Is Anyone Else Getting Really Leary of the Medical Profession?

[MaryH]

Do we really need all of those expensive, really intrusive tests?

Can you trust any of the drugs that are out there?

Can you be perfectly healthy and end up sick or dead?

I hate to admit this - but I'm afraid to go see doctors any more. As long as I'm healthy I think I will just go my own way.

[evil genius]

1. you have to be discerning.

ask for the old proven off-patent drugs. They work, they're cheaper and they don't kill you.

[Warpy]

10. Good advice

and advice I follow myself, and I'm part of the medical profession.

The people in the profession you really have to watch out there are the ones who aren't actually delivering care, the administrators who are trying to wring profit out of what should be at the very least a nonprofit system and the hucksters who are trying to sell you nostrums you don't need in TV commercials.

[ender]

16. the worst are insurance and drug co's.

in general, doctors and nurses, and all related care-givers have the patients best interest in mind.

its the drug companies, and the insurance companies that scare the bejeezus otu of me.

[Rockerdem]

52. The biggest problem with the medical profession are the patients

Too many patients think that medicine is an exact science like math or physics. IT'S NOT. It's somewhere between them and an art, with a little luck thrown in for good measure.

There are so many ailments that have the same symptoms and sometimes it takes many "intrusive" tests to narrow it down. On top of that, not every ailment has been fully researched (like diabetes, duh). Perfection, if it ever comes, is at least 75-100 years away.

Put yourself in a doctor's situation: you're in a profession that precludes perfection, yet your livelihood is in risk by the inexact nature of it. So, you cover . . . your . . . ass. What other rational person wouldn't, given that drastic incentive?

Sure, you're all Mother Teresas, lol.

[Melodybe]

28. I trust my doctor, but he is awesome

[quispquake]

2. It's a business...for the most part they want to keep you sick...

That way they keep you coming back...

No AIDS vaccine, but LOTS of expensive drugs to keep you alive...
Boner pills galore...but the common cold is still there!!!

I have grave doubts about the MAJORITY of the medical establishment (although I know there are great doctors & people in the med field out there...my doctor rocks!!!).

[RobertSeattle]

3. I'd wait 5 to 10 years on some of the "new" pills

Let's someone else be the guinea pig. There is just so much money in pharmaceuticals that good ethical testing is getting compromised - Celebrex is only the most recent pill that may do more harm than good for some people.

They should ban "kickbacks" to doctors from the pill industry.

[Walt Starr]

4. The only time I ever see a physician

is in the emergency room.

The first time I had a kidney stone, it was lodged at the tip of my urethra for over 36 hours before I finally broke down and went to the hospital.

[AngryOldDem]

17. Sounds like me (except for the kidney stone part)

I have to be practically dead before I see a doctor. Even then I usually go to an urgent care place, where I get treated for my symptoms and sent on my way. I do have a GP because I had to have a doctor for insurance coverage, but I've seen the man only twice -- I get the impression that he is one of those types who wants to do every kind of medical test on you for no good reason, and is an alarmist to boot. Example: I saw him a few weeks back for a bad sinus infection (one of those rare times when I could not stand to suffer any longer), and all he wanted to talk about my getting a colonoscopy.
Spent more time on that than he did my sinuses. I would have been pissed if I hadn't been so damn miserable. Just one example of the many reasons why I am not particularly fond of doctors.

[Betty]

5. I almost never go to the doctor

and I get shit from people for admitting that, but I feel the same way, I think that as long as I feel good, and take care of myself, I am better off staying away. I think they medicate people way too much... and with all the ads on TV, I think some people get convinced that they can't live a healty life without being medicated. I work with kids and have seen a (small) number of them put on meds because their parents don't want to deal with their behavior, and I wonder if the drugs are really neccesary. In some cases I am sure it is but I am suspicious about some that I have seen.

[Dora]

6. Snake oil hucksters

Modern "medicine" is a joke.

Medicine is no longer a calling or a cause, but an industry. And like all industries, it demands profit over everything else. They'll sell us anything if we'll buy it. They don't give a crap about our health, only about our "symptoms."

[Mandate My Ass]

7. Most people I know have trouble getting thorough testing

intrusive or not. I'm required to get a referral anytime I need even a simple test performed and the hours at the capitated site are very restrictive and appointment dates way in the future. More intrusive tests are even harder to get. The problem is with the inurance companies tying MD's hands, IMHO.

I know my doctor is sick of it and he doesn't hesitate to say so.

