Has anyone ordered their FBI file?

[eeyore]

I understand that under the Freedom of Information Act you can send away for your FBI file. Has anyone done this? If so, did it surprise you what was/wasn't in it?

I have a friend who send away for his, and there were lots of pictures of him protesting the gulf war with his Jewish Student Union group from college. His face had been circled in the photos. Pretty creepy.

Do you think that once you send away for your file they put you on another list of people to watch out for? After all, why would you want to see it unless you'd done something that warrants having a file?

Do we all have files no matter who we are or what we have done?

Has the Patriot Act made all of this worse?

-eeyore

[squidbro]

1. Interesting

I'm interested. How does one go about ordering their FBI file?

[eeyore]

2. They only list this option

An FBI Identification Record, often referred to as a Criminal History Record or Rap Sheet, is a listing of certain information taken from fingerprint submissions retained by the FBI in connection with arrests and, in some instances, federal employment, naturalization, or military service. If the fingerprints are related to an arrest, the Identification Record includes name of the agency that submitted the fingerprints to the FBI, the date of arrest, the arrest charge, and the disposition of the arrest, if known to the FBI. All arrest data included in an Identification Record is obtained from fingerprint submissions, disposition reports and other reports submitted by agencies having criminal justice responsibilities.

more at...
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/fprequest.html


I don't think my friend actually sent in his prints. This was a few years ago, so maybe things have changed. Anyone know?

eeyore

[ConsAreLiars]

3. Instuctions here

http://www.rcfp.org/foiact/index.html
Form letter generator here: http://www.rcfp.org/foi_letter/generate.php

[democracyindanger]

4. I've always wanted to

out of curiosity. Somebody around these parts said that just asking for your file puts you on a list, but take that for what it's worth.

[Selwynn]

5. Ok, I'm so doing this.

I'd love to see what's in there for me.

[izzie]

6. When I was in grade school they took every one prints.

This was in the State of Maine during WW2, and the Navy has also taken my prints along with my children. My aunt worked in fingerprint part of FBI and said they have just a part for those prints. Now it is most likely in a large data base.

[GreenPartyVoter]

14. AFIS

[Piperay]

7. I wouldn't send for it until

chimp is out of office and President Kerry is in charge of things. I have always heard that just requesting it will put you into a file if you didn't already have one and with this bunch in I wouldn't want to take the chance. :scared:

[beachman]

8. Hate to break it to you...

But the FBI isn't going to change much if Kerry takes office. Government agencies just aren't that way, especially in security stuff.

Rembember MK-Ultra. Albeit a CIA-thing, it ran from the mid-50s perhaps as late as mid-70s, and though there were hearings, no one was punished. heck, there probably running similar operations today.

[eeyore]

15. I totally agree

Things may not change that much from President to President, but AssCrack is out of control, and who knows what's being collected? It will be really interesting to see files when they are released 20 years from now.

Are they really doing more, or are they just talking a big game to scare us into submission?

-eeyore

[teryang]

9. An active investigation is exempt from Privacy Act

So if something was going on, they don't have to tell you what is in that file.

[anarchy1999]

10. No, and why would a single one of us want to? Just because we might

be bored and want to send up red flags everywhere?

If we have a file, okay, do we want to bring attention to it, NO! Why in the name of anything sane would you just want to challenge "Homeland Security"?

"I want to see my file", Why?, might be a good question to ask.

If you think you have a file, then you probably do, why do you want to ask for it? Don't you already know what is in it?

[Fear]

12. because in most cases you can't know what's in it.

Aks yourself the question, why is my picture in this file while walking a protest mars against the war in Iraq.....necessary?

Assumptions are made, and that's dangerous business!!!!

Why is this post in my file.....

[Fear]

11. Everything you say and do - can and WILL be used against you.

There's only one thing that made it worse, computers. It's all about data-mining storage etc. etc.

When you think that's all they have......well, think again.
- How many video camera's are located all around the globe (yes - face recognition is in a very good developed stage and already used)
- You flew with an airplane (all logged)
- You payed with a credit card (all logged)
- You used your preferred card in a grocery store (all logged)
(try using your jewel card in a dominix store, works as well, it's a centralized database system)
- Library (could be logged)
- Cell phone usage (logged)
- Internet traffic (logged) / http://www.echelonwatch.org
etc. etc. etc.

What your friend saw was what they can 'legally? siege'.......but don't underestimate the current database systems and information storage / retrieval. Supposedly the US has got a database systems that's capable of storing 2 pages per person on the entire planet / it's not that hard to create something like that.

