt practices and the deception of the Texas-based energy mafia chums of Bush-cheney while the Whitehouse refused to halt the looting.

It is all well-documented, but as typical of the Dems, they can't get a head of steam in any direction.

[Cassandra]

39. How about this

http://www.ferc.gov/press-room/pr-current/06-25-03_enron.pdf

The government agency that FINALLY did something useful (their job).
It's a PDF file, so I can't figure out how to copy and paste.

[salin]

41. See the following article

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2002/052902a.html

Especially the part about delaying any intervention in California.

[Cocoa]

10. isn't Davis known for being very aggressive?

even dirty?

I know very little of him, but one criticism I've never heard about him is his timidity in attacking opponents.

If Enron could be made into an issue against the republicans, you'd think he wouldn't hesitate.

[revcarol]

27. Davis has been speaking up all along, and the media ignores him.

Now that there is the recall election, his words, even though the truth, are discounted as being "sour grapes."

The Democratic Congressional delegation has been MIGHTY in their criticism, getting at the truth, and redressing a tiny bit of
the financial damage to California.But the media and pundit line is "Oh, they're from California, so ya gotta disbelieve them!!"

The Senators have been all over FERC, the President, Cheney, Abraham,the secret energy meetings and no one pays any attention.

When you don't have one single branch of the government and the media is bought and paid for by corporate interests that don't want you to investigate THEM too closely, you're dead meat.

[bvar22]

12. Frustration and disappointment redux.

I am unable to offer a suitable explanation for the conspiracy of Democratic Silence on this (or these) topics.

The Democratic Stronghold of California would be an ideal location to originate the public exposure of of the bush*/republican party's complicity in the raping of the Northwest during a shamed up energy crisis! The proof is available. The unnecessary shutdown of power generating facilities is documented. The interstate shell game of reselling power is documented. Collusion and coordination is self evident. bush*/cheney*/republican party's complicity is revealed in their granting of Enron's request to not interfere with their gang rape. Record Prices plus Record Profits = Market Manipulation!

The only excuse I've heard offered from the Democratic Party spokespersons (apologists) is that they don't want to take a chance in alienating the base with wild speculation and conspiracy theories!!!!!!
I can't see this alienation happening in California! They were raped; they know they were raped; and bush*/republican party are the perpetrators!!!!

[bpilgrim]

14. very revealing, eh...

and they wonder why people are pissed :crazy:

i would love to go toe to - rhetorical - toe with any of these so-called leaders on national teeVee and ask them point blank on a myrid of scandalous topics with ENRON at the top of the list :argh:

i would do it with a smile and be as calm as a clam while inside delighting in every squirm. :evilgrin:

guess i'll just have to settle for the wannabees who constantly try and defend them - the leadership - here ;->

peace

[bpilgrim]

16. if they need a refresher course they should go here... ENRONOMICS

http://news.globalfreepress.com/enronomics.shtml

peace

[Stuck in Florida]

17. I couldn't agree more...

What a bunch of cowards the Dems are. They let election after election get stolen, and unlike the Repukes, they ignore their base. I am sick of them chasing after the so-called swing vote at the risk of pissing off their own base. One thing you can say, the Repukes do everything they can to solidify their base BEFORE going after the swing vote. Even if the Dems get a chunk of the swing vote, it means nothing if the Dem base sits out the election. A friend of mine who works in D.C. told me shortly after 9/11, that half the Dems won't give money to the Dems because they were fawning over the self-proclaimed King Smirk and the other half wouldn't give money becaue they are furious that the Dems won't even fight for their own base who put them in office. When complaints are made that the Dems can't be trusted to save us from a foreign enemy, maybe they think if the Dems can't act as an opposition party and fight the Repukes, how can they be trusted to fight a foreign enemy. This party needs leaders who can fight. There are Dems, like Kucinich, Dean and some others who are willing to do it but they get tossed aside and laughed at by their own party. If the Dem leadership can't stand up for the base, let them get the hell out of their leadership roles, the bunch of cowards. No matter what you think of Davis, he at least fights. At this point it's hard to decide what's more important, the issues a Dem is for or finding a Dem who will take the fight to the Repukes and America. It would be good to have both. However, most Dem fighters don't end up in the leadership, at least not in Washington. It isn't about Gray Davis, it's about another stolen election. Go Gray Go!!! Rub the Repukes noses in their own shit they're throwing. How many more elections will they steal before people wake up!!!!!!!

[HootieMcBoob]

18. Do you think Ahnold has even a clue about this?

I mean, I say this all the time but you never hear the pundits on tv mention it at all. The one thing I do keep hearing is that he came in with a surplus and now there's a record deficit. Sounds familiar huh? The one person who could really put their feet to the fire is Arianna Huffington. I mean that's what she's about, right? Unfortunately big ass Ahnold is sucking up all the air and nobody has any time for anything other than him. C'mon Arianna, tell it like it is!

[Dover]

20. I feel torn between the excuse of fear, incompetence and collusion........

because it's so difficult to imagine that fear and incompetence are so pervasive among Dems. Therefore it MUST be collusion. Any way you look at it, the answers are unsatisfactory!!!

RichM did you see my earlier post?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=156598

The article in the post was from early 2002. I can't believe we are no closer now to answering the questions posed in that article.

What DID happen in that meeting between Arnold S, Riordan and that criminal Milken over some information provided by Ken Lay?

Are the Dems REALLY ignorant or incurious?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

21. No Rich they don't. I believe they will but if they divulge their actual

strategy for arguing against the recall this early in the game, it gives their opponents an opportunity to shape their arguments around the strategy. There are several self supporting millionaires in this race. Let them develop their ads and then have NO RESPONSE to the Dem response.