[babylonsister]

19. That's my problem, too.

Situations that might require further testing aren't addressed, probably due to my insurance limitations.

[Nikia]

44. I've had trouble getting tests through my HMO

The usual way of doing things at my required clinic is for the doctor to prescribed a drug that treats your symptoms or the condition that you are most likely to have based upon your age, sex, and medical history. If it doesn't work or have serious side effects, they prescribed you a couple different drugs that also work. They may do some simple blood work right away or after a round or two of pharmocopia roulette. They see no need to do invasive testing if you are young and have decent vitals because those would be too expenisive. After about a year of treatment or if your condition takes a serious turn for the worse, they will then do an invasive test.

[sendero]

8. My hard learned lessons include...

... don't assume that your doctor is some god-like genius, many of them are just not that bright.

If my doctor makes a diagnosis, I go home first thing and read medical literature and anecdotal information on the net and see if I concur.

I don't take any prescription medication until I've read the PDR pages and believe that the medication prescribed will actually do some real good, not just mask some symptoms.

There are lots of good doctors out there, I have one. My experience is that younger doctors are better because they weren't trained with the "you are god" mentality that older doctors were trained with.

If your doctor does not leave you with a helpful feeling, if he gives you 10 seconds to talk and then starts writing a prescription, dump his ass quick :)

[LeftCoast]

9. I'm just entering the medical profession

I'm a student nurse and regarding drugs, we (nurses) recommend that you are neither the first to take a new drug, nor the last to take an old drug.

There is a perception in this country that doctors just wave a magic scalpel and people are cured. The fact is, EVERY surgery has risks and any effective drug will have side-effects. You must always way the risks and the benefits of any medical procedure or drug. If your doctor or nurse will not explain these risks it's time to go someplace else for your medical care.

Be healthy,

LeftCoast

[DU9598]

12. Doctors are pawns

They have been brainwashed by the republican party and the chamber of commerce. They are tools of big business, and paid handsomely in return.

[LeftCoast]

13. Every single one, eh?

Hmm! Who knew?!?

[Walt Starr]

25. Not every single one, but enough that I won't trust any of 'em! n/t

[LeftCoast]

30. You don't go to doctors?

I'm confused.

[Walt Starr]

47. Not unless I'm on death's door

and then reluctantly.

[LiberalinNC]

11. As a breast cancer suvivor...

I have to say that I trust my doctor's 100% - that being said, I have run into some real jerks who wanted me to try some new experimental drugs for the cancer, thankfully I didn't take their advice. When I moved up to NC, I saw my new doctor at Duke Medical Center, who told me that if I would have taken the experimental drugs it wouldn't be the cancer that would have killed me, but those experimental drugs would have.

Unfortunately every profession has their weirdo's, my best advice to anyone who is sick, or newly diagnosed is to get as many opinions you can afford or that your insurance will cover. AND if you don't like a certain doctor, than DON'T use them, find one you like!

[Bridget Burke]

14. No. But the "Medical Industry" can't be trusted.

I get the recommended checkups & get help when necessary. My last problem was a broken fibula; somehow, I don't think herb tea & vitamin C would have cured it.

You're responsible for your own health but sometimes a professional is needed. Do your homework & ask questions; doctors are human & good ones should be able to communicate. I'd hesitate about taking any drug advertised on TV & am not on any regular medication.

Quite a few doctors are sick of HMO's & insurance companies.

[Caution]

15. no. this stuff is just another attempt by the fundies to undermine science

I really dont see why people buy into this stuff. Remermber this when you read the news or the papers. One sensational story does not prove the rule. For every one person who has a terrible, adverse reaction to treatment there are thousands whose lives are saved.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

18. The issue isn't so much with the medical field but with the revolving door

between the FDA and drug companies. Many of these new drugs CAN be promising, but the industry hacks that are at the FDA hide crucial information from practicing docs that can affect their descisions. That is exactly what happened with Rezulin. Treating docs on the frontlines were assured of its safety and needed a drug for the diabetes patient that was uncontrolled or poorly controlled with the usual glucophage/glypizide/glyburide routine...instead their patients died of liver failure DIRECTLY because of poor oversight via the FDA heads who KNEW the problems.

[Skidmore]

21. A related issue is that the physicians are only too willing

to take expensive gifts and trips from the pharmaceutical companies. Every morning when I walk through the lobby, the pharmasales people are there in groups, all dressed in snappy black suits, and hauling in free food and brochures about seminars in exotic resorts.