The danger of data-mining is that people are setup in little boxes - Someone flew to Egypt once, went to Hawaii twice and went to New York. The reasons don't matter - when data-mining nobody cares about reasons, but mearly looks for potentials. It's a massive lookup system, this person also has a subscription to Guns n Ammo, that person bought rat-poison and asperines in the Grocery store / well that could make this person even more suspicious / this person doesn't fit the regular profile......this is an example ofcourse, but easily doable.

So quit simply queries as (Give me all people that went to Saudi in the last 2 years, who bought rat poison and is still single)

It's all about making assumptions.

Now don't get paranoid, you didn't do anything wrong right?

(on edit: yes probably a flag gets checked that you requested the information)

[eeyore]

13. I don't have that much faith in the FBI

I don't think that they have the level of organization that would be able to keep track of the little information about each and every one of us. I think that you need to come to their attention as "a threat" in some way before they start tracking your moves.

I'm as tinfoil as the next guy, but that kind of database would be a monumental undertaking. I can't believe that they have any interest in tracking the average suburban American.

Now coming to a site like DU and posting subversive messages about the government - that will get you put on their list, right?

:tinfoilhat:eeyore:tinfoilhat:

[Fear]

16. yup@ontheirlist, except I'm not really on their map :P

that database is in existence. I'm sure you remember the fingerprinting for all foreigners traveling to the US/ that's done digitally / stored in a database. Yes they have everything that is currently within their reach stored in databases,

don't forget all the information gathering that is done can be funnelled over later anywayz.

Trust me, it's really not that hard to accomplish. - it's more about space.....but even that is being overcome easily now.

All that I've described is in existence.

[Fear]

17. Some links to back it up for you.

Public Database of Government Officials
By: Mike Healan
July 9, 2003

Remember TIA, known formerly as Total Information Awareness and now as Terrorist Information Awareness? TIA is a new project by the United States Department of Defense. TIA's purpose is to amass a colossal database of information about American citizens and visitors to the country.

The stated goal of this project is to help protect America from terrorists. However, many fear that TIA will be abused by the US government to monitor US citizens who have nothing to do with terrorism or any other crime. This fear is exacerbated by the fact that the head of the project is Admiral John Poindexter, a man known for his contemptuous disregard for privacy rights and citizen oversight of government. Poindexter was once convicted of committing purgery before the US congress (a federal crime in the United States), although the conviction was later overturned.
<snip>
FROM:
http://www.spywareinfo.com/articles/gia/

Total Info System Totally Touchy
By Ryan Singel

Can a massive database of information on Americans really preempt terrorist attacks?

That's what industry experts are asking about the Pentagon's proposed Total Information Awareness System, which, according to the proposal (PDF), would aggregate on "an unprecedented scale" credit card, medical, school and travel records.

http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,56620,00.html



ah look for yourself :P
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&newwindow=1&safe=off&q=database+Total+Information+Awareness

in http://www.google.com with example keywords:
database Total Information Awareness

[tom_paine]

18. Google DARPA's Project Genoa

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q=%22Project+Genoa%22+DARPA

Isn't that interesting? DARPA took down their page on Project Genoa...

http://dtsn.darpa.mil/ixo/genoa/genoa.doc

Here's a related pdf, though. Take a look at Project geona. Sure, it

http://www.darpa.mil/darpatech2000/presentations/iso_pdf/4armouratb&wrev1.pdf

Well, well, what a surpirse, project Genoa has been excised from this web doc!

http://dtsn.darpa.mil/ixo/genoa/genoa.asp

Another Genoa doc deleted!

Oh my yes, they are preparing to move against the Imperial Subjects of Amerika! They can talk all about their Business Partners like Bin Laden all they want.

But I would not believe these Free-Market Stalinists if they told me water was wet.

[KansDem]

19. I worked with a fellow once...

...who, after the FOI Act was passed, thought he would see if the FBI had any file on him, so he requested to see it...

The FBI told him there was no such file. However, soon afterwards an agent visited his town (he was from a small town in Missouri) and asked questions of his neighbors about him.

He told me that, if he didn't have a file with the FBI before, he certainly does now!

[Raskolnik]

20. Only request it if you want to feel bad about yourself...

Most of the files are unbelievably boring. Even for people that consider themselves firebrands, the file usually just categorizes them as unimportant.

[DoktorGreg]

21. Mine only had that i had requested my FBI file! Doh!

EOM

[Raskolnik]

22. Disappointing, isn't it?

I was hoping mine would have something along the lines of "subject is a devilishly handsome intellectual that is capable of great things."

It didn't. Sigh.

[LuminousX]

23. FBI files are like fortune cookies?

[Raskolnik]

24. That would be awesome!

"You will be going on a voyage (to jail)"

[Jabbery]

25. I don't think that I would live long enough to read it

I've fought Republicans for more than 20 years. My file is probably bigger than Clinton's new book.