Have fundie right wingers impacted your view of christmas?

[FM Arouet666]

I generally regard christmas as a break in the regular work cycle, but little else. As an atheist, I pay little attention to the whole holiday. This year is different, I have become much more conscious of my disdain for fundamentalism and the activist christian agenda.

For example, I walked past the salvation army pot, sorry no donation. Before this years election, I probably would have thrown in a few coins without thinking. I did donate, but only to secular institutions and, or course, DU.

Happy Holidays vs MC, I consciously said Happy Holidays to everyone. Last year, I would have said MC without much thought. The wing-nuts have made it an issue. Interestingly, I worked today, and interacted with Jews, Muslims, Hindus and Christians. Except for the christians, all said Happy Holidays. I realize that today is christmas, but why assume that I celebrate?

No tree, no celebration, no christmas eve dinner, and no exchange of presents. Years before, I would acknowledge the season, but now it just reminds me of extremism, intolerance, and ignorance.

I don't wish to deny those who do celebrate, in fact, that is why I work on this day. My office is mostly christian or catholic and I really don't mind working to give them the time off.

Any thoughts, Oh and do have a Happy Holiday:evilgrin:

[The Zanti Regent]

1. They killed my only child.

I've got an empty chair in my apartment. My only child is dead after being brainwashed by the Jesusistas. He listened to liars like Dan Rather and 19th Century Fox who linked 911 to Iraq. Just out of high school, he went into the military to get even for 911. I pleaded with him not to go, his mind was infected with bible thumping preachers.

He now resides in the VA Cemetary.

All I see from Christians is an unending stream of hate and bigotry.

[amazona]

10. I am so sorry

I can't imagine the terrible grief you must feel.

All Christians and all who celebrate Christmas are not about hate. Unfortunately the noisy few try to spoil it for all.

I don't know what to say except that I know I'm not the only one thinking of you and hoping we can change this world for the better.

[Maat]

15. Zanti Regent - I'm so sorry.

I know that this will not be enough. We will remember your son as a courageous, dedicated human being.

May his energy protect you and comfort you (albeit from afar)!

We can change this world for the better. And I will think of your son and his sacrifice every time I work for peace.

You are connected with all of the good hearts on DU. Let thoughts of others that don't help you just pass quickly.

Peace - we will make it happen (with our strong consciousness).

[FM Arouet666]

11. I have no words

I am just sick with reading your post. Your loss is beyond anything I can imagine. You have my sympathies and my thoughts. Peace

[NightTrain]

17. Damn.

I'm so sorry, for you and for the 1,300 other American families who have lost their precious sons and daughters to Bush's lie.

Just four days ago, a 21-year-old reservist from my hometown was buried in a cemetery not five miles from where I live. He was killed during an explosion in Baghdad two weeks to the day before Christmas. I can well imagine what it must be like at his family's house today. :cry:

GODDAMN GEORGE W. BUSH'S SOUL TO HELL!!!!! :mad::nuke:

[lectrobyte]

20. I'm so sorry for your loss.

[American Tragedy]

28. God, I'm sorry Zanti. That really puts things into perspective.

:cry:

This Christmas, I and my family will be thinking about you and others who similarly grieve.

Although I am not especially religious, I promise you that not all Christians are as you describe. My grandparents and parents and other relatives are Catholic, and they all opposed this war from the very beginning, and voted both times to get this creep out of office. My friend's Presbyterian minister spoke out very courageously against the war. There are many Christians who are fine people; unfortunately they are drowned out by the modern Pharisees in our midst.

I am grateful that you shared your pain with us, though, because it reminds me that we here cannot afford to give up. If you and others like you do not express your discontent, this cycle of violence will never end.

[Pithy Cherub]

32. My deepest and most profound sympathy for such a tragic loss.

There are no words to do justice to your loss. I am so very sorry.

My beliefs are my own and hypocritcal fundies first need shame to understand how they have negatively impacted people by being purists in their own minds.

