are you a DU 'moderate' or a DU 'liberal'?

[UpsideDownFlag]

Poll question: are you a DU 'moderate' or a DU 'liberal'?

[Walt Starr]

1. I'm a moderate

I always answer that I'm a moderate.

[UpsideDownFlag]

2. have you ever felt an appreciable difference on DU about what a

'moderate' is, compared to other places?

[Walt Starr]

9. Everybody I know is a moderate

Even my rightwing brother in law calls himself a moderate.

:shrug:

[artv28]

11. Dean/Clark

It's interesting how the so called 'most liberal senator' is considered a moderate here. In the following order, I liked Dean, Clark, Edwards, Kerry. I also like Kucinich but knew he was too liberal to have any chance of winning. He's also too short and funny looking to be elected in a shallow country like ours.

[Razorback_Democrat]

3. I liked Wes Clark best

then when he dropped out supported Edwards

I'm a mix of moderate and liberal views

never liked Dean-something about him turns me off. don't think of him as moderate, although he governed as a moderate, his presidential campaign was aimed at the left.

only ever got warm towards Kerry

Like Hillary, but think she has no chance in 08 or probably ever.

Like her views on taking care of children.

Don't care for Lieberman, too neocon for me.

Disliked Gore in 88, then came to like him in 2000. (thought he was too conservative in 88, now he is painted as a liberal)

[ArthurDent]

4. Lumping Lieberman with Gephardt

I don't get it. Gephardt is Mr. Champion of Labor. Lieberman isn't. Why them together?

[MarianJack]

5. I'm a Radical Moderate who has been...

...pushed to the left by the worst president in U.S. history.

[HuskerDem]

14. That is just about the coolest statement I have read for months

on DU. :thumbsup: It comes close to me, I think.

[MarianJack]

39. Thanks, HuskerDem!

Are you by any chance from Nebraska? If so you and I are in the 2 states that divide their electoral votes!

[RUDUing2]

6. personally I liked Kuc best and agreed with him the most..but I didn't and

dont think he has a chance in hell of ever being elected...

I supported Clark for the party nomination because I thought and still think he had the best chance to defeat bushie boy....

[Minstrel Boy]

7. I've never liked the word "liberal."

It's much too squishy.

And "liberal" has little bearing on what one makes of 9/11. That's a whole other paradigm.

To cover both those bases, I'd describe myself as a democratic socialist whose critique is informed by Peter Dale Scott's model of "Deep Politics."

[sui generis]

8. I'm an extremist

I'm for making "social conservatism" or any other form of political rationale that involves restricting human and civil rights ILLEGAL.

the topic is, how do you prevent social conservatives and religious bigots from turning America into Afghanistan Lite.

Twok amongst yaselves.

[deutsey]

10. I'm on the Left, but don't fit any of your categorizations.

[Forkboy]

13. Same here....badly worded choices

[melnjones]

12. Wes Clark all the way! nt

[chaska]

15. I second that, clark all the way. DK: Right message, WAY wrong messenger.

[Hippo_Tron]

17. Not really wrong messenger, message that America isn't ready for...

DK's just as good as anybody to deliver the message, America isn't really ready to hear it.

[xultar]

38. I loved the poll and how the options were phrased kind of a push poll

rotflmao!!!

[Hippo_Tron]

16. I liked DK, Dean, Kerry, and Clark

I consider myself liberal. I agree with a lot of what DK says but I never supported his candidacy because I know that America isn't quite ready for it. I liked Dean but I was never a Deaniac, he just didn't appeal to me for some reason. I was torn between Kerry or Clark in the end. Lieberman and Gephardt didn't really appeal to me.

[realisticphish]

19. i agree about kuchy

i will support him locally as much as possible, but theres no way he will win a presidency in this culture at the moment


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[realisticphish]

18. Um

im all liberal except that i am as of yet convinced of mihop/lihop


:hippie: The Incorrigible Democrat

[intheflow]

20. I'm mixed.

Loved Kucinich's dedication to peace, but thought that made him unelectable.

Loved Dean's passion, but thought that made him unelectable.

Lived most of my adult life with Kerry as my senator and enjoyed (and benefited from) living in a solidly blue state. Figured he was the most electable out of the three.

So am I a moderate or a liberal? I think I'm a pragmatic liberal.

[Piperay]

21. Moderate

or some kind of mix. My choice was Clark but I like Dean too, still I voted for Kucinich in the CA primary because Clark and Dean were out and I didn't want to vote for Kerry.

[Mike Niendorff]

22. none of the above

I like Dean's approach and his no-bullshit style, but he's definitely far more centrist than his critics like to portray him as being. As for Kucinich, I like his fire and his consistency, and am impressed by his willingness to take harder-to-sell positions that happen to be right. But there are still areas where I consider him too mainstream, within the context of the constituency he's appealing to. I'd like to see him rock the boat a little more on his own side, too, as Dean has shown a willingness to do. Shake people out of the ruts in their thinking, and don't let sloppy reasoning and partisan schtick pass simply on their inertia. Still, both he and Dean are a HUGE step in the right direction. I'm just very concerned that this step may be too little, too late.

As to 9/11, Bush and Ashcroft had *substantially* more forewarning than they have ever admitted to publically, and they not only chose not to act on that information, they attempted to prevent OTHERS from acting on it. They then subsequently tried to roadblock the investigation of these and other matters. That much is not a matter of opinion, it is a matter of provable fact. Call it lihip, mihop or whatever you like, it simply is what it is.

