720 sq ft house in not so good neighborhood selling for $515,000.00.

[maveric]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20040616/news_1n16housing.html
The housing market here in San Diego is horrific. Families cant buy a home unless both spouses work 2 jobs.
What would happen if the middle class is priced out of the housing market? Would corporations buy up all the property for rentals turning everything into a "land/robber baron" scenario?
I had to sell my house in 1999 for $129,000.00. A 3bdrm in a working class neighborhood. That same house is up for sale now for $425,000.00.
Is this what our children have to look forward to?
This is disgusting!

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. This is why I live in a trailer

Not pretty, but at least it's ours. Wish the land was too, but we can't afford to buy it.

[stavka]

27. I like your thinking.

We live in a very high priced market and could "afford" to live in a "better" i.e. larger, newer house, but we choose to live among poorer people and don't feel the need to have a heated cave of a house. It also makes us less debt ridden.

It's warm in the winter, it's cool in the summer. We have trees, a lawn, and neighbors of every color and religion I can think of (in all seriousness, our neighborhood is the most diverse according to the US Census data in both our and the most reasonably comparable neighboring county)

We joke we live is the Muslim quarter of our city - cops hate to come here, and yet we have the lowest crime rate in the city.

Perception vs reality

[maveric]

37. I'd love to buy a trailer but the space rents out here are in the $700.00-

$1,000.00 range. Everyone wants a piece of the "screw the consumer" frenzy.

[GreenPartyVoter]

42. We are lucky. only costs $200/mo for a lot in our rather nice

trailer park. But even so, I do wish I could be buying my own land instead. However, even if I could get some for a similar price per month, I can't afford the down payment or setting up water and septic.

So, here we stay. Thank heavens it's a really nive neighborhood!

[Beloved Citizen]

71. Los Angeles housing is crazy

But it can work in your favor. A fixer upper we bought for $400,000 2 years ago is now valued at $760,000.

We're unloading it and buying another shipwreck. This will be the 4th distressed property we will have bought in 5 years, and each one paid off handsomely. I'm sick to death of scraping and painting, but it's worth it.

Word to the wise: In towns like San Diego and Los Angeles, people want to move into pristine fully operational houses. And they pay out the nose. But there are still plenty of distressed joints around that, if you put in the work, will help make life a little easier.

Exploit yuppies. Rip off the rich.

[RebelOne]

97. Boy, are you lucky.

Where do you live? I pay $289 for lot rent and I thought that was cheap.

[GreenPartyVoter]

100. Maine. :^)

[RebelOne]

94. Yikes! What state are you in?

I live in a mobile home in No. Georgia and only pay $289 lot rent and that includes water and garbage pickup.

[FlaGranny]

43. Us too.

The trailer AND the land are ours. No mortgage. It's a wonderful feeling. It's the first time since I got married many, many years ago that I've had no mortgage.

Edit: I live in a park where there are almost 400 trailers - NONE are available right now. A year and a half ago, there were nearly 30 available.

[Warpy]

47. I lived in a trailer for five years before interest rates

came down. I owned the trailer, liked the park and my neighbors, but the space rent kept climbing. I bought a little house in a formerly bad but on its way up neighborhood as soon as I could.

I really preferred living in the trailer. It was a very well thought out living space. This house was built in 1952, and is fairly typical of the post war, mass produced house.

If I could have bought a lot in this area and moved the trailer onto it, I would have. The space rent in that park is now within $100 of my monthly principal, interest, taxes and insurance, with no interest deduction.

Anybody who knocks trailer living has never lived in one. They are far superior to apartments, and superior to many houses.

[FlaGranny]

62. They're great

if there are no tornadoes or hurricaines around. ;-)

[Booster]

61. I was considering looking at

a mobile home, but a friend has one in LaVerne CA and she is paying $900 a month just to park the thing on their property. That seems like a lot to me because LaVerne is certainly far from L.A. Must admit tho, I haven't really looked into it much so....

[LynzM]

2. It has to give, eventually...

The housing market bubble can't go on like this forever. At least, that is what those who study the market seem to say. I certainly hope they're right, or we're all going to be living in the middle of nowhere, commuting a zillion miles, in order to afford places to live. California seems to be the worst, by far, however.

[progressiveBadger]

20. I was just in Jamaica

and that is what happens when land and housing becomes too expensive for the middle class to afford. Now, almost everyone rents and the only land owners are very rich foreigners and resort owners.

[silverweb]

3. I hear you.

I'm in San Diego, also, and rental prices are just horrific. It's got to end somewhere.

I keep hearing about that "housing bubble" that's about to burst, but there's no sign of it happening here any time soon!

[maveric]

6. San Diego is also a "No Cause Eviction" region.

Which gives landlords the power to evict anyone theywant at any time without cause.
I'm sure that the all white county commission voted that in.

[Sub Atomic]

41. However,

A law was recently passed that stated the landlord had to give a minimum of two-months notice to evict, unless it's for non-payment or breaking the law.

I know it's not much, but at least it's better than the old 30-day notice they used to be allowed to give.

