WTF!? "All the planet is vibrating."

[Syrinx]

I've never heard of such a thing. Has anyone?

And what exactly does he mean about disturbing the earth's rotation?

"All the planet is vibrating" from the quake, said Enzo Boschi, the head of Italy's National Geophysics Institute. Speaking on SKY TG24 TV, Boschi said the quake even disturbed the Earth's rotation.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=516&u=/ap/20041226/ap_on_re_as/indonesia_earthquake_23&printer=1

[Ediacara]

1. It means that P-waves are continuing to encircle the earth

You can't feel them but a seismograph can. Add to that that something like 20 strong aftershocks... I don't know what he's talking about re:rotation though, the real movement of at most a few metres won't move enough mass compared to the entire mass of the planet to alter anything concerning rotation.

[Syrinx]

3. it sure sounds scary

Sounds like we're going to lose our orbit and go flying into space. :scared:

[Why Syzygy]

7. flying into space?

where do you think the planet is now?

(hint: space)

[Syrinx]

9. duh

Away from the sun where we would all freeze to death. Though I guess we would all be killed in quakes and avalanches and stuff before we had a chance to freeze.

(I don't think that's going to happen. It's just I never heard of anything like this before, and it does sound a little scary.)

[Why Syzygy]

10. death toll

14,000!!! This is shocking!!

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=avlj7S0nxSL0&refer=top_world_news

Dec. 27 (Bloomberg) -- The death toll rose above 14,000 after an earthquake off the Indonesian island of Sumatra, the world's biggest in four decades, caused tsunami waves that devastated coastal towns from Thailand to India.

[cliss]

13. I just read that over

800 Swedish people are missing. I just read this in a Swedish online newspaper. Many survivors have lost half their families, or one spouse has lost the other spouse. One Swedish man was in a hotel room and he watched his wife and 2 daughters get swept out from the tsunami. They are still missing.

The photos are just unbelievable. It's chaos over there in the hospitals as families are trying desperately to find their loved ones.

Cars inside stores, it sounds like a few islands have been completely washed away.

[Why Syzygy]

23. do you have

a link for the Sweden aspect?

[EuroObserver]

45. Some news now from non-tourist areas near epicenter...

NEW DELHI, Dec. 27 (Xinhuanet) -- Nearly 2,000 people were confirmed dead Monday in Andaman and Nicobar islands which were ravaged by the killer tsunami triggered by a massive earthquake off the cost of Indonesia, an official said.

Powerful aftershocks measuring six on the richter scale rocked the islands in the bay of Bengal Monday at around 6.20 am.

The situation is very grim and the toll is likely to rise, he said. Enditem

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2004-12/27/content_2385492.htm

[Liberty Belle]

108. Deaths are up to 24,000 today.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

130. death s are up to 44,000 today

[ShaneGR]

124. It will end up being closer to 100,000 when the final toll comes in....

Factor in disease. This morning the toll rose to 40k.

[KSAtheist]

15. That's nothing to worry about.

If we survived Krakatoa and Thela, then we won't rocket into space because of an earthquake.

Now, when Yellowstone turns into a volcano, then it's time to worry. At least that will only wipe out half the northern hemisphere, but it won't send us into the ether.

[oneighty]

73. No, we will be 'Gassified'

and become the ether.

Hee hee hee!

Oh wait! That is not funny 180.

180

[Endangered Specie]

120. ROFLMAO!!!!

good point

that one is making my eyes water LOLOLOLOL!

[soothsayer]

27. nah, we've already developed a wobble

Did you see that waxing moon the other night (a week ago)? Crescent was on the BOTTOM (as opposed to on the left or right side).

We're wobbling all over the place already!

[Why Syzygy]

42. noooo

did see the full moon rising last night.. It was a beautiful Orange globe.

Do you have a source to substantiate your assertion that the crescent was irregular?

[soothsayer]

67. ok, the moon does that every 6 months. But how about the

increase in the earth's wobble portending a pole shift?

http://www.michaelmandeville.com/earthmonitor/polarmotion/plots/chandler_wobble_plots.htm

; )

[momzno1]

47. I noticed the crescent on the bottom about 2 weeks ago too!`

i thought it must just be that it is normal and I am generally not observant visually... Is it really Not NORmal????
I have been very anxious lately...

[soothsayer]

62. apparently, a bottom crescent happens in the winter, and is

called a "wet moon." Actually, it supposedly happens every 6 months. That one two weeks ago was so prominent it scared me! But I guess it's not due to Planet X after all.

[Ladyhawk]

63. "Why is the crescent moon sometimes lit on the bottom?"

http://starchild.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/StarChild/questions/question43.html

[0rganism]

116. that's just Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson spinning in their graves

Not to worry. We may get a bit "eccentric" in our orbit for a few years, but eventually they'll give up and go back to their eternal rest, or rise from the dead to beat the shit out of Antonin Scalia.

[Kurt Remarque]

5. are you sure? i thot i felt the toilet bowl vibrating today

[Maple]

2. The earth literally rings like a bell

'The Earth rings like a bell after a large earthquake – the lowest ring tone is E flat in the 20th octave below middle C (Source: F Press and R Siever, Earth, New York: Freeman, 1986, p 467).'

http://www.chemsoc.org/networks/learnnet/jesei/fascinat/home.htm

"What is perhaps surprising to people is that a large earthquake with these megatons of energy can set the entire earth vibrating like a bell. So an earthquake is like the hammer hitting the bell and the entire planet then resonates with its natural frequencies for periods of weeks following the giant earthquake."

http://www.pulseplanet.com/archive/Feb00/2077.html

[Syrinx]

6. interesting stuff

Thanks for the link!

