Did Anyone Else Feel Proud to Be an American After Watching John Kerry?

[Composed Thinker]

Today, after I came back to my room from my first class, I watched John Kerry's official kickoff of his presidential campaign. And I can say with much certainty that I felt proud to be an American after watching that. Not only was there a very supportive group, but the speakers were tremendous. Former Sen. Max Cleland, the man shamelessly and ridiculously attacked for being unpatriotic, was terrific. He sounded so genuine. If Kerry is elected president, I hope Cleland gets some cabinet position. And the various retired military officers--including a Cheney who actually served--were also excellent. But most of all, watching John Kerry give a reasonable, fairly nuanced speech left me in such a good mood. With him, I feel like our country has a chance to go back on the right path.

If Sen. Kerry is the Democratic nominee--and since a fair number of people think it's between him, Dean, and someone else, he could very well be--I'll certainly vote for him. Or rather, it would take a lot for me not to vote for him.

[JohnKleeb]

1. I bet if I had seen it but I was at school

[Composed Thinker]

4. Well, my statistics class

just had its discussion section today. And after explaining a few things, the teaching assistant, who arrived late, let us out very early. Since my computer hasn't arrived yet and since I have about an hour and a half before my German class, I figured I'd check some stuff out at using one of my school's computers in the library.

[JohnKleeb]

7. thats cool

It was my first day so I was getting to know people and all.

[searchingforlight]

2. I am proud to be one of a group of Americans who are represented by

men like Kerry and the other candidates but I am not proud to be an American as it is represented by our administration, most of our government and the people who support their policies.

[killbotfactory]

3. The military crap turned me off...

Do they issue you a "Get one free presidency!" card when you join the military, or something?

The message I take from Kerry is "I fought in a war that was wrong and cost the lives of thousands of people because of pride, and then voted to send kids off to die in a war that was wrong, but it's all the presidents fault. Vote for me!"

[liberalhistorian]

8. Exactly!

Couldn't have said it better myself, and I also get tired of all of the military macho bullshit Kerry seems to thrive on.

[Composed Thinker]

9. I don't think that's fair

While I haven't studied the Vietnam period in detail yet, I hardly think it's fair to blame people like Kerry for fighting in it. When he went off, he wasn't making the decision to go to war. He was serving his country because his superiors, whose orders are always followed in the military, told him to do so. In the same way that I would hold no grudge against soldiers in the second Iraq war if I opposed it, I don't hold it against soldiers in Vietnam. (By the way, I still haven't made up my mind about the Iraq war.) And when he came back, after he received his medals, he bravely fought to end what he felt was a wrong war.

[killbotfactory]

14. I don't blame anyone who served in Vietnam

I just don't see how it's particularly relevent as to why he should be president. I also don't understand how, after knowing the hell of fighting in an unjust war, he could give the green light to Bush to wage an unjust war on Iraq.

[Composed Thinker]

16. Well, as far as I see it,

he didn't have any direct knowledge of whether the evidence was good. Like most congressmen who aren't directly involved with intelligence committees, he apparently went on the words and information presented by others.

[killbotfactory]

18. And according to Kerry, that information did not justify an invasion...

But he voted for it anyway.

[Composed Thinker]

19. Right, but at the time...

he didn't know that it was bad and/or manipulated, as it now appears to be.

[killbotfactory]

22. At the time he knew it didn't justify invasion...

and unless he had his fingers in his ears during the lead up to war, he should have known how manipulated the evidence was and that there was no reason to go to war when we did. How he could support Bush's actions after repeatedly saying (even today) that we should only go to war if we have to, not if we want to, after supporting a war which by his own admission was rushed, premature, and based on no secret evidence (we knew everything he did) frustrates and angers me.

[Composed Thinker]

26. But again, it doesn't seem he knew that stuff was...

probably manipulated when he voted to go to war.

[killbotfactory]

37. If he didn't think Iraq was an imminent threat, and he didn't..

and he didn't think invasion was neccessary, and he didn't, then he had no business voting for the Iraq resolution. Manipulated evidence doesn't come into it.

[Composed Thinker]

39. But he thought all of those things were there or were right...

because of the apparently manipulated evidence.

[blm]

42. This is Kerry going after the BIGGEST GOP LIE

that has hurt the Democrats electorally the most for decades...That the GOP is the stronger party on national security and military matters.

If you do not GET that, then you don't understand exactly how big our Democratic battles have been.

[gratuitous]

5. Excellent, then

I don't hold any particular brief for Kerry, but the Democrats will be well served by getting a candidate who can offset the dire predictions of the corrupt Bush administration. The Bushistas feed best off of fear, and I think a major thrust of their campaign is "Just imagine what might happen without the sure hand of George W. Bush at the helm."

The successful candidate will turn that around to say, "You don't have to imagine -- the worst terrorist attack ever on American soil happened under Bush's stewardship. Let's get a Democrat back in the White House and you and your children can rest easily once again."

I'm all for any Democratic candidate who can paint a hopeful picture for the future to offset the Republican scare tactics.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

33. He's been a good Senator

He's a straight shooter and has a very liberal voting record (right up there with Kennedy).

I'm not sure if I will vote for him in the primary. Some of this is selfish-don't want to lose him and have our Repuke governor appoint an interim Repuke Senator.

