Mari333 | Secondary Post Traumatic Stress | Let's DU more than PRAY...

[nostamj]

on edit: please keep this kicked.

A lot of you have been reading about the struggles that Mari333 and her family have been going through.

Multiply it by 10s of THOUSANDS. And DOUBLE it. And DOUBLE it again.

Even those who have not lost their sons and daughters; even those who have not seen their sons and daughters grievously wounded; are suffering every day.

Military Families Speak Out spokesperson Nancy Lessin has reported that the Red Cross is being overwhelmed with calls from military families dealing with "Secondary Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome."

While we continue to see intensive coverage of a family's grief when a civilian is murdered, we see nothing in the corporate media of what's happening to these thousands of military families.

Mari's story is not unique or isolated.

Since you're on-line anyway, it's time to time to let the media know that this is a story they MUST cover.

Here's calimary's media contact list:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1413842

This is from April, so calimary, if you have an update, please post it if you see this!

You know the drill. Prayers are fine but... as we used to say in the Buddhist group I belonged to:

It's fine to chant for the water to boil, but sometimes it's better to turn on the stove.

TURN ON THE BURNERS!

Here's mine:

Dear _________

While we are all moved by the images of Paul Johnson's family, your failure to report on the ongoing grief and stress that thousands of military families are going through is disturbing.

Contact the Red Cross and investigate the growing problem of Secondary Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome that is literally tearing these families apart.

Contact Military Families Speak Out for first-hand accounts of what this war is doing to them.

By showing only the stories that serve to inflame anti-Muslim sentiments, you are sanitizing a war that never should have happened. You are hiding the anger and grief of thousands of families by showing the President surrounded by cheering troops who have no say in appearing in his blatant campaigning and no opportunity to express their real feelings.

It's not too late for journalism to return to America and not too late for America to return to its ideals.

Sincerely,

[UrbScotty]

1. Just emailed CNN - here's the link

http://www.cnn.com/feedback/forms/form1.html?39

[IkeWarnedUs]

2. I don't know if this is a coincidence

I have CNN on while reading DU and they just did a quick piece on how the media covers selected victims (like Jessica Lynch, Berg, Johnson, etc.) while thousands more go nameless and faceless. They esentially said it is because people saw coverage of the few - saw their faces and those of their families - and could relate to them.

It was a short, lame piece, but at least it starts the public discussion.

And (short and lame as it was) convinced me of the importance of your call to action.

[Luminous Animal]

4. Thanks for posting that...

I will include in my letter that the reason that thousands go nameless and faceless is because the media ignores them.

[nostamj]

10. interesting timing!

I missed it. flip-flopping btw CNN and MSNBC.

[nostamj]

3. damn!

70 'my thoughts and prayers are with you'

and ZILCH for this thread?

[Mari333]

5. nostamj, thank you and I will write also

I spoke with my husband, and told him to come home when he is ready. He is severely depressed, but he is an adult and he knows where to go and who to call for help. He is , at this point, not a harm to himself, but I had to speak with him and let him know he can come home and get help. Its up to him now, and I have to allow him that time.
In the meantime, I will contact the news media and organizations and tell them about our family, and the fact that thousands of other families are going thru this and it is being ignored by the media.
kick

[vetwife]

7. Marie Honey, tell him we are all hanging on by a thread and we are praying

This nightmare has got to end and he has to just keep on keeping on and we all are here for you guys !

[Rebellious Republican]

41. My prayers are with you Mari333, now get off DU and kick some

Media Whore Ass! :evilgrin:

:yourock:

[vetwife]

6. Jeff..listen to Guy's show today if I get on..got some news..well

It is not good. I have the direct quotes from The Va Heaquarters how they are planning on dissing those vets. Most of them are not even gonna qualify for treatment ESPECIALLY PTSD.. I went under the wire and got the documents from the Va Heaquarers through an acquanitance that works up there !
As Ricky Ricardo used to say.Sombudy got som splainin to do !. Mr. Bush
You got some to do !
Not offense to my latino friends and I loved Desi Arnaz !

[nostamj]

8. i'll be listening

at least the first two hours.

I was going to call on this topic BUT, you are MUCH more qualified and informed... go for it. direct DUers to this thread.

I'll email Guy a heads-up.

