I did a bad thing.

[Dees]

I put a Kerry bumper sticker on my car and did the most horrendous thing yesterday. I did the most unthinking and idiotic thing imaginable. I pulled my car into the driveway of one of my wife's right wing family members. It was spotted and the fight was on.

Over the years I have kept my mouth shut when her family would blow off about Reagan, Clinton, Poppy, Nixon, Monkleynuts and anything else in their closed little rethuglican minds. I could not take it any longer and so I exploded yesterday. It was matter of being abused no longer.

One thing about Repugs, they don't like facts and figures supporting an opposing view. The amount of factual ignorance was simply amazing especially in Reagan's case.

I can feel the strain of family relations already but by damn, enough is enough. It felt great. I urge all Dems to challenge rethug horse crap when thrown in your face regardless of who it might be. Employers, family and friends are usually people you feel you should not confront but there just comes a time. I feel better having finally said my piece instead of laying low as to not upset the fam. There's too much at stake now.

It will be a spell before I'm invited to put another shrimp on the barby. Oh well.

John

[disinfo_guy]

1. If a wingnut spouts propaganda, I will refute it

In social situations it's often best to avoid political discussions, but if they bring it up, I don't hesitate to shoot down their crap. The stakes are too high right now not to.

[NMDemDist2]

2. yup, Hubbys says the gloves are off now, the POF party

(POF=Pants on Fire) think just because us Libs are tolerant and MOOBiz we are wimps. I think some RWers will get some rude wake ups this summer and fall as we come out swinging on this crap

I'm sorry you have some family issues (hope your spouse is OK with it)
but you did a good thing this weekend. We can no longer let the BS stand without answer

[Eurobabe]

33. I can't wait to get my Kerry/(insert veep) yard sign!

To have all my wingnut neighbors see every morning!

[charlie105]

3. I have been working on my conservative brother-in-law for

about a year now. And I think he's finally coming around. Actually, I've convinced him to come see F911 with my wife (his sis) and me this Saturday. I'll have to buy the ticket and the snacks but that's only a small sacrifice. I feel so good.

Small problem though. He may agree not to vote for Bush but he's miles away from agreeing to vote for Kerry. But I'll take what I can.

[Hoping4Change]

37. Kudos for the sustained attempt. Keep forging ahead because

suddenly it will click and your brother-in-law will see the facts for what they are and not how bushco has spun them. His friends and associates will then get to hear a different viewpoint from one of their own. :toast:

[Fear]

4. you did a good thing.......

isn't it a GREAT feeling! - yeah, it's so much fun in regard to: 'they don't like facts and figures' - that always hurts and shows their ignorance and their misunderstanding of things so BIG time!

[Ironpost]

5. No, you done a good thing

we must not lose sight of loosing our democracy. It's happening before our very eyes. Have a good day my friend, we need more people such as yourself.

[sui generis]

6. congrats for standing up for yourself

although it's best to make a public attempt to avoid a fight by saying "guys come on let's not talk about politics because you know we disagree", if they keep at it, then tear their other cheek off. Between every slam, remind them that you offered to not talk about politics and that they can still back off. Then rip them a new one. It's very therapeutic.

[Warpy]

7. They didn't give a rip about insulting you, did they?

If you've been taking this for a long time, it means they felt you'd been silently agreeing with them all along. The fact that you haven't has made them feel a littel betrayed, at the very least. Don't let something like this happen again!

When somebody starts to spout about that rubbish, I just laugh and tell them they couldn't be more wrong. I'm willing to let it drop if they are, and most of the time they do. Of course, I do have a certain reputation for knowing my stuff and not taking any crap.

The problem is that there are otherwise good people out there who think that they know stuff they really don't know. They've heard so much disinformation over the past 15 years that they really don't know which way is up any more. They're usually not bad people, or even stupid ones, just horribly disinformed by corporate media.

Let folks in social situations know you think they're wrong, but do it with a laugh and a smile. If they whip out the needle, let 'em have it. Otherwise, just disagree and let it go.

Besides, you can buy your own damn shrimp.

[Dees]

26. I didn't go into this situation looking for blood. They

put the dogs on me from the get go. It's a side of these folks I haven't seen before although I had my suspicions. I guess I'm just gotten to the point where I don't need to constantly feel less than a good citizen because I'm a Dem. I feel no shame. By friggin damn I fought for this country, employed people over the years, paid my taxes without bitching and obeyed the laws.

[tandot]

8. you did a GOOD thing...congratulations for standing up

that takes a lot of guts.

