Okay, I'm now convinced of a coverup...

[theHandpuppet]

... regarding Bush's health. Not buying the "choked on a pretzel" anecdote now, nor the supposed 47 spills from a bicycle. Nor am I buying that Bush suddenly gave up jogging due to a bad knee.

Nope, there's a reason Bush has postponed his physical until AFTER the election. There's a reason he's always covered with scrapes and bruises, why his injuries always seem to occur out of public view, a reason he has given up jogging in public, a reason why he couldn't even stay on a Segway when his 80-something Pop can still parachute from airplanes. He can't even hold onto Barney without dropping him.

Tonight was the clincher for me. The red face, the slouching, the slurring of words... god knows this is not new, but its become increasingly worse over the past months. And just why did Bush require his personal physician be present just behind the wings, when the rules supposedly allowed each candidate only one assistant offstage?

There's something rotten in the state of Crawford, and my bet is that Bush has a physiological/neurological disorder for which he's taking heavy meds. I'm skipping the booze theory, because I think there's something much more sinister going on. It's not like the GOP hasn't engaged in this kind of coverup before -- look at Ronnie Reagan.

My partner thinks the old boy is having seizures for which he takes heavy meds. Sure would explain a lot, including the avoidance of his routine physical until AFTER the elections.

Thoughts?

[The Traveler]

1. Something is wrong with him

Perhaps your theory is correct. I thought he was a little buzzed, lightly drunk.

[theHandpuppet]

6. I don't think it was booze

That's dismissing something which smacks of a more sinister coverup. I think he's on some kind of meds for an ailment that would become public if he were to submit to the routine physical.

[The Traveler]

10. You could be right

All I can be certain of is that the man was not in complete command of his faculties ... to put it bluntly, he was mildly fucked up. Incredible given the importance of this event ...

[RapidCreek]

25. Probably on Neurontin

RC

[tinrobot]

2. Hmmmm...

Could explain why Bush never stood up straight once and was always leaning on the podium.

[DenverDem]

3. Something IS rotten in Rotterdam.

The postponed physical is a flashing red light.

He sure didn't debate like a healthy man. That or his really is that stupid.

[homerthompson]

4. he's on an anti-depressent

I remember reading that on kos a few months ago.

[PretzelWarrior]

5. nope. I'm going with the "that wasn't water in his tumbler" theory

which reminds me of an old joke:


A new priest was so nervous at his first mass, he could hardly speak. After mass, he asked the monsignor how he had done.
The monsignor replied, "When I am worried about getting nervous on the pulpit, I put a glass of vodka next to the water glass. If I start to get nervous, I take a sip."

The next Sunday, the new priest took the monsignor's advice. At the beginning of the sermon, he got nervous and took a drink. He proceeded to talk up a storm.

Upon his return to his office after mass, he found the following note on the door:

1. Sip the vodka, don't gulp.

2. There are 10 commandments, not 12.

3. There are 12 disciples, not 10.

4. Jesus was consecrated, not constipated.

5. Jacob wagered his donkey, he did not bet his ass.

6. We do not refer to Jesus Christ as the late J.C.

7. The Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are not referred to as Daddy, Junior and the Spook.

8. David slew Goliath, he did not kick the sh*t out of him.

9. When David was hit by a rock and was knocked off his donkey, don't say he was stoned off his ass.

10. We do not refer to the cross as the "Big T."

11. When Jesus broke the bread at the Last Supper he said, "Take this and eat it for it is my body." He did not say, "Eat me."

12. The Virgin Mary is not called "Mary with the Cherry."

13. The recommended grace before a meal is not, "Rub-A-Dub-Dub thanks for the grub, yeah God!"

[rooboy]

14. Very funny... thanks n/t

[0007]

33. Thanks for the great joke!

[krkaufman]

7. AAR's Sam Seder says it's Kosakov's Syndrome

Korsakov's syndrome - dementia observed during the last stages of severe chronic alcoholism; involves loss of memory for recent events although long term memory is intact

This would explain why the jackass said twice during the debate that 100,000 Iraqis have been trained.