[Mari333]

9. kick to get the word out on this

we are not the only family. Thousands and thousands out there are calling the Red Cross every night begging to hear or see from their loved ones in Iraq and Afghanistan, and have no help...Secondary Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome is a real issue, and is devastating families, such as ours, to the point of such high levels of stress and pain that people are not able to function.
Just to get the word up through the chain of command to a loved one in Iraq is extremely difficult and sometimes doesnt even happen (Bush needs warm bodies for his "war", his admin does NOt care about soldiers and their families, not a whit)
The media cannot continue to ignore us, and it is getting worse as the truth comes out about the lies about Iraq, more and more families will suffer from this.
This issue is not going to go away, and the mental health of military families is being destroyed , as are the soldier's mental health ...no one is addressing these needs. There is no place for these families to go, or for the soldiers.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

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[gpandas]

12. this post is about getting the media...

to listen to all the people that were in the war and have changed their minds, not just one or two hand-picked stories. what is wrong with showing compassion about a loved one who died,or was horribly wounded? what is wrong with appreciating someone who was willing to die for his country?

[nostamj]

13. thanks

someone has their cluephone unplugged.

the lies and mistreatment of soldiers by bushco is unprecedented.

and the media's enabling is sickening.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

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[Media_Lies_Daily]

14. Maybe YOU should try growing up. First off, as a former serviceman....

...I signed up back in 1976 to serve in the military and to fight if needed. But, that has NOTHING to do with fighting wars based on the pack of lies fabricated by FratBoy and his NeoCon sidekicks.

LEGITIMATE wars are fought for LEGITIMATE reasons...that's the basic point you've somehow missed in all of the discussions on DU.

Since you seem to have a hardcore approach to serving in the military, when did you serve and in what branch of the service? Or are you just a simple chickenhawk that talks big but can't deliver?

[nostamj]

17. I hope you're not holding your breath

I don't think you'll get an answer!

[supercrash]

29. "chicken hawk" ?

I don't wish or want war.

I also never served.

Now can you list some of the "LEGITIMATE" wars we fought in recent history that had "LEGITIMATE" reasons ?...or some of the "LEGITIMATE" overthrowings we have commited ?

BTW....I have no "hardcore approach" to serving in the military, The US has a history of fighting other peoples wars...and nobody should be surprised when they get sent off to fight somebody elses war when they are serving, I just want to see Americans stop passing the buck and take responsibility for their actions, we WILL reap what we sow....Don't follow our Joe Millionaire Presidents example...don't pass the buck...take responsibility...and when you sign away some of your rights to the US government and things don't go as planned...you only have yourself to blame, there is no draft................yet.

Tally ho

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

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[Rebellious Republican]

36. History lesson, legitimate Wars .............

Revolutionary War, without it you would be speaking queens english and a loyal subject of the Queen of England, Tony the Poodle Blair would be your PM today.

Civil War, depending on which state you live in now as to what Country would be living in right now? Yes we did fight somebody else's war, the blacks of that day could not fight it for themselves!

WWI and WWII, if we did not join in to help fend off Germany, Sie würden Deutsch jetzt sprechen. I will let you figure that one out!

Sure I could go on and on but I think you get the picture, but then again maybe not?

[supercrash]

42. Yup!

Is that all you got ?

Ends with WWII ?

So since WWII what do we have ?

I DID say "recent history"....

Blah blah blah.

Go ahead and claim Nam and the Gulf war are legit...Maybe the US involvement in the Iran/Iraq war was legit...Iran/Contra..?..getting closer ?.....ALL troops have signed up since then...the history speaks for it's self...there is no reason they shouldn't have known what was coming

[Rebellious Republican]

47. YUP....

So lets dismantle the entire American military machine, get rid of anything associated with American defense. Yup and we can all sleep safely knowing that world is a warm fuzzy place to live. Why we all know that no one would ever try to bring harm to a defenseless free nation. You live in a fantasy world little pup, there is a reason why you can sit comfortably in front of your monitor enjoying whatever your smoking, bashing those in uniform. You have so much to learn about this very complicated world we live in. I wish it were as simple as you think it is, I to wish it were all milk and honey. But its not, if you are old enough why don't you take yourself on a little vacation to some third world country and see for your self just how nice you have it here, then reflect as to why you might have it so nice. Until you gain some real experience on a global level, I suggest that you rethink your limited wit and wisdom.

:nopity:

[immoderate]

15. I think some signed up expecting

to defend the United States. This war is over the top.

This is not mercenaries anonymous.

