could this be the explanation for chemtrails?

[OneBlueSky]

It's a really interesting interview with someone the interviewer is calling Deep Shield, who apparently is involved with the spraying program and knows a lot about it. He explains what is happening and, more importantly, WHY it is happening. VERY interesting (and VERY scary) stuff. It's rather lengthy, and I have no idea how much credibility to lend to it, but I found it fascinating reading.

http://www.holmestead.ca/chemtrails/shieldproject.html

[BevHarris]

1. I agree it is interesting. Because there is no way to verify the

source, or the information, as of yet, it has to be put in the category of "hmm, that's interesting." But it certainly has a lot of fresh material.

For those who haven't clicked the link, it has to do with using polymers to slow down global warming, and states that the problem is more intractible than has been acknowledged, and that this method has the potential to solve it to some extent, whereas the environmental solutions won't be enough to make a dent, because the problem has reached an advanced stage.

Has to be considered of ?? credibility but it has a plausible, fairly solid feel to it. A good read.

I may be more open minded to this than some, because I had a client who had done considerable writing about weather control, and when creating his press kit I had to familiarize myself with some Air Force reports about various things they have done ever since Viet Nam to manipulate the atmosphere in small ways.

Bev

[Az]

2. No way to test?!

Charter a jet. Inspect it. Fly it. See the Chemtrail. Realise the concern was unwarranted and that chemtrails are natural formations from jets.

[BevHarris]

4. Soo...did you personally do that?

You chartered a jet and checked? What did you do, reach out the window and grab a handful of vapor?

My guess is you're guessing and so is everyone else. Do a google search on Air Force and weather control. You may find the information surprising, and that IS from a credible source. Check out Operation Olive Oil (maybe spelled Olive Oyl, can't remember).

Look, I'm born of a family of scientists. You don't have to KNOW the answer before you know the answer. You've got a hypothesis, Deep whatever has his hypothesis, others have other ones. Until solid evidence proves one of them, you just keep them on the table.

[no_arbusto]

17. Yeah?

Google "why the F*#k are there contrails behind this jet flying in circles over the highway, in the desert, in southern CA, in August, next to 'cirrus' clouds" and tell me what you get. This is one of the few things my far right "freeper" cousin and I actually agree on. I've got pictures. Let me know if you'd like to see them.

[Minstrel Boy]

3. I don't know what to think about

chemtrails, but the thought they might actually exist scares me about as much as anything ever has.

Thanks for the link, though I too don't know how credible it is. One point "Deep Shield" makes I believe 100%: humanity is facing uprecedented ecological and energy crises, and if most people knew the gravity of our situation social order could collapse.

[OneBlueSky]

5. I believe that, too . . .

and so does Deep Shield apparently; for those who haven't yet waded through the text of the interview, here's his answer to question #11:


11. Why all the secrecy?

"Due to the severity of the situation it is mandatory to maintain public calm for as long as possible. The Earth is dying. Humanity is on the road to extinction - without the Shield mankind will die off with in 20 to 50 years. Most people alive today could live to see this extinction take place. This means that an announcement of the situation we face boils down to telling every man, woman and child on earth that they have no future, they are going to be killed. People would panic. There would be economic collapse, the production and movement of goods would collapse. Millions would die in all cities on earth, riots and violence would reduce civilian centers to rubble within days. Half of the population in dense metropolitan areas would try to leave the cities seeking 'safety' in the rural areas thinking that they would be safe. Those left behind in the cities would be at war with their neighbors, fighting for the remaining supplies. We would be telling the world that the world is coming to an end, and even with the Shield the chances of survival are small.

"UV Summer and Global Warming are the immediate problems we face, there are far greater problems that are raising their ugly heads and will present new problems which in some cases have no viable solutions at this time. Ecologies are collapsing. The extinction rate of species is climbing. The amount of chemical pollutants in the water and soil are fast approaching and in many places has surpassed the earth's ability to heal itself. Crop failure is on the rise, even in the USA the returns on crops are smaller than they were 10 years ago. Even with the advances in genetically altered food crops, we are falling behind in our ability to produce enough to go around. Throughout the 20th century chemical fertilizers and pesticides were used to insure the best yields. Unfortunately many of these have contaminated ground water, killed beneficial insects along with the undesirable insects. These chemicals have gotten into the food chain and are affected other species besides mankind. It is only a matter of years before famine spreads like a cancer throughout the world.

