Steep Spike in Power Protection Co. Stock – 4 HOURS BEFORE BLACKOUT!

[Junkdrawer]

The Chloride Group (CHLD.L – London stock market) is one of the world’s largest suppliers of emergency power equipment and power monitoring equipment. Here’s their website:

http://www.chloridepower.com/hub/main.html

On an average day, about 700,000 shares of the stock changes hands. Yesterday, almost 6,729,370 shares were traded in London 4 hours before the largest blackout in US history.

http://table.finance.yahoo.com/k?s=chld.l&g=d


Date.........Open..High..Low...Close....Volume..Adj. Close*
Aug-15-03 53.50 53.50 53.00 54.03.3,212,380 54.03
Aug-14-03 47.00 52.50 47.00 51.50.6,729,370 51.50
Aug-13-03 46.50 47.00 46.50 47.50.1,100,440 47.50
Aug-12-03 43.00 45.50 43.00 44.71...799,300 44.71
Aug-11-03 43.00 43.50 43.00 43.80...432,856 43.80
Aug-08-03 43.00 43.00 43.00 42.55...115,000 42.55
Aug-07-03 43.00 43.50 43.00 43.00...100,000 43.00
Aug-06-03 43.00 43.50 43.00 42.52....56,033 42.52
Aug-05-03 41.00 43.50 41.00 43.50...618,618 43.50
Aug-04-03 41.00 41.00 41.00 42.00...304,260 42.00


Why do I get the feeling we’re not being told everything there is to know about this power outage?

[lcordero]

1. It's probably manufactured, like every other crisis in history

[Jacobin]

2. Did you take into account the time differential?

I don't know the answer, just curious.

Pretty weird little coincidence if it actually was four hours prior.

[Junkdrawer]

4. From what I understand, London markets close 12:00 PM EDT.. n/t

[papau]

5. Proves trading in Terror futures a good idea - 4 hour warning!

And 911 would have had a warning.

Of course that is in effect admitting that somewhere someone knows what is going on in the "orders to terrorists" (or CIA) world.

[w13rd0]

9. On NPR this morning...

...there was a reporter talking about how sources had indicated to him that a Russian arms seller (can't recall the name, lemme look it up), Victor Bout, with an "emissary" in the US, based in Dalas, had assisted the US government in smuggling CIA operatives and weaponary into Afghanistan just days before September 11th 2001...

Reading up on this Victor Bout fellow. Has worked alot with the CIA, isn't busted because he's considered an "asset" (for selling lots of guns to warring Africans apparently), some real shadoworld stuff here beneath the surface...

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

21. The Center for Public Integrity used nearly an entire article covering

Bout. He works it from every side.

They have an excellent 10 part series entitle MAKING A KILLING - THE BUSINESS OF WAR at their site...everything you ever wanted to know about the illegal arms trade, mercinaries, privatization and the war economy but were afraid was true.

[paulthompson]

62. Victor Bout!

Please tell me more about Victor Bout. He's a very interesting figure in terms of 9/11, and figures a number of times in my 9/11 Timeline. Showing that he had ties to the CIA days before 9/11 would help confirm a CIA -> ISI (Pakistani intelligence) -> Al-Qaeda link. Here are the entries about him:

Mid-1996-October 2001: In 1996, Ariana, the national airline of Afghanistan, is essentially taken over by al-Qaeda and becomes the transportation for an illegal trade network. Passenger flights become few and erratic; and instead the airline begins flying drugs, weapons, gold, and personnel mostly between Afghanistan, the United Arab Emirates (UAE) and Pakistan. The Emirate of Sharjah, in the UAE, becomes a hub for al-Qaeda drug and arms smuggling. Typically "large quantities of drugs" would be flown from Kandahar, Afghanistan to Sharjah, and large qualities of weapons would be flown back to Afghanistan. (Los Angeles Times, 11/18/01) About three to four flights a day would run the route. Many weapons come from Victor Bout, a notorious Russian arms dealer based in Sharjah. (Los Angeles Times, 1/20/02) Afghan taxes on opium production would be paid in gold, and then the gold bullion would be flown to Dubai, UAE, and laundered into cash. (Washington Post, 2/17/02) Taliban officials regularly provide terrorists with false papers identifying them as Ariana employees so they can move freely around the world. A former National Security Council official later claims the US is well aware at the time that al-Qaeda agents regularly fly on Ariana, but the US fails to act for several years. The US does press the UAE for tighter banking controls, but moves "delicately, not wanting to offend an ally in an already complicated relationship," and little changes by 9/11. Much of the money for the 9/11 hijackers flows though these Sharjah channels (see June 29, 2000-September 18, 2000 and September 8-11, 2001 (C)). Could the 9/11 attacks have been stopped if the US pressed harder to shut down the Sharjah al-Qaeda money channels? There also are reports suggesting that Ariana Airlines might have been used to train Islamic militants as pilots (see October 1, 2001 (C)). The illegal behavior of Ariana helps cause United Nations to impose sanctions against Afghanistan in 1999 (see November 14, 1999), but the sanctions lack teeth and don't stop the airline. A second round of sanctions finally stops foreign Ariana flights. But Ariana charter flights and other charter services keep the illegal network running (see January 19, 2001). Ariana and the network is finally largely destroyed in the October 2001 US bombing of Afghanistan. (Los Angeles Times, 11/18/01)