[Comadreja]

8. He's turning back into a hideous Reptilican alien

Soon his flesh will begin scaling over and the forked tongue will begin darting out for all to see.

[ghostsofgiants]

11. Haha

I heart David Icke.

[DebJ]

35. me too

[Dogmudgeon]

9. I (politely) disagree

I think Bush is "merely" stressed beyond his ability to handle it.

He's never had to face the consequences of his failures before, and he's never had anything close to an objective audience. Tonight, when he was required to acquit himself and his handling of the war, he just broke down.

It doesn't take alcoholism, Korsakov's syndrome, dry-drunk behavior, psychotropic meds or any other chemical cause to do it. Bush is overwhelmed, and he's never had to handle that before. And it's driving him bugfuck.

--bkl

[xxqqqzme]

19. He's never had 2 stand and take

someone calling him a failure and not B able to throw a tantrum. Good lord, how many times did he take a drink of that last drop of water. I'm surprized he wasn't licking the inside of the glass!

Here is a complete failure @ everything he has ever attempted in his ENTIRE life, spectacularly off base the last 3.9 years. Every time there was/is someone 2 bail him out, pat him on the head and tell him 2 get back on that horse. 2night he was slapped w/ the truth, kicked in the ass, and only had pickles and his progeny mirrors 4 comfort. AND he had 2 wait NINETY minutes 4 that! I'm certain his pathetic life flashed B4 his eyes many times during 2night's event.

[nefarious]

12. The years of booze and drug abuse

Have left him spaced out and nearly mentally deficient. The awkward pauses and occasional non-cogent responses indicate he has to work against a considerable case of attention deficit disorder.

The personal physician probably dosed him up on amphetamines to focus more clearly and appear more sharp and alert. The fidgeting and irritated movements when Senator Kerry was speaking seem to fit the theory.

Notice the amount of water he had to guzzle?

[librechik]

21. Provigil n/t

[Columbia]

13. Vertigo

Would explain the constant falling and him holding himself up on the podium.

http://www.neurologychannel.com/vertigo/symptoms.shtml

Vertigo refers to the sensation of spinning (subjective vertigo) or the perception that surrounding objects are moving or spinning (objective vertigo). Some patients describe a feeling of being pulled toward the floor or toward one side of the room. Moving the head, changing position, and turning while lying down often worsen vertigo.
Peripheral vestibular disorders also may cause the following symptoms:

Blurred vision
Fatigue and reduced stamina
Headache
Heart palpitations (rapid fluttering of the heart)
Imbalance
Inability to concentrate
Increased risk for motion sickness
Muscle ache (especially of the neck and back)
Nausea and vomiting
Reduced cognitive function (i.e., thinking and memory)
Sensitivity to bright lights and noise
Sweating

Severe vertigo can be disabling and may result in complications such as irritability, loss of self-esteem, depression, and injuries from falls. Falls are the leading cause of serious injury in people over the age of 65.

Edit: I did some further digging and apparently vertigo is among the serious adverse reactions (as well as neuropathy and facial paralysis) for the smallpox vaccine - http://www.who.int/entity/vaccine_safety/topics/smallpox/en/smallpox_dec03.pdf

Perhaps all this is from the shot he took back in 2002 - http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/12/21/bush.smallpox/

It is notable that he fell off the Segway in 2003 and his bike this year - http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/05/22/bush.fall/

[eridani]

28. Lots of people took the smallpox vaccine--

--are these symptoms widely reported in that population?

[OneBlueSky]

15. postponing his physical was the clincher for me . . .

no reason to do that unless you don't want the results released before the election . . .

[gauguin57]

16. He's the president, he works for us, we pay his salary ...

... he should be FORCED to take that physical. People need to have the information BEFORE they vote!