[NYC]

12. E flat 20 octaves below middle C.

Thanks for that info.

[ChairOne]

21. Of course sound won't travel thru space, but....

... for the 'ring like a bell' business, is there any "ringing" in the EM spectrum when we have big quakes? Or is it only tectonic/sonic/mechanical vibration?

I'm imagining the potential for a more effective SETI project...

[donsu]

74. the earth also "gongs" 69 times every day

" The cavity formed between a planetary body and its ionasphere acts as a natural resonator; most people who lived on Earth were unaware tht they lived on a gigantic gong that boomed out exactly sixty-nine times ever day."

from the novel: Ammonite
by Nicola Griffith

[nofurylike]

4. i've been watching that! wild! i'm actually

'glad' to read someone else seeing it too.

wow.


peace!

[Tinoire]

8. Most interesting.... Never heard of such a thing either.

Would love to hear/learn more.

[BeTheChange]

11. Not to be an alarmist..

But if you look at the seismic activity it is fascinating.
http://www.iris.edu/seismon/last30days.phtml/

Its like they just keep moving up and down the fault.

I also read a stupid fox news story about a tear in the earths crust or something. I always take fox with more then a grain of salt.. but sometimes the truth is somewhere in the middle.

Seismographs all over the world are "ringing" http://aslwww.cr.usgs.gov/Seismic_Data/heli2.shtml

Interestingly, not too far from this quake is the site of a volcano that holds the record for biggest eruption in the last 2 million years.. give or take a century or two ;)

http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/volc_images/southeast_asia/indonesia/toba.html

My eyes are glued to the ring of fire.

[aquart]

14. Mt. St. Helens has been a bit busy, too.

[BeTheChange]

17. Helens is growing a new top

The cam is all frozen over but I remember reading something about how its regrowing the top it blew off last time.

[Pachamama]

24. Pachamama is angry....

Pachamama, my chosen name on DU, is actually the Quechua/Incan word for Mother Earth....I learned of its name when I spent time in the Amazon with various tribes in the mid/late-90's when I went on my "Walkabout"...Many of the tribes, from the Uwa, Achuar, Shuar, Huaranhani and other all have said that the activities of those in the North (they view the world as North and South, not East/West as we do) that the "dream" is becoming a nightmare and that if Pachamama is angered enough, she will shake people off like a dog shakes of fleas. They laugh when environmentalists talk of the destruction of the earth. They say Pachamama was here before humans and she will be here after humans. They say its not about the destruction of the environment but rather of humanity. Change the dream is what they always told me.... :hi:

[Tsiyu]

26. If Mama's not happy, nobody's happy

And Mama's pretty pissed about the mess we've made in some of our rooms.

x(

[Pachamama]

29. I love that line! But its true! And she's more than pissed....

Personally, I'd love to see a fault line open up in Crawford, TX or the White House (maybe simultaneously) and just suck down every Neo-con in a 5 mile radius....Yeah, maybe then there might be some peace on Earth....

It is pretty interesting stuff though - to think that very peaceful, simple people living in the Amazon told me years ago that great wars were going to be fought over Pachamama's blood (oil) and that we needed to beware of these people (said to me during the Clinton Years) and that the result would be Pachamama getting pissed....well, stay tuned I say - it seems that everything they said back in 1997 is coming true....The good news is that they said that it would have a happy ending...the bad news is that a lot of people die.... :cry:

[amazona]

72. seems a tad unfair

Some harmless beach bathers and fisherfolk are not the ones making the mess.

[Tsiyu]

92. Aaah, but the innocent always pay

for the stupid, selfish actions of the guilty.

There are many Native American prophecies pointing to the same end result.

[indigobusiness]

31. Tho Kogi of Columbia warned the World

in a recent documentary. The story is compelling. The Kogi represent the most complete surviving civilization of pre-Columbian America.

Theirs is a very interesting story. As is their message.

http://www.labyrinthina.com/kogi.htm

[Pachamama]

32. Wow! Thanks for sharing! I'll have to dig up info on the other tribes

and share it with you and the DU....very interesting...I have such deep respect for these ancient peoples....I learned a lot from them...still am learning... :hi:

[indigobusiness]

36. The Kogi are absolutely beautiful.

The documentary is stunning and I highly reccommend it.

They are one of the most remarkable indigenous culures I've ever heard of. They have ways and means and a depth of spirit that deserve respect and honor.

[Pachamama]

37. The Uwa, Achuar, Shuar and Huaorani were too, although many

of them are warriors and have been known for some not so savory things...funny thing is I felt totally safe and protected with them while visiting...Unfortunately, some friends of mine met a terrible and deadly fate while visiting the Uwa, but it was not at the hands of the Uwa, but rather some of the paramilitary groups in the jungle of Columbia....

I'll have to look for info on the Kogi...

thx! :hi:

[indigobusiness]

40. The Kogi are not warriors. They live in absolute, if isolated, hamony

with the planet. You will enjoy their story. They have spectacular organic vegetable gardens and crops with sleek, healthy horses etc without veterinary medicine.