October 1996: Since 1992, arms merchant Victor Bout has been selling weapons to Afghanistan's Northern Alliance, but this month he switches sides and begins selling weapons to the Taliban and al-Qaeda instead. (Guardian, 4/17/02, Los Angeles Times, 1/20/02, Los Angeles Times, 5/17/02) The deal comes immediately after the Taliban capture Kabul and gain the upper hand in Afghanistan's civil war (see September 27, 1996). Bout formerly worked for the Russian KGB, and operates the world's largest private weapons transport network. Based in the United Arab Emirates (UAE), Bout operates freely there until well after 9/11. The US becomes aware of Bout's widespread illegal weapons trading in Africa in 1995, and of his ties to the Taliban in 1996, but they fail to take effective action against him for years. (Los Angeles Times, 5/17/02) US pressure on the UAE in November 2000 to close down Bout's operations there is ignored. Press reports calling him "the merchant of death" also fail to pressure the UAE (for instance, (Financial Times, 6/10/00, Guardian, 12/23/00)). After President Bush is elected, it appears the US gives up trying to get Bout, until after 9/11. (Washington Post, 2/26/02, Guardian, 4/17/02) In one trade in 1996, Bout's company delivers at least 40 tons of Russian weapons to the Taliban, earning about $50 million. (Guardian, 2/16/02) Two intelligence agencies later confirm that Bout trades with the Taliban "on behalf of the Pakistan government." In late 2000, several Ukrainians sell 150 to 200 T-55 and T-62 tanks to the Taliban in a deal conducted by the ISI, and Bout helps fly the tanks to Afghanistan. (Montreal Gazette, 2/5/02) Bout moves to Russia in 2002. He is seemingly protected from prosecution by the Russian government, which in early 2002 claimed, "There are no grounds for believing that this Russian citizen has committed illegal acts." (Guardian, 4/17/02) The Guardian suggests that Bout may have worked with the CIA when he traded with the Northern Alliance, and this fact may be hampering current international efforts to catch him. (Guardian, 4/17/02)

January 19, 2001: New United Nations sanctions against Afghanistan take effect, adding to those from 1999 (see November 14, 1999). The sanctions limit travel by senior Taliban authorities, freeze bin Laden's and the Taliban's assets, and order the closure of Ariana Airlines offices abroad. The sanction also impose an arms embargo against the Taliban, but not against Northern Alliance forces battling the Taliban. (AP, 12/19/00) But this doesn't stop the illegal trade network the Taliban is secretly running through Ariana. Two companies, Air Cess and Flying Dolphin, take over most of Ariana's traffic. Air Cess is owned by the Russian arms dealer Victor Bout, and Flying Dolphin is owned by the UAE's former ambassador to the US who is also an associate of Bout. In late 2000, despite UN reports linking Flying Dolphin to arms smuggling, the United Nations gives Flying Dolphin permission take over Ariana's closed routes, which it does until the new sanctions take effect. Bout's operations are still functioning and he has not been arrested. (Los Angeles Times, 1/20/02, Montreal Gazette, 2/5/02) Ariana is essentially destroyed in the October 2001 US bombing of Afghanistan. (Los Angeles Times, 11/18/01)

---

As these entries show, once one starts looking at the 9/11 attacks, a whole underworld of criminal activity with ties to official gvmts begins to show up. As one FBI official testified, "we can no longer distinguish between terrorism, organized crime, drugs, and arms dealing" (not an exact quote, I'm paraphrasing). I think Bout is key to understanding the links between some of these relationships. The CIA has even admitted encouraging and supporting the ISI in developing a massive heroin and opium trade in the 1980s (the excuse: the drugs helped weaken the resolve of Soviet fighters in Afghanistan). But once that channel of illegal activity of CIA -> ISI -> mujaheddin got started, I'm convinced it never ended (the only change is some mujaheddin got organized into al-Qaeda), and this weapons trade is just one outcome of it in the present day. The US turning a blind eye to all the growing of drugs in Afghanistan is another blantant example of how these relationships continue, often the exact same people selling the exact same illegal products.