[silverweb]

84. I hate that "no cause" clause.

I used to manage a small building and only had to evict once (for very good cause), but a friend of mine was evicted once because the manager wanted to rent his unit to a relative. It was completely unjust and my friend had absolutely no legal recourse.

[hatrack]

18. Just wait until interest rates start going up

FOMC will meet in about 10 days, and the almost unanimous consensus is that they will bump rates. It probably won't be much - .5% at most - but it will not be the only increase.

With foreclosures as high as they are, and rates as low as they are, it won't take much to push a lot of overextended individuals and families into the financial ashcan.

[tjwash]

53. The ones who will suffer, are...

...the people who swooped in and bought 400000 dollar proprties on 1.5 and 2 percent ARM's. In five years or so, the banks are going to be reclaiming a lot of proprty after the rates get adjusted back up.

[tjwash]

50. There is no housing bubble.

It's just the way it is here. I remember in 85 you could buy a huge brand new 4 BR 3 BA house in Scripps Ranch for 175000. Back then THAT was considered outrageous. The same "real estate bubble bursting" talk has been going on for as long as I can remember. 90 through 94 were bad years in the market, but housing prices never fell, it would just take up to a year to sell your property.

I think what's going to happen, in the future, is the US is going to end up the same way Germany or Switzerland is; everyone will have to rent, and no one will be able to buy.

[maveric]

59. That same house in Scripps Ranch would sell for $700,000.00 now.

I sold my home in Chollas View for $129,000.00 in 99. Its on the market now for $425,000.00.

[Must_B_Free]

82. I agree

What I saw was that with no confidence in the con men of wall street - realestate was a tangible investment; at least I can see what I'm getting.

With the corruption of the administration that was going to "run the government like a corporation", I see nothing to give me confidence that all the corporate con men were going to "turn over a new leaf".

So as the quality of life dimishes, the luxuries you enjoyed as a youth are all but unattainable today. But look back to the large farms that people used to enjoy living on and you see it's been going this way for a long time.

[Kellanved]

107. what?

I have never heard about especially high prices in Germany. Compared to the UK, houses are not that expensive in Germany (especially considering the available subsidies) -resulting in a high percentage of people living in their own homes.

[Skidmore]

4. Come to Iowa...

sell your house there. Start a business here. You can buy a house with more than twice the square footage for less than $100K in a small community. Rural areas can get you a home for $30-$50K. Either scenario gets you a good yard.

Woohooo!! This is my 1,000nth post....I've arrived.

[Wickerman]

7. Yep

you can buy a helluva a house and a lot of peace of mind and a great place to raise the kids for what must be pocket change in the big city.

With telecommuting and broadband and netflix and amazon, etc., life is good in the sticks.

[DoNotRefill]

66. Yup Yup...for under $70,000, got a couple of acres of land...

and a 5,000 Sq. Ft. house. It's even waterfront, but needs some work.

Of course, its out in the middle of BFE....

[maveric]

9. But the sun doent shine there 9 months a year.

And the beautiful cliffs and beaches arent there. <sarcasm>
I know, Iowa is beautiful but I've been spoiled by 24 years out here.

[Skidmore]

12. Those cold months are for

cuddling.

[gpandas]

98. can't have it both ways, unless you are wealthy n/t

[Blue Gardener]

11. Property taxes are probably lower too

A little high in Iowa City, but manageable.

[Skidmore]

15. You betcha...

We pay $1028/yr. for a three bedroom with 1,800+ squ.ft. of living space. We also have a two car garage and 1/2 acre yard with a number of great gardens. Love it here!!

[Blue Gardener]

22. I love it too!

I wouldn't think of living anywhere else. The gardens are looking great this year!

[maveric]

30. Thats what I pay for a shithole 3 bdrm apt in a crappy area.

I may have to leave paradise.

[JNelson6563]

119. Paradise revisited

I live in northern Michigan and we are surrounded by water. Fresh water. The rolling hills and seas of trees....it's gorgeous. Compared to your area real estate is a steal.

I would put northern Michigan against any other region for natural beauty. All year long. Summer-time, coming down big hill and you see the rich greens of the hills of trees and the two contrasting blues, the sky and the deeper blue water, beautiful. Fall, the most beautiful of all I think. Breath-taking, really. Winter too~the awesome power of nature, really stunning. Then spring and early summer, many orchards of cherry trees, flowers and growth everywhere.

While the state has been hit financially the north has not felt it much yet and may avoid it all together. Sometimes being "behind the times" has it's advantages.

Lastly, our over-throw~the~fascist~bastards effort is really jumpin'. Lots of fun! :hi:

Julie

[shrike]

121. It is GORGEOUS up there

We used to spend our summers in northern Michigan. Truly a paradise. Unfortunately, I need my city fix regularly enough that I can't see living up there permanently.

[JNelson6563]

122. Best of both worlds

I too am a city person and I live in the thick of it. I can drive 10 minutes and be at the bay or in the wilderness. Or I can go to the corner of my neighborhood and be among a sea of commerce. (Traverse City is the place--ask Displaced Texan--she's lived here and can tell you)

Having my cake and eating it too in the north--

Julie

[Red State Rebel]

40. In Missouri - our property taxes are just over $600.00

3 BR 2 Bath, 20X50 Deck, 2 acres, full basement. 1/2 hour from downtown St. Louis. We bought the house in 91' for $64,500.