[Pachamama]

33. Here is info on some of the tribes I visited....

Uwa of Colombia: http://www.moles.org/ProjectUnderground/uwa.html

Huaorani of Equador: http://www.mongabay.com/external/Ecuador-Huaorani_2004.htm

http://www.frif.com/cat97/t-z/trinkets.html

( Moi who is pictured on the cover of the book "Savages" is a friend of mine...I haven't seen him since 1997, but when I was last there, we traded some good trades, including my Nike Hiking boots and other things...I got his prized blowgun with quiver and poison darts...unbeknownst to me, it was "loaded"...I figure a few neo-cons ever try to mess with me, its poison dart time :hi:)

[indigobusiness]

39. Fascinating

Thanks for the links...and the story. Watch out with those darts, they might just make a neo-con's venom stronger. And, an accidental poke can upset your chili, and make a mess out of your morning.

[BeHereNow]

113. I have been looking for that for YEARS!

Oh thank you, thank, thank you, thank you!!!
I saw that documentary years ago and could NEVER
remember the tribe name or name of the documentary!
I have NOT stoppted thinking about it over the years.
I got deeply interested in Frank Waters and the Hopi
Prophecies too, Thomas Bayancya etc...
I CAN NOT BELIEVE you just posted that link!
WOW!
WOW!
WOW!
I can not tell you how hard I have tried
to find someone else who saw that documentary!
I was starting to think I saw it in an alternative reality.
NO ONE ever knew what I was referring to, and blammo-
it shows up on DU!!!
I LOVE you for this!
BHN

[indigobusiness]

119. I love you more...

There is a publication that came out 10 years ago with the story of the Kogi, with an article by the film-maker they let in to make the documentary. It opened my eyes to the most beautiful, most utterly human and unique group of people I have ever learned of. The world should listen, these folks have got the answer.

http://www.crystalinks.com/kogi.html

http://www.reelwest.com/magazine/archives/vol14_3/heart2.htm

[BeHereNow]

127. I found him! He wrote me back!

After you posted the name of the doc, I went
searching on the net. The director now runs
a trust for the Tairona and has retired from the BBC.
He is still making documentaries through his own
company in London, "Sunstone Films."
I wrote to them last night and asked if
it was possible to get a copy of the film.
Below is his reply to me which I found in my
email this morning:

Dear xxxxxx
I'm sorry for being so hard to find.
I run the Tairona Heritage Trust ([e-mail], www.taironatrust.org)
and we give a gift of a DVD of the film to anyone who donates more than $50.
The address is
Thairona Heritage Trust
90 Summerlee Avenue
London N2 9QH
UK
and cheques should be made out to the Trust
Happy New Year
Alan Ereira

Like I said, WOW!
I can't believe it- you have NO idea how hard
I have been looking for that film since I first saw it!
I LOVE YOU MORE IndigoB!
Check out the Tairona trust web page he sent us.
There are INCREDIBLE articles and details on updates
regarding Kogi events and his relationship
with them since the documentary was made.

BHN

[indigobusiness]

128. Send me a copy and I promise to love you more.

And I didn't think it possible!

That is just fantastic, that really makes my day. Thanks for telling me.

Please keep in touch. We are kindred spirits.

Ciao

[Silver Gaia]

38. Very interesting, Pachamama...

Thanks for sharing your experience. Yes, Pachamama is VERY pissed, and has been for quite some time, IMO. Her time and our time are not the same, though, and her anger will not subside any time soon. I agree with the wisdom of the tribes you mention. She will survive. It is we whose survival is in question, and we would do well to heed their warnings.

[Liberty Belle]

109. A volcano in Alaska is becoming active, too.

It was having quakes when we visited there this summer. Also I heard this morning that there's a tsunami warning issues for parts of Alaska.

[starroute]

19. The super-eruption of Toba

It may have set off the last Ice Age. It may also have come close to wiping out the human race -- at the very least, it is probably responsible for the deep genetic divide between India and Southeast Asia.

http://www.jqjacobs.net/anthro/paleo/bottleneck.html

In a 1998 article, Stanley Ambrose proposed an alternative hypothesis, a volcanic winter scenario, to explain recent human differenciation. The bottleneck was caused by a volcanic winter resulting from the super-eruption of Toba in Sumatra. If Ambrose's hypothesis is correct, modern human variations differentiated abruptly through founder effect, genetic drift, and adaptation to local environments after around 70,000 years ago.

<snip>

Ambrose concludes that bottlenecks occurred among genetically isolated human populations because of a six-year long volcanic winter and subsequent hyper-cold millennium after the cataclysmic super-eruption of Toba. This volcanic winter played a role in recent human differentiation. The resultant combination of founder effects and genetic drift may account for low human genetic diversity as well as population differences associated with so-called races. The bottleneck hypothesis offers an explanation for why human exhibit so little genetic variation, yet superficially appear diverse.

See also http://www.andaman.org/book/app-r/ch5_bottleneck/textr5.htm

[blindpig]

123. thanks!

that hypothesis was unfamiliar to me but seems to work. Explains much, all textbook evolutionary biology. How the creationist goomers can deny the beautiful elegance of evolution displays a lack of imagination and indeed, a lack of faith, IMHO.

[HeeBGBz]

59. I heard that bit about the crack too. But, it wasn't on Faux.

It was a passing mention with no details. I think I heard "40 mile crack." I think I need details!

I found this, but I don't think its what I heard on tv.

Warnings might have reduced tsunami toll

snip

"Researchers say the earthquake broke on a fault line deep off the Sumatra coast, running north and south for about 600 miles or as far north as the Andaman and Nicobar islands between India and Mynamar.

