Mike Brown/FEMA: "Mother Nature can go anywhere she wants, anytime

[barbaraann]

she wants."

Is it just me, does anyone else think it's absolutely NUTS for a high-ranking official in charge of disaster management to believe in freaking MOTHER NATURE??? I've heard this several times over the last few days from more than one official. Also, they always emphasize that Mother Nature is a WOMAN, i.e. "she."

Republicans are such masters at shifting blame when THEY fail. It is just astounding. If nothing can be done about "Mother Nature," why do we spend billions of millions and millions of dollars on hurricane and weather warning systems?????

[otohara]

1. With A Litttle Help From Global Warming

Why is it we never hear about GW when these disasters strike?

[Bluzmann57]

2. Let me see if I have this straight

You are blaming Republicans for an act of nature? And you don't think that an entity referred to by many many people as "mother" should be considered a woman? Well, I don't know about you, but I don't blame any humans for an act of nature and I sure as hell know that my own mother is a woman. Please clarify your points if you have any.

[barbaraann]

4. Geez.

I am blaming the Republican leadership in Florida for failing to adequately prepare and evacuate for Charley. I've posted a lot about this in the last day or so, and I'm not going to repeat it here, but you can do a search and find all the posts. The GOP is blaming "Mother Nature" for ALL of the destruction caused by Charley, but SOME of it is the direct result of the FAILURE of Jeb Bush and others to deal with the imminent disaster. (His brother believes in pre-emption, but apparently Jeb doesn't.)

Regarding the Mother Nature issue, it wasn't Mother Nature that hit Florida, it was a HURRICANE. And do you remember when all hurricanes were names after women and then that was changed because it was anti-female?????????? It wasn't just an innocent, innocuous thing that all hurricanes were named after women for a very long time and it wasn't frivolous that now half are given MEN'S names.

[JHB]

8. Jeb thought NOAA warnings were a "historic overview"...

...If he'd had any specific information on the storm's track, he would have moved heaven and earth to prevent any damage or loss of life. (/sarcasm)

[JHB]

12. I think it's more of a "who knew they'd use planes as bombs" complaint...

...papering over inadequecies in the Republican-controlled government preparations and response to the storm.

[DaveFL99]

14. If we can get the blame to stick we should blame Bush for this.

Let's take a page from Rove's play book and claim that Jeb blew the path prediction. If we say it often enough it'll become the 'conventional wisdom'.

[BOHICA06]

3. Because someday we will ...

the NOAA gave the proper warnings. The west coast was red - hurricane warning from Florida Bay to Cedar Key. That means get out - for flood zones & mobile homes. The media got focused on the Tampa Bay track. I bet such a focus cost 2 or 3 people their lives because the didn't anticipate any changes.

My own plans changed when they went Cat4 - I was figuring on a bug-out location, but then the right turn due to a cold front changed everything ... again.

[DrWeird]

5. Lot's of them believe in God too.

But I think he's just using a metaphor in this case.

[Eloriel]

7. Exactl;y -- just a metaphor

And nothing sexist about it. Nor did it sound to me like anyone was trying to shift blame to "Mother Nature," and this is coming from one who agrees with Barbarann otherwise that there IS blame to be found among state officials re what happened in FL last Friday.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

6. Here's Jeb cover: "Hurricane's sharp turn baffles scientists"

Ya' see, Tampa was the target. Mother Nature fooled us.

http://www.newscientist.com/news/print.jsp?id=ns99996285

[JHB]

9. See #8 above.

Baffle/smaffle. Anyone who lives in a hurricane area should know they sometimes do screwy things that defy prediction. NOAA warnings are based on the best guess and provide a lot of leeway, but still when one's in the neighborhood you have to be ready for anything. Public officials should know that, especially in Florida.

[Eloriel]

10. If you read that short article

It said scientists don't know WHY the hurricane veered -- it doesn't say anything about any forecasting for Tampa on their part.

The weather service had hurricane warnings for just about the entire west coast. This doesn't let Jeb off at all.

[skygazer]

11. Hurricanes are huge

They can be tracked but are often known to veer wildly. I lived in Alabama in the 80's and a large hurricane was headed straight for Mobile - I lived in a trailer and I took my kids and cats and drove for 250 miles before I could find an available motel room (Birmingham). There I found out that the hurricane had hit Dauphin Island at the mouth of Mobile Bay then veered into Mississippi - all my area got was some high wind and a lot of rain.

I was not in the least put out at having fled. As far as I'm concerned, anyone living in a trailer who is in the expected zone of landing (which evidently Punta Gorda was even before the veer) should be told to get the hell out. Anyone who's been in disaster relief or weather forecasting for more than a month should know that hurricanes do not always land right where you think they're going to. Better to evacuate those in high risk homes that are in the line of fire than to have a loss of life like this.