House payment is $522/month :) We are surrounded by beautiful hills and maybe a few rednecks :)

I can't imagine trying to live somewhere like San Diego where the cost of living is like that.

[Sandpiper]

45. The tradeoff for the expense is

You live in a place where it's sunny and 80 degrees for about 9 months of the year, and has beaches that are within easy driving distance of wherever you live.

[shrike]

78. Yeah, you have to make up your mind what you want in life

I can understand why some people choose the weather and the beaches, but my unglamorous town allows me the privilege of earning my living as a writer/artist and owning my own home. It's a matter of choice, unfortunately; few can have it all.

[Red State Rebel]

89. I'm not a sun/beach person so it works for me, our tradeoff is

enjoying all four seasons - in the fall, the hills surrounding our area look like they are on fire with the color of the leaves. I live for crisp fall mornings and evenings with the smell of autumn in the air. A nearby orchard is open for apple picking - you can take your kids there for a tractor drawn wagon ride out to the orchards and pick your own. Every few years, my husbands side of the family gathers with the old copper kettle and makes homemade applebutter while the nieces and nephews play. Everyone takes turns stirring and the guys are in charge of feeding the fire. When it's ready, we bring out the jars and can it. The day before all of this, my sisters-in-law and I sit around the table and peel and slice the apples and talk.

Winter can be a pain on occasion, but there is still nothing like waking up to everything covered in white and the silence that comes with that.

In St. Louis, there is the Symphony, The Fox Theatre, baseball, football, the Missouri Botanical Gardens, the St. Louis Zoo, etc.

I've lived here all my life and love it.

[silverweb]

85. I know someone in Missouri...

He was telling me pretty much what you're saying and I was seriously considering visiting to check the place out. My kids are here, though, and my youngest is just starting college, so I'm not going anywhere for a while. I've been here too long and it's home. I'd hate to be driven out by economics, but that may eventually happen.

[Worst Username Ever]

13. MN

My Family lives is spread out around CA, in Sand Diego, Temecula, San Clemente, and Dana Pointe. Everyone moved there from Minnesota (where I live) and they just complain nonstop about rent and house prices. I am not sure why they complain, they left MN and the houses here are right about at the national median... and they get nicer weather. Summer was last week here, and I do believe winter should be rolling in again in a few days...

[rinsd]

26. No offense...but its still Iowa, cheap or not.

I grew up in NJ and I have been here in San Diego for 6 years. I just couldn't imagine moving to a non-major metropolitan area. The culture shock was enough moving East to West. West to Mid West might kill me.

[Wapsie B]

64. You'd be suprised at the number of Garden State

natives that now live in the midwest, Iowa in particular. Those I've talked to just wanted to get out of all the congestion on the coasts and lower cost of living. Depending on where you live you're not that far away from a major metro area like Kansas City, St. Louis, Chicago, or the Twin Cities. Some would say that Iowa is the middle of nowhere. I say that Iowa is in the middle of it all.

[Lefty48197]

33. I like Iowa

Norway, Dayton, all the biggies.

[senseandsensibility]

56. Good way to arrive!

Bearing good news about the housing prices in Iowa!;-) It sounds like heaven to us rent/mortgage slaves in California. I've been to Iowa once, and liked it. I also liked what I saw of it when c-span broadcast from there during the primaries. Lots of good Democrats. Congrats on 1000!

[catzies]

75. Congratulations on that 4th digit!

Woohoo!

[Gregorian]

110. There's no marine influence in Iowa.

That's what people are paying for.

[Sandpiper]

5. I know what you mean

I pay almost as much per month for rent on my 1 br apartment in San Diego County as my parents pay for the mortgage on their 3 br house in North Carolina.

[Demobrat]

8. You can get a house in SD for $515,000?

Here in San Francisco you would be lucky to get a two bedroom Condo for that price. A 600 sq ft one bedroom condo with paper walls on a busy street goes for $450,000. People have been saying since I moved here 20 years ago that prices couldn't go up any further, but they've always been wrong so far. I don't see any end in sight, frankly. People are so desperate to get into the housing market here that they'll do and pay practically anything.

[BrotherBuzz]

23. Just south of you...

In Palo Alto/Menlo Park area "knock-downers" go for over a million bucks a pop (and those are the small lots!). Some architects are pround of designing replacement homes within five square feet, the maximum size house allowed for the lot!

[LynzM]

91. Depending on where you're willing to go, and how you want to live....

You can live cheap. Our house just appraised at $35,000. Two-bedroom, 1.5 bath, right downtown. Not the best neighborhood, and very little land (which makes me sad) but quite close to the public library and several parks. Still, I'd rather have more land and less house, but you can't beat the price, for now! We're in Indiana, btw.

[shrike]

103. We live in Indiana too

Two bedroom, two bath, all new upgrades. We're on two acres, though, right in the middle of town, so our house is worth anything from 130,000-150,000, so I'm told.