[Cleita]

24. What about all those commercials for drugs you don't really need?

I mean there are so many commercials and some of the new drugs aren't any better than the old ones. The worst part is that old people like us are paying high prices for drugs that we can't do without so they can market commercials for drugs for sexual disfunction and adult ADD. For fairly young, healthy people sometimes drugs can create a medical condition where there wasn't one at one time.

But they want this market of young people, who still have jobs, and can afford riduculous prices for expensive drugs that may be even dangerous. I am really disgusted with how this is all developing. I feel like they are trying to drug the younger, healthier population with Soma ("Brave New World") so no one complains about what is happening to them.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

27. a gram is better than a damn

btw..how's hubby?

[Cleita]

34. Oh, he had a bleeding ulcer we didn't know about.

They pumped his stomach, but he lost a lot of blood, so they had to give him two units of blood and pills that he doesn't want to take. He is getting very frail though. Says hi to you. :-)

[Dr Ron]

42. I hate direct to consumer advetising

I've always considered drug company advertising/promotions a pain, but particularly dislike direct to consumer advertising.

All other things being equal, I tend to avoid prescribing the medications most heavily advertised by the drug companies. Patients have enough misconceptions. We don't need them coming in asking for specific drugs because of a commercial they've seen or a mailing they received. Plus, for obvious reasons, the advertised medications are the newest and most expensive. Sometimes the new drug is better, but often it isn't.

[idiosyncratic]

20. Don't get something like chronic Lyme disease

or any other disease that the AMA doesn't believe in.

I didn't believe a real disease, caused by a bacteria, could be political or controversial, but this one is.

Doctors who treat chronic Lyme disease patients in a way that is therapeutic and helpful have been brought before Medical Boards and have had their licenses taken away.


I don't trust the medical profession at all.

Finding a real doctor is very, very difficult. Google Lyme literate doctor if you want to read about the struggle chronically-ill people go through. :cry:

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

23. The docs that write the AMA guides are fucking asshats

That's why people suffered so long with Guillaine Barre symptoms...they are republican asswipes that have never done a day of manual labor in their life pretending they KNOW what it means to be impaired

[idiosyncratic]

36. And look how long it took them to believe ulcers were bacteria caused.

I have also read about people with Crohnes Disease being successfully treated with a cocktail of antibiotics instead of surgery to remove portions of their intestines.

The antibiotic treatment doesn't create as much revenue as the surgeries. :cry:

[indigobusiness]

22. 'Western Medicine' has become a meat grinder.

Great with trauma, though.

[illflem]

29. You've got to be leery

of any profession that says they "practicing" their trade.
I'm 60, last time I saw a doctor was in Vietnam in 1966.
Don't plan on going again except for an autopsy.

Most of the folks I know in my age group are so strung out on meds whose side effect are worse than the disease it's pathetic.

[indigobusiness]

33. Been leery so long I'm bleary.

I'm with you.

[ip568]

26. Before

wEL, I WAS getting suspishus until theY gave me a loboTomee by accident when i went In fOr catarc surGuree.

[napi21]

31. I agree with all of you on some things and none of you on all of them.

The public has some responsibility too. The Drs order all the test now to CYA in case of a law suit. I've even offered a written statement that I won't sure them, but to no avail. I well remember the days when we all just went to a GP, he listened to your complaint, took your BP, looked at your throat, checked your heart rate, and most of the time made his diagnosis. Many times, the prescription he recommended was given to you from his samples. My GP delivered both my babies, and when the one time occurred when he believed I needed to see a specialist, there was no hesitation to do so.

Something has caused Americans to seek the courts for every damn thing these days. I don't know what it was, or how to change it, but I think we need a radical mindset change in this country! Yes, there is sometimes negligence, or incompetence, but far more times there is not. Somehow, we need to convince people that it's just wrong to attempt to find fault where there is none, and without setting caps on settlements, we need to instill some common sense back into everything!

[musiclawyer]

32. Basically western medicine is no good for chronic conditions

Doctor's are not trained to teach you how to eat, eaercise, and de-stess--the very things that will keep you from seeng them. If you already have a chronic condition go to an alternative practitioner. YOu'll be far better off becauase they seek to rid the cause and not simply treat the symptoms with drugs. I'll give my example: I had chronic indigestion a one point. Developed a problem with gluten that I never had before too. Regular doctor just gives me antacids and helps me out the door. That was the end of my relationship with him. Went to see a MD alternative practicioner who talked to me for an hour. He thought I had "candida", something regular doctors don't even regognize. A few months later after dietary changes, particular antifungal herbs aand oils, and a liver flush, I was like new. I can even have bread once and a while with no problems. Regular doctor would have fucked me up forever.