Why trailers are even allowed in coastal hurricane areas is beyond me, anyway.

[barbaraann]

13. You are correct. The mobile home issue is crucial.

I saw a piece on tv about a mobile home park where every single home was destroyed except for the ONE home built to more hurricane-proof standards--with 2x4's instead of smaller framing lumber.

Building codes are crucial, and unsafe mobile homes simply should not be allowed in hurricane-prone areas. These particular mobile homes, at the very least, should all be removed NOW, in my opinion. They are a disaster waiting to happen and they will cause much loss of life and property at some point in the future.

Mother Nature is not responsible for the buiding codes. Human elected officials ARE responsible and the Republicans need to stop blaming Mother Nature for all of the mobile home park devastation.

[BeFree]

24. Mobile homes are all some can afford

Even some well built houses got smashed, and those were houses only the elite can afford.

The mobile home owners are taxpaying citizens of Florida. An event such as this hurricane should have been better planned for. The warnings were up for almost a week and Florida has been forever knowledgeable of possible hurricane damages. These people should have been offered shelters that would have protected them and supplies readily made available after the storm.

If the state was prepared, as Jeb said, the services meant for the millions in Tampa should have quckly made it down to the hundred thousand or so, in Punta Gorda. They weren't, they aren't. It's only a hundred miles away from Tampa.

If the storm had hit Tampa the misery would be multiplied by a thousand.
There is no way the state was prepared for Charley.

[barbaraann]

31. Only 6 of 23 emergency refuges were open in Charlotte County.

http://www.charlottecountyfl.com/Emergency/refugesites.asp

[NewYorkerfromMass]

35. No wonder Jeb didn't want to limit classroom size

no money for anything apparently.

[BeFree]

48. Only 6 shelters....

A failure to provide services as needed for the poor people in that county. Well, let's hope they all learned a lesson.

Jeb said that the state was prepared. Utter Bulls... Every available shelter should have been opened along the whole westcoast of Florida.

There was a mandatory evacuation of all mobiles, yes. But the people had nowhere to go because the shelters were few and far between. The state was not prepared. Just imagine if Charley had hit the Tampa area, there would be thousnads dead.

[kiahzero]

15. Stupidest... attack... EVER.

You want to tell each of the Pagans on this board that they're "NUTS?"

Nevermind the fact that he was using it as a metaphor. This is essentially what your post says: "*Gasp* Someone has a different religious belief than I! Let's point and laugh!"

[barbaraann]

18. I am assuming that Mike Brown is not a pagan.

I would guess that he is a Christian and it seems to me that he should be blaming the "hand of God" if that is true. He is twisting reality to absolve Jeb Bush of any blame.

If Mike Brown were a pagan, I would have to agree with you. :-)

[kiahzero]

20. He was speaking metaphorically

Specifically, he was using the literary device of "personification" - giving the attributes of humans to something that is clearly not human.

Jeb Bush is not responsible for the hurricane's path - he's responsible for his failure to act appropriately when threatened by the hurricane.

[barbaraann]

30. FEMA officials should not be using literary devices.

They should be speaking the language of science and reason, IMHO.

[kiahzero]

34. Why?

No one's suggesting that a position paper be written with something like that - it was a public statement. The phrase he used was clear enough to convey what it needed to convey - a hurricane's going to do what it's going to do, and the only thing we can do is get out of its way as best as we can.

[ClassWarrior]

38. pssssst... It's an opening...

It's an opportunity to slam li'l Jeb for Cheneying up the response. And to slam Dubya, who can't adequately protect our nation because he's tied up our entire military fighting his war for profit. Who cares if it hurts the FEMA director's feelings if we ridicule him?

[kiahzero]

40. I do

It's not his fault Jeb fucked up, and it's not his fault that Bush went to war in Iraq. Put the blame where it belongs.

[barbaraann]

43. He's a collaborator.

He didn't look like a heavy BFEE hitter, IMHO, just a collaborator.

[ClassWarrior]

44. He's a member of the Mis-Administration, isn't he??

[kiahzero]

47. I dunno

Is FEMA a political appointment? Is there any evidence that this guy has done anything that would warrant the ridicule?

[BeFree]

52. FEMA

Federal Emergency Management Agency

The head is appointed by the president. The idea is that in an emergency FEMA will manage the problems created by an emergency, and beforehand be prepared.

