How'd Condi Get a Ph.D.?

[SoDesuKa]

The senators of the Foreign Relations Committee fell all over themselves praising Doctor Rice for her "brilliance." But I thought her responses were trite and somewhat shopworn. I know that in her career she's managed to snag a Ph.D., but she doesn't come across as scholarly.

She reminds me of George Will, who never uses a small word when a big one will do. Rice frequently employed rhetorical flourishes when she could have said the same things fairly simply. At first it was a distraction; then it became annoying.

I haven't read Rice's dissertation but on the basis of her performance before the Senate, I suspect it's neither original nor signficant. Otherwise, in the intervening years, where did her sophistication go? Did she simply forget what she learned?

[rwenos]

1. She's a University of Denver Product

She's definitely smart, but she's tres arrogant, reflecting what looks like a career of getting too much power, too soon, without the maturity to temper it.

I understand the faculty at Stanford hate her guts. All cuts, no goodies.

[AllyCat]

3. No wonder I don't like her

I went to Colorado College. DU is our archrival :)

[librechik]

12. not only that, but her "adopted Dad" was head of the department

so it's a miracle she passed any of her classes (snort)

I graduated from DU twice. Condi spoke at my MFA graduation ceremony in 96. I shook her hand. Her cold, death-like hand. :scared:

DU used to be pretty good, back when I first went there in the late 60s. Condi graduated in 74 I think. It really went downhill around then. I blame Condi.

[JHB]

25. So she was the "fair haired boy", so to speak...

...just to use the "Old Boy" term for playing favorites.

[vikegirl]

26. Really?

Damn. I'm currently taking graduate classes at DU. Now I guess my education is tainted. :-(

[Seabiscuit]

2. Answer: wearing out her kneepads.

[FM Arouet666]

4. That is how she got the gap in her teeth. n/t

[Mabus]

5. and with no dates

she had nothing else to do in college. There are fewer mirrors in a library than there are in dorms. She had to increase her chances of not being revealed for the succubus she is by hanging out at the libraries.

Right? :shrug:

[oscar111]

9. Stewardesses smile and talk at same time:Rice scowls and talks at once

Powell at least was plesant to look at.. he looked dignified.

Rice is hard to look at.. always that scowl.

I predict that like Cheney {snarler}, the more the public sees of rice, the better for us.. the public will be turned off by the scowl.

Did you know she has an oil tanker named after her? Think it was a supertanker.

Does condoleza mean anything?

[Mabus]

14. I think the tanker is Chevron's

but I'm looking it up.

on edit: http://butsowhat.com/

"W" selected members of his cabinet who are the wealthiest of any administration in U.S. history. His "poorest millionaire," Condoleza Rice, has a Chevron oil tanker named after her.

[SoDesuKa]

21. Chevron Tanker

Here is the Chevron tanker. It has since been renamed the Altair Voyager.




http://aztlan.net/oiltanker.htm

[fortyfeetunder]

6. OK guys...knock it off

She is an intelligent person, I don't doubt her academic credentials.

But wouldn't you agree she is misguided in her brownnosing the Bush adminstration?

[TaleWgnDg]

8. Yup. Agreed. Dr. Rice is brilliant; however, she's bowing

b4 the wrong "god," George Walker Bush. And does she sound it too!


.

[PurityOfEssence]

17. She is not "brilliant"; she is average with a need to be lauded

Brilliant people can answer questions off-script.

She is a classic compensating academic: she needs the sanctification of advanced degrees to make her unassailable.

Her very need to be worshiped is the core of her being; this is why she was so rankled by Boxer's impugning of her integrity. Her image is everything to her. Disavowing any advantage she may have garnered as a black or a woman, she, like the odious Clarence Thomas, credits all of her success to her personal superiority.

She's a sad individual, and she'll spend the rest of her days burnishing her reputation. As a spokesperson she's hideous: she reeks dishonesty, quivers in fear, and evades anything posed to her with barely concealed hatred.

[immoderate]

22. Bingo! The Wizard of Oz Effect...

Scarecrow asks the wizard for a brain. The wizard says, "I can't give you a brain, but I can give you a diploma.

I have seen no evidence of intellectual creativity in Rice. From what I know, she got her academics in Russian studies when there was a USSR.

She rattles much too easily to be a good diplomat or even a politician.

--IMM

[TaleWgnDg]

40. With all due respect, yes, Dr. Condoleezza Rice is brilliant . . .

With all due respect, yes, Dr. Condoleezza Rice is brilliant . . . her curriculum vitae speaks well of her as does her many other achievements. Stanford U provost? Graduating cum laude at the age of 19 w/ a bachelor's degree? Phi Beta Kappa? a master's at age 20? and she speaks four languages? Awww, come down off your pedestal of anti-academia. Bashing academia sounds more Bush-like than a member of the Democratic Party!

You may disagree with her politics as well as her political relationships as do I, but don't attempt to dump on her intellect for it doesn't bode well upon you.

http://www.tau.ac.il/jcss/condy.htm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/3609327.stm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condi_Rice

.

[progressoid]

36. I don't think I've ever heard a brilliant statement come out of her mouth

EVER!

[babylonsister]

16. Misguided possibly, but she's not a dumb ass.

But she is also towing my line, the * line. I think we showed some balls today, i.e., Boxer , Kerry, and the great shout out from those who disagee w/ the Bush admin.
We took baby steps today, but the best is yet to come!

[ProfessorGAC]

23. Read Her Dissertation

It's available through almost any college library. (Probably costs a few bucks. I don't have to pay.)