[DBoon]

2. Christmas is really a pagan holiday to me

So the tree is cool, so is the gift exchange.

Consider the famous people born on December 25:

http://www.who2.com/birthday/25december.html

Isaac Netwon, Dido, Jimmy Buffet....


Wait, is that Karl Rove on the list?

On second thought, you are right about ignoring December 25.

Have a merry Saturnalia!

[FM Arouet666]

7. Saturnalia!? I am curious...tell me more n/t

[pnutchuck]

8. Great sig!! n/t

[InvisibleBallots]

3. looks like the GOP culture war is working

Republicans wanted to claim Christianity - the religion and culture of 80% of Americans - for themselves. Now, they want to claim the holiday of Christmas - cherished and celebrated by the vast majority of Americans, including plenty of non-Christians - for themselves.

It would be hard to do this, with so many Christian Democrats and all the Democrats who celebrate Christmas. Fortunately for Republicans, plenty of Democrats seem to want to help them.

[Royal Observer]

13. If we surrender Christmas and the flag to them;

what else will be left to give them? Motherhood and apple pie?

[Piperay]

18. True and

I think they are already trying to take those last two also. :-(

[Royal Observer]

21. They can't take them

but we sure as Hell can give them away.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

4. Like you, I felt this year was different

My family is Christian, but my husband and I are not. I always donate a bit to the Salvation Army but it is in memory of a great-uncle who devoted his life to work with the poor and destitute via that institution. I've felt a pall over the holiday as I saw people struggling to have money to get presents, and people worrying about loved ones over in Iraq. I have not seen anyone smiling or gloating over Bush's election-I'm talking about physically seeing a person, not the internet. I have a feeling of impending doom as we approach 2005.

[Delarage]

5. No. Fuck them.

It just reminds me how far away from true Christianity they have strayed. They are truly Pharisees (all show, selective interpretations of the Bible, hypocrites).

[pnutchuck]

6. I'm a Buddhist, but also have become more aware of MC

My family celebrates, but I don't. They continue to buy me presents even at my refusals. My boyfriend is half Jewish but doesn't celebrate Channuka. I too used to say HH and MC without much thought, just the feeling of a common bond among mankind at this particular time of year. However, I have become more disenchanted by this "spirit" as I feel it has blinded many into irrational thoughts of "Christianity is better" and "our way or the high way". I know not all Christians think like this, but I feel disenfranchised now with the Bush Admin "mandate" and zealot jargon. It's as if Bush is the king of the zealots and us serfs should feel priviledged enough to be allowed to exist. I am thankful that I am not an Iraqi or any other person that resides in a country that he covets.

[amazona]

9. No. They have stolen my flag

They will not steal my Christmas.

[MissBrooks]

12. I feel very sorry for you.

You sound very sad and lonely.

I am also an atheist but take the time during Christmas to visit with old friends. You don't have to believe in "baby jesus" to celebrate life and friendship.

I hope your heart grows this year.

[FM Arouet666]

14. I was waiting for this...........

I knew that if I added just enough melancholy to the tread, someone would offer up a response such as yours. I am disappointed, however, I was hoping for a religious response.

Truly, I am not sad and lonely. Both my wife and I have to work today, but hopefully it will be a slow day. And I get New Years off, to travel and visit with family. It is not my heart that is growing this year, it is my belly. :evilgrin:

Peace

[fishingriver]

16. A True Christmas Story

Last night my family went to my inlaws to celebrate Christmas, see our relatives and enjoy some desserts. My inlaws are rural residents who still beleive in the democratic party and in spite of all the manipulation from the right wing spin machine voted for John Kerry.
But like so many families who shoulder the burden of a family member gone astray there is "ONE" moronic Bush supporter who married my wifes sister and practices his bobble head excercises at our family gatherings.
He knew better than to bring up the election because he is alone in this and we are all still recovering from the devastation. So....too cowardly for suicide he brought up the religous icon in public places non-issue.

Here is how that conversation went-


GOPer Inlaw- "Did you see the the UCLA is trying to remove a cross from a building in Califiornia"?