"It's a huge rupture," said Charles McCreery, director of the Pacific Tsunami Warning Center near Honolulu. "It's conceivable that the sea floor deformed all the way along that rupture, and that's what initiates tsunamis."

[mcscajun]

68. Some details...

Excerpt from the L.A. Times story (emphasis mine):

Quake shifts isle 100 feet, giving rise to fatal tsunami

THE LOS ANGELES TIMES

The magnitude 9.0 earthquake that struck off Indonesia on Sunday morning moved the entire island of Sumatra about 100 feet toward the southwest, pushing up a gigantic mass of water that quickly collapsed into a tsunami that devastated shorelines around the Indian Ocean and the South China Sea.

The quake was one of the largest ever recorded by scientists. It was the first tsunami in the Indian Ocean since 1883, according to Costas Synolakis, a professor of civil engineering at the University of Southern California in Los Angeles.

Sunday's earthquake, which occurred in an active geological region, ruptured an estimated 600-mile-long stretch of the Earth beneath the Indian Ocean. The quake caused one side of the fault to slide past the other much as seismologists expect the San Andreas Fault to do when the "big one" hits California.

[LeftyMom]

16. Sorry, I'll turn it off

new batteries, my bad. ;)

[Syrinx]

18. I guess the earth moved for you, solo

:)

[flygal]

30. LOL

:smoke:

[elf]

20. Nicki, where are you ???!! She might be dead..in Phuket..................

elf (597 posts) Mon Dec-27-04 01:57 AM
Original message
Nicki, where are you ???!! She might be dead..in Phuket..................


We are so devastated, our son is here from Germany for Christmas.
His best friend's sister went to Phuket, Thailand with her friend.
This is a very popular area to do vacation for Germans.

They both were swept away, she(the friend) survived,got somehow a Swiss guy to call from a survivors camp home to Germany, now nobody knows where Nicki is. Her friend said she was swept away from her.
She has a broken wrist and a broken foot and has a high fiver, she is not capable of telling anything more (the Swiss guy said she is in pain and shock).

Our family was in such a good spirit for this Christmas day.
My children come over every year for Christmas.

Now we bow our heads and pray, even though we are no muster-Christians!
Can you imagine, what we all think..............she might swept away and survived somewhere..................God help us to find Nicki

[koopie57]

25. I just said a prayer for her

eom

[Silver Gaia]

34. Oh elf... I'm so sorry to hear this...

:( We have friends who are in Thailand vacationing right now, too, and are anxiously awaiting news from them. We've heard nothing so far. We don't think they would've been on the coast... more likely in Bangkok or in the northern areas, but we are on pins and needles waiting for word that they are safe. We will say prayers for Nicki...

[Silver Gaia]

115. We just heard from our friends in Thailand

and they are OK! whew! I hope you get good news about Nicki, elf...

[slutticus]

22. The Earth can resonate like a bell.

Nothing strange about that.

[Fleshdancer]

28. Red Cross donation info for anyone interested:

http://www.redcross.org/article/0,1072,0_312_3870,00.html

You can help those affected by this crisis and countless others around the world each year by making a financial gift to the American Red Cross International Response Fund, which will provide immediate relief and long-term support through supplies, technical assistance, and other support to those in need. Call 1-800-HELP NOW or 1-800-257-7575 (Spanish). Contributions to the International Response Fund may be sent to your local American Red Cross chapter or to the American Red Cross International Response Fund, P.O. Box 37243, Washington, DC 20013. Internet users can make a secure online contribution by visiting www.redcross.org.

[Silver Gaia]

35. Here's another interesting article I just read from the India Daily...

Largest earthquake in modern times breaks 625 miles of Andaman fault line, creates 45 feet Tsunami and kills more than 25000 in South Asia

Balaji Reddy, Special Correspondent

December 27, 2004

It is the largest earthquake known to modern civilization with a reading of close to 9.2 in Richter scale. It started with a precursor near the coastline of Sumatra, a series of shocks happened one after the other and before all was done, 625 miles (1000 Kilometers) of Andaman thrust or fault line broke. The result was devastation never seen before in modern times. 45 feet tall Tsunamis (coastal tidal waves) originating from the epicenter of the earthquakes, crushed onto the shores of Sri Lanka, India, Maldives, Thailand, Indonesia, Singapore and other countries in the region.

According to reports we are receiving, this is not a simple earthquake, it is the mega quake that happens once every thousand years. No one knows how much after shock will devastate the area. Never ever in the known human history in modern times, an earthquake happened that broke 1000 miles of fault line.

More than 25,000 people are dead or missing. The death toll eventually can rise to 100,000. The damage to economy and crops can be staggering.

More here: http://216.132.172.240/indiadaily/editorial/12-27-04.asp

[ogradda]

41. scary.

very scary.

[radfringe]

43. bet the "rapture-ites"

have their eyes glued to this story

[Is It Fascism Yet]

44. SECRET GODDAMNED ENERGY DEALS! THIS IS ALL SHRUB/CHENEY'S FAULT!!!!!!

Pardon me for screaming, i just can't help it, yes, they are making our planet uninhabitable for the next several thousand years...we are the Atlantis of the future! You know, we do have a wobble, and the magnetic north pole is moving! Yep, that's right, it's moving north from canada, and is ecpected to arrive in siberia within the decade. this, in fact, may reverse our rotations. you know that picture window you put in the east side of the breakfast nook so you can have sunshine with your morning coffee? Start serving dinner there.