[Nikia]

45. I'm thinking about that

I've had digestive problems for the past several months. The doctor is calling it ibs, but admits that he did see some minor colitis from the biopsies during a colonoscopy which puzzled him. I had lots of different blood tests too. All the medicines prescribed either didn't work at all or gave me intolerable side effects. I asked about diet and he only said that I should eat as much as possible since I lost around 20 pounds. I don't see how diet couldn't be an issue.

[Dr Ron]

35. BS

Those expensive tests are helpful for one thing--keeping people alive.

Same with the drugs (despite a handful of well publicized problems).

It is easy to think when you are healthy that this is not necessary. What most people don't realize is that the chronic medical problems which kill most people laterin life are best treated early, before most people realize they even have a problem.

I can keep people off dialysis, or reduce their chances of getting a heart attack or stroke, if I start treating them when their sugars and blood pressure are only slightly elevated (or preferably still normal) as opposed to the more common situation of seeing them for the first time after they've been running around with uncontrolled sugars and/or blood pressures for years (but feeling perfectly healthy)

[Cleita]

37. So what do you think of overcharging people for

the drugs they have to have, in order to make a lot of stockholders really rich?

[Dr Ron]

38. Different Profession

The thread was started about the Medical Profession.

Your comment is on the Pharmaceutical industry. Those of us in the medical profession have no control over what the pharmaceutical industry does. We spend quite a lot of time (unpaid) trying to get patients medications they cannot afford.

[Cleita]

41. Not really.

The whole system is tied up in corporate for-profit BS at the expense of those who really need medical care and drugs. I, incidentally, agree with you about screening with testing. I also believe that if everyone got themselves a little electronic blood pressure machine they could save themselves a lot of health problems down the line.

My real question that I was attempting to tease out of you is what do you think of National Health Care along the lines of the Canadian system?

[Dr Ron]

46. Not a simple question

The medical profession and pharmaceutical are distinct fields, despite their obvious overlaps. I certainly don't benefit from the profits of the pharmaceutical industry. Rather than being of benfit to me, their profits (and the prices which bring this about) are a real headache for me.

As for your next question, first of all, Candada is single payer, but not a national health system as in the British model.

As for single payer, the economic logic favors it. For example, on average overhead is four times higher under private insurance than Medicare. However, it is time we adopt one viewpoint of the right--skepticism of big government (now that the Republicans are so firmly in control).

While on an economic level single payer makes more sense, I fear having all such decisions made by a GOP dominated government. They would have no qualms about denying care so that they could have more money to pay on warfare. I think we are best off with a hybrid system, with the private sector giving a comparison to keep government honest. That's why I went for Kerry's proposals. I also like the idea of allowing people to buy into Medicare at age 55 as an experiment, with many people suggesting "Medicare for all" as ultimatley the way to go to a system of universal health care.

[Cleita]

48. You're right about the GOP being in charge to muck up

the works. My husband and I are already feeling the effects of the Medicare Prescription drug plan, courtesy of Bush and his advisors from the fourth circle of Hell.

I was referring to a single payer system much like the one proposed by the Physicians for a National Health Plan. Medicare for all could be workable as second best. This would keep the insurance companies in it for awhile as medi-gap providers.

Medicaid would have to pick up the slack for those who don't have jobs or can't afford medigap policies. Since that would be most of the sick and old people who need medical care, it could pave the way for kicking them out altogether in a decade or so. One can hope, anyway.

I do know that the health care providers like yourself are being screwed by our present system too, not just the patients.

[TX-RAT]

39. Yes and NO

Just recently had a single bypass. Had a great doctor, he's also a close friend.
Wife is a nurse, at a nursing home.
The story's i hear about the homes and doctors filing false claims against Medicare, will infuriate you. One local doctors on trial now on 54 counts of insurance fraud. Another recently received ten years, but some how made it to Pakistan before sentencing.

[KharmaTrain]

40. Medical Professions Or Insurance Companies?

A big difference and one rarely talked about. It's the insurance companies overall mission to make profits that are the real engine that drives higher health cost prices. They determine what the costs are now and when things get outside their comfortable profit range they either raise rates, cut benefits or get government subsidies. Not a bad racquet and the GOOP lives with it far thicker than the Democrats do with the trial lawyers (ABA) and doctors (AMA).