For him to stand up there and belittle FEMA by stating the obvious is ridiculous. FEMA down thru Jeb, down to the county level, is responsible for the management of the aftermath. If we don't push them to do the right thing for our fellow citizens, who will?

To blame Mother Nature for his possible failure is tantamount to treason against the American people.

[kiahzero]

54. I know what FEMA does

My question was whether or not the head was a political appointee or not.

Does anyone have a link to where he said this? It depends on the context whether or not you are correct in your third paragraph - if it was a dodge of "Why weren't you prepared?" then yes. If it was just an opening statement or something before a press conference, then no.

To blame Mother Nature for his possible failure is tantamount to treason against the American people.

What's the definition of treason again? Oh yeah, that's right:
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort. No person shall be convicted of treason unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court.

So, when you say that it's "tantamount to treason," you're just plain wrong.

[BeFree]

55. Check the meaning of 'Tantamount'

Are you saying that FEMA was prepared either beforehand or afterward? Because if that is what you are saying you have a lot to learn. Had FEMA been prepared, they would have had heavy equipment down there that night with water food and whatever else was needed by the citizens.

There was plenty of warning.

Why is it that you are so willing to excuse the lack of prepartion? FEMA, for all the good it could possibly do has failed the people. That is 'tantamount' to treason.

[kiahzero]

56. Bullshit

For the record, the definition of "tantamount:"
Equivalent in effect or value

And, because I know you'll bring it up, the definition of "equivalent:"
Equal, as in value, force, or meaning.

By saying that FEMA committed an act tantamount to treason, you are saying that FEMA committed an act that was equal to treason - that FEMA committed treason.

It did not commit treason, as defined above. You are simply misusing the word, just like Ann Coulter does. And so I will point out your error, just like I do when Ann Coulter does.

[BeFree]

57. No, no, not BS

"Equivalent in effect or value"

Well, if you want to protect the boosh administration, feel free to do so. But what they have (not) done is tantamount (read: equivalent in effect or value) to treason. I did not write commit treason, you did. Fruedian slip on your part?

[noiretextatique]

59. i agree with you...his statement doesn't exactly inspire confidence

in his agency's mission.

[LoZoccolo]

49. Wait, so if he's a pagan it's OK to believe in Mother Nature...

...but if he's not, then it's not OK.

:eyes:

[DaveFL99]

16. We'd better blame Bush

before he hangs this on Clinton

[NashVegas]

17. You Have a Problem With Metaphor / Animism?

Could you be over-reacting?

Until we can definitively control weather patterns, anyone who lives in these disaster-prone areas has no business blaming anything but their own desire to live in a half-paradise, half-carnival ride location.

[barbaraann]

22. Well...

I have been watching a LOT of the coverage of Charley and blaming Mother Nature is just a part of a larger picture of Republican officials SHIFTING BLAME. For example, no one is saying "Gee, we made a mistake in allowing unsafe mobile homes in hurricane-prone areas" or "We should have ENFORCED the mandatory evacuation orders."

And they are totally avoiding the issue of whether or not they have enough National Guard troops to deal with the disaster. I started a thread earlier about how there were "technical difficulties" on CNN when Jeb was asked about the availability of Guard troops.

It's part of a pattern--the typical BFEE blame-shifting pattern. I guess it really struck me because the Christian Fundamentalist Bush regime is blaming a PAGAN entity and not their awesome God.

[NashVegas]

28. But the Gov Has Been Doing That for Decades - Centuries

So why do we start assigning blame now? If Jebbie's ass had been defeated in 2002, don't you think whomever the Dem governor would be, might also be getting his ass chewed up a bit?

I guess it really struck me because the Christian Fundamentalist Bush regime is blaming a PAGAN entity and not their awesome God.

Teehee. I hear you on that. Best not let Asscrack hear of it.

[barbaraann]

33. Hmmm....if pagans ran FEMA...

that would be interesting! :-)

[skygazer]

23. Welllll.......

I'm not going to get worked up over the "Mother Nature" thing (which kind of reminds me of the old margarine commercials - remember those? "It's not nice to fool Mother Nature!") but I digress.

I live along the San Andreas Fault - most definitely a half-paradise, half-carnival ride location. Buildings and bridges are required to pass building codes specifically geared toward earthquakes. In the event, this helps to protect me and mine.

People have known for ages that trailers fly. Not on their own but when picked up by hurricanes and tornados. Yes, people choose to live in them but when I moved to Alabama from Vermont, I had no idea of the force of a hurricane, no idea how flimsy a trailer would be in one. Allowing them to stand with no safety codes, particularly when they are prime housing for elderly, is not right.