They'll calm down. I've noticed that a lot of my liberal friends don't share their political views with their right-wing friends and family. Hence, all of their friends and family assume that my friends also love Bush. I think that this leads them to conclude that a majority of Americans support Bush. If more liberals would speak up, those right-wing nuts would get the picture.

It is just amazing how much those right-wingers hate Democracy. If they would have their way, we would have a one-party system with Bush as dictator.

[CrispyQ]

9. What issues did they bring up & how did you refute them?

[Dees]

34. Watergate to WMD

Watergate...shall we read the transcripts or listen to the tapes together?
Reagan...I'm able to quote essentially Ronnie's "66" firsts verbatim.
The cold war myth to trickle on economics
Clinton...Everything..I say things like 22,000,000 jobs, took a shot at bin Laden, cleared of any Whitewater wrong doings, "is" vs. WMD,
80 million dollar investigation.
Poppy...Iran Contra, pardons, recession, BFEE history
the current fraud...It unfolds every day in front of our very eyes. WMD, 911 Commission, AWOL...

[Catherine Vincent]

10. You did not do a bad thing. Bless you for standing up

to your beliefs and telling the right wingers where to shove it.

[Dees]

11. One issue in the discussion

that was particularly personal for me was the issue of Kerry's military Vietnam decorations vs. the AWOL fraud's disgraceful military career. That * is much more in command of the troops than Kerry would be who turned on the troops. The AWOL story to right wingnuts is, as it was described to me, "pure Democratic propaganda bullshit. Bu$h was a great pilot". Ignorance makes bliss I guess.

[Warren DeMontague]

20. "Turned on the troops"..

What a joke. Kerry earned the right to protest the Vietnam war because he went there, fought, killed, saw men die.. Dubya didn't feel like going himself, but didn't have the balls to go himself, but also didn't have the guts to stand up and be counted in regards to the fact that the war was wrong.

And the war was wrong, which is another fact that the GOP conveniently forgets when trying to attack Kerry's patriotism for opposing it.

Someone who has seen war and fought in it is, in my opinion, much more inherently qualified to look out for the troops and take into serious consideration all the issues before sending other young men off to die. And how can anyone (meaning your GOP in-laws) really believe that Bush, Rumsfeld, et. al. are doing right by the average grunt in Iraq? Those kids have been getting the shaft almost as much as the dudes being sodomized with bananas and glow-sticks over in Abu Ghraib. Between the $20 halliburgers, and the days where they are only given one meal, to the "stop-loss" orders.. the average soldier in Iraq has been getting what most low income Americans get from this administration- a little lip service, a lot of BS, and a heaping helping of steaming "screw you". But, the GOP has done a hell of a PR job convincing Americans they they look out for "reg'lar folks". Go figure.

[Dees]

25. I could not agree with you more.

[StopThief]

12. Just wondering. . . .

how does your wife feel about you making your stand?

[Dees]

17. She's Ok with it. She is a converted rethug

and now a solid Dem. She doesn't like to see the strain but said it was about time to get it out in the open.

[Ironpost]

22. You are a blessed man.

[demnan]

13. You have a right to your own opinions

if they can't accept that then they want a totalitarian society, not a democracy.

[Warpy]

15. It's more than that

Totalitarianism depends utterly on having an echo chamber regarding all opinion. It can't tolerate any dissent at all, no matter how mild. It is absolutely imperative that we make these folks know that we disagree with their rubbish, even if we're too polite to start nailing them with facts and figures in a social situation.

Polite silence = tacit agreement. Never forget that.

[fedupwithbush]

14. Great!

I went off on someone yesterday on a forum I frequent that's about music. He's a gung-ho ex-soldier and spouted that Abu Ghraib was okey-dokey with him. I responded by pm since it's not a political site(he overlooked that part). I read the first paragraph of his response to me. Said I watched too much CNN.(My reply had nothing in it about watching TV, which I do very little of these days.) And I deleted the post and didn't reply. My blood pressure is up and there is no talking to someone who won't research their facts. But I did offer him a new website to visit where he'll fit right in. And no, I didn't sully DU with his presence, lol.

And just last week I had to remind my grandfather-in-law that I want removed from his right-wing e-mail list. He and I have talked and agreed to disagree.

Thank you all for this site. And the sane people who actually know what's going on.