These people set up the test you refer to as another "judge" if you are worthy of the coverage you've paid for. If the tests show your problem costs too much for your coverage, they'll have you take another test until things balance, or they cut benefits or drop your policy. There's virtually no accountability for this industry and they're gonna get more from this regime's latest fleecing of social services and the treasury.

[sarcasmo]

43. Doctors getting kick backs to push new drugs.

When it comes to the medical system Canada has us beat hands down. Our doctors get kickback IE.. trips, or money to push drug companies drugs. Half of America is on some sort of prescription drug because the new age Doctors quick fix is to put you on a drug to fix your problem. How many kids do you know on mood altering drugs for ADD Adults on Zoloft, Zanex. The Country's health care is out of control and the Doctors and companies like Pfizer are the ones raking in the cash. I have yet to find a Doctor with a good bed side manner. They get you in and get you out like Mickey D's, looking to be the first one with a Billion served. Canada has it's flaws with it's health care, but hey,at least everyone has health care.

[Dr Ron]

49. Kickbacks illegal

While I'm sure it still goes on to some degree, it is now illegal for durg companies to use money/trips etc to bribe doctors.

Pediatrics is out of my field, so I won't comment on the number of kids on drugs. Otherwise I don't find statistics about half of Americans being on drugs to be meaningful.

Keep in mind that I do not see a representative sample of Americans, but of those I do see the problem is more often insufficient medication rather than too much medications. I see far too many people with heart disease who aren't on statins and beta blockers, hypertensives who aren't on enough drugs to normalize their pressure, diabetics who aren' t on enough drugs to control their sugar, etc.

I have no idea what percentage of people should be on drugs. I see it as a problem both when people are on drugs they don't need and when they are not on drugs which they would benefit from. Again, I personally see far more cases of people not being on enough drugs, but this is from a sample which likely is not typical of the entire country.

[6000eliot]

50. Tools of the pharmaceutical industry

The doctors at the clinic I go to push a prescription for every complaint. I'm not buying.

[geniph]

51. Most doctors are good mechanics -

they're good at fixing a broken bone or administering a known solution to a known problem. Most are horrible diagnosticians and sloppy scientists (that's obviously not true of all). Many are so pressed for time that they spend no time with their patients at all - they are writing on the prescription pad as they walk in the door. "Here, take a pill and go away and stop bothering me."

Expecting doctors to fix problems or cure diseases whose causes are not well understood - or which are misdiagnosed - is expecting a mechanic to fix your car in the dark, without ever having seen that model of engine before, and without being allowed to run the engine.

People have too much faith in the efficacy of doctors and medicines. Most is a crapshoot. You're better off with a lot of problems trusting to your body's own ability to heal itself. Now, obviously, that's not true when there's a problem whose cause is obvious and whose solution is known (a broken bone, a case of gonorrhea). The problem comes with people coming in with bizarro symptoms, half of which they don't have time to communicate to the doctor in their five-minute appointment block (and which most people don't communicate clearly anyway) and expecting the doctor to give them a magic pill to make everything better instantly, with no action required on their part. Successful medical care is every bit as much the patient's responsibility as the doctor's.

That being said, I DO have a lot of faith in nurse practitioners. I think they're better diagnosticians than most doctors - they see more people and spend a lot more time with them.

[skygazer]

53. You have to be pro active and educate yourself

If a doctor prescribes a medicine, ask what it is for, ask about side effects, ask about long term complications, ask whether it will cure the problem or simply control it, ask if it will adversely interact with any other medications.

If a doctor prescribes tests, find out why, what they are for, what he/she is looking for and whether or not he/she has reason to feel you are at risk for such a thing.

If a doctor advises surgery, get a second opinion, discuss what other options may be available, find out exactly what the surgery entails, how long it takes, what the risks are, what the benefits are, what the rate of success is, how long the recovery period will be.

Doctors are not magicians and they can't be expected to know everything about their patients. It's up to patients as well to be as involved as possible in medical decisions. Ultimately, it's their life and their body.

And of course you can be seemingly healthy and drop dead of something but avoiding doctors is not the way to avoid sickness. Doctors don't make you sick.

And of course, there are doctors out there who are not the greatest. I've had problems with docs in the past but that's why you need to be pro active.

[Medium Baby Jesus]

54. I long for the days when

Life expectancy was 40 years, a large percentage of women died during childbirth and a large majority of children died before adulthood.

:eyes: