Why Keep Invoking Nader?

[porphyrian]

Are you guys freeper moles trying to cause dissent amongst our ranks or what? Nader isn't even supported by a significant portion of his own party, so you can't possibly be threatened by him. Maybe you're just trolling for an argument? I'm OK with that, but I don't think that requires five or six threads at once, given the other issues available for discussion (though I acknowledge the irony of that statement as I add yet another Nader thread myself). Just curious.

[Skittles]

1. I am sick of hearing about him too

and I pity the people who would actually support him.

[Bill Wade]

3. I don't support Nader, but I don't support the Democratic party, either.

I pity the people who think John Kerry is going to come in and be a wonderful workling class, non-corporate, anti-war, progressive president.

[mzmolly]

5. I pity the people who think Nader will come in and be a wonderful

working class, not corporate, anti war, progressive. :P Don't forget Nader made his fortune in the corporate stock market. He also busted unions in the past, and invested in the defense industry.

I'm personally voting for Kerry because he's rational. Bush is not.

Kerry has a solid record supporting progressive issues... Is he a perfect human being. NO. There isn't one person running for President (with a voting record) I dont have some issue(s) with. NOT ONE.

http://www.issues2000.org/John_Kerry.htm

[Skittles]

6. I really hope you don't assume I'm one of those people

at this point I would accept someone who is acually ELECTED and can speak in full sentences.

[sendero]

9. Nobody thinks that..

... they just think he'll be a huge improvement over Bush.

The left has sat idly by while hate radio and whore media has sold the public at large an interlocking series of lies that convinces them to vote against their own interests or not at all.

AAR is the only concerted response we've made. We've sat by and watched the only liberal media outlet we had, NPR, turn right. Many morons still send them money. Why not just send Rush a donation?

There is no "president" on a white horse who can come into office and set everything right next year. It took 20+ years to get here, and it will take a long time to undo the damage, if ever. The public brainwashing has to be undone. No politician can do that, it is up to the people.

[nofurylike]

10. so you support *shrub then. just say it honestly.

take the responsibility of honesty.

which begs the question "why are you here?"

and remember later:

"when they came for me..."

well, not that there will be a "later" should shrub.....

(won't even utter the words)


sheesh

[Bill Wade]

16. Riiiiiight.

I guess I must have been confused when I donated to DU.. maybe I thought it was a GOP donation of some sort... by the way, how come you haven't donated? I'm sure they could use some money from a really intelligent rational person like you, instead of a closet Bush supporter like me.

Well, at least now I know "you're either with us, or against us" even here at DU.

[louis c]

2. Nader

is turning out to be just a joke.

[mzmolly]

4. Well, if you look at the data, he is a HUGE threat that could decide swing

states.

www.dontvoteralph.org

I guess I'm taking him seriously this time.

[sangh0]

7. Interesting graph

Thanks for posting it

[porphyrian]

8. About those polls...

This is just an aggregate of a number of polls, correct? Who did them? What were the sample sizes, response rates, methods of polling, and margins of error? And, assuming that the data is correct in all cases, all of the percentages shown are less than 10%. Why is it easier to worry about Nader than to focus on getting 10% more votes from non-voting anti-Bush people?

[mzmolly]

17. I plan to focus on Nader and the non-voting population.

If you want data on the polls, check the link I provided.

[RichJohnson1976]

11. If you guys were smart

You'd figure out how to tap the anger in the republican party over the fact that those of us on the far right are as mad at Bush as you are over his big government republicanism. I know if a guy like say Alan Keyes had run against him in the primary I'd have straight dumped Bush.

[liberalmike27]

12. Pity-me then, I love Nader

Never has a candidate represented me so thoroughly, and like other posters, don't expect Kerry to be substantially different than Bush on many issues.

I understand the dynamics, and I think Kerry can win too. In the end, it is the Democratic voters who are to blame. Nader entered the race because the voters abandoned Dean, the only candidate who displayed some populist backbone.

I think if Kerry would push just one issue, the living-wage, "not" the minimum wage, he'd probably take all of Nader's voters. All he can come up with is a milquetoast minimum wage increase, proposed for the distant 2006-2007 year. Why not now, those who make near minimum need it now, not three years. While 90% of us fall further behind, the top ten percent are earning fortunes. And the middle class, never realizing how close they are to the circus-floor, without a net, often goes along with their policies. One slip, and they crash to the floor, needing medical assistance, with very little to no safety net, one job loss of a good job, and having to take on a poor-paying job, and the house has to be sold, and you are down with the fish.

If you want to look at the upside, with Nader in the race, you'll get so many people who end up voting for Democrats in the Senate, that we may actually be able to make some progress there. I'd much rather have the Senate, perhaps the house than win the presidency. That would allow us to make Bush's life the hell he deserves.

[11 Bravo]

13. And if Bush is allowed to place one or two justices on the SCOTUS

they will then have a lifetime in which to make all of our lives a hell which no one deserves. Nader has already afforded Bush four years in which to continue to trash the middle class, dismantle the social safety net, and, in his spare time, turn us into the most reviled nation on the planet. Do you honestly believe that four MORE years of Bush is just what the doctor ordered?

[John_H]

14. Your last graph underscores the stupid, self absorbed agenda of Naaderites

It's fine to elect chimp just so a Dem senate can give him hell? You'd much rather have the senate than the presidency. LOL! You're the prototype Naderite, dude.

[John_H]

15. Your last graph underscores the stupid, self absorbed agenda of Naderites

It's fine to elect chimp just so a Dem senate can give him hell? You'd much rather have the senate than the presidency. LOL! You're the prototype Naderite, dude.

[mzmolly]

18. Nader can represent you *thoroughly* because he has never participated

in Government.

ANYONE who has will disapoint at sometime.

And if your so supportive of Nader because of his stance on a living wage ... ponder this:

http://www.realchange.org/nader.htm

"
Busted a union among his workers:
Ralph talks big about democracy and even unions. But when his own workers at one of his magazines, Multinational Monitor, got fed up with cruel working conditions and started agitating for a union of their own, Nader busted the union with all of the hardball techniques used by corporate owners across America. Workers at Public Citizen, another Nader group, also tried to form a union because of 60 to 80 hour work weeks, salaries that ranged from $13,000 down, and other difficult working conditions and were blocked by Nader, who remains unapologetic to this day.
Nader says "I don't think there is a role for unions in small nonprofit 'cause' organizations any more than ... within a monastery or within a union."

When ringleader Tim Shorrock filed the union recognition papers, Nader immediately transferred ownership in the Multinational Monitor to close friends who ran an organization ("Essential Information") that Nader had set up. When Shorrock showed up for work the next day, he had been fired, the locks were changed, and management called the police to charge him with theft (of his own work papers.) That charge was thrown out of court, but management fired the two supportive editors and sued the three of them for $1.2 million, agreeing to drop the intimidation suit only when they dropped their NLRB complaint. All of these action are straight from the hardball anti-union playbook, and Nader makes no apology.

According to Nader, "Public interest groups are like crusades…you can’t have work rules, or 9 to 5." Shorrock, with his "union ploy," became an "adversary" according to Nader. "Anything that is commercial, is unionizable," but small public interest organizations "would go broke in a month," Nader says, if they paid union wages, offered union benefits and operated according to standard work rules, such as the eight-hour day. Remember that Nader's well-funded organizations were amassing tons of extra money that Ralph has been playing the stock market with during all these events."

Nader has also helped bust unions in other companies. That's how much he cares about workers rights/salaries.

[sangh0]

19. I'm not Mr T

I don't pity the fools