[RichM]

26. This is of course possible, but it makes me nervous, as it sounds just

like the refrain from before the 2002 elections: that the Dems "had a strategy" to return to focus to the economy & away from Iraq, etc -- and we all know how that turned out.

The Recall is a GREAT OPPORTUNITY to direct vast public attention on the power-market shenannigans of Spring 2001, & the role of Bush-Cheney-Enron in bringing them about. If the Dems blow this opportunity, which seems to me, Ahem!, not inconceivable, based on the performance of the last few years -- I believe it will represent the most extraordinary sort of political cowardice.

I hope your scenario comes to pass, I really do. But, as the saying goes, I'll believe it when I see it.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

31. I hope so too and am basing it on my personal knowledge of some

of the players. Every other candidate is in this on the basis of a budget deficit that has been framed as poor fiscal management. To give the othr candidates something that can be easily rejected or reframed this early would be suicide.

Satrpass does have SOME good points but overall, the Governor, the AG and the state senate committee heading California's investigation have whitewashed nothing and have been the SOURCE of the Perot computer program and other stories underscoring HOW they did it. IF they were complicit why would they release this?

[Cha]

32. Thanks for all this!

[madrchsod]

29. read the chicago tribune

article about how the banks hide alot of stuff from anderson accounting. if you remember anderson was the first and only big player to take the hit. nobody else took a big as hit as them. ..other than the employee`s and stockholders. although anderson did know what was going on the banks hid alot of stuff from anderson...the bankrupty judge may not allow the banks to recover debts from enron...don`t you feel sorry for those poor bankers? i know i do...

[moderateindependent]

34. Good point - too late?

Davis should have been trashing Bush the past couple of years - from when the energy crisis began, then as Bush's deficits and cuts started gutting the state - but he sat silent. Now it may too late to make that case, but it should be made.

Also, the case about if Davis should go for deficits, so should Bush...

[CWebster]

37. The mother lode

and why do they not mine it?

Although unfamiliar with CA politics, I do recall the debate among posters on another site around the time of the energy crisis. Seems Schwartzenegger campaigned for Gov Pete Wilson who set up the deregulation scheme, but Davis was remiss in rectifying the crisis.

My sense is that they are without strong, uncompromised leadership again on the state level. A reminder of why establishment insiders will forecast no change on the political radar. They will play it safe while the ship sinks.

[Democat]

42. Davis is one of the toughest Democrats around

If all Democrats would fight like Davis, we would not be in the sad situation we are now. He is not charismatic, and he rubs many people the wrong way on a personal level, but when it comes to fighting the right wingers, Davis is the man you want on your side. I have often heard him compared to Bill Clinton as far as being able to out think, and out fight the Republicans.

The Democrats won every statewide office in the last election, that is no small victory. The fact is that this 100 year old recall law allowed a tiny fraction of people, funded by a rich right wing fanatic, to undermine and nullify the will of the people of California. Maybe Davis should have done something to try to stop the recall, but it's not clear that anything could have stopped it because the bar was so low and the money so plentiful.

Davis is a fighter and if he goes down, he will go down fighting fiercely, unlike many Democrats in 2002.

[CWebster]

44. its a losing battle he is fighting

if so many of his constituients are disatisfied. He might be fighting the vast-right wing conspiracy, but he seems clueless as how to win.

[Snellius]

43. Part of the problem was Californians themselves

Gov. Gray Davis (2001):
"I would love to personally escort Lay to an 8 by 10 cell that he could share with a tattooed dude who says, 'Hi, my name is Spike, honey.'"

Davis did put up an aggressive attack on Enron and FERC, but, except for the NY Times, not only did the media prefer to believe Cheney The Shill but many Californians were more prone to blame Davis. Sometimes it seems that Californians geographical isolation cuts it off from seeing their own problems in more general terms.

[CWebster]

45. The question becomes

What is Dean doing right and what valuble lesson do other Dems have the opportunity to learn from him?

A good politician is a convergence of events, but the great politician heeds the call and keeps their finger on the pulse.

[Democat]

46. The California media is very activist against Davis

Most of the print media in California as well as virtually all of the radio stations and most of the television media have been active for years in Davis and Democrat bashing.

There is nothing bad that happens in California that isn't Davis's fault according to the media. At the same time, there isn't anything bad that happens in America that Bush is responsible for.

The media in California were doing their best to promote the recall even before it was a serious effort by the right wingers.

The only person who has ever been able to get the media to be anything close to sympathetic to Davis was Bill Simon, and that's because he was so bad that they couldn't ignore his stupidity.

The activist media in California will be a big problem for Democrats during the recall.

They've already started marginalizing all candidates except Arnold.

[Snellius]

47. This demagogic gang pact between Repubs and Limbaughs

will likely get out of hand for the right. Not just in California. Those country-club, all business Republicans may find their attempt to use mass media to buy a broader base may turn around to bite them back. Schwarzenegger may not be Schickelgruber but the political dynamics are not completely dissimilar. There are already signs that aristocratic conservatives are shocked by this uncouch bounder.

[CWebster]

48. Then

he is not much of a fighter.

[Q]

50. I find it kind of strange...

...that the usual suspects show up on a RichM thread to denounce him for 'Dem bashing'. (Not the previous poster) Yet...as far as I can tell...many of these same posters don't seem to have a problem with the DLC bashing the party with their rhetoric about 'failed policies of the past'.

- The DLCers do the party a disservice when they proclaim traditional Dem values and policies have failed the nation. Threads like these help to give us a better understanding about the direction of the party.

- Liberman was among the 'New' Dems that allowed the Enron criminals to escape justice and corporate corruption to remain in place under the protection of the US government.

- It's becoming more difficult to wage battle against corporate and government corruption when part of the Dem party acts as enablers and co-conspirators.