[AliciaKeyedUp]

46. Could you please cite that?

nt

[Is It Fascism Yet]

48. the running away magnetic pole? discovery channel, try their website n/t

[ProdigalJunkMail]

50. was it the fault of humans

when this has happened in the past? How do you expect ANYONE to affect the magnetic poles of a f*cking PLANET?

theProdigal

[Is It Fascism Yet]

54. um, by fucking global warming changing the gulf current

for instance. i guess you don't do science either. don't be simple about it, you don't belive we are altering the environment? please.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

56. you are talking magnetic poles...not currents in the ocean

you don't be simple...

theProdigal

[SlowDownFast]

94. also by massive displacement of minerals,

precious metals, oil-from the massive mining, drilling, etc thats happened since industrial revolution.

edit: not to mention massive displacement of rivers, bodies of water from dams, etc.

[Silverhair]

52. BULLCRAP!!!!!!!!!

1. The magnetic pole isn't going anywhere. It does change in strength but only slowly, and it has reversed polarity several times, but not in human history.

2. The Earth is definately NOT going to reverse it rotation.

Humans do not yet have the ability to make those kind of changes.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

55. why because you said so? 142 nobel prize winners think its a possibility

and their guess is better than yours. sounds like you are in denial. yes, the north pole is moving. i didn't make it up. do a google search, or a search on discoverychannel.com. just because you yell and scream that "it can't be true, it can't be true" doesn't make it so. 2100 loud repetitions only makes a truth on faux news, not here. The Secret energy deals allowed energy companies to increase immissions of mercury and lead, up to 6 times, and they were already frightfully high. its all about greed, but they are very stupid, since they will have more money, but no planet suitable for life. as a result of the increased mercury emmissions, a large part of the child bearing women in america have become so contaminated by mercury that the rate of autistic births is skyrocketting. the increased lead emmissions are greenhousing us all the faster, melting glaciers, bringing cold water into the gulf stream, altering the magnetic centers, causing monster hurricanes, yes, CAUSING hurricanes by heating up the waters of the gulf stream, that's was causes hurricanes, since you are so unversed in scientific theory, i will tell you. now, you can yell and scream all day in your juvenile way that it isn't true, but that's just denial. don't expect me to give you every referenece you need to research the problems of the environment, you got a computer, go for it, or don't, keep your denial if it makes you happy, this tsunami death toll is now up to 20,000, so, i wish you any happiness you have available to you.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

57. people do not change poles...

if they change...they change IF and WHEN they just happen to...

theProdigal

[Bridget Burke]

58. OT: Clues for communication.

The Shift Key is your friend; it's proven that a mixture of upper & lower case letters is easier to read than ALL UPPER or all lower.

Consider learning about paragraph breaks; a message consisting of one giant block of text is hostile to the reader.

Supply references for any controversial statements.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

60. i have supplied a reference, discoverychannel, they have a website, n/t

[ProdigalJunkMail]

61. funny though, the discovery channel does not mention

humans affecting the poles...ocean currents, maybe, but poles...not on your life...

theProdigal

OnEdit : I should have realized that responding to you would be futile when you mentioned reversing the ROTATION of the planet...just damn...

[Is It Fascism Yet]

75. yes, it does mention the migration of the poles, it seems to really make

you angry. I personally am not responsible for this you know, it upsets everyone, but, it isn't my fault, and yes, i understand you may be shocked to learn this, but just because it is a shocking truth is no reason for you to be so nasty to me. Will you also be abusive if I tell you we might get hit by astoroids too? Geeze, can't you use a search engine as good as me? Alright, here is some documentation of the problems with the gulf stream from increased emmissions causing global warming, http://yosemite.epa.gov/oar/globalwarming.nsf/content/index.html
you are shooting the messenger, sorry its news, sorry it's bad news, it ain't my fault. After the neo ice age, when the LeftOfTheLeft becomes empowered, lets not argue anymore everytime we find something remarkable. Yes, i know, citations should be given for radical thoughts, but, my friend, this is accepted knowledge, it's like asking me for a source to prove gravity works, you must be the last to hear about the magnetic pole migration. (I can't believe I have to prove this to you? doesn't everybody know this?)
http://mb-soft.com/public/tecto2.html
now you will say, well, it doesn't say bush caused it! well, you might have to read more than one article on the subject to understand that when the overall temp of the earth rises only a few degrees and the gulf stream becomes cold from glacial waters, it changes everything, because, everything is inter-related and inter-dependent.
http://educate-yourself.org/zsl/magpolereversal22nov03.shtml
http://www.antarcticconnection.com/antarctic/news/2002/041802mag_flip.shtml
http://www.oceantronics.net/17POLE.htm
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2004/06/040618064721.htm
http://www.fourwinds10.com/news/04-environment/C-earth-changes/2004/04C-08-27-04-break-up-of-the-north-pole.html
http://www.john-daly.com/polar/arctic.htm
http://www.barry.warmkessel.com/barry/8related.html
I mean, there are just links to this stuff everywhere, it's not pretty, but it's the truth. This stuff does happen naturally, it just doesn't happen naturally very often, and would probably wipe most everything out, but yes, pollutents are accelerating us toward such very fast, and those come from bush/cheney secret energy deals. by the way, my daughter is a psychologist who specializes in behavior modification for autistic children, and she tells me that mercury in the drinking water is known to be the cause, nobody in the field doubts it, they consider it to be proven. Please, don't make me search links for that, come on, use your head, mercury in the water and lead in the air have ill effects.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

77. you're a hoot

people are causing a shift in the poles? That is all I have a problem with you saying...we do not have the power to move the poles...they move on their own...the electromagnetic poles of the earth are controlled soley by the spin of the core of the earth...nothing we do here can affect that. Read what you want...nothing credible will ever say that humans are affecting the magnetic poles of the earth...the gulf stream I can see changing via global warming...the poles...no.

theProdigal

and no...i can't use a search engine as 'good' as you...

[Name removed]

81. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[gorbal]

126. Did you read ANY of the articles he posted?

You go on to act like what he says has no creedence whatsoever and totally ignore the articles from reputable sources that he posted. If you want to crtitisize, please read up first.

[shadowknows69]

65. speaking of communication

who has taken serious steps to get older forms of communicating with each other. might not be a bad idea for there to be a ham radio craze again. not to be a doomsayer but our mother earth burps in the right direction (or certain politicians cause a nuclear war)and the internet isn't going to be viable.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

83. yeah, that's a good idea, and wouldn't it be nice to plant some food n/t

[Silverhair]

69. I have a science degree.

I majored in math, minored in physics, and I keep up. I subscribe to Scientific American and Discover and actually read them.

I suggest that you get a genuine scientific education.

Reversing the rotation of the earth would require reversing all of the momentum of the earth with all of the associated kinetic energy and humanity doesn't have the ability throw that kind of energy around.

The earth's magnetic field is caused by forces deep withing the earth's iron core. We have not been able to effect that.

A kid with a BB gun has a better chance of stopping a fast 300 car freight train than humanity has of doing the things you are becoming hysterical about.

I am not in denial. I am scientifically educated.

Take a deep breath and calm down. The world will still be here for hundreds of millions of years, and it will still rotate in the same direction. It is impossible to change that. Even life will be here. There are some things that are bigger than humanity.

Oh yes, about those hurricanes. The globe has about the same number of cyclonic coriolis storms every year. Sometimes there are more in the Pacific, sometimes more in the Atlantic, but the same total energy each year.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

85. you all are so condescending in your ignorance, really, its not my thesis

http://www.planetsave.com/ViewStory.asp?ID=4579

[Silverhair]

89. Doesn't matter if it is your or not.

It is still bullcrap about the earth reversing it's rotation. Magnetic poles do indeed reverse every so often, but that is on a geologic time scale, not a human one.

I still suggest that you get a genuine scientific education.

[itzamirakul]

122. Sometimes, you just cannot convince people to

look beyond what they believe to be true. After awhile it makes no sense to continue to try to convince them to see things the way that you see them.

As far as I am concerned, I do not believe that ANYTHING is impossible.

I am not a scientist, in fact, I am an artist who generally runs from any scientific discussion, but I found this one particularly fascinating.

There was a time when man used drums to communicate.
There was a time when man used torches for light.
There was a time when man did not know how to fly.
There was a time when man did not know how to harness nuclear energy.
There was a time when scientists did not believe in the power of thought to cause physical reaction.(See Karl Rove,GWB, Rush, et al).

It is not beyond my realm of belief that man may be capable of affecting the rotation of the planet.

[Silverhair]

135. A little bit of common sense, please?

You say that you are an artist and run from scientific discussion, yet try to say that nothing is impossible?

It is not in man's current ability to reverse the rotation of a planet. If we ever do aquire that capability, we will have also become a spacefaring race long before gaining that ability.

My statements that it is something we can't do NOW stand. A few thousand years from now - I won't speculate.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

88. okay you all, here's the truth, increased mercury and lead immissions are

good for you, we didn't need glaciers, the temperature of the gulf stream matters not at all, noah warned that we'd be seeing bigger and better and more hurricanes in the future than the past but what does noah know? they are just the national weather service, i am sure you all know better. you asked for source, i gave you a dozen, if you use a search engine with the phrase "magnetic pole reversal" you will get dozens more, if you don't want to believe it, that's up to you. the north pole is perfectly stable, believe whatever you want, scientists all over the place are talking about the increasing rate of magnetic pole migrations and the weakening of the earth's magnetic field and the possibility of a reversal of poles, which, has occurred before, and yes, the earth will still be here, but possibly not with us on it. If you don't want to open your minds to that ugly info, that's up to you, but don't blame me it is not my thesis, it is the thesis of many many scientists, and if you think you are better informed then the entire community of scientists who are worried about this, fine, enjoy.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

80. do you even realize the contradictions in your post?

Two quotes...same malformed sentence...

the increased lead emmissions are greenhousing us all the faster, melting glaciers, bringing cold water into the gulf stream , altering the magnetic centers, causing monster hurricanes, yes, CAUSING hurricanes by heating up the waters of the gulf stream , that's was causes hurricanes, since you are so unversed in scientific theory, i will tell you.

I think it is time that we should stop our little conversation...

theProdigal

[Is It Fascism Yet]

90. i am not attending a writing class here you know, this is causally written

and you are nitpicking quite a bit aren't you? is this about puncutation? or will it be okay with you if i use a casual style? it was good enough for ee cummings, and it's good enough for me.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

100. it is not about punctuation...

it is about you saying (in the same sentence, no less) that the cold water going into the gulf stream is heating it up! That is just nuts...ever hear of thermodynamics?

theProdigal

[davekriss]

101. Is It Fascism Yet makes a minor mistake

The Gulf Stream is driven by the Artic pump: Cold, dense water sinks to the ocean floor, spreading southward miles below the surface where it does no harm. Warm waters from the south rush in to fill the space above the descending cold water. This "pump", along with the rotation of the earth, results in the circulation of the warmth-giving Gulf Stream.

Now here's the problem: The gulf stream is warming up. It is contributing to the rapid melting of the Artic ice cap. The melting water is decreasing the salinity of the water rushing to the bottom under the warmer water coming up from the south. As salinity decreases, so does density, so the density gradient between warm and cold is diminishing and thus so is the force of the "pump". Theory holds that the "pump" could cease, warm and cold simply blend, and thus the Stream stop streaming.

What happens if the Stream stops streaming? The warmth-giving heat pump is turned off for Northern Europe, and it descends into a new ice age. The frigid temperatures in turn spread across the upper hemisphere and we have glaciers in London, northern France, NYC, Chicago. Not a pretty picture.

There are intelligence agencies that believe this risk is much greater than that from terrorism, world war, and all other calamities combined. A paper was written a year ago and leaked with some media attention. Anyone recall? It was written by the grandaddy of the intelligence agencies and directs a group that sits atop the CIA, DIA, and other agencies. I'll try to find it and edit this post with the link...

(IIFY: I did not see, above, where you pointed out the paradox -- warming leading to freezing -- hope this helps.)

[ProdigalJunkMail]

103. thanks for the primer

on the Gulf Stream and the Artic Pump...I knew much about these already...but I hope it will help clear things up for the Fascism posts. I don't think she understands that there is no link between this and the magnetic field of the planet we call earth...

theProdigal

[shadowknows69]

64. humans don't, mom nature sure does. n/t

[Silverhair]

70. Planets do not reverse rotations.

There are some things that nature simply does not do. That is one of them.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

76. yes, they do

http://educate-yourself.org/zsl/magpolereversal22nov03.shtml

[ProdigalJunkMail]

78. interesting source

"The higher dimensional beings who coordinate the fires in the stars and the living processes on the planets know how to roll up the scrolls of heaven and bind them with circlets of rope."

Looks like the humans are not to blame ... :freak:


theProdigal

[Is It Fascism Yet]

79. here is another source for you

http://www.planetsave.com/ViewStory.asp?ID=4579

[ProdigalJunkMail]

84. speaks nothing of human causes

as does nothing reputable...

bye bye ... :spank:


theProdigal

[gorbal]

125. I saw that

Yeah, I see alot of sources that say it's a possibility. Somebody I know who teaches physics was explaining to me about the earth's magnetic field and how it is weakening.

On another note, I under stand that heat expands things, is the earth any exception to this rule?

[Silverhair]

82. Pole reversal, and rotation reversal are NOT the same thing.

The earth's magnetic poles DO flip from time to time. That has happened several times.

The earth's rotation does NOT reverse. That is an entirely different matter.

Once again, I suggest that you get a genuine scientific education.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

86. i have officially given up

and for sanity...perhaps you should as well...if not...good luck to you...you are going where no intellect has gone before...

theProdigal

[Silverhair]

87. True. It is a waste of time.

Won't this guy be dissapointed when, if he lives that long, the world is still here and the rotation hasn't changed, and magnetic compasses still point the same direction?

Unless one wants to count the microchanges, then changes over the span of a human life are to small to count.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

91. well, no, i won't be a disappointed guy

but mostly because i won't be any kind of a guy, since i am a woman, but, you guys know everyting, more than all the scientists who wrote all the articles i quoted to you, so, you should have known that.

[Silverhair]

93. OK, dissapointed woman then.

There are some things that are simply physical impossibilites, and some things that are already will known. If somebody tries to tell me that the earth is flat, or that evolution didn't happen, I am free to laugh at them. I don't need to know the nuances of their theory as I already know that it will be bunk.

The belief that the earth will reverse it's rotation is of that order of error. The belief that humanity is causing the very slow reveral of the magnetic poles is also bunk. The magnetic field is caused by events in the earth's core, and we can't influence that.

Once again, I suggest that you get a serious genuine scientific education.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

95. i didn't tell you the earth was flat, and you are not the only person with

a scientic education, i think this gentleman has a few advanced science degrees himself, Charles Jackman of NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center.
you can read more about the collapse of the earth's magnetic fields here:
http://www.theozonehole.com/magnetic.htm
these are not my ideas, and you are very rude to try to insult me for bringing them to your attention. that is a tactic that makes me suspect you as a troll. however, i do think these ideas are valid. if you disagree, simply saying you are more educated than everyone else is not a convincing argument for substantiating why you disagree. you are not more educated than the many many scientists who are aware of this problem and its implications. you have been given reliable sources, if you choose not to investigate them thats fine, but please, stop being so condescendingly obnoxious. the one theory you cannot provide a source for is that you are smarter and more educated than every one else who has considered the problem.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

96. on the science channel, right now, they are talking about the overwhelming

evidence of global warming causing radical changes in climate.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

99. i am breaking my own rules by coming back to this

but will you please stick to ONE F-ING TOPIC??? You are interchanging three things: global warming, magnetic poles and global rotation...regardless of what you may think, global warming has NOTHING to do with the other two and, having perused your 'sources', neither do any scientists...

please, please stop...

theProdigal

OnEdit : four topics...for some reason you are also talking about lead and mercury poisoning...are you thinking THESE relate to??? Make up your damn mind...

[Silverhair]

106. Changes in climate are NOT rotation reversal.

I am ridiculing the idea that you have posted that the earth's rotation will reverse.

I am ridiculing the idea that humans can cause a reversal of the earth's magnetic field. It does appear to be starting a reversal, just as it has done before, but that is something that it does on it's own, not at our influence.

I am not ridiculing global warming, nor am I ridiculing that humans can effect the climate. Climatic changes take place on the surface of the earth. The magnetic fields are generated thousands of miles below in the earth's interior - far, far beyond the influence of humans.

You are seriously misunderstanding what is in the articles that you have been linking. I liked the link to "The Ozone Hole" and bookmarked it. Lots of good info there. But it does not support your idea that the earth is going to reverse rotate, nor does it support you contention that humans are causing the fluctuations in the magnetic field.

[Silverhair]

105. You haven't really read what I have said.

I have several times said that the earth's magnetic fields do indeed change, and that a fluctuation in them has been measured. That is beyond doubt.

But the earth is NOT going to start rotating in the opposite direction. The sun will NOT rise in the West. That is what I am ridiculing.

To claim that the earth's rotation will reverse is like claiming it is flat, or that evolution didn't happen.

You need to know the difference between polarity reversal, and rotation reversal. Two very, very different things.

Again, I recommend that you get a serious genuine scientific education.

[Name removed]

97. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Silverhair]

104. I didn't rag you about puncation. Please check who your are responding to

I have ragged you about very poor science.

It is not being a troll to point out bad science.

[Silverhair]

111. WOW. That site is funny.

Here is a quote:

"There have been nine major eruptions from the sun since October 26 2003. The Earth was grazed by a couple of the Coronal Mass Ejections (CME). The October 26 CME was supposed to slam into the magnetosphere of the Earth and cause all manner of communications and electrical transmission problems. The CME was deflected before it got here. There are large spacecraft like the SOHO photographed "Sol Cruiser" protecting us at this time."

Somebody has been doing some serious drugs, or member of the Heavens Gates cult missed the comet last time around.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

49. well, the peeps in power don't do nuance, and they don't do science n/t

[Is It Fascism Yet]

51. after the environmental catastrophies, and the new ice age, i just hope

that humanity will not be completely extinguished and that the leftest of the left will rise to power after the ensuing anarchy phase.

[shadowknows69]

66. not likely

they own all the good bunkers and I have a hunch we're not invited.

[Silverhair]

110. Not likely.

Anarchy is almost always followed by a ruthless dictatorship. The left depends upon a reasonable organized society to support its goals. In an anarchy, the foundations of the left are shot to hell. If the anarchy is global, then you have to start all over, with mere survival.

[rooboy]

53. Known in scientific circles as "The O'Reilly Effect". n/t

[amazona]

71. chill it's perfectly normal

The earth always "rings" after an earthquake.

[Jose Diablo]

98. It's planet X, Niburu is coming back

http://www.detailshere.com/niburu.htm

The cover-up of the return of Planet X is about to end. Pole shift, the skin of the Earth sliding around, meteors, earthquakes, read about all of it. :)

:tinfoilhat:

[goforit]

102. I heard that bush had an Earthquake machine. True?

[Is It Fascism Yet]

112. yes, sort of, it's called, "secret energy deals" n/t

[kostya]

107. In fact, the moon is still ringing from a massive meteor

impact in the Middle Ages that was witnessed. Once they got the laser measuring equipment up there they were able to confirm it. - K

[davidwparker]

114. Earthquakes accompany the "wars and rumors of wars"

Notice how they are increasing. They will increase in frequency and intensity like the birth pains women feel when they are about to give birth.

[rman]

117. ... according to end-times gospel

in which rational liberals usually don't believe.

got any sources to prove the earthquakes are increasing?

i've got evidence that it isn't:

Number of Earthquakes per Year, Magnitude 7.0 or Greater 1900 - 1999
http://wwwneic.cr.usgs.gov/neis/eqlists/7up.html

TWENTIETH CENTURY EARTHQUAKES - CONFRONTING AN URBAN LEGEND
http://www.icr.org/pubs/imp/imp-295.htm

[Tony_Illinois]

118. Well, I thought the world was upside down on 11/4/04 . . .

[Bo]

121. The Pirus tribes in Peru are still not contacted

formally. They have been declared off limits to investigators and have had very limited contact with the outside world but have survived well since before the spanish. Logging is now infiltrating there world the spanish have once again built runways to remove rare wood species.

[wormhole]

129. heh..

makes Bush seem like a small problem...

[noshenanigans]

131. If the world was vibrating just a little bit more..

I'd probably never get anything done.

[jimshoes]

132. I'm sure you wouldn't

be the only one :)

[kslib]

133. Wow.

Um, wow. Well, I do believe that eventually the poles will flip. Just as they have done so before. I also believe we MAY be "overdue" for this flip, and that it will likely cause problems. That we can cause a reversal in the earth's rotation seems, um, kind of silly, and to cite the internet as a basis, seems silly as well. (I do, however believe we can cause catastrophic weather/climate related damage to the earth by global warming, too much science out there to refute that!!) Too often I see/hear people citing this or that website as "proof" of a theory. People can post anything on the web, that doesn't make it so. Even educated people can come up with crazy theories or hunches. The education level or even job title of the poster does not make the theory true. Just a few cents from me.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

134. planet is wobbling per CNN

http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/science/12/29/quake.wobble.reut/index.html

[maxrandb]

136. It's Alll Clinton's Fault

Sorry, just couldn't resist.