[theHandpuppet]

18. And just why is the press...

... pushing this issue? WHAT IS BUSH HIDING?!!

[Sannum]

17. Is there a doctor in the house?

I would love for someone on DU with a medical background to analyze his behavior.

[Columbia]

20. Not a doctor, but check out Post 13

[Swamp Rat]

22. Bush is such a psycho that they give him meds 24/7 to control him.

[nomatrix]

23. All that "hard work" references

How many days has he actually been at the WH?
Entertained dignitaries at the WH?

[Duncan Grant]

24. I hate to be an insensitive ass but ...

:nopity: :nopity: :nopity:

[Cat Atomic]

26. I agree with you.

I think he's got some kind of medical problem. His speech has declined tremendously since the 1992 interview featured in F911. And he's worse now than he was in 2000.

That pretzel story was always too ludicrous to be true, but I always just dismissed it as a "who can say?" sort of thing. Could've been drunk, or just clumsy, or whatever. But the same sort of thing has happened again and again, and his performance in the debate tonight was just abysmal.

I'm no doctor, but it seems like there's something wrong with him.

[eridani]

27. The bad knee is plausible--

-otherwise I think you've nailed it. Surely someone in among our 50,000+ posters could give us a list of meds that would be used for neurological problems and also produce the evident dehydration that required quite a few glasses of water tonight.

Hint, hint ;)

[Spider Jerusalem]

29. Antipsychotic meds, for one.

Neuroleptic medications (like Seroquel, Risperdal, Zyprexa, etc) can cause dry mouth (along with several other side effects, such as lack of focus and concentration, lethargy, involuntary muscle tremor...)

[loudsue]

30. So...after the election, if bush won, WE'D GET CHENEY??? (puke!)

Everyone in their right mind knows that if Americans thought we'd get stuck with Dick Cheney as president after November 'cause the shrub has to take permanent vacation.....NOBODY WOULD VOTE FOR BUSH!! Cheney ISN'T warm and fuzzy!

:kick::kick:

[Media_Lies_Daily]

31. You know...you may be on to something. But is he actually pretending...

...to be ill in hopes of getting some sort of sympathy vote? I wouldn't put anything past them.

[WLKjr]

32. Pickles beats hims

so he is a nervous wreck all the time?

[johnnie]

34. From what I have heard

He has a problem with his heart and he passes out. Jeb supposedly has the same issue.
My buddy has the same problem and it is something to do with a nerve in the brain that doesn't let the heart beat right.
I heard bush has this from someone close to the scene. I don't know how correct it is, but after I heard it, it seems to make sense. I was told he didn't pass out from a pretzel, that was just the story they used.

[leftchick]

36. wow! How did I miss that?

and how in the world can he get away without that physical? Good lord if I missed it I am betting most TV watchers don't know about it!

[OneTwentyoNine]

37. Hell,some Celebrex will keep the pain down on a knee,I should know..

I had knee surgery back in 2000. The surgery went fine but the knee and down my shin bone bothered me for a few months. Two or four Celebrex per day did the job for me.

If Bush is zoning out over knee pain then there's something much deeper than that.

David

[coolhandlulu]

38. Hehehe

I think it's really funny that you guys keep bringing up the pretzel. A couple of months ago, I was yammering about Bush to my Mom, almost nonstop and with much passion. My Mom listened attentively. When I finally take a minute to catch my breath, my Mom says calmly, " I knew something was wrong with that man when he choked on that pretzel." Now I had been quoting facts and sources and such, but Mom managed to break it down to the most simplistic level. People who choke on pretzels should not be President!!!!!

39. If you did this, maybe you would be a nervous wreck too--

www.libertywhistle.us

[FearofFutility]

40. Maybe it was my tv

but his lips looked cyanotic (blue) to me indicating that he's not getting enought oxygen. He's definitely not getting enough oxygen to his brain.

[mopaul]

41. he refused a physical in the air national guard, now as president