By the way, there's an interesting little tidbit about Bout I didn't include in the timetime. In 2002 the Russian gvmt issued a statement that Bout wasn't in Russia. At the exact same time the statement went out, Bout happened to be getting interviewed live on a Russian radio station, flaunting the fact that he was in Russia and not being pursued. A lot of egg on Russia's face over that one. But the US is just as uninterested in catching him as Russia is, it seems. Too much money to be made by corrupt officials. The Afghan heroin trade alone is worth $100 billion a year.

[DUreader]

6. a very pretty weird little coincidence, pretty penny profit that is

kinda like the put options on the airline stocks prior to 9-11

those put options that the mass media just stopped talking about

yeah coincidence that's the ticket

[Jacobin]

29. Not disagreeing with the possibility

That run up in such a short period of time mimics the insider trading on American Airlines and General Reinsurance in the days before 9/11 that "could not be traced".

Something weird going on....or should I say, something criminal

Another day in BushCo world.....

[w13rd0]

3. Well, in all fairness...

...there were several other "spike" days, but none so high as this one. Weekly totals show that the spike on the day before blackout was higher, just that day, than any other WEEK save the one ending Oct 2001 I think...

We aren't being told everything because they think we are gullible rubes. And for the most part, we are...ok, reviewing, May 13th, 2003 also showed a larger spike...

What happened on May 13th, 2003 and on Oct 31st, 2001? Both these days show similiar spikes in volume.

[deek]

7. US attacks???

Afganistan and Iraq??? Just guessing here.....

[w13rd0]

10. Of course...

...you do understand I was being somewhat sarcastic, right? Oh, and you aren't guessing...May 13th, 2003 is the day that the UN inspectors were recalled home from Iraq, which essentially put the writing on the wall for an invasion.

[latebloomer]

50. No, not May 13th

The inspectors were called back in March, and the war started on St. Patrick's Day-- March 17th.

Damn curious about yesterday, though.

[Andy_Stephenson]

11. Oct 31st, 2001

the Chief Chimp in charge signed the patriot act into law.

[Pastiche423]

19. Do you mean

March 13th?

[papau]

41. Vol or price - spike in price was 43 to 53 - was that also the case

May 13th, 2003 and on Oct 31st, 2001?

[SpiralHawk]

8. Earth to America's Media Borg:

Snap out of it.

Tell this story.

And be sure you make the obvious link to the 9/11 futures scandal that has dropped completely off your radar.

Get a clue. Connect a frikking dot or two.

It's now or never.

[DUreader]

15. At this point , it cannot be a clue they are lacking,treasonous complicity

At least the public has a clue

[Junkdrawer]

12. Several other questions linger about this blackout...

Why the vastly conflicting stories from TOP government officials here and in Canada: http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/americas/08/15/power.blame.ap/index.html

Why will it take so long to get Detroit back up if there was no damage to the transmission/generation infrastructure: http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/08/15/blackout.detroit/index.html

And why was terrorism ruled out so quickly initially, when now authorities are saying nothing is ruled out?

[jiacinto]

13. Do they do business in the states?

Interesting. I wonder if the SEC is going to look into it.

[Junkdrawer]

16. Check htuttle's excellent post. n/t

[htuttle]

14. Another possibility

...not that what you've mentioned isn't possible, but here's another one that's occurred to me as I've thought about this today (I saw it earlier this afternoon):

The actual cause of the problem did not strike at once (like lightning), but rather was a growing problem of some kind, somewhere in the grid.

Wednesday night or early yesterday morning, perhaps it became apparent that it was finally going to blow. This news may have travelled through personal contacts throughout the day, finally ending up in someone (or a group) buying into the Chloride group stock.

In other words, those who were in a position to know that this was going to happen decided to make money on it, instead of deal with it (or warn people). It would also mean that they are covering up what actually happened right now, since the current story makes it out to be a 'bolt from the blue' (literally?) incident.

Who would it be? Well, somebody(s) with a pile of money judging by the stock volume. Probably somebody at the top related to the plant(s) or transmission companies that actually caused this cascade failure.