"Clean fresh water is in short supply, in many places well water is nonpotable, containing the run off of pesticides, herbicides and fertilizers that have been used on crops and lawns. The water treatment facilities we have are unable to scrub out all of the toxins we have placed in the soil and water supply. Many of the toxins we find build up over time in the body, a long slow poisoning which has been making its presence felt in many areas of the world in the form of cancers, leukemia, sterility, birth defects, learning disorders, immune deficiency problems, etc. These are on the rise, any good researcher can find the records. For decades there was public outcry for the end to pollution. For every small step we made to clean up our production, millions where born who added to the problem. Yes, pollution is down per individual, however there are a couple more billion individuals producing pollution, thus the real numbers have an increase in over all pollution produced. Name a city that does not have problems with smog. You would be hard pressed to find one. Though smog controls on automobiles is higher than ever before, the number of autos on the road has increased thus the amount of smog producing pollutants is higher than ever before. All the clean air acts passed to curb individual factory and auto emissions did not address the production of more factories and more autos. Here an uneasy compromise was made between the need to maintain the economy against the need to maintain the ecology. The ecology lost since it was estimated to be a problem decades from now. The economy was a problem that would have dire effects today.

"All of these factors combined have produced a scenario that in shorts boils down to the end of the world in 50 to 75 years. Even if we were to stop all emissions of pollution today, the inertia of past decades is enough to carry us over the brink in 100 years. However we cannot stop the production of pollution, to do so would mean shutting down every factory, every auto, every train, truck, ship and every household on the planet. Electricity is used to heat many homes in the Western World. The production of electricity produces fewer pollutants than heating all homes with wood or coal. Cutting our power generation abilities down to hydroelectric and fission reactors would leave a good chunk of the world in the dark. It is an impossible situation, our civilization is geared to the use of energy, take away our energy and civilization will collapse."

[ElsewheresDaughter]

7. How We're Preparing Ourselves and Our Children for Extinction

http://www.ishmael.com/welcome.cfm
http://www.ishmael.com/Education/Writings/littletrain.shtml
Address by Daniel Quinn delivered August 16, 1997, at the annual conference of the North American Association for Environmental Education, Vancouver BC

In a recent semi-documentary film called Garbage, a toxic waste disposal engineer was asked how we can stop engulfing the world in our poisons. His answer was, "We'd have to remove everybody from the face of the earth, because humans GENERATE toxic waste, whether it be pathogenic organisms that we excrete from our bodies or whatever. We are toxic to the face of the earth."
What is your gut reaction to this assessment? Please raise your hands if you agree that humans are inherently toxic.

I understand that many representatives of the First Peoples are attending this conference. I hope there are many in this audience. Please raise your hand if you belong to an aboriginal people. Thank you. Now I'd like to ask you the same question I asked the whole group a moment ago. If you consult your traditional teachings, do you agree that humans are inherently toxic to the life of this planet?

Those who know my work will know that you've just demonstrated one of my basic theses, that the people of my culture, whom I call Takers, have a fundamentally different mythology from the First Peoples, whom I call Leavers. In Taker mythology, humans are indeed viewed as inherently toxic to the world, as alien beings who were born to rule---and ultimately destroy---the world. As WE are currently ruling and destroying the world. In Leaver mythology, by contrast, the world is a sacred place, and humans are not perceived as alien to that sacred place but rather as belonging to it. In other words, in the Leaver worldview, people are no less a part of the sacred framework of the universe than scorpions or eagles or salmon or bears or daffodils. . . .

When I first proposed to speak here about how we're preparing ourselves and our children for extinction, the organizer of the conference wondered if this topic wasn't directed too exclusively to members of "our" culture---the culture I call Taker culture in my books---the dominant culture of the world, found wherever the food is under lock and key and people have to work to get it. I think it's important that you hear my answer to this question.


more

[DrWeird]

6. Here's another explanation.

[LunaSea]

8. thanks OneBlueSky

interesting read.
I'm particularly impressed with his suggestions for further
study-notably the ones (like N) which are very specific. I'd
like to know if anyone else pursues this data.

"To validate what I
say, would require a bit of research on your behalf. I would
recommend the following subjects to look up and study:
                
A. Population numbers for industrial nations and the tons of
pollutants produced annually. Start with 1975 and work your
way up.
                
B. Number of emerging Industrial Nations.
                
C. Number of cases of Skin cancers worldwide.
                
D. Crop Production vs. land area dedicated to crop production.
Simple math will show that more acreage is needed to produce
food per individual.
E. Automobile production from 1975 to present, estimated
number of autos on the road
and the average emissions of later model cars produced as
compared the emissions of earlier model cars. A little math
will show that though individual autos produce less emissions,
the amount of emissions has risen due to the number of autos
on the road.
Remember that many autos are the road that were built before
present emission control standards. 1980 is a cut off date -
anything put on the road before then produces more pollutants
than autos produced today. I would include research in the
number of diesel autos produced, diesel has not been under the
emissions control acts.
F. Severity of storms and the number of severe storms. Also
include heat waves and droughts in that research, you will
find that the numbers are staggering when compared to data
from 1950, 1960 and 1970.
G. Research how naturally occurring Ozone is produced in the
stratosphere. Compare to how it is produced industrially.
H. Research political reforms in the past 30 years, see which
political institutions have changed, which nations have joined
with whom. Concentrate more on these from 1982 onward. This
would include the fall of the Wall and Iron Curtain. 
I. Research polymers and how they are made, look at recent
research done in biological polymers, medical polymers and
filaments.
J. Check out spiders and spider web and the way spiders use
their different webs and threads.
K. Research clean fresh water estimates as compared to the
1970's to today - world wide.
L. Research the following medical conditions per capita: Birth
Defects Cancers Leukemia Immune deficiency diseases (excluding
virus borne ID illnesses such as HIV) Occurrences of Learning
disabilities, including dyslexia, ADD, and over all IQ tests
Sterility for both male and females world wide Instances of
glaucoma and cataracts.
M. Compare the history of UV indexes from 1970 to present. You
may note that it was on sharp rise until 1997-99.
N. I would strongly recommend researching the reactions of
different barium and aluminum compounds and how they are used.
Research how long it takes for these metals in pure form to
oxidize, how they combine with nitrates, carbon monoxide
carbon dioxide and fluorocarbons and hydrocarbons and water
vapor.
O. Research how mold propagates, the conditions it needs to
grow and just how abundant it is in the atmosphere.
                
               If you pursue these lines of inquiry, you will
see the Shield Project as it really is."

 

[LunaSea]

9. Anyone have numbers

on human activity vs volcanism?

[stickdog]

10. Microbes rule. (NT)

[OneBlueSky]

11. if this is true, it could explain a lot of things . . .

beyond the chemtrail phenomenon itself . . .

if those in power have scientific evidence that convinces them that the collapse of human society and the extinction of much of terrestrial life is immanent, they may actually see their apocalyptic notions more as scientific fact than religious belief . . . and if they believe that the environmental damage already done is irreversible, that could account for their abandonment of all notions of environmental protection as simply useless exercises in futility . . . hell, this might even account for the massive renovations done to the VPs residence, and the underground bunkers for government officials . . .

if these guys really see the world as coming to an end, no sense doing anything more than trying to accumulate all the wealth for themselves and their cronies and coming up with ways to survive the holocaust and start over, don't ya think? . . . even if the public doesn't panic because they don't know, that doesn't mean that those who DO know won't panic and do everything possible to give themselves an edge up . . . which may be precisely what they are doing . . .

just some rambling thoughts on a muggy Saturday night . . .

[BrotherBuzz]

12. Weird, I haven't seen a Chemtrail

Since the beginning of the buildup to the war in Iraq. Not one!

[HalfManHalfBiscuit]

13. I lie awake at night worrying about water vapor trails

Condensation - the end of the world as we know it.

[stevedeshazer]

14. Contrails, not chemtrails

They're not the same at all.

[HalfManHalfBiscuit]

15. Correct, the chemical is H2O

Water vapor is a mighty troubling substance.

[OneBlueSky]

16. kick . . . I hope more people will read this interview and comment . . .

if this guy is legit, it would explain an awful lot, from the chemtrail phenomenon to BushCo's environmental policies . . . I realize it's a long read, but it's worth the time, and I'd sure like to hear other's take on it . . .

[fabius]

18. wtf?

:wtf:

Come on! There are plenty of real conspiracies out there that we need to focus on.

[fabius]

19. PS the world really is facing severe environmental degradation

...and all the "chemtrails" in the world won't prevent it.

Getting rid of Bushco would be a big help though.

[arikara]

20. There are some good threads on chemtrails somewhere in the archives

I used to have them bookmarked but can't find them anymore since they changed the board. Does anyone have the links? We were talking about this at work today and I wanted the info for someone.

There were chemtrails over south Vancouver Island about 3 weeks ago. When they lay them here, they are obvious, a definite grid pattern. I've seen them twice now in the past year and they are really creepy. No-one can convince me that they are ordinary contrails.

on edit: fix stupid grammatical error.