Why do some people get so upset when DUers talk about leaving the US?

[LeftCoast]

Americans have a long tradition of moving to better opportunities. The vast majority of us come from familes who moved here precisely because they hoped they would find more opportunity. Even within the country people will move thousands of miles for better jobs (or even just better weather). America still provides many people the hope of a better future, but there are lots of us here on DU who could do just as well, if not better, elsewhere.

I've often heard people argue that no matter what, we must stay here and fight, but I'd like to ask why? Do you really believe that we must fight to keep America on track toward some sort of manifest destiny? That America is somehow, by it's very nature, better than all other countries? If you do, I think you're buying into the RW jingoism.

America is a powerful country which has at times been an example to the rest of the world. I hope it can be again, but what if that doesn't happen? How long should a person stay and fight? I look back at our history and I see a country in decline. Used to be that a family here could have a good standard of living supported only by a single income. How many families do you know that could survive with only one wage-earner these days?

Socially, while things were hardly perfect, at least society seemed to have the goal of greater equality and social justice. When was the last time that was even an issue? Who cares about the growing legions of homeless? The environment? Anything other than the almighty buck?

I'm not saying we should emigrate en masse, but I'm not going to criticize someone for wanting a better life for themselves. The fact is, even if we (Democrats) started winning elections again it will take DECADES for this country to get on the right path. Is it a surprise then, that people look across our northern border with longing?

Stay and fight...I commend you, but don't piss on others who are simply doing what Americans have done since the Pilgrims - moving to find a better life.

[Sandpiper]

1. Love it or leave it!!!

Seriously though, I think it's because some interpret it as a sign of surrender.

[LeftCoast]

5. We've been getting our ass kicked

For some, it could be seen as survival (thinking of gays and lesbians).

[jpgray]

Because too many people can't leave

And for those of us not willing to just abandon them, we need all the help we can get.

[candy]

2. My country,right or wrong----

but right or wrong,my country.

I'm stayin'.

[Done]

3. If too many of us leave...

some of these countries may close the gates on Americans, and I won't be able to get out.

[bryant69]

4. It depends on why they are doing it

Or I should say why they say they are doing it. I got no problem with people leaving America to better their lives. But often times those posts are accompanied with a bit about how America is no longer worth saving, we American liberals are kidding ourselves if we think something can be salvaged here, and so on and so forth. Defeatism.

I got no problem with someone deciding they can find a better life elsewhere, but I do have a problem with someone saying that we should give up on America.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[LeftCoast]

6. I'm not giving up on the place yet

But the light at the end of the tunnel better get turned back on quick!

:)

[murray hill farm]

9. i am an expat

and i really do feel better about my life outside of the usa. i have not given up on the usa...and, really just bought a little house in Georgia..one to return to if and when i need or want to return there to live...for now i use it for visits. But, for now, i stay in mexico...it is calmer here...safer...more tranquil. I do understand the love it or leave it train of thought of some..and also the thought that if you love your country, to stay and fight for the belief that it is your country right or wrong..it is still your country. I do not hate my country...i have not given up on my country, but..for now...i will continue to live in mexico. One of the things i like most about the usa though...is that right or wrong..we all are intitled to our own decisions and beliefs on this..or any other issue...and that all are intitled to our own opinions...what is right for me to do, may not be Ok for another.

[LeftCoast]

10. The thing that's really scaring me

is that it seems like it's becoming less 'ok' to believe things that the RW doesn't support.

[murray hill farm]

12. yes..and i believe more so everyday!

which, i guess, is one of the reasons why i sort of wait it out...to see what happens in the usa...and also, i wait it out in paradise..on a tiny mexican caribbean island..which also is pleasant. I do as much here..via internet..and returning to vote, etc. as i could do to fight the good fight from the usa, but i sure enjoy my life here in the mean time.

[LeftCoast]

15. Sounds like heaven

I better start working on my Spanish. :)

[IStriker]

7. If you can find place that better suits your views that will accept you...

and you can afford the move and can find work, why would you stay here regardless of who is elected?

[mattclearing]

8. Because they can't see the writing on the wall.

eom

[tk2kewl]

11. I think its nationalistic RW crap to disparage those who want to leave

I am a citizen of the world and my religion is to do good

-Tom Paine

[proud patriot]

13. Probably because we don't want to be left alone

to fight these bastards

[LeftCoast]

16. Just because they leave doesn't mean they can't fight

Overseas votes count just as much as the rest and the internet has brought us all closer together. Fighting does not necessarily mean one has to stay.

[proud patriot]

24. True true I hadn't thought of that

perhaps they are assuming a change of citizenship
like I just did :D

[dreamcollector]

14. I think American foreign policy stinks and has always done so

From your treatment of the natives and black slaves to your conquest of Mexico and your attempts to conquer Canada and so on. I don't know why Americans believe the prettified version of America ---"beacon of light and freedom to the world". (Read CONFESSIONS OF AN ECONOMIC HIT MAN John Perkins). Half my family still lives in the U.S. and my mother's branch of the family traces back to the first colony. My father's family left at the time of the Revolution. Those who came to Canada (apart from my mother who married a Canadian) did so because they had moral objections to the American way. Canada was built by people who left the U.S. because they disapproved. Whenever your country does something particularly immoral we get a fresh influx of new Canadians.What is cowardly or "giving up" about leaving because your county's government is just plain immoral? I would be deeply deeply ashamed to be an American now. My heart aches for the Iraqis. I wouldn't leave now though cuz I'd have been gone way back during Vietnam. I wouldn't pay taxes to support the things your government gets up to. I think it's immoral to stay there. Most of your taxes go to arms for immoral wars against countries that have not attacked you. What is there to be proud of and "patriotic" about? I'd sooner be a Swede or a Frenchperson any day. I'm too old to leave Canada and have children and grandchildren here. Were I young I'd leave cuz we're just to dang close to you for comfort. Sorry. I think there are many hundreds of thousands or millions of wonderful Americans but your country is run by greedy and murderous corporations.

[Karenina]

23. Oh, dreamcollector!

I just recovered from a fit of uncontrollable laughter after reading,

"Were I young I'd leave cuz we're just to dang close to you for comfort. Sorry."

BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Spit, sputter, BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Shit, there it goes again...

WELCOME to DU!!! :spank:

BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Spit, sputter, BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[Bridget Burke]

17. Personally, I believe it's envy.

And, yes, it's envy that I've felt myself. For quite a few of us, it's just not possible to leave the USA. Most countries require a marketable profession and/or tons of money. I'm at that awkward stage--too old to start over & too young to retire.

If someone wants to leave, they've got every right. If they can afford it, good for them. But why do they come whining here to get permission?

[LeftCoast]

19. That's a good point

But the response most people give isn't that. It's more the "love it or leave it" argument (which has never made any sense to me).

[murray hill farm]

21. it does not take tons of money!

it really does not..to live in another country, but it does perhaps take adjusting to a lifestyle that is different than what u are used to living with in the usa. If you choose to live simply..and that will mean perhaps not having a car...living without airconditioning..eating local food..you can live for very much less than u would think. If you choose to maintain the life style of the american way...yep..tons of money. I have here an fm3 retirement visa..which means only that i can stay here for 12 monthes with out renewal. my soc security is my income..and it really is very little. my SO lives with me, he does not receive social security..too young..like you! He must leave mexico and return, to renew his tourist visa every 6 months..and he has no requirement to show income. YOu could do the same as he does, but..yes..in might require a change in life style.

[Done]

18. If we can't stop the neocons, is anybody really safe?....anywhere?

[LeftCoast]

20. Well on that front, we spend how many trillion$ and we can't even win

in Iraq. If things got to the point were America was nuking other nations, nobody'd be left, here or in another country.

[Donkeyboy75]

22. I don't think it's one reason.

Some think it unpatriotic, others maybe are jealous, others think we should all stay in the U.S. and fight the good fight. Some reasons are good, others aren't.