How do you get Freepers to pay attention?

[wickerwoman]

It's all well and good to ridicule them, to feel superior, to feel dirty and diminished in their presence, to hope they just go away... but the fact is there are a lot of them and they vote. I have a few in my family. You probably do too.

At the end of the day, we're the party that believes in inclusion; that believes that talk works. And in our defensiveness and confidence in our own righteousness, we haven't been talking to them very effectively. There are two kinds of teachers in the world: the ones who see students aren't paying attention and get pissed off and resentful towards the students, and the ones who see students aren't paying attention and ask "what can I change to make my lessons sink in better?" I'd like to be the second kind of teacher for the purposes of this thread.

Thinking back over past Freeper reactions, what has sunk in? They don't respond to reason and they certainly don't respond to ridicule. They don't respond to appeals to a higher good or evil or any sense of fairness and justice. They don't respond to having their own hypocrisy pointed out to them.

I can think of one issue where they were on the right side. Many Freepers railed against the Patriot Act as fiercely as we did. And why? Fear. "What if the Democrats get back in office and they have these powers? They'll hunt us down in our sleep, suck our blood, force us into gay marriages and steal our guns."

We need to harness that fear and paranoia because by a strange twist of fate, it IS justified. They can't associate it with their own guy, but somewhere deep in the Freeper Id, they know that something is wrong with what's going on in government today.

So when Freeper relatives say Armstrong Williams doesn't matter. It's no big deal. We need to come back, not with "WTF is the matter with you? Of course it matters because...", but with "What if Bill Clinton was caught paying radio commentators to promote his health care plan?" "What if Bill Clinton was caught authorizing torture?" "What if Bill Clinton outed a CIA agent to stop her investigation?"

The Clenis is still our friend, and their fear of it, even more so.

[Liberal Veteran]

1. Threaten to have the 10 C's tatooed on a sexual organ...

...and you'll have their undivided attention, but not in a good way.

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ThoughtCriminal]

2. Quote Jesus

They really have trouble figuring out how to deal with it when conflict between religious right dogma and the actual teachings of Jesus clash.

[wickerwoman]

4. I've tried, but I've already outed myself as an atheist.

Their response is "well, you don't know anything about it. You're an atheist."

Like I said before, pointing out their hypocrisy tends to make them shut down and get defensive. I want to channel their anger and fear into an active political response (not voting for Bush.)

[GreenPartyVoter]

15. Tell them even atheists can appreciate a great philosopher. ;^)

[Ladyhawk]

25. The problem is reading the bible contributed to my becoming...

...an atheist. If more fundies would read their bibles, there would be fewer fundies.

But, yeah, they don't listen to me, either. All I did was quote Jesus.

[Nimrod]

3. I've heard a 2x4 works pretty good

:)

[yankeedem]

5. Make them outcasts

Seriously....
Freepers are basically followers. They only survive because they think everyone agrees with them. It's the "in" thing to put down Kerry for being a flip-flopper, for calling Ted Kennedy a murderer, etc.

Next time they send a chain email, or start making fun of democrats at the water cooler, confront them WITH MALICE. I've been doing it since September and you'd be surprised how quickly you get support. The freeper puts their tail between their legs and shuts the hell up. Show them that, unlike Congressional Democrats, you will actually stand up to the right wing ideas.

See, Hannity and Oxy Rush tell them 6 hours a day how Democrats are wimps, how Democrats are dumb, and feed them talking points. When their talking points are challenged, they fall like a house of cards because they are based on NOTHING. Trust me, they don't challenge you again.

Edit: How do we change them to our side? When they find out that what the Right Wing talk show hosts have been telling them is false, they start to think. And slowly, some "thought" enters the horizon. Then is when we can start showing them the light.

[Bouncy Ball]

23. I agree with yankeedem, completely

[BlackCoffeeSound]

6. Might as well say...

Since I am new, I might as well own up to my past.

When I was 22, I joined the college republicans, a newbie to politics and bought hook line and sinker the spiel on states rights, small govt, blah blah blah and I ran with it. The following months after 9/11, I saw no one in the White House that exhibited any of the qualities I had believed to exist when I had voted for the man. Since then I have kept my mind open to all sides of the debate knowing that somewhere between both sides' rhetoric, the truth lies. More often than not, it seems to be

That being said, the final straw came in the last few years. I would lurk on Free Republic, searching for people who upheld the so-called "conservative" beliefs that I did (small government,adherence to the Bill of Rights, staying out of the problems of other countries). However, I have always been a liberal socially and the hypocrisy of the right when it came to "letting the people rule themselves, less govt, etc" when issues of gay rights, drugs, etc came into play.

Apparently it was our God given right to tell people "what's up" when it came to those things.

Where am I going with this? Well, since lurking over there initially for entertainment value, it began to lose its value day after day. The same people that cracked me up for believing that banning smoking, the greenhouse effect, SUV discrimination, etc were all left-wing radical ideas were now infuriating me with their obvious "kill em' all, let God sort em' out" bullshit. One doesn't have to look far to find that crap over there. Just check out the Tsunami threads where people said "Tough shit. I have no tolerance for Muslims to begin with." And the level of free speech and public discourse rates about an F. If you even remotely criticize the so-called "conservative" administration, you were booted and there was nothing you could appeal to those f'ing scary ass moderators.

Since then, I turned my back completely on this neo-conservative movement and realized the glory days of conservative ideals about a non-intrusive government were long gone and the neo-conservatives only applied rights to gun owners and not for people who were gay, smoked pot, and pled for a public discourse. It's pretty clear to me now that I was barking up the wrong tree to begin with.

I am really glad to be here at DU. I may not always agree with everything ANY political philosophy stands for 100% but I sure know that what I am looking for is NOT with the people of Free Republic anymore, nor did it ever I realize now. I like the people over here, I like the ideas, and I like the level of discourse and love of country. It's a damn scary place to live these days when you're living under a neo-Wilsonian administration.

Hope to see you all around.

[wickerwoman]

10. Welcome to DU!

It sounds like you like it here for all the reasons I like it here. :-)

I think the lies of the right have confused a lot of people about their political orientation. Fifteen years ago I would have been slightly left of center. Today, without really changing many of my core beliefs, I would probably test out as a communist on the political spectrum laid out by the media.

I'm glad to see that things like intellectual honesty are still valued out there.

[BlackCoffeeSound]

11. thank yah

Yeah, all I look for in a place of discussion is simply THAT: discussion. It's going the way of the Dodo Bird. Currently reading The War on Our Freedoms and it's just opening more doors for me. After taking a "political quiz" on the Christian Science Monitor to determine if I was a neo-conservative or not, I found out that I was an Isolationist which probably makes me a Libertarian. Whatever, you know? Beats being a GD neoconservative, know what I mean?

[Cats Against Frist]

12. Welcome to DU

I've a slightly different story. The freepers drove me to being a libertarian, from being a Democrat, all my life. I still agree with most everything Democratic, I've just changed my opinion on how to get those things. I'm kind of a girl without a political party, but DU is the best -- they do welcome a lot of different people, and there are a lot of varied opinions here.

Welcome! :hi:

[tx_dem41]

14. Welcome to DU, BlackCoffeeSound...

Can I just call you BCS?

Thanks for the introduction you gave us. It always helps to know where people are coming from.

:toast:

[BlackCoffeeSound]

16. sho'

You bet ya can. Ha ha, it kinda felt like confession, ya know?

[tx_dem41]

21. We all have lots to confess...

...although your's was a doozy! :-)

[proud patriot]

24. Confront the stereotypes they've been fed by Rush and the likes

[Taxloss]

29. Welcome!

The great thing about the left wing is how conservative it is in some respects. The state doesn't own you.

[FreakinDJ]

7. Tell them...."God said to me"

just like Bushit does

[wildflower]

8. I think that's a good suggestion.

There are certain trigger words/ideas that are anathema to us, and certain ones for them. What's interesting is how we're actually on the same side in some ways.

Sometimes, what they call 'communism' we call 'fascism,' but we'll be talking about the same thing. For example, when both sides were very upset about the forced mental health screening.

-wildflower

[Dees]

9. Give up. They are too busy lying and scat eating. Years

ago, after I was banned of course, I learned their isn't a half a brain on the entire FR.com site. Morans and primates. Who else would adore Nixon, North, Lushball, Hannity, MonkeyNuts, Wolfowitz, Raygun, Armstrong, Cheney, Gingrich, Bennett, Falwell, Poppy, Rummy, PNAC, Federalist Society, Heritage Foundation, Cato, O'Lieley, Frist, Delay, Hastert, Agnew, Mitchell, Watt, Robertson, Reed, Bauer, Ann the Man, Washington Times, NY Post, Novak, Sanitarium, Giuliani, Carlson, Paige, Privatization, Iraq, Kristol, Hume, Barr, Murdock, E.D., Lott, Thurmond, Jebby, Tort reform, SDI, WMD, Oil, Iran Contra and Pickles.

[wickerwoman]

13. I just can't accept that as an alternative.

How can we combat the increasing polarization in this country if we refuse to even acknowledge the other side?

There are people at FR with half a brain. They opposed the Patriot Act and mandatory mental health screening, as wildflower pointed out. If we can skim off the libertarians that's a damn good start.

Why do they get away with calling us elitists when the Dems are the ones looking after their interests? Because we call them morons and refuse to talk to them. Maybe some of them are morons, but that's still not an excuse to turn our backs on them.

[BlackCoffeeSound]

17. naaaah....

Don't count on too many free thinkers over there. It's a crapshoot of having your membership revoked if you even remotely post something "outside of the box". No, having been there for a few years, it's nothing more than a police state. Someone just posted the article about Black Thursday and they were immediately suspended for doing nothing more than posting the article. Give up on most Freepers. If they have any sense, they will move on to other message boards. Its a freaking police state X10 over there. Scary business. Hey, that's why I'm here! Screw those idiots.

[Dees]

18. Are Dems really doing the polarizing in this country?

And, maybe I just hit Freerepublic at one of their more bigoted, hate filled and candid moments. If your after converts...go for it and best of luck. Know your enemy and make have no doubt about it, Freepers are the enemy. I'm not ready to hold hands quite yet. BTW, I would never turn my back on a Repug...

[wickerwoman]

19. Of course we're not the ones doing the polarizing,

but some things we do make it easy for them to stick the label "elitist" on us and ignore everything else we say. And calling them morons to their faces or ignoring them completely doesn't really accomplish anything (except making us feel better).

I'm using Freeper here in a broader sense- not just people who post on the website but people out the world who have the same viewpoint but aren't rabid enough (or hooked up to the internet) to post on the website. I'd count my born-again aunt in the later category. And since I have to see her at Thanksgiving and her kids' weddings and she brings up politics, I'm looking for an effective way to bring home my points that won't cause her to shut down.

Ignorance and intolerance can't be the twenty ton gorilla in the room that no one wants to talk about. These people are our coworkers and family members not some blips out in cyberspace. And ignoring them creates the climate in which they breed best.

[Dees]

28. It is tough. I use the term moron (moran) in a collective sense.

My wife's family is over the edge right wing. I deal with the sniping, innuendo and Clenis attacks almost on a daily basis. I've defended myself and the Democratic party with outrage, logic, humanistic compassion and reams and reams of factual data. Every thing I offered up was labeled "left wing" propaganda. I'm not a far lefty. I consider myself to be a moderate/progressive. My point is, over the years I've tried every debate tactic I know to simply defend my positions. I don't find anything moderate or accepting in the far right's dogma.

[BlackCoffeeSound]

30. oh

Didn't you hear? We're at war.

[BlackCoffeeSound]

20. well..

When you do "hit" Free Republic, know that it will probably be your only shot. They don't just ban accounts, they ban your ISP from ever posting there again. Ruthless mothers, they are. I've been banned 3+ times since 2000.

Seriously, it would be fun to be able to just tear apart 80% of the people that post there but the entire set up is so similar to media anyway. They're only gonna let the information they WANT to come through. Anything remotely dissenting will be chalked up as "trolling" and you can kiss your account goodbye and the rest of the yahoos scream "Sayanora, punk".

Besides, you wanna hang out with people like this?




Ugh, I could vomit right now

[Dees]

26. Exactly right and welcome!

[Bouncy Ball]

22. Sigh.

When people advocate things that are IMMORAL and are convinced they are right, what in the world would work?

I don't have the energy anymore. I spent two years talking to real life freepers until I was blue in the face.

A good strategy is to focus on the fence sitting ones. The ones who have milder right wing POVs or who are kind of apolitical but prone to RW talking points from the mass media.

[Rush1184]

27. Look, overthere...

A newly married, inter-racial, gay, islamic couple!!!

Yell that at a republican meeting and see what happens!

j/k

[GreenPartyVoter]

31. Have Martin Sheen give Michael Moore an award *lol*