[LynzM]

111. Yeah, depends where you are

We're in Terre Haute, the armpit of Indiana :evilgrin:

Where are you?

[shrike]

113. We're in northern Lake County

I've heard good things about Terre Haute, though -- mostly about the reasonable cost of living.

[LynzM]

114. Yeah,

But not many jobs. Then again, that's pretty true everywhere, these days. Terre Haute's got its own self-perpetuating bad rep. Check out www.terrehautesucks.com ... that's a lot of the mindset here. Really, though, it's not that bad.

[RedEarth]

10. Not here in Oklahoma...2500 sf for $130-200,000 on a 1/4 acre

[mike1963]

32. Yep, here in eastern OK we got 2 acres & a 2200 sq ft house for 75 grand

and it's 3 blocks to a beautiful lake...winter is crappy but we can afford to spend much of it with my partner's relatives in Florida.
:D

[kymar57]

14. 720 sq ft?

Is that a typo? 1/2 a mil for that? DAAAMMNN.

[maveric]

31. No typo my friend.

And in a bad neighborhood to boot.

[rinsd]

16. San Diego is outrageous....

I was just joking with someone that if I win the $30M lottery tonite, I will finally be above the San Diego poverty line.

[wryter2000]

17. Modest 2br/1bath in Oaktown

We live in a bad neighborhood in Oakland (on a good block). And old house, would be sold as a fixer-upper. The house appraised for $345K last year. It's nuts.

[Cobalt Violet]

19. Massachusetts is pretty bad too.

You can buy a used trailer for 150,000.
Rents are so bad.
I cant even afford a studio apt. nevermind an apartment with a bedroom.

[Sandpiper]

39. What's rent like for a 1 bedroom where you are?

The low end here is about $650.

[DoNotRefill]

67. 1 bedroom: $250/mo

close to campus. nice 2 bedroom:$350

[stavka]

83. I'd say a one bedroom is about $600-700

They are also almost unheard of. Two bedroom is typically $1,100 - though the prices have dropped off through "Discounts" - free months rent

I live in a college town.

[LDS Jock]

77. Boston, $160,000 for a parking space!

The escalating cost of parking, long a premium in Boston, hit home for many when it was learned that a 180-square-foot parking spot sold last month for $160,000 at the Brimmer Street Garage in the Beacon Hill neighborhood.




http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/Northeast/04/27/boston.parking.ap/

[LibDemAlways]

21. The CA real estate market

is ridiculous. Three years ago I tried selling my 1600 sq foot 3 bdrm/2 ba tract house for 350K and got a few offers but took it off the market because of a change in plans. Today the house would sell for over 600K with buyers lined up.

Homes in a new hilltop development nearby that sold new for 400K 5 years ago are now going for over a million. Where all these wealthy buyers are coming from I have no idea. I couldn't cash in my equity and "move up" even if I wanted to because I couldn't afford the property taxes on a high-priced home.

[Piperay]

69. The houses in my area are selling for

close to a million dollars and they are just CA Ranch style tract homes!:wtf: I live in the coastal area of Los Angeles County so I guess people are buying for the location and not the crappy 3 bedroom 2 bath houses themselves. I know if I didn't live here already there is no way in hell I would pay that much for these homes. :puke:

Edit: My parents bought this house in the 1950's for TWELVE thousand dollars, I inherited it from them.

[salin]

93. This is part of the reason I left the beautiful Bay Area

no way to ever do nonprofit work, ever think about owning a home without a 1.5 hour commute... each way. Would have to change my professional work (don't want to do that) - or never be able to buy or even barely put money aside for retirement. And I don't trust, anymore, that SS will be available at any liveable rate - regardless how much I put in - by the time I retire.

I miss the Bay Area tremendously - but have moved back to the midwest, am doing the work I love, am closer to family, and have saved enough to buy a nice home - that with a small amount of money put in will increase (moderately) in equity - while I continue to (finally) feather my retirement nestegg. No way I could be doing this had I remained in the Bay Area.

[Gregorian]

112. I hear you!

I was raised in the Bad Area when there were dairies. Then came the concrete and condos. I moved away and got a degree in engineering. Then came back in 1990. Even the high paying wages couldn't keep me there any longer. I've been off, and running ever since. Next stop might be Canada. I too miss the roast duck at the Chinese markets. And the beautiful weather. I'll probably never go back, I hate it so much there now. Idiots and their love of that stinking car. That's what did it. Breeding and driving drove me away.

[Pithlet]

24. That's insane!

How does anyone live there? That same house would be under 100 grand around here. You can get 4 bedroom, 2200+ sq ft homes for around 200-250,000 here. Brand new.

[FreeState]

25. Hey its not in a BAD area

Not all of North Park is a bad area. There are parts of North Park that have homes that go for a lot more, by the park its not unusual to see some of them go for 800K or more. North Park has areas that are safe an nice and areas that are well Condo Hell.

North Park is slowly becoming Hillcrst 2... all the gay people are moving in because Hillcrest is even more expensive now.

I live on the canyon in University Heights (That part that use to be a part of North Park until about 7 years ago) and the guy across the street from us just put his house on the market for $850,000. He will sell it at that too.

