Taking the "Christian" out of Bush...

[cap]

I'm interested in ideas on how to totally trash Bush's "Christian" image. Notice I'm putting the word Christian in quotes because to real Christians, Bush is anything but.

But I think we could weaken his base if we could destroy his "moral" image.

Some of his attack can be on lack of charity to the poor -- but that really won't turn off the base. His base doesn't really care about the unfortunate in our society.

His base must be convinced that Bush is personally immoral. Kinda like finding out that Bush is really a Jimmy Swaggert. And unlike Swaggert, beyond the possibility of redemption.

Also we need to counter the reality that his early partying days have been covered up by his Dad's money. And also, that the base has forgiven those days, because in his 40's, Bush turned to Christ (we don't know what Christ has said about this!!!) and under Laura's good counsel, gave up drinking. How can we get the base to unforgive Bush?

It's really necessary to strip Bush of his "Christianity" without annoying devout, conservative believers.

Would like to hear especially from the conservative Christian DU'ers amongst us.

[Kolesar]

1. War is not "pro-life"

The major American churches opposed the war. I wish they would follow through and endorse his opponent so that we can remove this murderer from office. (Note: I do not have Christian credentials)

[Bandit]

2. Bush*'s own Church opposed the Iraqi War and Bush* would not meet

with the Pastor of his own Church. It is not hard to debunk Bush*'s Christian credentials if one tries at all. He is anything but Christian in word and deed.

[meow2u3]

13. Executing innocents is not pro-life

He who makes fun of an inmate he just had executed crucifies Jesus all over again :mad:

[Kolesar]

23. Yes, wasn't that the most sickening thing?

I was ambivalent about the death penalty, but the more I see of those who embrace it enthusiastically, the more I turn against the death penalty. These are hateful, vengeful people. They scare me.

[soleft]

3. His base aren't "Christians" either

that's the problem.

[indepat]

12. Bingo, you hit the proverbial nail on the

head.

[Flubadubya]

4. To many of these "Christians" you refer to...

unfortunately the only thing they see as a "mortal" sin has to do with something "sexual". You're right, they mostly don't give a hang about the unfortunate in society. Their greed is most likely right along a par with the Bushies.

They don't care about the immorality of war... just look at their attitude on that. They also don't seem to have a problem with malfeasance, (well, that's just part of doing business).

They don't even seem to mind being jobless. They "keep the faith", no doubt.

Lastly, many of the "devout conservative believers" will never see Bush as anyting but a saint, primarily because the are "devout conservative believers". Period. Nothing can "shake their faith" because they are so narrow minded.

Sorry, looks like nothing but a good, old-fashioned sex scandal can rock these peoples' world... and, unfortunately, it appears that this is the only area where Shrub "may" be clean. Seems to be anyway.

[noonwitch]

10. They are "Christian" Pharisees

More concerned about the law than the spirit.

[Aristus]

14. Of course he's "clean" in that area. He's got the sex appeal of a

car accident!

[efhmc]

5. For all of his immoral habits, Clinton is much closer to the true

meaning of a follower of Christ. But so many were turned off by his behaviour that they went running for a "moral" man. People that are true Christins have already seen the difference and those who are not will continue to cling to bush because they love the smell and feel of power and like to associated with a "winner". I find that the reason many here (Texas) are closet Democrats. bush is a Pharisee and the right wingers love that type. He is much more interested in the law than in the spirit as they all are. You will never change those folks' minds, such as they are. What we need to do is show what a poor leader for our country bush is. You think people would see THAT by now but it is slow going.

[leesa]

6. If they can't tell by his behavior, I would say they are not very

good christians. These people do everything on faith and they WILL believe Bush is good because they are told he is the person that will bring about the Rapture. Doesn't matter what he does.

[Jesus Christ]

7. If ye are called by My name, ye shall live by My teachings

And the Son of Bush does not even come remotely close to doing so.

And ye can quote Me on that!

[efhmc]

9. Thanks J. C. When did you join us? We could sure use some guidance.

eom

[roughsatori]

8. Read the New Testament cover to cover

I would suggest the King James Version," though I was raised on the Douay Rheims version. It is filled with words that are admonitions against what the Shrub misadministration is doing. I would recommend that you write down the Book, chapter and verse.

I think that the website LiberalslikeChrist has done some of what you are thinking of doing.

edited to add: be careful of accepting Biblical quotes that you have not found yourself. There are many translations of the Bible. Also, the Catholic and Protestant versions contain a few different books.

Many times I read quotes from the Bible on message boards that are not only out of context and paraphrased, but invented by the poster.

[The Night Owl]

11. This month's Vanity Fair has an interesting article about this topic.

The article is by Christopher :beer: Hitchens and is quite good. In the article, he writes about how Bush's speechwriters use a kind of code, biblical phrases that only hardcore Christians would recognize, to signal to Christian conservatives that Bush is still their guy, even though his policies are sometimes not the kind of policies Christian conservatives can support.

Hithcens also mentions the fact that, despite the efforts to make Bush seem like a man motivated by Christ, the current White House is more enamoured with Leo Strauss than with Christ.

[cap]

15. still not quite answering the question...

the anti-war stances of many of the major churches will not fly with this crowd. For these people it is OK to be pro-war and a "Christian".

What is needed is to generate a total repulsion of Bush -- the way many PTL folks felt with the uncovering of Jimmy and Tammy Swaggert. Something to really revolt these people....

[Bandit]

18. Jimmy and Tammy Swaggert ~ Uhhh maybe Jim & Tammy Baker

I know there are so many it's hard to keep them seperate but we should really try and get it right.

[AntiCoup2K4]

16. I'm with the Lord on this one

There's absolutely no compatibility between the PNAC agenda and the teachings of Jesus Christ. If you were to put the Bush team in a time machine and send them back 2000 years, they would side with the scribes and Pharisees over JC in a heartbeat. In fact I can hear Asscrotch now...

That long haired guy over there telling the crowd to "Do unto others". Follow him, he's gotta be a terrorist!

[Aristus]

17. I'm a liberal Christian, not a conservative. But I attend an evangelical

church, and believe me, Bush could order up dead babies for breakfast and scream for seconds, and the fundies would keep kissing his ass! They have a strange idea of morality, and it's not likely to change. Fundies are a 'check your brain at the door' crew, and you have to have a mind before you can change it.

[demigoddess]

19. One thing that struck me was about adoption

The Bushes said they were all set to adopt a set of twins when Laura got pregnant with the twins and then they did not adopt. They have enough money to support more than two kids and we all know people with far less money who have biological and adopted kids. If they really believed their pro-life rhetoric they would have adopted those kids, it seems to me.

[esse_quam_videri]

20. When asked who his favorite political thinker/philosopher

was in 1999, Bush stated Jesus Christ. Oddly, Bush could provide no details on what JCs politics were. Surely, because he didn't have a clue. Although I am an atheist, I know enough about the JC story that his politics would not go over well with the GOP (and more importantly, Karl Rove!). If anyone wants to clobber Bush and his ilk with the politics of Mr. Christos, I suggest looking "beyond" the church stories. ;-)

[chadm]

21. I'd run a 1 minute ad...

Open with one of GWB's proclaimations that he's a Christian.

Voice over with a few of the 10 Commandments.

- Thou shall not kill

In the background, the war

- Thou shall not lie

The 16 words

- Thou shall not steal

Show the oil wells in Iraq


End voice-over: "Not good enough for America. Not Christian enough for America's Christians."

[Liberator_Rev]

22. Promote http://www.LiberalsLikeChrist.Org/BushRecord

http://www.LiberalsLikeChrist.Org/BushRecord



at http://www.LiberalsLikeChrist.Org .

See what Christ might say about the "Christian Coalition" & "Religious Right" imposters.

[flyingfish]

24. Maybe we can take the "Christian" out of Rev also

Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, the Rev.
All the same.
Try to make others look bad so their views look good.

[outinforce]

26. One other Similiarity Among All of them

Pat Robertson.

Jerry Falwell.

Rev. Dubuque.

They ALL -- every one of them -- are convinced that they have the one and only "TRUE" version of Christianity, and that all will be well if THEIR own personal view of Christianity were adopted as policy for the USA.

[outinforce]

25. You've Got a BIG Problem With This

Although I think I understand what you are trying to do here, cap, might I suggest that you are treading on very dangerous ground here.

If you attempt to undermine *'s support among his fundamental Christian supporters, what alternative will you offer them?

Will you, for instance, offer them a Democrat who is more in line with their view of Christianity?

Or will you simply leave them to find some other Republican other than * to support?

And if it is revealed, somehow, that members of the Democratic Party "engineered" an undermining of *'s support among his more fundamental Christian supporters, how do you think that will resonate with his supporters? My guess is that they will be much more likely to forgive him for whatever immorality you attempt to use against him.

It's much the same error the GOP played againsty Clinton. "What is", they thought, "the thing Democrats will never forgive a sitting President for?" Answer: "Lying to the American People". After all, the GOP reasoned, Richard N ixon was forced from office -- because he lied to the American People.

So, the GOP went off to engineer a little episode that they were sure would turn all Americans - including Clinton's most ardent aupporters -- against him.

They engineered an episode in which the President was certain to lie to the American People.

Only it backfired. BIG TIME.

My only counsel is this: Be VERY careful when trying to engineer an episode that you think will erode support among an opponent's base.

Better, in my view, to argue policies (like compassion for the poorest among us) than to attempt to destroy an enemy.

[Bandit]

27. Use the words of Christ as often as possible

It is very difficult for a "Christian" to refute the words of Christ. I know of no words of Christ that will justify Bush*'s adminstrative views on any subject. Use Christ's words often and not sparingly. Compare what Christ actually says with Bush*'s actual actions. It shouldn't be a big feat. Blessed are the Meek. Bush* is a bully not at all meek. On and on and on and on.

[cap]

28. I think that can be part of it...

by using Christ's words against him...

That is taking the high road.... Although I am not sure how effective it is.

I am also thinking of taking the low road.... but it is very hard to prove conclusively. His personal morality does not measure up... but beyond rumours of Victor Ashe, we have nothing.