Is it Jeb's fault? I think when you see a hurricane coming toward the entire west coast, it might make sense to tell those in trailers to GET OUT!! I know I was told just that in AL. And it didn't hit us. Better safe than salami.

[barbaraann]

29. There WAS a mandatory evacuation for mobile homes in Charlotte

County but it wasn't ENFORCED. IMHO, it should have been ENFORCED by Florida officials. Police and Guardsmen should have been IN THE TRAILER PARKS making sure that people left.

[BOHICA06]

37. You are responsible for your own sorry butt.

Its about Freedom - and the freedom to make a stupid decision. If they enforced it, the cries of Gestapo would be next.

[ClassWarrior]

39. How compassionate.

[BOHICA06]

45. Compassion and Freedom ...

sometimes conflict, particularly during Hurricane Season.

Now don't be coming down to visit between June & December unless you're prepared to bug-out when the blow comes.

[BeFree]

58. Prepared

FEMA was not prepared. Neither was the state. They knew it would happen eventually but they were not prepared even though that is their job: "To Protect and Serve".

Now, if you want to excuse them from doing their job, that's fine. The rest of us will gladly hold their feet to the fire, because one day we may be the ones needing their help.

The failure of the government to do their job is tantamount to treason against the citizens.

[BOHICA06]

60. What job did they fail to do?

It's 72hrs later and stuff is happening - lots of stuff. What were they not prepared for in a disaster that covers 2,000,000 people in a 150 linear miles?

If you have some way of stopping a Category 4 hurricane - please share. Even better and more practical - please design a 1200ft2 home that can withstand 105-145 mph wind - sustained for 1 hour and costs no more than a single-wide trailer home.

[CaptainClark23]

19. Actually, I think thats a healthy attitude

for a FEMA official to have.

Arguing over metaphorical terminology is silly.
One might just as easily say:

"Meteorological Phenomena occur, and we can't do much about it except try and get people out of the way, and clean up after its past."

But then I suppose the official would have been too clinical, eh?

[barbaraann]

25. But they DIDN'T get people out of the way. That's the issue.

Mother Nature didn't write the building codes, allow unsafe homes in hurricane-prone areas, mishandle the warnings, send the National Guard to Iraq, etc. And Mother Nature isn't failing to provide temporary housing to all of the homeless victims of Charley.


The unpredictability of "Mother Nature" or whatever you want to call it must and can be factored into hurricane warning systems. Calling the unpredictability "Mother Nature" doesn't excuse humans from taking responsible action.

[CaptainClark23]

42. Response:

You stated: "Is it just me, does anyone else think it's absolutely NUTS for a high-ranking official in charge of disaster management to believe in freaking MOTHER NATURE??? I've heard this several times over the last few days from more than one official. Also, they always emphasize that Mother Nature is a WOMAN, i.e. "she.""

I responded that I thought it was a healthy attitude for a FEMA official to have.

As to how well elected or appointed officials handled this disaster, I didn't see that addressed in your initial post, except perhaps by inference. It seems to have developed along with the progression of your thread.

I answered your initial stated question. No, I don't think its nuts.

[ClassWarrior]

21. It's the "Shit Happens" Administration.

This was the topic of a thread about a week ago - Bush* & Co. aren't responsible for anything. Things just "happen." Wars wage themselves. Jobs lose themselves. Environments destroy themselves. Emergency preparations misdirect themselves to Tampa. Etc.

[barbaraann]

26. Bingo.

Georgie can't think of ONE mistake he has ever made and I guess Jeb can't either.

Heck, I've already made a couple of mistakes JUST TODAY! :-)

[ClassWarrior]

27. You error-prone HUMAN, you!!

:7

[barbaraann]

32. And I'm not prepared for an emergency right now

I'm still in my nightgown. :o

[ClassWarrior]

36. Slacking around in your nightgown??

You must be one of those liburl elites...

:P

[barbaraann]

41. Yup, that's me.

Multi-billionaire lounging around sipping mint juleps and eating caviar. :-)

Actually, the time has gotten away from me and I need to go volunteer for the Kerry campaign today. Yikes!

[ClassWarrior]

46. You go Girl!! It's on my to-do list to stop by...

...my local Kerry and Feingold offices today!

[theboss]

50. I take it you don't believe in "landslide" victories either

I mean, no rocks fall when people vote.

I think you are being a little on the sensitive side. Democrats use metaphors and allegories too.

By the way, when the US got "blown out" by Puerto Rico this weekend, there were no explosions.

[ClassWarrior]

51. Yes, let's sit quietly and be polite.

Tom Daschle, is that you, ya big lug??

[theboss]

53. I was actually being a smart-ass

Which is not the same as being polite.