Maybe the other smaller spikes in the stock volume were 'false alarms' when the grid was wobbly but didn't fall over. It would be interesting to see some information on the shape of the power grid on those days (maybe I should check the average temperature in the northeast for those days...where they hot?).

Does anyone know anything more about Chloride Group and their market? Are there other suppliers, or would it be a given that they would receive most of the business in North America? I'm wondering, because I've never heard of them before, and I just went UPS shopping about 5 years ago (we finally got a 12KVA Exide).

I checked at their website, and it doesn't seem as if they make UPS systems that get rebranded (they have two retail brands themselves).(looking at their website again...)

They do seem to have a pretty heavy presence in North America for their telecom power protection services:


Maybe that's the market they have cornered.

Well, there it is.

[DUreader]

17. good stuff htuttle, this is what I like best about DU

thanks for that

[Junkdrawer]

18. Would your scenario be "insider trading" ???

The morality certainly stinks, but since the person or persons involved may not have known business details of Chloride....

[htuttle]

22. I would think so (and I just heard more on ABC NEWS)

I just saw this on ABC WNT. Here's my notes of their account based on power company internal event logs they obtained (exactly what I'd like to get my hands on).

Started outside Lansing -- line voltage problem of some sort, 3:06 pm
Lansing first blackout area, 4:09

They said that the GM plant was integral to the failure in some way. Probably toppled a 'domino' that was about to fall.

Ohio didn't remove it self from grid as it should have.

The disturbance was finally stopped in Pennsylvania (?)

Could have spread to Florida and Rocky Mountain states if not stopped in Pennsylvania.

That really sounds to me like they saw the problem ahead of time in Michigan.

So, what power company handles Lansing?

Re: insider trading: It would be the same situation as the 'put' options purchased before 9/11. Not sure if that's 'legally' insider trading.

I think an FBI agent got arrested for doing his own smaller option scheme before 9/11, due to warnings he was seeing in the information stream at the FBI (I have a link to this somewhere, but it was somewhat widely known -- didn't stay in the news more than a minute, however).

I think they arrested him for something, but I'm not sure if it was actually for 'insider trading'.

[Junkdrawer]

23. That gives you an hour warning. London closed 4 hours earlier...

And this particular run-up looks like a 2-3 day thing, accelerating each day.

[htuttle]

28. That's just the first problem event that ABC found in the log

It's likely that those who run the systems were well aware that things were going sour long before an event got logged.

I'm hoping to find more details on this level.

[Junkdrawer]

30. Let me be clear...you may well be onto something...

and I believe the earlier volume spikes may very well correlate to power usage spikes (We had a hot early summer, a few cool rainy months, and now a few days of hot weather).

[DUreader]

33. British utility owns failed power grid

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=68643


NNN0LHI (1000+ posts)
Fri Aug-15-03 07:16 PM
Original message
British utility owns failed power grid



http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=434095

The New York power grid, which collapsed, plunging millions of Americans into darkness, is owned by the
British utility National Grid Transco.

Shares in the company fell sharply in early trading yesterday as fears mounted that the blackout across
the Niagara Mohawk transmission system would leave National Grid Transco facing multimillion-dollar
compensation claims.

At one point shares were down by by 5 per cent, wiping almost £600m off the value of the company. But
the shares recovered some of their losses later in the day after reports that the cause of the blackout
may have been the collapse of several major transmission lines in the US Midwest, which are not part of
the Niagara Mohawk grid.

A National Grid spokesman said its US arm had insurance cover but he refused to comment on whether it
was likely to face claims from businesses, public services and householders who were affected by the
blackout. He said: "If customers file claims against us then we will investigate them on a case-by-case
basis."

more

[htuttle]

34. Here's some recent news from National Grid Transco

National Grid Transco bought the Niagara Mohawk Grid in 2002 as part of their 'crush, kill, destroy' acquisition strategy (okay...I'm exaggerating, but they seem to be on a merger spree).

ROUNDUP National Grid Transco reports strong H1, to exceed cost savings target
http://www.ananova.com/business/story/sm_716427.html?menu=
Story filed: 12:22 Tuesday 26th November 2002

National Grid Transco PLC reported first half profits at the top end of market forecasts and said it expects to deliver in excess of the £100 million target it set for annual merger cost savings.

It is also ahead of schedule delivering integration savings from its New York operation, and is confident of achieving a further 20% reduction in US controllable costs.