Its a 1,600 sqr feet with 2 bedrooms/2 baths and den. It has a big, for this area, back yard.

A house just down the street just sold for $500,000.... it is 900 sqr feet with ONE BEDROOM.

I know this much, if my partner had not bought our house 6 years ago we would never have enough $$$ to own here.

[rinsd]

29. University Heights is nice....

Along with Normal Heights(though much farther along) its becoming an improving area.....much of North Park has a long ways to go.

[maveric]

35. Its not Mira Mesa or Del Cerro.

That part of town has gangs and drugs. Trust me, I know this for fact.
Some parts of No.Park are ok if you like small houses with no yard and parking problems. I use to live on Cherokee St and a 1 car driveway just doent cut it when you have 2+ cars.

[rinsd]

57. I work here in North Park.....

Why? Because we can rent a 7 room office for $1000.

Not the greatest neighborhood but I've seen much much worse(Logan Heights comes to mind)

[1monster]

28. My house sits on a large corner 2 1/2 lots and was appraised last

summer for $141,000 (I thought that was low ball). Today, the five lots across the road from me which have been up for sale for less than one week sold for $130,000... :shrug:

[shanti]

34. move to phoenix or las vegas

been told that the home prices are terrific. sell high in cali and buy low in AZ or NV.

[Coventina]

44. Not anymore, my friend

Here in Phoenix the housing market has shot through the roof.
Homes in established neighborhoods start around $250,000.

To get anything cheap you need to either buy something in a REALLY bad area or buy a McMansion out on the fringes.

[Demobrat]

46. I bought a 1000 sq ft 2 bedroom condo in Phoenix

a couple of years ago for $65,000. I rent it out now, figure I'll have it paid off in ten years and go retire there, or else sell it and buy someplace else. There's no way I could ever afford to buy where I live now.

[Psst_Im_Not_Here]

49. We get a lot of Cali "immigrants" here too

Here in Colorado, the prices are much more reasonable. We've been getting a lot of people from Cali here. Sun shines 300+ days a year and winter is a piece of cake compared to what it's like where I come from! It's funny most people who think of Colorado think we're buried in snow 10 out of 12 months....not so. If it does snow, it's gone in a day. But...shhhh, dont tell anyone!

4 bedroom 2500 sf house great neighborhood...$200,000

[WolverineDG]

73. don't bet on vegas

my friend & her husband are "buying up" because the housing prices are skyrocketing. they purchased their house 5 years ago for about $110K, and now the asking price for that house is in the $200-225K range. i think it's a bad idea for them to do this, esp. since they'll probably only get an ARM this time around, but it's not my money. i'll still worry about them though.

no one seems to know why housing prices have skyrocketed so much w/in the last year. personally, i smell a rat.

dg

[shanti]

102. hmmm

well, compared to the bay area prices, vegas is a bargain! but it sounds like prices have gone up just about everywhere.

[boxster]

36. A recent study (in the same paper) said that only 15% of the

population can afford to live there.

I've been trying to move there for 15 years. Guess it's a little late now!

[Mountainman]

54. San Diego isn't what it's cracked up to be.

San Diego is now just like Los Angeles. When I first lived there it took about 1/2 to get to work. When I moved it took over an hour. Average commuting speed is 0 to 30 mph. There is only one freeway East and West the I-8 and the I-5 and 135 north and south. Just about everyone has to drive on them going to and from work.

The weather is OK but never changes. The tourists out number the residents 20 to 1. The military and tourism are the two main industries.

There is a poor part of San Diego with gangs and drugs etc. but you never hear about it. It is mostly conservative politically and there is an "I got mine you get yours" attitude there.

I didn't like living there as you can tell.

My brother is a pastor of a Catholic parish there but I don't like going there to visit him.

[shrike]

79. I know a whole family (parents, adult children) who moved to San Diego

and then moved out. Their beef was mostly the living expense. Mom and Dad went home to Michigan, son moved to Oregon, daughter to Phoenix.

[Timefortruth]

38. Remember when "rare" Beanie Babies sold for over $!000?

That's what this sounds like.

[Xithras]

48. Say it with me *** MARKET BUBBLE ***

And it's gotta pop soon. The market is beign driven by three things right now:

1) Lenders so desperate for business tha they'll finance anyone with a pulse for far more money than they can actually afford.

2) Interest rates so low that people can afford massive house payments if they go with a 3 year fixed and a decent down payment.

3) Investors looking to make money hand over fist in a real estate market that's growing 13% to 25% anually in some regions.

#1 can't be sustained because the eventual defaults will put many of these companies out of buisness. #2 can't be sustained because inflation will drive interest rates back up into the 8% to 9% range over the next few years, and people without fixed mortgages will default when their mortgage payment skyrockets.

But #3 will be the worst of all. The investors who are driving many local real estate markets right now aren't your traditional long-term land speculators. Many of them are stock market refugees looking for short term gains in a hot market, and most will dump their properties once they perceive that the market has topped out. That's when the crash will happen.

I expect that we'll see a 20% decline in the average home price in California over the next 5 years, with a far higher drop in the overpriced urban markets like San Diego. Once interest rates go back up, there simply won't be any buyers that can afford that range.