I'm still waffling on my candidate. We'll see how things pan out.

[ramapo]

6. Sounded great

I hope he keeps it up. I'll donate to his campaign if he keeps true to his word to challenge Bush* every day.

[molly]

10. I was very proud!

[Composed Thinker]

11. Wouldn't it be nice to have Sen. Kerry and

someone like Gen. Clark, both decorated military veterans, go up against two draft dodgers like Bush and Cheney?

[seventhson]

12. I am usually painfully embarassed and frankly horrifed whenever Kerry

speaks.

The richest guy in the Seante.

Proud of his war crimes

voted for the daily death and destruction of thousands of Ameriucans and Iraqis and Afghanis and the rollback and stomping on of our Constitutional rights.

Kerry makes me embarrased and ashamed to be a citizen of the same nation as he.

Preppy corporate warmongering rich boy fascist ivy leaguer just like Bush

Cringe.

Anybody but Kerry (or Bush).

[sandnsea]

21. Anybody? Like who?

Specifically who would that be? I can't think of anybody who fits your criteria. Even Kucinich voted for the Afghanistan war. Who were you planning on voting for?

[JohnKleeb]

24. Dean and Kerry have more than common on that surface than DK and Dean

Dean and Kerry- alma mater Yale, DK its not Yale somewhere in Ohio
War Crimes- I dont think Kerry committed those
preppy corporate rich boy- Dean wasnt exactly a truck driver's son he is not the biggest union and anti corporate person in the race, thats Kucinich, Edwards, or Gephardt
I think seventh supports Dean.

[Starpass]

23. seventhson---well, I guess you could be a rich boy, ivy league,

preppy, seal deals with corporations behind people's back, son of a Wall Street real big boy who got a medical deferrment??----there's all sorts of levels of hypocracy, you know.......lots and lots of levels.

[JohnKleeb]

28. As I said Dean isnt exactly Kerry's antithesis as for as backgrounds go

You want the anti thesis of Kerry seventh I think Kucinich is your man.

[ibegurpard]

29. Hey get your bashers straight!

Seventhson has been advocating, as far as I know, for a draft-Gore campaign. Typical to blame all the bashing on Dean supporters, however.

:grr:

[Coffee Coyote]

31. what shocks me

Is he didn't being up yet AGAIN the tiresome tinfoil regarding the Skull & Bones. :tinfoilhat:

[JohnKleeb]

34. heh that oh umm who are you suporting

Just saying,

[DemocratSinceBirth]

35. He's Bashing Kerry For Supporting The Afghanistan War

Gore supported it too...


The level of discourse on this board makes me dyspeptic at times...

[JohnKleeb]

38. hes a rare one

You know me DSB I am perfectly willing to support Kerry and infact hes my backup. The only thing I disagreed with Kerry was the patriot act and the IWR, other than that hes solidly liberal, and not so bbad. I do respect Kerry, I have risen on the occasion to defend him.

[Coffee Coyote]

27. thanks

I may just support him yet with ringing denunciations like that. :D

[onehandle]

13. I was. Made me also think these dark days may be numbered...

My heart swells with pride when I hear any of our fine candidates speak. This weekend I caught a few minutes of Graham on CSPAN at the Iowa Fair. He was excellent. And it's always wonderful to hear from my former Senator Max Cleland.

Next November it will be easy for me. I'll just look for the D.

[tokenlib]

15. Overkill!!

The setting was fine, Kerry has the credentials and my respect--although I don't agree with him on a few issues--and think Dean our best hope. But did Kerry really need the multitude af American flags?? His resume speaks for itself--ONE flag would have been enough. I don't mean to sound petty--but these flag choked backdrops remind me of Bush and Cheney the "emperors with no clothes" trying to legitimize themselves and to blot out their service records.

In the future Kerry can dispense with the multitude of flags. He doesn't need them to stand taller than Chimpy Bunnypants.

[Composed Thinker]

17. I wonder if he controlled that, or if that...

was the result of one of his staff members or people on the carrier.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

25. Kerry pushing it back into Bush's face

back at 'ya!!!

Bush has stepped in "it". Kerry will now make him pay. BIG TIME!

[Coffee Coyote]

30. if you want to defeat the enemy

you have to sing his song.

[Starpass]

20. There was something about a "military" background shown behind

a man who is entitled and deserves to stand in front of that background that made me feel great!!! What a comparison to that AWOL son of a bitch that swaggered and posed and sullied the carrier he walked on. A flag belongs next to Kerry---Bush uses the American flag to wipe his ass and the ass of his unholy, greedy friends. It was gooooood to hear someone use intelligent speech and who has something more than the "smoke 'em out...smoke 'em, smoke 'em" speech that the national idiot has been using over and over and over again, even if he's talking about education (think the boy smoked too many of them). It's good to see a man STAND at a podium and address people rather than a lazy, fucking, inept bastard who obbviously learned nothing from his daddy paid diplomas. It was just, plain goood.

[CWebster]

32. Not unless one equates militarism with patriotism.

No thanks.

[Composed Thinker]

40. That's not what I meant

[oasis]

36. I'm proud to be an American and claim Kerry as the leader of my party.

[otohara]

41. Proud American Until I See or Hear Bush

or DeLay, Lott, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Coulter, O'Really, Tucker Carlson, and a host of others....then I want to crawl under a rock.