(more at link)

So, even if the grid fault didn't start with them, I'd like to know whether these 'ahead of schedule integration savings' or the '20% reduction in controllable costs' had any effect on the power grid's ability to stop a cascade failure. I really don't like the sound of a 20% reduction in controllable costs managed by a brand new owner on a merger spree. Was Gordon Gecko in the house?

As the ABC report stated, if the plant operators in Pennsylvania hadn't pulled some sort of 'computer Hail Mary' that worked, the blackout probably would have spread as far as the Rockies and Florida.
(dark, dark, dark)

Why?

[Junkdrawer]

35. So, if you're a (British?) energy sector investment analyst....

and you see one company increasing profits by shortchanging maintenance/modernization, wouldn't you bet on the company that sells 'advanced power monitoring'??? And guess who's going to pay for the new equipment?

[DUreader]

36. Now if we can find solid connections between these two companies

board members maybe?

[Junkdrawer]

43. I checked their boards - no overlap. What is disturbing is that...

National Grid Transco profited by precipitating a crisis (short changing maintenance) and will probably profit more by fixing the crisis (tax/ratepayer dollars performing modernization).

[htuttle]

40. Another company to look at in light of new information: FirstEnergy

It's another bemoth like National Grid Transco, but they cover Ohio.

Why that's important, is that Ohio didn't remove itself from the grid, as Michigan had done. This is what allowed the outage to spread eastward.

From the ABC News article:

The Ohio power company failed to separate from the national electric grid, as it was supposed to and as Michigan did. Thus the cascade of problems was sent on to New York.

"The system is designed to isolate itself to protect that area, to have the area go down and have the rest of the system survive. And instead it spread further and longer than it should have," said Michehl R. Gent, president and CEO of the North American Electric Reliability Council.

A spokesman for the Ohio power company, FirstEnergy Corp., said it had followed all proper procedures but would not comment specifically on whether it had triggered the huge blackout by failing to separate.

"If they had separated you might have seen a region in Ohio area that would have been without power, but you would not have seen it in almost a national scale, as we did," Divan said.  
(more)
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/wnt/US/power030815_GMplant.html

FirstEnergy Corp:
http://www.firstenergycorp.com

From their website:

FirstEnergy is a registered public utility holding company headquartered in Akron, Ohio. Its electric utility operating companies -- Ohio Edison, The Cleveland Electric Illuminating Company and Toledo Edison in Ohio; Metropolitan Edison, Pennsylvania Electric and Pennsylvania Power in Pennsylvania; and Jersey Central Power & Light -- comprise the nation's fifth largest investor-owned electric system, based on serving 4.4 million customers.

But still, there remains the question of why National Grid Transco's grids all went down as they did, and why it could have spread further West and South if not stopped in Pennsylvania.

[DUreader]

42. There were some radio reports that it may have started in ohio

no link for that and generally speaking all kinds of theories have

been floated for the 'cause' of this, everything but terra of course

which was instantly ruled out

[htuttle]

38. Here's a link to the ABC news story with more details

Now, it seems, they think it started outside Cleveland and hit Lansing:
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/wnt/US/power030815_GMplant.html

Aug. 15— Something still unknown happened to one power-transmission line in suburban Cleveland on Thursday at 3:06 p.m. ET.

That began a series of power gyrations as the Ohio-Michigan electric grid system tried but failed for more than an hour to recover.

And then the blackout began.

It first hit Lansing, Mich., at 4:09:02 p.m., at two General Motors plants there.

[jiacinto]

20. I wonder if the SEC is following this

nt

[madrchsod]

24. sec????

i doubt they will ever be allowed to say anything.

[Junkdrawer]

25. BTW: Here's the original post htuttle refers to...

Just heard on "Today" London Co. spikes 10 X average on power surge

[htuttle]

26. This bears a stranger and stranger resemblance to 9/11 all the time

I just read that yahoo.com article about scientists warning about the shape of the power grid as recently as November:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=68591

Here's some reminiscent quotes from it:

NEW YORK - Scientists and engineers with the National Research Council (news - web sites) warned the White House and Congress about the vulnerability of the power grid as recently as November, saying nationwide weaknesses needed to be repaired — and fast.

and

The report urged the protection of key elements of the power grid and the creation of an updated system that would limit vulnerabilities to the flow of electricity.

and

A day after the largest blackout in U.S. history darkened lives across the most populous swath of North America, power experts said the system's sorry shape appears to have been a surprise only to the unwitting consumers who relied on it.

Just like on 9/11, where every friendly (and even just cordial) country sent warnings that something was going to happen with increasing detail, and nothing was done, it sounds like it was the same situation as leading up to this blackout.

The Bush mob doesn't seem to be able to deal very well with topics that they didn't put on the agenda themselves...or DID they? (...obligatory :tinfoilhat: :) ...).

[sugargoose]

75. Maybe a tactic to force their energy agenda

I saw Delay today indicating that Repukes had tried to take care of this but the Dems wouldn't allow the energy bill that included repairing the grids to pass. Dems were blocking it because of the shady oil drilling in Nat'l Parks that was also in it. The interviewer asked, with it being such a crisis, would the Reps consider trying to pass the bill WITHOUT the oil part in it.......didn't go over well.

[papau]

44. Penn line went down an hour before the 9 seconds, so what happen at 60 min

to send out of phase current into the Lake Erie loop so that it meets the in phase current in Canada and knocks Canada out - and whatever it is that did that still does not explain the reason the interconnect relays did not snap (a computer program)so as to isolate the problem to the Lake Erie loop.

[htuttle]

45. Some 'dots' on that

National Grid Transco seems to own almost all the big transmission lines in the NE on both sides of the US/Canada border.

National Grid Transco recently acquired Niagra Mohawk and boasted of an ahead of schedule 20% cost reduction in their New York operations (see my reply #34).

So my questions:
1) Big electric/transmission companies probably lose a LOT of money by the hour if they drop service, right?
2) Would there be a possibility that the severity of a fault situation like this might be underestimated (ahead of time...during the 'cost reduction'), and program parameters adjusted to make the interconnect relays a little less 'touchy'? (kind of a nightmarish equivalent of putting a penny in a fuse socket)

The effect of the fact that the Niagra/Mohawk power system was recently acquired by another company and 'cost reduced' deserves more scrutiny.

However, it seems there is quite a lot of blame to go around (for example, why didn't FirstEnergy in Ohio take itself off the grid?).

[Semi_subversive]

27. If you look back to early June

there was a similar spike of 7,800,000. There were several other occasions where 3-4 million shares traded hands. I wonder if anything fishy happened on those days?

[htuttle]

31. June 5th was the big day in June

7,895,430 shares traded.

It wasn't a hot day in Lansing (extrapolating that this is where a weakness in the grid is + stock purchasers) on June 5th (68 F high temp + raining).

However, it was a steamy 86F on June 4th in the afternoon, with high humidity. I bet the air conditioners were running full blast that day. Wonder whether a 'domino' on the grid in Lansing started wobbling before night fell:
http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KLAN/2003/6/4/DailyHistory.html

(man...the web is cool...)

There are a number of assumptions that go into whether the temperature in Lansing, MI is relevant at all, but as before: There it is.

Finally, the knowledge that the power grid was weak seems to have been widespread, far outside anyone Lansing, MI (see reply #26). Whether or not there was a particular weakness in Lansing, the stock purchasers would also know that the rest of the grid wasn't capable of handling a disruption. LOTS of people appear to have known that.

[inthecorneroverhere]

39. Roosevelt, we need your help!

Thanx for some intelligent commentary on events in this thread.

Folks have been talking about weaknesses in the power grid for at least 5 years. 'Policy Pete' is a dude who is critical of deregulation and the associated lack of investment in basic infrastructure such as transmission lines, substations, distribution equipment, etc. He is also critical of increased reliance on natural gas, which he believes is the first 'bellweather' of the Hubbert Peak.

http://qv3.com/policypete/policypete.htm

In all honesty, the solutions to this problem will not be popular either with Friedmanesque Neocons (that means *shrub and his gang of screwballs), nor with contemporary 'social' liberals. The reason is that the solutions involve major investment in infrastructure. Infrastructure is viewed by some 'social liberals' as boring, humdrum usage of money. Unfortunately, post-1968 liberals have not been as strongly in favor of infrastructure investments, as their predecessors who practically built the infrastructure of this nation during the 1930s-1950s under the auspices of the TVA, rural electrification, CCC, WPA and other such 'building' programs.

The solutions to this problem will cost money. The private utilities will need to invest money to improve their grid, especially the transmission and distribution portions thereof. The government should re-regulate, not de-regulate.

Classic Rooseveltian (FDR) policy applies here.

[gristy]

49. The government should re-regulate, not de-regulate.

Yes. Utilities regulated for the benefit of the public good. I'm all for it.

[Wickster]

55. I'm with you, gristy.

Re-regulation is the ticket.

[NYC]

32. This is very interesting.

I didn't sleep last night, so am too tired to follow it. I hope all of you keep digging. I'll bookmark this. Thanks.

[freeforall]

37. Ha! Junkdrawer...

I really wondered if this was somehow engineered (as * kept warning of something - shades of their events-wagering scheme?).

I arrived at 2 pm in Ottawa to visit my family, and the power went off at 4:00 pm! So, we broke out the candles. The only problem was that our building had no water. We also had to eat snack food for supper.
Everyone safe though!

[rhite5]

46. My tinfoil hat is just as handy as anyones, but ....

before we get too convinced there were evil-doings here ...

We should remind ourselves that traders trade on "rumors" all the time ('tis not illegal) and they exchange information rapidly (also not illegal) and that the warnings about weaknesses in critical parts of a critically large power grid were KNOWN (the Administration AND Congress had been informed and both apparently chose to ignore).

So the makings were there for reasonably good gambling decisions.

The June 5 spike suggests traders were already on the lookout for weather events that might trigger a breakdown. The current trading buildup probably can be shown to correlate with an almost unbroken string of very hot days so speculation began to run rampant and the activity on the charts was so obvious any trader could read it. The fundamentals were there and the charts were there, so they jumped in.

Remember these traders are everywhere in the world in all time zones and there's a market open somewhere around the clock and everybody uses the internet and can place orders anywhere from London to Hong Kong and Tokyo.

I don't think it means much that the NYSE closed just before the blackout hit NYC.

The major difference between this and 9/11 is that warnings about 9/11 would not have been publicly known by professional traders. Warnings about weakness in the power grid would have been known.

[htuttle]

47. That's a good point about the trading

These conditions were very well known to everyone but the power companies' consumers, apparently. It could have been a bunch of guys in Taiwan or Rio or anywhere who made these bets.

That's actually what I find so disturbing. In fact, the more widespread and distributed the placers of these trades were, the more damning the situation right now.

It was no natural disaster. It wasn't an extraordinary event. It was a duct-taped, bailing-wired, wheezing, overwhelmed system that, quite predictably, fell over.
While Bush was on vacation. Again.

[stickdog]

53. Maybe. Or maybe somebody did it on purpose. (NT)

[Junkdrawer]

48. That's a pretty good summary of what we puzzled out so far...

I asked a perfectly legitimate question and I'm willing to entertain all reasonable explanations. But I still think it wouldn't hurt to have someone look into who did all the buying yesterday.

[rhite5]

51. I agree. Who made any huge trades must be learned.

As far as how widespread the trading was ..... remember traders are like lemmings and they are watching the tickers by the minute. So the fact it was widespread is not so suspect as some really huge trades would be.

[amazona]

65. TRW Investment Management , Deustche Bank another

I don't yet know if they are related to the TRW that does the credit reports, will try to find out. They apparently hit their target and sold their shares yesterday after the outage:

http://table.finance.yahoo.com/k?s=chld.l&g=d


This doesn't mean they were involved in the buying Wednesday or Thursday morning, since they first gained a "reportable" share in Chloride Group PLC in 2002.

I will keep on looking to see who else profited.
ON EDIT: DEUSTCHE BANK acquired a huge number of shares and was required to report this acquisition just a few days before the outage.

[Junkdrawer]

70. Here's an ownership disclosure from the Chloride site:

Name of holder................................Number of shares...% of issued shares
Deutsche Bank................................34,851,139.........14.04%
Prudential plc.................................29,592,976.........11.92
Aegon UK plc..................................10,083,957..........4.06
Legal & General Inv.t Mngmt Ltd..........9,841,710..........3.97
TRW Investment Management.............9,153,157..........3.69
Royal Bank of Scotland plc.................8,040,969..........3.23
Second Adv Value Realisation Coy Ltd..7,812,261..........3.15

[myrna minx]

79. Wasn't Pat Robertson involved with the Royal Bank of

Scotland?


http://www.wsws.org/articles/1999/dec1999/bank-d04.shtml

The Bank of Scotland failed recently in its ambitions to become a larger global player. An attempt to establish a joint telebanking operation with US right-wing evangelist Pat Robertson collapsed in the face of opposition from gay rights campaigners in the UK, who called for customers to close their accounts if the venture went ahead. Should this latest effort fail, the bank would itself be a take-over target.