[boxster]

65. It may not burst as quickly as you might expect.

San Francisco's prices have been climbing for many, many years, with everyone anticipating a precipitous fall that hasn't happened. San Diego is up 95% in the past 5 years and over 20% per year for the past two.

Interest rates certainly haven't been low that entire 5-year period, so net migration has a lot to do with it. SD is growing almost exponentially and has a continual housing shortage that was exacerbated by the fires last year. It may be a while before anything resembling a market correction happens out there.

[salin]

95. Even if it were to "burst"

I have read that the decline would only be 15 - 20%. When talking about $500,000+ homes that wouldn't make things more affordable for a large portion of the population.

I recall in the height of the tech boom in the Bay Area (circa 1998) folks were renting the living room of their apartments (eg a couch to sleep on) for $1,000 a month. And houses going on the market in Palo Alto for -say 3 million - would be bid UP a million within a week.

I moved in early 1999, so I don't know if that is still the case - but I would assume with the tech-boom that this particular aspect (the upbidding of homes to that rate, and the renting out of living room space for "bunking out" for $1,000 a month) has slightly cooled. But I could be wrong...

[NewYorkerfromMass]

123. I agree. Cheap to borrow money now. Too cheap.

This will all end soon.
Manhattan is absurd. Our apartment we rent now is ours IF we pay about $700/sq. foot. I am not interested. We would be looking at a $3000/month mortage payment plus monthly "maintenance". SO depending on negotiations we could get away for no less than 3K per month, and that's a lot more than our rent now.

I want to wait for this bubble to pop. Real estate is so scarce for development that gas stations in Manhattan are now being bought to put towers on.

[kymar57]

51. What are the rent rates in SD?

I'd have to say I'm just dumbfounded. By my figuring this type of property would cost just under 3k a mth at the current interest rate(30 yr mtg). This is barely enough room for 1(By myself in 880 sq ft).

So where do those that don't make 90k live?

Honestly,I'm not disputing your numbers.But what does the middle class family do there?

[maveric]

58. 2bdrm apt's are about $700.00 to $1200.00 a month.

And those are not in exclusive areas either. I pay $1050.00 for a 3bdrm, 1,1/2 ba apt with NO Amenities other than a small laundry room. No pool, no AC, 1 parking space and substandard wiring in La Mesa, about 1/2 mile from San Diego.

[Mountainman]

52. I sold a Condo in El Cajon for $136,000 in 1992.

I lost a job and couldn't make the payments. I made $27,000 on the sale and moved to Lompoc, CA. Bought a house there with the money as a down payment. Sold that for a $100,000 gain and built a house in the mountains. In each case the interest rate was at it's lowest level. I went from 10% to 7% to 4.5% Real Estate is OK if you can do it. You need to start out and keep selling at a gain at the right time.

I do feel for those who are children now.

[Deja Q]

55. Only the beginning. Housing bubble to burst in 5... 4... 3...

2 parents working 2 jobs just to make a poverty earning.

Try 3 jobs each if the republican fuckers nix the "minimum wage", claiming it to be more unnecessary regulation. x(

Once inflation creeps up, the housing bubble will burst. $500k houses in shit neighborhoods with a 10% or more interest rate?

<social commentary> People really shouldn't bitch and whine about how we made life to be. That's how we made it to be. </social commentary>

When will corporations remember that the middle class supports our economy by 70%? Get rid of us and they'll get rid of themselves in the process.

Outsourcing et al has NOT resulted in lower prices. Have you seen lower prices? I haven't. There's a big problem at work, and deregulation (thank you grandfucker reagan) is part of the root cause.

Oh, the national debt that's beyond repair at this point...

We're in desperate trouble, if not very soon.

[donhakman]

60. Once it bursts

The banks and richublicans can buy houses up for cents on the dollar.
Bankruptcy laws will be ammended so people will not be allowed to keep their homes as before. Forclosure lawyers will be rolling in dough.

Or enough buyers will wise up that the bubble that exploded on Wall Street may do the same to their property soon.

Like all the bad investment advisors telling people to buy stocks...they are telling people that it is a no brainer to buy grossly overvalued homes now while interest rates are low.

Will Greenspans coming announcement be the bubble burst heard round the world?

[PeaceProgProsp]

87. You don't need to change the laws. You can't protect a mortgaged

home from bankruptcy. You can only protect a paid off home in bankruptcy. No? If you don't pay your mortgage, you lose your house.

EVERYBODY has a mortgage on their home now.

Everybody can now lose their homes.

[ShaneGR]

63. What kind if of person would want a 720 sq. ft. home??

Seriously, San Diego is nice but screw that.... there are plenty of places with warm weather to get a house triple that size for more than half as much.

[Occulus]

68. GOD FUCKING FUCKING FUCKING ***DAMN*** IT ALLL!!

Is there ANY reason ONE person working FORTY HOURS A WEEK should not be GUARANTEED a home of their own?

Huh???

OTHER than the greed of the seller?

HUH?????

[Jacobin]

74. Wha?

Houses sell for what buyers are willing to pay.