[MoonRiver]

16. "It will be a spell before I'm invited to put another shrimp on the barby"

Sounds like a good thing to me! :D We're not only invited, but pressured and coerced to attend family affairs even though the daggers are drawn before we walk in the door! What is said whenever I protest about certain impossibly hostile rightwing relatives is something like 'having family together is soooo much more important than politics', and 'y'all just need to get over it'! My husband and I could keep our mouths shut (sometimes!), but we're baited every time. Should be interesting this Thanksgiving after Kerry wins. I have a feeling things will be very different. Especially if we get the Senate, and please God, the House. My dear wingnut relatives just may have a case of severe indigestion.
:evilgrin:

[Treaghon]

21. It's a good way to weed out the non-thinkers.

The republicans I run into are, by and large, blind followers of their party and would goose-step over a cliff if called upon and would even argue that the moon is cheese if a 'Publican said it was.

Oh, this reminds me of an old bible verse along the lines of "if you are persecuted you're building up treasures in heaven." But that's for your religion.

I hope to at least get a free coffee mug or T-shirt with all the persecution I'm getting from republican friends.

[MoonRiver]

27. So true and so sad.

I don't know what it will take to wake up the lemmings. Its incredible how much brainwashing has been going on while the rest of us were leading normal lives!

And welcome to DU, Treaghon!! :hi:

[ithinkmyliverhurts]

18. A self-induced cranial colonoscopy.

That's right wing logic for ya.

[MUSTANG_2004]

19. "closed little rethuglican minds"

While I enjoy heated political debates with family members, comments like "closed little rethuglican minds" seem a little much. Do you really have such a low opinion of your wife's family?

[Dees]

24. The comment stands. In this

case it is purely subjective. To refute everything Democratic as nonsense (political propaganda) seems a bit intolerant. Even I will concede some rethug arguments as staunch a Dem as I am. I've not known many rethugs who were exceptionally broad minded. Have you? They are still family.

[WLKjr]

28. lol, but thats how they all are

They all have "close little rethuglican minds" I run into them everyday and they all act the same way, they hate facts and figures cuz it makes their brains hurt!

[Brewman_Jax]

23. You done good

:thumbsup: One of the reasons I signed on to DU was for information in having to deal with freepers, neo-cons, rethuglicans, ignorant RW'ers, oppressed racists, chickenhawks, and other stupid people. I didn't have the info to match up with them, and now I do. With hundreds of pages of notes and articles available to me, I now have no objection to bashing them with the hammer of truth.

Besides, if you don't stand up for yourself, who will?

[WLKjr]

31. Yes you did do good

Don't be ashamed to yell back at their crap. I joined for the same reason Lurking_Argyle, I got sick of repugs yelling crap at me and I didn't have anything to pitch back and now I do. They tend to shut up more and more now that I have started pointing out things to the stupid shits.

[Brewman_Jax]

36. So true

Facts don't always stop them, esp. when out and about, but it does slow them down. You're right, a couple of swings with the hammer usually changes the subject--quickly.

[cmf]

29. Good for you!

Stand your ground, and don't let them bully you anymore.

Fortunately for me, my inlaws are the rare breed of respectful repubs. Every now and then there might be a Clinton remark, but they're few and far between. We know where they stand and they know where we stand. There's no fighting, which is nice. Of course, they're more old-school conservatives, rather than the repugnant breed of neo-cons, so that might have something to do with it.

[Toucano]

30. Bravo, Dees

You done the right bad thing! :)

We're very proud of you, and you're absolutely right. There's too much at stake this time.

[Treaghon]

35. Just the facts, maam...

I find that most of the time I refute an misinformed propaganda spewing republican's "argument" with a backed up fact, they either back down pretty quick or get extremely agitated and regurgitate another piece of propaganda.

I'm still telling these 'pubs that the exiting Clinton staff never trashed the white house with porn, feces and spray-painted colorful metaphors about Bush.

Which brings me to another question: Why has no major print or news outlet refuted this lie yet? I still wanna know how to get to the center of a Tootsie-Pop fer cry'in out loud.

[Dees]

38. In regard to the trashing..

Could it have been that the media was caught with egg and other matter on their faces and just couldn't own up to the lies? They were in such a hurry to get this "big" story out.

[DeaconBlues]

32. My wife and I went to visit my father-in-law and his other kids with our

new "Veteran for Kerry" sticker on our car. They are all right-wingers and I was hoping for a nice juicy argument. The thing is, they are all beaten down by Bush's incompetence that they didn't even give a good fight. Just a few grumbles from the old man and that was it! And his son said he's considering Kerry (although I'll believe it when I see it).

What's a guy got to do to be able to let loose with some Bush-bashing!?