death penalty vigil

[Beer Snob-50]

The first person in 40 years is being put to death in the state of CT at the end of the month and I would like to get a vigil going as a way of expressing our displeasure with this barbaric act. Has anyone every been involved in one or started one and can they give me some ideas of what has to be done to have one.

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bryant69]

2. Do you support it in this case?

I don't know very much about this case, not being from Conneticut, but if you have some information on why this person deserves to do, please share it.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[Cobalt Violet]

3. What situations is it okay for the state to kill someone?

:shrug:

[Beer Snob-50]

4. IN no situation is it okay for the state to kill someone

[maveric]

48. How about Ted Bundy or John Wayne Gacy?

Sexually brutal killers of women and children.

[Jack_DeLeon]

5. I support the death penalty...

I dont support it for all murderers, however I dont see anything wrong with it being used for some murders.

I would however like more info on this case just because I'm curious what the guy did.

[Ms. Toad]

6. You might want to join forces

with others already working:

http://www.dontkillinmynamect.org/
http://www.cnadp.org

Other resources (don't know if they have anything specific planned)

Connecticut
Amnesty International State Death Penalty Abolition Coordinator
26 Hans Avenue
Waterbury, CT 06708 4821
Robert Nave contact
203 757 3722 (day)
860 314 2785 (fax)
[e-mail]

Connecticut Civil Liberties Union
32 Grand Street
Hartford, CT 06106
Teresa Younger contact
860-247-9823 (day)
860-728-0287 (fax)

Connecticut Network to Abolish the
Death Penalty
571 Farmington Avenue
Hartford, CT 06105-3051
203-757-3722 (day)
[e-mail]

Connecticut Students Against the Death Penalty
Box 4596
222 Church Street
Middletown, CT 06459-4596
Nicole Henderson contact
860-685-7649 (day)
[e-mail]


A national group (one of many):
http://www.cuadp.org/upevents.html

Note to the folks whose posts are not responsive to the original post: Perhaps a discussion over whether the death penalty is appropriate could be moved to its own thread - Unless I am misreading the original request, the poster was asking for experienced advice, not discussion about whether the death penalty was a good thing or not.

[Beer Snob-50]

7. thank you!

this is what i have been looking for. because this is the first case in 40 years in this area, i was hopeing to get involved in some kind of vigil or protest.

[Ms. Toad]

9. Ohio started back up a few years ago

and was #2 behind Texas this past year. I hope CT doesn't follow the same path.

[Annus Horribilis]

8. Michael Ross Case?

The man who admitted to and was convicted of killing 8 women and raping them?

[Behind the Aegis]

10. How horrible!

Still, I do not support the death penalty for a few reasons. The most important one to me is personal and therefore, based in emotion. My opinion, as I can be a vindictive asshole, is that I do not think a person like that should be put to death because it really is no punishment. He should be made to sit in a cell (three hots and a cot) with nothing on the walls, except the crime scene photos and should be made to watch home movies of the people he murdered. But, then again, I am real ass when it comes to things like this!

[Annus Horribilis]

11. I agree

But, the fact is he won't sit in a cell with nothing. He will have a TV. He can read books. Work out. Maybe get an education. Make friends. The women he killed will never get to do any of this. That's why I support the death penalty in extreme cases like this.

[livinginphotographs]

14. So it's revenge you're after?

How very liberal of you. :eyes:

[Annus Horribilis]

15. I never said I was a "liberal"

And, in cases like this, I believe the correct punishment is death.

[Beer Snob-50]

16. does being a liberal mean you are soft on crime?

[Annus Horribilis]

20. No

I have met some liberals who are soft on crime and some conservatives who are. Me, along with many other Democrats including John Kerry, believe that for the worst crimes (like terrorism), the death penalty is justified.

[livinginphotographs]

19. The question still stands.

So it's purely revenge you're after?

[Annus Horribilis]

21. Nope

How can I be after revenge? This person didn't kill my mother or sister or anyone I knew. It's as simple as believing the death penalty is the correct punishment for Michael Ross.

[livinginphotographs]

23. But your entire reasoning behind killing him

is that it will somehow make it right that he killed someone else. You said: "But, the fact is he won't sit in a cell with nothing. He will have a TV. He can read books. Work out. Maybe get an education. Make friends. The women he killed will never get to do any of this. That's why I support the death penalty in extreme cases like this."

That sounds like revenge to me. Feel free to explain it further to me if I'm missing the point. :shrug:

[Annus Horribilis]

24. Not Revenge

Is putting him away for life without parole considered revenge? Is taking his freedoms away from him considered revenge? No, of course not. It's called punishment for his crimes. And it's my belief that the punishment for certain crimes should be death.

[livinginphotographs]

25. So do you think that I should be able to rob from someone

Who robbed from me?

If someone rapes my wife, should I get to rape their wife?

[Annus Horribilis]

26. Nope

When did I say I believed in the whole "eye for an eye" thing? But if someone robs you or rapes your wife he should be punished and sent to jail for a long time. And it wouldn't be revenge, but punishment.

[livinginphotographs]

27. The entire basis of your argument is "an eye for an eye."

He gets to continue breathing and the victim doesn't, therefore he should be deprived of breathing.

Don't know if you've ever been to prison, but it's not a country club. Death row means solitary confinement for ten years, so while it's not pleasant, there's no shankings, anal rape, abuse from the guards, etc.

[Jack_DeLeon]

32. Sometimes there isnt anything wrong with a little revenge...

I see nothing wrong with executing some murderers.

[Pithlet]

33. It's not justice

That is what is wrong with it. We have a justice system. Not a vengeance system. At least, that is how it is supposed to be.

Besides, there is one big, fat, irrefutable argument against the death penalty, and it can be expressed in one word. Texas. The haphazard and arbitrary way they implement the death penalty should serve as ample warning why no just society should go down that road.

[Jack_DeLeon]

38. The problem with the death penalty in Texas is...

that not enough people on juries are as willing to sentance more whites to the death penalty as they are to sentance blacks and hispanics.

[Pithlet]

40. It's a whole lot more than that.

Although that certainly plays into it. And you point out yet another point against the death penalty. Prejudice. That doesn't just exist in Texas.

I've often said that if I'm ever accused of anything, I'll waive my right to a jury trial. I do believe people should have the right to a jury trial, and don't want to see it abolished. I just won't have any part of it if I'm unfortunately ever faced with a trial. Not taking my chances with a jury. No way. With all the ignorance and prejudice out there, it's a crap shoot. Whether your actually innocent or guilty doesn't seem to factor into it.

[Jack_DeLeon]

41. Its certainly your right to waive a jury trial if you want to, but...

I would rather take my chances on the predjudices of 12 different jury members than the predjudices of a single judge.

[livinginphotographs]

34. I hope you're not a Christian...

Otherwise, I'm about to quote some Jesus on you.

[Jack_DeLeon]

37. I believe in Christ...

however no, I dont follow his teachings.

[Puglover]

45. Your M.O.

seems to be standard operation procedure for most "Christians" these days.

[ulysses]

42. there is if it's the state getting that revenge.

We might as well have lynch mobs. Revenge is absolutely not the proper role of government.

[FellowAmerican]

17. I agree . . .

the state could save itself a couple of million dollars over a lifetime to keep this killer alive in prison - money that would come from the taxpayers! When a person is found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt and when all scientific evidence (DNA) finds the person guilty, then the death penalty is the legal and just thing to do. It also serves as a deterrent to others who may think twice before committing the ultimate crime of murder.

IMO, of course.

[livinginphotographs]

22. Patently false.

(I've know we've gotten into it before, BTW. ;) )

In fact, I don't even know where to begin.

The death penalty is NOT cheaper. It costs millions more dollars to have a capital trial than a regular life-with-no-chance-of-parole trial. This has been documented time and time again.

As far as the deterrent, do drug laws deter people from doing drugs? Obviously not. Do shoplifting laws deter people from shoplifting? Obviously not. If someone's going to commit a crime, they either do it because the mentally incompetent (whether biologically-based or under the influence of some sort of substance) or because they believe that they will not be caught.

Do you really think murderers, while planning to kill someone, sit around and think, "Hmmm, I better not do this, because I might get the death penalty?"

