Same trajectory as the USSR?

[west michigan]

This may be an odd way to throw this out there, but here goes. If I get a little rambly .... I think you will get the gist. I do not see how we can afford to rebuild and/or keep troops in Iraq for the years it would probably take to be effective (if that is possible). The winger argument of reagan defating the U.S.S.R. I do not wholeheartedly agree with, but to me the arms race accellerated the fall of the soviet union because they could not afford to keep up. They also had Afghanistan to deal with in the 80's. Are we on the same trajectory? How much more can the U.S. consumer handle as being the growth engine of the world? We are going to have deficits as long as the eye can see with the #'s that the govt. throws out and those #'s do not seem believable for they do not include the cost of rebuilding. That and for the past 2-3 years the projections have been on the low side only to be revised upward later.

How firmly on the path of decline has fearless leader placed us? Where is our place in the world going to be the next decade or so? Are we going to go the way of the russians, germans, british, and the spaniards or no.

[Homer12]

1. Their is a way around the problem

Full out Military rule of other nations, not just 3rd world.

Subjegate industrilized nations either through all-out war or economic slavery.

[Old and In the Way]

2. How do you propose that Homer12?

We are doing a bang up job in Iraq and Afghanistan, I know. Do you think we're ready to take on China? Or Russia?

If anything, we should now understand the limits of our power, the rest of the world knows. Bush has done the monumentally stupid....proven how vulnerable the US really is in military campaigns outside the US.

Clinton was smart and used diplomacy with our "overwhelming superiority" in military capability as our unplayed ace in the hole. That was pretty effective and Clinton was the acknowledged leader of the world by most of the world's population.

In 2-1/2 years AWOL-boy has managed to destroy the reputation and goodwill of the US, turned our forces into brutal anti-democratic occupiers, and proven that we are not nearly as effective a military force as we think we are.

Iraq was not stupid...as soon as we invaded, they pretty much refused to play the military game by our rules. But now we are forced to play the game by their rules and we cannot win.

Iraq was and is a 3rd rate military force....so how would you propose that the US "dominate" the world? Start pitching ICBM's?

[west michigan]

3. I think homer....

....was either being sarcastic or vying for the 1939-1945 plan ....which seemed to go well untill early '42.

[Old and In the Way]

4. Thanks West Michigan..............

my cynical sensor is in the shop and being retrofitted for better sensitivity....

[Bandit]

5. Reagan didn't defeat the Soviets, Sears and Roebucks did.

The Russians saw the Sears catalog and wanted what the west had. It was their desires that brought down that wall not Reagan talking about outer space weapons. There is not a truthful thing comes from their mouths.

[west michigan]

6. I hear ya and I'm with ya....

... but I think that Sears is but one facet of that gem. They sure spent (the Russians) a hell of a lot on thier military to try to conquer Afghanistan as well as hold up thier end of the arms race.

What I am driving at is the situation we are in now .... how is it sustainable? How do we pay for it .... remain a credible economic force (debt) .... with a go it alone mentality that puts us on potential (arguable) war footing with other nations?

[Old and In the Way]

7. Short answer.

We can't.

Condi said that we could be in Iraq for a generation...maybe 30 years. If we are spending $1BB a week, that bill will be $1.5TT. And that's just Iraq.

Bush may be helping to accelerate our economic demise....at what point does this become actionable as treason?

[bigtree]

8. who's forcing us to stay?

I've heard it said that the US drew the Soviets into Afghanistan or at least kept them busy by fueling the opposition there with the intention of bogging them down and bankrupting the already faltering empire which was involved in conflicts in the neighboring independent states as well.

Our position in Iraq reminds me of that. Over-committed militarily as we may well be, and economically unstable as we are, it's not hard to imagine a scenario where an economic collapse could force a reassessment of our military ambitions.

[Old and In the Way]

9. Halliburton, Bechtel, Mobil, Exxon, Chevron..........

they seem to be the ones making our foreign policy these days....see Cheney secret energy meetings...

[maggrwaggr]

10. I thought that Iraq would be our demise from the moment

I heard Cheney give a speech well over a year ago and I realized that they were going to war, no matter what anyone else said or thought.

I had a bad sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach. It's that feeling that's never wrong. The gut instinct. And it said "man, this is a horrible idea."

I really think Iraq is the beginning of the end for America.

Which is a sad sad thing because it simply never should have happened.

Yes, I think America will go the way of the Soviet Union because of Iraq. It's going to bleed us dry. Bankrupt us. Both morally and financially.

It's a black hole.