Me- "You mean the ACLU"?

GOPer Inlaw- "Yeah whatever. They want to remove Jesus from this country and it was founded on Christian principles".

Me- "Speaking of Christian prinicples, did you see the FBI emails that implicate the white house in the Abu Grahib torture"?

GOPer Inlaw- "They mentioned it on FOX but said there was more to the story".

Me- "What else did they say there was to the story"?

GOPer Inlaw- "I don't remember, but the story about the cross they want removed shows what a bunch of radical left wing nutcases the UCLA are".

Me- "The ACLU interprets the law and then works to preserve the constitution. They are about the only organization left working to defend our civil liberties."

GOPer Inlaw- "They need to get rid of them. Why do you care anyway, you aren't a left wing nutcase".

Me- "I am too".

From the room about 7 other relatives pipe in "Me too!"

GOPer Inlaw- "Thats the best fudge you ever made Grandma".

[FM Arouet666]

22. LOL.......

I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall. Most right wing adherents just parrot what they have heard on Faux or hate radio. Next christmas all of us at DU would like to chip in and get your relative a brain. :evilgrin: Happy Holidays

[lectrobyte]

19. Yes, my bullshit tolerance is exhausted, I didn't go see any of my

fundie relatives or inlaws this year for the first time in many many years. I feel so much less stressed this year. I'm pretty much a "Happy Holidays" kind of guy, too.

[housewolf]

23. I can't help but think

that they are doing this on purpose. I see it as a direct attack in the Culture War that they are waging against us even though we have been unaware of being a part in. That's why this stuff keeps taking us by surprise and putting us on the defensive.

Keep you eyes and ears open, the next volly will becoming soon.

[indepat]

24. Fundie right-wingers have impacted my view of the humanity of man,

America as a bastion of freedom and liberty, and America as the land of the free and home of the brave.

[silverweb]

33. Amen to that.

I agree with you completely.

:(

[Skittles]

25. yes

makes me realize more than ever they really don't have a clue what Christmas is all about.

[sakabatou]

26. Everyone around me is progressive/LW/liberal

so, I don't have the experience of a fundie ruining the holidays for me.

[Kashka-Kat]

27. MERRY X-MAS!!!!!

I didnt get any Christmas cards from my fundamentalist siblings this year! Usually I get some of those Jesus types of cards from them. I didnt feel like sending them anything either, not after the big hoopla about how "happy holidays" is apparently offensive to some of them folks. Usually, since I am not a practicing Christian, I wouldve sent everyone a card or email with my innocuous "happy holidays" greeting. In my mind,when I say "happy holidays" that is meant to INCLUDE the birth of Jesus, along with solstice, hannukah, new years, & etc. And what about Boxing Day?? So whats the big deal??? I just don't get it.

But I didnt feel like having to explain all this in my card, getting bogged down in explanation and in trying to deflect possible criticism..... when all I really wanted to do was wish them in all sincerity a simple & heart felt "happy holidays."

I'm very sad that its come to this.

[Clark2008]

41. Happy Holidays is not offensive to me

and I'm Christian.

Of course, my ex is Muslim - so.. heh... I guess I'm used to diversity.

We have those little candlabras in the windows and my 5-year-old son swears it's for Kwanzaa. I barely know that is! (My bad... I just don't)
Then I saw the Blue's Clues episode where they show Christmas, Kwanzaa, Ramadan and Hannukah and I got why he thought that.

It was nice. :)

[ThoughtCriminal]

29. It certainly impacted my opinion of how THEY view Christmas

That is, that they do not have a clue about how Jesus wanted us to treat each other.

[American Tragedy]

30. It's a shame to hear that.

It hasn't impacted me, partly because I am never really exposed to fundamentalists. I come from four generations of progressive Catholics, oxymoronic as that may sound!

Our house has pretty much stuck with family tradition: the tree, Christmas dinner, decorations, gifts, and Grand Theft Auto on the big screen. We did stop donating to Salvation Army this year because of the flap about rejecting homosexuals.