--IMM

[linazelle]

16. People who signed up are now being held against their will

it's not a matter of volunteering any more. The agreement that these people signed has been broken--and, at the very least, they should have expected to be fighting and risking their lives based on truths and not the lies of the current administation. Nobody should be bound by a contract based on lies.

[supercrash]

31. They "broke" the contract"

Come on now...Clinton ordered a stop loss order also

Bush sr.....lied to the American people to wage war, as did other Presidents..this is nothing new

But I do think Bush is the worst prez ever, by far...with very evil intentions

BTW...The US government is allowed to break the contract...YOU are not allowed...not fair, but the way it is

[Curious Dave]

44. Yes Clinton did

order a stop loss. But, it was for the bombing campaign in Kosovo. A very different matter than the evil bush war in Iraq.

[supercrash]

59. "A very different matter:" ?

Fuck that

Both wars are somebody elses, US troops are fighting other peoples wars

Looks the same to me...It really doesn't matter how or why we are there. the fact remains...the US troops ARE NOT fighting to defend thbis country, they are defending somebody else, If that is what you want out of your life...then join the service, I can promise you that you WILL fight somebody elses war

BTW, ....nevermind, fucking hypocrites

[vetwife]

62. Kick

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[vetwife]

30. OK supercrash...lets talk !

I deal with veterans everyday and I tell you PTSD is real ! You may not can see it..like a cancer..but it spreads throughtout the family.
Now, I would venture to say I know a little bit more about this than your average person, considering I deal with veterans, one in particuliar my husband who fought in Nam in 71 and the others who have called me as late as 3:00AM not knowing where to turn. I also have talked to people in DC at the VA Headquarters studying Agent Orange and guess what..depleted Uranium is there ! If you are are against this war which the lady in question is, and her son, then you should have some sort of idea just what kind of Hell this family is going through. If you are a Hawk, and a lover of suffering then you belong in the Bush/Cheney loving crowd.

If you have never experienced PTSD, or survival guilt or helplessness then you have no idea what this family is facing. So..he joined......As a weekend warrior...But he sure as Heck didn't expect to be held over there with no end in sight. Nor did the family. Nor did any of them expect his status as an MP to be so looked down on as when those folks followed orders and he was not one of them but guess what..my husband was spit on when he returned and he didn't deserve that. Now if you know more than the twenty doctors, social workers, experts, combat vets and mental health professionals that I have talked to, you sure are wasting some valuable talent posting on a board flaming. Either help the situation or get the Hell out of the way ! Am I clear enough on that?

[ElectroPrincess]

34. I second the sentiments of VetWife ... well written!

[Sugarbleus]

53. VERY well said!!

It's about time the 'REAL' world is presented in cold hard facts to some of these clueless sorts.

I almost started a flame throwing contest at this person myself..but you've covered it much more succinctly.

There's a certain crowd in our party (or in these types of forums) that just doesn't get it. They cannot think independently, rather they run with the "pack" in their hateful ideology. Therefore, that makes them no less numb skulled and hard-lined than the Bush neocon crowd....the black and white, all or nothing band.

Perhaps these types are just too immature. Perhaps they are:
.......'The children of the Corn'.......... or from:
.......'The Village of the Damned'................

Sorry Mari....

[Mari333]

57. Listen, Ive heard these types of people time and time again

They form opinions based on NO experience of the issue. Its like someone telling me they have an opinion on climbing Mt Everest, having never done it.
Unless you have a service member over there, or you have been in the service, you can
a. empathize or have compassion by using what experiences you have in life to understand (perhaps a loss of a loved one, etc, ) or
b. think before you form opinions, or do some research.
The Bush administration has sent kids over to Iraq with shrapnel wounds ( a second time), with broken arms, stop lossed them, and ruined our reserves and National Guardsmen by using them in innappropriate scenarios (one soldier who was not qualified to detonate an IED was sent to do it anyway and killed)
the Bush administration refused to armour the Hummer vehicles, and hundreds of our troops died because of it..until there was an outcry, the Hummers are just now being armoured
The Bush administration cut veterans pay, veterans benefits, and for a while made soldiers pay for their own meals
the Bush administration has NOTHING in place for the vets when they get back to deal with their PTSD , and there is NOTHING in place for the families to deal with their own sorrow and worry and secondary PTSD
This war should have never happened. Not ever.
Every man and woman who died in Iraq should not have died.
They died for nothing.
Every person injured over there...for nothing.
The only people that benefitted from this war are the corporations that own Bush and Cheney and the rest of the mob.
This war is, and always has been, a fraud.
Many service members and their families are wrapping their minds around that truth now.
I spoke with Nancy Lessin at www.mfso.org , and she said its hitting them, finally. Bush sent their loved ones over there for
nothing.
My husband and I knew it all along.We always knew this war was a fraud, from the beginning.
Might want to do some research before one forms quick opinions from their playstation games online or people who watch too many Arnold Shwarzenegger movies
http://www.calltoconscience.net
http://www.bringthemhomenow.com
http://www.vaiw.org
http://www.mfso.org

[supercrash]

60. Are you shittin me ?

The people in the military had a choice...they made their choice, they joined

The Iraqi people NEVER had a choice....yet tens of thousands have died



Where is their thread ?

I support those who join....but please shut the fuck up already and stop crying about how you never expected to see a stop loss order (Clinton)....or how you never expected to fight somebody elses war(Bush sr., Clinton, ect...) ...or how you never expected soldiers to get killed (every fucking war) ...or just how you didn't realize that you would miss them when they went to war

Now I have to listen to you people cry about how evil Bush is just because you miss your soldier...and it is his fault that you miss him

I would bet my best goat that if Clinton or another Dem was in office during 9-11 that your soldier would still be deployed....somewhere

This is a war on terror....The troops are just in the wrong place, if you want to bitch about that then feel free

[vetwife]

67. Supercrash....Lets talk Again..this time with attitude......

You remind me of a fellow who I had the honor to meet at the VA when my husband went for a little stay. I was standing by the nurse's desk when this Know it all Doctor (quite uninformed and new)was giving this vet the one I admired) who was in a wheelchair a hard time. Telling him that he could quit thinking abou the war if he wanted to. This man who had went into the military and served and came back mamed with only one leg and one arm, shaking. The vet leaned up as the Doctor was looking oh so very important and better than the patient. Not appreciative of sacrafices made and totally detached from his patient.

The Vet asked the Doctor. Hey Doc..have you ever been shot at?
The Doctor said ....Why NO?
The Vet said, "What cha doing Saturday?"
That Doctor was removed from that floor and looked the Fool.

You may think because you haven't been shot at or raped or in a plane crash that PTSD does not affect the family and the patient, but that is because you have a narrow view of life and if it doesn't affect you , then it doesn't exist. Well guess what Doc......
the lady in question and her husband are not overseas, they did not join and they are suffering with PTSD ! That lady stands and protests war every week. That lady has shouted from the rooftops that War is Wrong but her family is still suffering. while you are doing nothing but aggravating a situation you know nothing about.
Don't be so smug in your ideals , never know when some burly guy might find you attractive in a dark alley, or a victim of some lone guneman, or passenger on a jet that decides to malfunction. Then you will be in the ranks of those with PTSD and or family member with Secondary PTSD looking for help anywhere you can find it. Are you one of those people who spit on soldiers? Are you one of those people who will fight a four year old for a souverneir baseball? Are you one who looks for causes not to help with? If not, you sure are giving that kind of impression. You are no different from Bush. A chickenhawk smells the same, no matter what party they are in. If you can't be part of the solution..For God's sake don't be part of the problem !
:dunce: Don't forget to pick up the smiley sign I left you. It shows just how smart you really are ! You are just too far removed from the problem to realize the folks on here agree with the war being wrong, you are just too busy bitching to see people are trying to find an end to this war by bringing attention to its destruction for all involved, you had rather find a reason not to do anything !All Talk..No Action !

You know..There just is no cure for your kind of thinking...Its upside down, its snotty and its
lame. I am sure there are plenty of vets on this board suffering who actually fought IN COMBAT who would love to ask you WHATCHA DOING SATURDAY ?

[Mari333]

73. If Clinton was in office Id bitch about him too

and I did scream against Kosovo, and I am against all US agression in other countries. Dont "assume" I liked Clinton as much as you think. I railed and ranted against the sanctions that were placed on the Iraqi people in the 90s and I am against the US using military chest thumping in all countries. I detest our superpower status, testosterone-filled bravado, and attitude, and I have been an anti war activist since the 1960's.
The "kids" over there on the ground are 18, 19, 20, and 21 years old, many of them. They are there because they are young, and afraid. Many of them are weekend reservists and guard members, who were more afraid of going to jail and many of the parents and loved ones, including me, tried to talk them out of it. They went, and now they are learning, many of them, that it was a lie and they were thrown into the situation based on lies, lies, damnable lies.
Its not a Playstation game, they are finding out.
If you have anger, I suggest you look no further then the White House, and point your finger at the Bush administration, the people who run PNAC, the corporations that run the politicians, and realize that the thousands of civilians who died, and the hundreds of soldiers who died, and both wounded on both sides are the victims of a war that should
have never
happened.
War is a product of mental illness, and the Bush administration, and any other administration that uses nationalism and war as an answer, imo, is mentally ill.

[anarchy1999]

75. Mari333, I've been out all weekend. What a magnificent post.

You need to put this up as a single post. Also expand on and turn into an essay, but who am I to give advice. I hope you and yours are doing okay.

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

37. As a former serviceman, I salute you, sir! Well done!....

I like that digital send-off to our mutual "friend", too! LOL!!

I take it that you were a P-3 pilot? I was a Naval Gunfire Liaison Officer for three years at Camp Pendleton after a year at sea. I absorbed everything I could from the Nam vets...they were excellent teachers about war and what it's really like.

[Rebellious Republican]

39. Naval Aircrewman, Photographersmate, enlisted.........

Got my combat baptism in Beirut in "83". Combat camera group, changed my whole outlook on life, after seeing it up close and personal.

:toast:

[T Town Jake]

48. Though I agree...

...with some of what you're saying, it is inappropriate, IMHO, in this thread. This is specifically about someone who is obviously hurting, and who needs our support. There are plenty of threads better suited to the expression of these sentiments.
Please ease up.

[nostamj]

18. kick

i'm just stunned that this is being ignored....

[Tansy_Gold]

19. another kick and a suggestion

Dr. Robert Jay Lifton was, I believe, the person who coined the phrase "post traumatic stress disorder" after his studies involving Vietnam vets. He has been a guest on Bill Moyers' shows in the past. I think it might be interesting to get Lifton's take on the current quasi-war and how the political environment is going to affect returning vets, their families, and their communities, especially in light of our awareness of PTSD, an awareness we didn't have 30 years ago.

[nostamj]

20. Mari... I'm sorry. maybe if someone else had posted this

it would not have died so quickly. my non-TOON threads are always pure LEAD.

I'll be leaving soon and I'm afraid this will be deep in the archives by the time I get back on-line.

again, sorry. tried.

[stavka]

22. ...Some people haven't been reading about what you speak.

I don't have a clue about what this posting is about? Can you provide any background?

[vetwife]

24. I'll try and pick up on this...You did good Nosta

[nostamj]

25. read this thread for starters

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1817928&mesg_id=1817928

and then check out www.mfso.org for more info.

[stavka]

28. Thank you VetWife and others

...hard to follow a story when you only know the punctuation.

Hope everything turns out ok.

[vetwife]

26. Please call the numbers posted above rearding Important issue

PTSD affects the entire families not just the veteran and even at that, this administration is working against the veteran and even more against the family. We have to get public awarness up in front of the media regarding PTSD for the soldiers and the Familes. We are in dire straits ! Families at home are falling apart due to this stress. No Help available !

[vetwife]

27. PTSD paralyzes a family unit as much as losing limbs !

I am very aware of this situation as my husband and thousands upon thousands of veterans have this disorder what used to be called Shell Shock. They can't sleep, work, relate and it does not just affect the soldier who has so many problems on return. It affects the entire family. It is a family affair.

The media has spent hour after hour after hour talking about one or two people and with just cause of the beheading but our soldiers in Iraq and their familes back home are stressed and depressed and past going. My husband who served in Nam and I consult with veterans because I started a Veterans organization are hurting right now. The soldiers are going to be shafted when they get home and the family unit is going to dissolve if we don't get medical attention and quick. Call the numbers and I will put up some links regarding this emotional illness and how debilitating it is so you can read up and call congressmen and Media to bring this thing to the front of the people. The war machine is not just killing soldiers and maming soldiers, they are maming their minds and the families minds.

http://patiencepress.com/

[Rebellious Republican]

38. You have my humble respect vetwife, I have read your posts....

I am happy that there are people like you in the world, and then again I am not happy that there needs to be people like you in the world. ;-)
:hug:

[vetwife]

40. I thank you and you, my respect as well.

Again Welcome Home !

[JohnLocke]

35. Kick

[playahata1]

43. Kick!

n/t

[Just Me]

45. To Mari333, her husband and their son,...

,...you are not alone.

People care about you and believe in you.

We are in this together.

It's hard.

We can only strengthen one another. We cannot prop up eachother.

We will find a way.

NEVER give up. Tomorrow may reverse all fortunes.

Meanwhile, dreams are free. We all meet the same destiny,...and our souls may be the ticket to the dreams we imagined,...in this existence.

I send my Love to Mari333 and her family,...and all those suffering the same reality.

[nostamj]

46. wow. just getting home

thanks for all the supportive posts, esp. to vetwife.

[RebelOne]

74. kick at 7:06 on East Coast

[alfredo]

49. A kick for the

niteowls

[Kool Kitty]

50. Another kick for the night crew.

Mari, you and yours are in my prayers. :kick:

[Wind Dancer]

51. Thanks for starting this thread!

For Mari333 and every person affected by this war, my heart aches. I wanted to kick this and will respond later, need to go to bed now.

I will certainly start an email campaign to media and several other sources.

[nostamj]

61. well, it seemed like the right thing to do...

hope it gets some traction and some action

[Sugarbleus]

52. Hey! I'm still here. I'll do my part.

I'm on west coast, still awake. I'll kick this and I'll follow the suggestions all of you have posted.

I've only been back in DU for a week or so. Had to take a break for a while. I remember Mari's step son was about to be sent to Iraq. I need to catch up on what's going on.

I understand the whole PTSD........I really do. It's HELL. I'll keep kicking this for as long as I'm awake, in addition to whatever else I can do for her and all of those that need this type of help.

I'm proud to be part of this effort. With all my heart. I weep for all our loved ones far from us.

My arms around you Dear Mari......:hug:

[anarchy1999]

54. We will try and keep this up through tomorrow and Monday.

n/t

Thanks, nostamj.

anarchy1999

[MI Cherie]

55. Another kick

Another good night / good morning!

:kick:

[Hekate]

56. Turn on the burners!

"It's fine to chant for the water to boil, but sometimes it's better to turn on the stove." I LOVE IT!

Hekate

:kick:

[nostamj]

58. i've always loved that quote

it's action that makes the difference.

[nostamj]

63. KICK!

[vetwife]

64. A Kick

[nostamj]

65. sad...

DU couldn't be less interested it seems.

[anarchy1999]

66. There is nothing to be sad about and lots of us DU'ers are here and

ready to go on Monday. Lighten up nostamj. We have been here all along and we are going nowhere but with you and all the rest. We all need time off. See you in the morning with bells and whistles! Watch OUT!!!!!!!! and Let's GO! To the phones, to the faxes, e-mails and any other contacts we all collectively have!!!

[nostamj]

68. hope you're right, uh, correct.

it's just been a struggle to keep this out of the archives

[burrowowl]

69. Kick!

and Kick!

[aquart]

70. A kick

In the butt that deserves it.

[vetwife]

71. Kick...

[anarchy1999]

72. Kick to the top on behalf of Nostamj, it's 5:30am on the East Coast-

Is everyone set and on the ready?

on edit: on behalf of all the families being ripped to shreds for this illegal war.

Also please if you have not already seen this thread check it out and include in your message, kill two birds with one stone!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=1825317&mesg_id=1825317

So... NOW WE RAPE CHILDREN??? (BeHereNow)

[vetwife]

80. Call those number and complain to the Media !

No time like the present !

[anarchy1999]

76. Okay everyone, it is a quarter to eight on the east coast, Washington,

Capitol Hill, Everyone ready???

It is time to ring the phones, the faxes, the e'mails of every person there is, just 15 minutes is all we ask. 15 minutes, DIALING FOR DEMOCRACY NOW!

[anarchy1999]

77. Okay, off of page 3 and I've only been gone for 2.5 hours, where is

everyone?

[nostamj]

78. dunno...

but thanks for trying!

[myrna minx]

79. A kick for Mari and her family.

:kick:

[vetwife]

81. Kick

[myrna minx]

82. kick.

[Scout]

83. kick

[anarchy1999]

84. I give Nostamj, it is just plain damn useless to try and get anyone

to care. Truly, I give, I call uncle, everyone else wins. I'm tired and sick to death of fighting for right and so is my husband. He just wants for me to quit. I give. The bad guys get to win.

[vetwife]

85. It just isn't in me to quit kicking ! Kick to Take Back the Media

and bring up this PTSD issue with them !

[Scout]

86. 'nother kick