If there are more buyers than sellers, the price will go up. Simple solution is to move to where there are more sellers than buyers. There are LOTS of places like that, although they aren't in California, as far as I know.

[maveric]

76. I work 72 hrs a week and there is no way that I would even qualify for...

a loan for a modest $400,000.00 home here in San Diego. A young woman I work with just bought a house. She and her husband have to work 2 FULL TIME JOBS to afford the $2800.00 a month mortgage payment. They will only spend 6 hours a work week at home and that is for sleeping. They each work at least 1 day on the weekend (not the same day) and thats when they spend time with their 2 yr old daughter. Where is the quality of homeowner life there? The only one who spends any time in their house id the dog. A $450,000.00 dog house.

[GOPisEvil]

92. Well...I work a pretty much 40 hr/week job, and I just bought a house.

Not the greatest place in the history of the world, but for a single guy like me, it's fine. Under $100k in Austin is saying something, even if the place is a 2BR/2bath with a postage stamp for a yard.

[Jacobin]

70. You guys are living in a place where there appears to

be waaaaaaay more demand than supply.

Why not move and change a red state to blue? (I know it may not be fun, but we could use ya out here in the boonies, and it would be good for electoral politics. :-)

You can get a great house for a couple of hundred thousand in most small cities in the red zone, although job opportunities will probably need to be self-created unless you have a professional degree.

I don't see how two middle class working people living together can buy a $800,000 little house and have any money left to like...eat, or travel, or have fun.

I wouldn't even consider jumping into a rat pile screwed up situation like that. Boggles the mind.

Oh. And that Bubble? It's getting ready to fucking explode. When interest rates go up, all those houses will be unaffordable to most buyers and they will sit on the market until they are foreclosed and the bank gets tired of holding them at which time they will be dumped on the market, further depressing prices. I've lived through two of those cycles.

[catzies]

72. 628-square-foot home in west Ventura sold for $476,000

"The two-bedroom, one-bathroom home with a detached office in back is on a large lot on Lewis Street, off Ventura Avenue, often considered a low-rent district."

Don't let "low rent" fool you. It's BAD down there.

[The Backlash Cometh]

80. Forces people to make bad decisions in business.

Well, decisions that may be good for business, but bad for people.

[Generator]

81. And people bitch about taxes!

This one is the "sunshine" tax and it's one I wouldn't pay.

[vetwife]

86. I am waay so lucky even if it is a red state

My family lives in a new Split foyer we bought that is two years old, 5 bedrooms, double car garage, sprinkler system, A/C C& H, Rock Fireplace, 3000 sq. ft. Music room...carpet, Oak cabinets, hardwood floors in Living area, 1 acre of land and vinyl siding with terrace and front porch. We paid 127,000. payments about 800 a month Tax insurance included.....Sure ya'll don't want to turn this red state Blue ! and 3 Full baths..one with Garden tub !


Lordie..I really love my home and appreciate it a lot ! Here it is !

[Wapsie B]

88. Forgot one very important point

about living in Iowa. I won't have my taxes increased to pay for some billionaire's sports stadium.

[thebaghwan]

90. My house in Seattle is an older (1972) 5 bdrms, 2 1/2 baths, 3200 sq ft,

full family room with wet bar and fireplace, huge multi level redwood deck for partying. Has a nice front and back yard. 1/4 mile to major freeway and bus route. River and lake to fish and canoe truly 15 minutes away---$280,000

[Kathy in Cambridge]

96. Sounds like Cambridge MA

We looked at a DUMP of a two-family for 800K. It was called a "contractor's special". In other words, knock it down and build something new. :eyes:

[gulfcoastliberal]

99. Kinda why I moved down south

I'm from Northern California, Davis and Berkeley. I can't believe how the prices go up a reliable 20% every 8 months or so. It's unreal. Here in my spot on the Gulf Coast, you can get a waterfront 1300 sq ft 2-bedroom condo in a building with a 24-hour doorman for 150,000 (they sold 12 months ago for 120,000). I just put in a bid on it and the bank recommended the sellers accept it. The 2-bedrm unit I live in is on the golf-course side, not on the water. Bought it last year for 90,000 it would now sell for 115,000.

[edhopper]

101. I won't go into details but

due to low interest rates, a soft stock market and Adjustable rate mortgages with small down payments. We are most likely in a Real Estate Bubble. Especially in the Northeast and West Coast. As interest rates rise and the economy picks up as well as the Stock Market. This Bubble will probably burst. Just remember the 1999 NASDAQ.

[TexasBushwhacker]

104. What happened in the early 80's?

Here in Texas, in the late 70's - early 80's interest rates had gotten to 14% fixed. Prices were too high too, because many people were buying whatever house they could afford thinking "if I don't buy now, I'll never be able to afford a house". But sure enough, when the average family can't afford the average house (in some cases by a factor of 2 or 3 or 4) something's got to give. I just figured I would wait for the bubble to burst, and boy did it.