[FM Arouet666]

37. Stopped with Salvation Army and Boy Scouts... n/t

[Pithlet]

31. Yes.

I now no longer view Christmas as a holiday to be shared with love with my fellow family members. It is now an object to be lorded over to measure my children's self worth. If I deem they are bad people, then they are no longer worthy of the holidays. I'll even turn it into a public spectacle by selling their stuff on ebay! And telling the world that I took down the tree in a fit of petulance on Dec 23rd. It's the American way.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=8157047854

[FM Arouet666]

34. LOL! If they are really bad, put them up for sale too. ;l)

[knight_of_the_star]

35. Had fun yesterday with my Uncle-in-Law

The guy works for Ahnuld and sits about where Bush is. He was saying to me, "So you feel good about the Republicans and Bush winning?" All I said before mom jumped in to shut us both up was, "How about I don't remind you of what Rumsfeld said to the troops a couple of weeks ago." If it wasn't Christmas Eve, me being the Liberal Pagan that I am I would have had no problem with metaphorically tearing him a new asshole.

[knight_of_the_star]

36. Had fun yesterday with my Uncle-in-Law

The guy works for Ahnuld and sits about where Bush is. He was saying to me, "So you feel good about the Republicans and Bush winning?" All I said before mom jumped in to shut us both up was, "How about I don't remind you of what Rumsfeld said to the troops a couple of weeks ago." If it wasn't Christmas Eve, me being the Liberal Pagan that I am I would have had no problem with metaphorically tearing him a new asshole.

[PowerToThePeople]

38. Disowned by fundies on Christmas

Well, went over for Christmas day at my family's today. I don't seem to have a family any more. They disowned me. Started earlier when a family member was complaining about the counting of king county votes (I live in Washington) Stated that I was happy that the county was able to do what the law says they had the right to do. Later Iraq war came up, I said that about 25,000 innocent Iraqis have been killed so far and I felt that the US was acting as the rogue nation in this incident. Was asked to leave on the spot. Well, I guess my new family is everyone in this world who truly cares about humanity. Cheers and happy holidays DU.

[bobbieinok]

42. that's terrible....they certainly did a fine job of 'Christian' witnessi

witnessing to everyone

I can't imagine how you must feel.....do you have some good friends nearby? I sure hope so

[Clark2008]

39. No, because I don't celebrate Christmas with hate like they do.

My family has always done a blending of the Christian with the secular and it's worked out well: Santa (St. Nicholas) for the kiddies and prayer for all. I find that blending the two, touching upon WHY St. Nicholas gave presents to poor kids TO BEGIN WITH and why he continues to love little children mixes wonderfully with Jesus's sentiment on giving and love.
We're not a wealthy family - in fact, other than the house, we pretty much border on poor (I gave up my health insurance so I could afford my son's and I'm still on dial up with a free ISP because I work for the company) - but we always give our clothes and toys away to charity just before Christmas instead of E-baying them or having a yard sale. There are people who need our hardly-used clothes more than we do.
And, what's most important to me is when you find that perfect gift and you get to watch that person open it. It's a miracle on ANY street.

So, nope. It hasn't changed my outlook at all. I know Jesus is about love and compassion and caring and joy - not hate and disclusion and fear. In fact, I feel sorry for the poor Freepers and Fundies who walk around absolutely afriad to LIVE because they're afraid to die.

[0007]

40. No way!

[Lydia Leftcoast]

43. No

It was very much as always. Ever since November 28, I've been taking part in all the musical events that a cathedral choir has during this season (one or two services each Sunday, Christmas Eve, Christmas Day, and two special concerts), and I just came back from spending the day with my mother, stepfather, brothers, and their families. I didmost of my Christmas shopping during my trip to Japan this year.

Since I don't watch CNN, Fox, or most mainstream TV and my church is liberal, I was pretty much able to ignore the fundies.

I'm much merrier that way. :-)