There's probably more I could say, but it doesn't really matter at this point. I'm 110% against Bush and his crowd, and that's the only label that really matters today.


MDN

[Columbia]

23. Labels are for canned food

[Harlan James]

24. I'm A Democrat

And that's pretty much all that matters. I'll leave the fashion show to those who seem to care about such things.

[MrModerate]

29. Yes and no . . .

My impression of the subtext here is "who do we think will represent our values AND win elections."

I always felt that Kerry and Edwards, while self-tarred with the "voted for Iraq" brush, represented an interlocking compendium of values that centered about the same place I center. DK has some fine ideas, wrapped up with a smell of weirdness that makes him unelectable. Dean handed the RW/media opposition a rope which they obligingly hanged him with, but he can come back older and wiser next time around. Can't take Hillary seriously because when I think of her I have to think of Bill, and she's not half the man he is (wink-wink). Lieberman/Gebhardt -- regardless of their positions (poles apart, apparently) are tired old pols and unelectable in their own rights, as they've proved multiple times.

But I have no opposition to labels, intelligently applied. The "labels are useless" crowd never, apparently, tried to sell anything to anyone, or needed to convince someone, or even had to explain a new concept to someone. Labels are Really Useful Things and inherent to the way humans think. If one is too snooty to acknowledge the power of labels, well they're probably too snooty period.

[Harlan James]

33. My Dear Mr. Moderate

Hope this doesn't prove too snooty for you, but I have always found the so-called debate regarding who is liberal and who is moderate to be fairly negative and rather ridiculous. One of the chronic problems that continues to plague our party is this nonsensical argument over who within our organization truly occupies the moral highground.

Such unneccessary divisiveness in the end the only serves the cause of the Republicans.

The worst Democrat is invariably better than the best Republican. In the face of the reactionary threat posed by Bush and those who handle him, the divisions within our party are trivial.

And besides, i wouldn't put too much faith in labels if I were you. Sometimes they look real pretty and all, but when you open the can all you find is shit.

[MrModerate]

36. By shit, I think you mean . . .

Homogenized excreta-based fructification spread -- but let's not get too hung up on labels.

I find myself agreeing with the end of your statements, but not the fronts. An example: "The worst democrat is invariably better than the best Republican..." followed by "the divisions within our party are trivial."

Human beings are too fallible for the first sentence -- there are plenty of monsters in dem clothing (or just creeps: take Gary Condit -- please), and some sincere legislators who happen to disagree with how our lives should be lived, and wear an elephant in their lapel.

However, the second sentence is the winner. Divisions are not just trivial, but intrinsic, and an intrinsic good at that. We are the party of inclusion, of the big tent, brought together by the unifying principles of acceptance of one another, support for one another, and comfort with one another's choices. The republican coin is intolerance.

I don't even let the splitters here on DU get me down, because we've been given the inestimable gift of the worst.president.ever to focus our energies on. Even if we stand in different places in the big tent, I think we still know who the bad guys are.

Usually it ain't so easy, and the fissures (tears in the tent, if you will) are a problem.

We "lost" this election not because of labeling each other as insufficiently true to the core principles of our party but because the Repubs were more efficient in getting their troops out that we thought the'd be; they own enough of the electoral mechanism to twist it to their needs; and where necessary they just plain stole votes. We can't let them do it again, but I'm not overly worried that we'll label ourselves into irrelevance.

[Dzimbowicz]

25. I'm just a plain ol' Democrat

and have been one since the beginning.

[SCDem]

26. Sounds like you're a Yellow Dog!

[Dzimbowicz]

27. Howdy SCDem !

Are you all moved in yet?

:hi:

[Darranar]

28. DU liberal - but I'm not convinced by LIHOP or MIHOP. n/t

[MrModerate]

30. I suffer from AFD . . .

(Acronym Forgetfulness Disorder) What are LIHOP/MIHOP?

[Darranar]

34. Let It Happen On Purpose and Made It Happen On Purpose...

in regard to Bush's participation or lack of participation in the 9/11/01 terrorist attacks.

[xchrom]

31. i'm a socialist

who votes for democrats -- and i make no bones about it.
and i certainly fall in the 00 theft and lihop camp.

[gorbal]

32. I am between the first two...

I voted for the first because I am very liberal...perhaps I should have voted for the second because I voted for Dean, I dunno. I just preferred Dean becasue I know he gets things done. People I know in Vermont love him.

[welshTerrier2]

35. i'm a socialist too ...

the Democratic Party will not regain its majority until it does a better job valuing workers over their corporate overlords ... and valuing earned income over investor income ... Democrats have been successfully branded as a party of "giveaways" to the poor ... the policy is right; the PR implications are not ... Democrats could significantly strengthen their position by doing a better job fighting for workers' rights ...

in the past, unions had all sorts of image problems and rightly so ... but we've thrown the baby out with the bath water ...

btw, on another topic, is there really any difference between lihop and mihop ??? i'm not all that sure there is ...

[AmerDem]

37. no vote from me, bad description of moderate.

I don't agree with the way you outlined moderate. I think a more accurate description of Moderate in the Dem. party would be those of us that support Wes Clark. Clark is very liberal on social issues but holds conservative ideals on most economic issues and defense.