In the mid 80's, sure enough, the value of the houses dropped as well as the interest rates. When people tried to refinanced, they owed more than what the house was worth and would have to pay $10 or $20K to get a loan at a lower interest rate. People would just go and buy another house and let the first one go into foreclosure. I bought a 3BR/2BATH/2 car garage, 1200 SF home that was owned by the bank. It was built in 1982, but it had been unoccupied for over a year when I bought it in 1985. The original selling price in 1982 was $56K. I got it in 1985 for $37K.

So my question is, did a similar correction happen in California in the mid 80's?

BTW, we have semi-California environment here in Austin. You can't go to the beach, but there are several large lakes and rivers for swimming and sunning. We have a great live music scene, and politically it's not nearly as redneck as the rest of Texas. I was just pining for a house that's up for sale in my neighborhood. It's 2800 SF, natural limestone all the way around, huge spreading live oak tree in the front yard and nicely terraced landscaping (Austin is very hilly). Asking price - $218K, and we don't have state income tax!

[tlcandie]

105. Live in Hernando County Florida...west coast...

Hernando County is the fastest growing county in Florida atm. In 2001, we purchased a 3 bedroom/2 bath/2 car garage/1700 sq. ft. home built in 1987 with bird-caged pool for $86k. It's now worth at minimal $120k.

New homes are going up like crazy for $100-120k for really nice homes. The super nice homes are $150-200k. Lots are getting hard to come by. We bought the one next to us for $9k and plan on keeping it for the peace and quiet.

Additionally, we underbought for peace of mind if something ever happened with career/finances.

California sounds crazy! All along the west coast it is becoming similar because many are moving north. I remember when I first moved to Washington State that the prices were high, but nothing like they became when I left in 1998. This includes the Oregon Coast! In the early 90s you could find some nice deals, but not anymore!

[AlCzervik]

106. California real estate marches to it's own beat

I'm a realtor and i'm amazed at the prices in my own town. I moved here 4 years ago and we bought a 2100 sqft house for $209,000, that price included corian, tile and hardwood floors. If i were to sell my house today i could easily get $450,000 for it. Thats more than doubled in 4 years, it's crazy. On the downside of that, we mave have to move to the SouthBay area, we started looking at town houses, a decent one starts at $500,000 and even at that price it still needs a major remodel.

[spinbaby]

108. My nephew just bought a house for $13,000

It's a small fixer upper in Wheeling, West Virginia, but it's in a neighborhood you'd actually want to live in.

[Gregorian]

109. Ha! I sold my 400 sq ft house for $420k. In 1999.

(In fact, it was only 252 sq. ft. on the assessor's documents. )

One used to pay off a typical mortgage in thirty years. Now it takes about 200 years!

So, yes, I have to ask where this is all going, and who can afford it. Double incomes, is one way. And or lowering of property values.

I am presently in the process of buying a house in the last place I know that I can afford it. In Canada. Wish me luck, as immigration isn't as easy as it seems.

[uncle ray]

115. want to puke?

i read yesterday on another very non political forum, of a person in a small town in MO who just bought 3 burned out businesses on the main street of this tiny town...for a grand total of $500.

[skippysmom]

116. My question is:

who are all the people who can afford this? We have our own bubble here in Mass -- and I just wonder who makes enough money to qualify for a mortgage on a 1/2 million dollar house? Especially when you consider the median household income in this country is only 40-50K.

Someone is making out like a bandit in this economy. And it ain't most of us.

[sleipnir]

117. The worst has yet to come!!!

Here's why real-estate costs so much these days.


Due to the transient nature of our modern society, we decide to buy homes/apartments at reasonable rates, with low finance charges. Of course the media then tells everyone about how a few people have gotten filthy rich selling their "investment" after only four years! Wow! Now, here's the problem. A vast majority of Americans believe that if they buy a home/apartment, in about 3-7 years they can sell it for a fortune, move on to another home, rinse and repeat.

Guess what, that doesn't work, as 3-7 years isn't enough time to build up a substantial equity. But no one wants to take a loss on their property, especially in the 5-6 digit range. So they mark up the value to hopefully post a gain. And of course, someone decides to buy the place, with the help of low interest rates, and the cycle starts anew.

Today people only want to live somewhere for a few years and then move on. It's the modern society we've created and I'm not going to argue with it, as I'm totally in favor of this style of living. What's the problem is that people expect to make a lot of money off of real estate. So prices are driven up and expectations of quality are lowered. This is how you get NYC $1.1 million apartments in areas that as little as 10 years ago were totally undesirable.

In the end, the problems are just going to get worse, but the only solution is high interest rates on home mortgages. We need to shift the market back from "buy" towards "rent", as it's horribly out of balance right now. Until this happens, look to see higher and higher costs for crappier and crappier homes/apartments.

[sable302]

118. my parents bought a house in Oklahoma in 1980

during the oil boom. Cost 85,000 then. The same home still wouldn't sell for 80K 24 years later! (at one point the market value dropped to 48K)

That was a bubble then, and this is a bubble now.

[sleepystudent]

120. I've wondered for a while...

if this housing crisis ( and it is a crisis ) could be used as a political point for the Dems. Just to acknowledge that this is a problem for so many people would show empathy for what people are going through and maybe more discussion of housing subsidy programs would get people excited.

The same goes for college costs as well. Dems need to discuss this more.