[rhite5]

52. Public power, anybody?

Ya know, the info you guys have turned up about what looks like deliberately postponed upgrades and/or postponed maintenance in order to keep the profits lookin' good for the investors PLUS the idea that the government would do it for them (or at least bail them out) if anything went wrong .....

well, this looks like one of the strongest arguments I have seen for the public ownership of utilities. Under public ownership (and there are several types), the consumers own the business in one way or another, their representatives sit on the board of directors and select the managers and set the salaries. There are no investors to reward, and they are not allowed to make profits beyond the reserves needed to operate and to service their debt. It is a win-win for the little people.

I thought the same thing when I saw the Enron power manipulations.

This bit of socialism is needed today more than ever!

[gristy]

61. socialize the costs - socialize the "profits"

That's what you get with public ownership. With what we have now, we socialize the costs and privatize the profits.

I'd definitely vote for public ownership.

[rman]

78. the profit is (should be)

a functioning, reliable power grid. essential to the economy and the wellfare of the people.
same with other infrastructures, education, healthcare.

rupubs are trying to both have the cake and eat it.

[inthecorneroverhere]

54. give this one a bump

Let's see more investigation into what happened on the London 'Futsie' in the hours before 4:15 p.m. U.S. eastern time....

[izzie]

56. That is odd and keep us posted.

We have heard things like that on other things but never proof.

[izzie]

57. Why do these things happen in the BLUE STATES???????

n/t

[PATRICK]

59. because these are where

Enron and others were moving FROM the south and west where deregulation and privatization is strong. California showed that making and exploiting energy failures ARE part of the plan. This one may have been a spontaneous blowup of the mess they foster in reluctant states.

What matters is how they ALWAYS nourish and exploit potential catastrophes. Even without facing up to that bald-faced horror enough stuff like insider trading or infrastructure incompetence leaks out of the sieve to damn them and their "business".

[markses]

58. Would the ADR ratio account for a spike in sales?

The Chloride Group American Depository Receipt sits at a ratio of 1:5, meaning that 1 US ADR = 5 shares in the local market (London). Chloride Group does sponsor an ADR, so I'm wondering if the huge spike could be accounted for by high volume ADR trading then multiplying according to the ratio (buying 20,000 ADRs becomes 100,000 shares).

I don't know much about this, and would welcome corrections from stock folks. On it's face, I guess it wouldn't really matter since speculators would always be pinning the ADRs to the ratio anyway, but I'm wondering whether the unit shift could indicate high volume US trading of ADRs on Chloride Group prior to, etc.

[markses]

60. Here's the ADR chart for the last month

Wish i could get some volume data on this thing. Price spiking begins August 12...

http://chart.bigcharts.com/bc3/quickchart/chart.asp?symb=CDGPY&compidx=aaaaa%

[amazona]

68. on august 11 deustche bank disclosed they had 13 percent ownership

On Aug. 11 is when Deutsche Bank announced that they now owned 13 percent of the common shares of Chloride. At the time the share price was $43. It is now closer to $54. Pretty good run-up for just a few days.

Some buyers may have been encouraged to buy because they assumed Deutsche Bank knew "something" but it begs the question of just what the bank knew that caused it to make such a large investment in such a timely fashion.

[Grubber]

63. Where was Spence?

Don't want to slap on the tinfoil hat right off the bat, but Energy Secretary was in London this week. Odd synergy with the market spike?

Apolgies up front if this has been addressed already...

http://mlive.blogspot.com/

AP story about half-way down.

[newyawker99]

64. Hi Grubber!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[NYC]

69. Yes, he was in London.

Welcome to DU.

[qanda]

66. kick

[hedda_foil]

67. kick!

[Astarho]

71. kick

That's interesting

Why do I get the feeling we’re not being told everything there is to know about this power outage?

I get that feeling a lot nowadays.

[Desertrose]

72. Kick up so I can find this later....

:kick:

This reminds me of 9/11...whatever happened to all the stock buys there...anyone else ever hear??

And now this ...again???

hmmmmmmm...........

Peace
DR

[joshcryer]

73. Is this the same as the terrorist stock market?

I would say so.

[i have issues]

74. :Kick:

:kick: sorry, this story is too important to let die.

[w13rd0]

76. kick...

...this whole blackout stinks, especially with the Bushbots now using it to sell their crap Halliburton/FirstEnergy enrichment legislation and agenda...

[Junkdrawer]

77. It may not be too late to place your bets on Chloride…

The share price is down –1.00 today.
http://www.prices.londonstockexchange.com/info.asp?sedol=0195207

And it looks like business may boom soon..
Energy secretary: Power rates to go up by $50 BILLION