And to say "beyond a reasonable doubt" is hubris, IMO. No human system can be 100% perfect, and that means executing innocent people. Even one innocent is too many for me.

Shall we dance again? ;) (I'm not trying to be confrontational, BTW, just joking).

[Pithlet]

30. There is no way to be 100% certain

Humans are not infallible. There is always the chance they are wrong. Even DNA evidence can be tampered with. And you can't undo the death penalty. As long as the death penalty exists, the possibility of an innocent person being executed exists. Is that really worth the price? Why not send them to prison the rest of their lives, so other innocent lives won't be risked?

No one who is pro-death penalty ever directly answers this. They will never admit that they think it is worth the price, because that sounds so horrible, so they just ignore the issue altogether. Meanwhile, innocent people have been put to death and it continues to happen, and all just to appease the "eye for an eye" crowd. Because, life in prison IS fit punishment. All the death penalty is really about is the eye for an eye argument.

[FellowAmerican]

35. You make it sound as if the majority

of those on death row are innocent! Don't you know that prisons are filled with innocent people!! I don't have the figures or facts on this but I would wager to say that the majority of the those on death row are truly guilty. IMO, if you do the crime you are subject to the consequence of your actions as they apply to the laws of your particular state.

I like to ask those against the death penalty = what if your mother and sister were brutally and savaged raped, tortured and murdered? What if it were your daughter or son? What if they found the killer, covered in their blood, with the murder weapon in hand and your loved one in the trunk, would you feel that "life" in prison is fair? Meaning guilt beyond any and all reasonable doubt - what would you feel? It's one of those questions that you can't truthfully answer unless is actually happens to you. Allot of people firmly believe one way, until it happens to them. I just happen to feel that it is not right that the killer gets life, and the victims get death.

[Pithlet]

36. No, I don't.

Saying that there is no way to be certain in no way states that I think the majority of those on death row are innocent. But, that is irrelevant, anyway. It doesn't matter if ALL the people on death row are guilty. It still doesn't change the fact that there is no way to be 100% sure. Since instating the death penalty RISKS executing the innocent, it isn't worth it? See?

If a loved one of mine was brutally murderd I'd want the fucker to pay with his life. But, that isn't what the justice system is about. I certainly don't want other people to pay for satisfying my blood lust and revenge.

[FellowAmerican]

43. Well, it is what the justice system is about

if the state laws say so. If a state has the death penalty, and you are found guilty of murder, then that is the punishment. It's not about revenge or blood thirst. It's about the law, and it is about our justice system.

[Solon]

49. So you are willing to risk the chance that an innocent life will be put...

to death? Just to be clear, you think that "most" people on death row are guilty, but leave the possibility open that some are innocent. What is to be done with them? Are they to be killed to, how is that different from murder?

[Bill McBlueState]

12. I'd like to know what you find out

I and probably others in Massachusetts would like to be involved in whatever comes about. We need to keep red state "values" out of New England.

[Beer Snob-50]

18. I am slso from MA but this is right in my backyard

[indigo32]

13. I'm against it in all cases

I'm not in CT though.

[Solon]

28. Why is it...

than when DP supporters come out to defend the practice, they only say it is for some cases, or only should be implemented when guilt is absolute, like DNA evidence(regardless of what happened at the FBI lab). Why do they only talk about these idealized situations, when in reality, there are no such restrictions. I have a question for DP supporters, do you support the Death Penalty, in the United States, as it is implemented NOW?

[Pithlet]

31. Because

They know their position isn't really all that tenable, but at the same time they just can't get rid of that feeling that killing for killing is the only right thing to do. So, they either cling to the false hope that evidence can be 100% correct and completely damnable, or they think the cost of the risk of executing an innocent is worth it, even if they wouldn't come out and say it.

[rednitej]

29. Huge site full of resources-

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/

[newyawker99]

44. Hi rednitej!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[rednitej]

47. Thanks!

I've actually been here for a while- thought I'd finally get my own username so that I could post away!

:hi: back!

[Tace]

39. No Help On Vigil -- But Death Penalty Is Morally Wrong

It's wrong to kill people.

Duh!

On Edit: Changed "ethically" to "morally" in header

[Beer Snob-50]

46. thanks to everyone for the links