Then let me know if you have the same certainty about her academic credentials.
The Professor

[Cocoa]

29. why don't you doubt her credentials?

fine if you don't, but why? Are you basing this on anything, or just accepting someone's word that she's "brilliant?"

I actually think it's a good question, is she really as qualified as everyone says?

[fortyfeetunder]

41. Knew of her long before she got tangled in the Bush

I've read numerous articles about her. There is no doubt from her bios and a few of her writings shows she is brilliant for an academic. She is just horribly misguided.

[TaleWgnDg]

7. Merely b/c one is addressed as "doctor" does not then mean

Merely b/c one is addressed as "doctor" does not then mean that one has achieved an academic doctorate such as a Ph.D. It may mean another academic doctorate. However, I have not a clue as what field of academic study Dr. Rice acquired her doctorate.

BTW, there's a difference between an academic doctorate and a professional doctorate. Am I boring you yet? Heh.

.

[oscar111]

11. tel us more of the difference..

i have heard md's are not doctors in truth.. it is an old traditon that is all error.

I once heard that a true academ. doctor must do original research of significance.

Medics .. what we ought to call md's.. do no orig research.. just memorize what is already known.
From what i have seen as a patient, the claims of hard study and intelligence are vastly overblown.
Surveys keep showing they dont keep up with the latest treatments and patients dont get good care.. 20 nation outlive us.

some are good, most are just greedheads. Like Frist.

I think in Eng, they are called something more accurate.. is it Clinicians?

In italy, BTW, dentists must first finish med school.

Long ago, as you know, barbers did the surgery on folks. So i have heard.. correct if wrong.

[autorank]

10. Ph.D. from the Graduate School of Intl. Studies, Univ. of Denver.

She's a ringer. OK Denver's a nice city, blablabla but U of D, international studies, give me a break.

From the U of Denver site:

Freshman admissions compared to national averages:

SAT (DU=Denver University)

DU Average Verbal 571 Math 576 Lying 800 Sociopathy 800
National "....Verbal 507 Math 519 Lying 300 Sociopathy 250

[vikegirl]

34. really depressed now....

....I was so happy when I got accepted at the DU graduate program. :cry:

[autorank]

38. vikegirl, Ignore Me, I'm a "Moran"

It's a very good school and these are undergraduate scores. I was just being casual in slamming an otherwise fine school to make a cheap (but accurate) point about Herr Doktor Rice. Many apologies. Enjoy graduate school.

[autorank]

39. I'm an even bigger Jerk than I estimated. Welcome to DU!!!

Sorry for the cheap shot. Geez, a new user. I truly am a MORAN.

[diamond14]

43. U of Denver is a PRIVATE school for RICH white people....

if you can afford the tuition/fees/social expenses, you WILL get a degree....

I'm sure condi was a 'novelty item' at that school....


BTW, INTERNATIONAL for Denver is basically flying to Mexico....in fact, MEXICO is the ONLY International DIRECT flight out of "Denver INTERNATIONAL Airport"....


If condi wanted to be academically competitive in Colorado, she would have TRIED to get into U of Colorado.....

[Greybnk48]

13. Rice is clearly articulate

And still seems to be playing the precocious child. When asked yesterday if she was tired late in the day she clearly was not. She loved performing like a trained poodle. She is intelligent, but not wise. She is more of a data processor than a thinker. I believe that her dissertation would reveal that. She probably collated other people's work in an unique way. I doubt you will find anything original that's interesting.

I am several months from earning my Ph.D. (U.W. Madison) and have attended two graduate programs. Grad schools have a fair share of Condis--intelligent and clever, but not wise. Earning the degree is just another trick they can do that some others cannot.

What frightened me yesterday and today was her apparent enjoyment at a chance to perform in front of an audience. At times she reminded me of Ken Starr who I believe is a socio-path. She did not seem to appreciate the gravity of the situation. Scary.

[SoDesuKa]

19. Condi's Writings

During the confirmation hearings, Senators were unable to get her to offer her own thinking about the events of the past four years. Joe Biden directly challenged her to cite some lessons learned from mistakes the government has made. Condi didn't budge. She claimed that history is still developing and that it's too early. This is a very unreflective answer coming from someone with a earned Ph.D.

I wonder what has happened to Condi's writings - they never come up in any discussion about her. Did she continue writing after her dissertation, or did she simply vegetate? If there is a body of work that shows how she thinks about political issues, it could have been used as the basis for more effective questions. Does she agree with her own writings, or does she agree with George Bush?

[ProfessorGAC]

27. I've Read Some Of Them

They are available through most university libraries, for a fee (i think, since i don't have to pay for them). I read her dissertation and some published work from the Stanford days. She is not the smartest person ever to receive an advanced degree! (Probably not the dumbest either. Li'l Georgie has an MBA for goodness sake!)

The work is generally flat, lacks in depth understanding, and requires BROAD assumptions as to certain inherent human behaviors to make the conclusions valid.

She is NOT an impressive adademic. She's a politician through and through. It's obviously how she got through grad school, how she got the job at Stanford, how she ended up, at her age and lack of experience on Exxon, and how she got her current job. All flash, no substance.
The Professor

[Skittles]

15. I'm guessing she is better at putting stuff on paper

than she is at doing ANYTHING else

[Seabiscuit]

18. Speaking of stuff on paper

it looked like she was reading crib-notes throughout the hearings - or at least the part I watched. E.g., when John Kerry asked her whether the administration's position is as described in the magazine article he was referring to regarding Iran, she looked down at her desk for awhile and then reiterated that the administration's position is that "the article is full of inacuracies". So he asked the same question again. Same look down. Same answer. He stared at her incredulously and said: "with respect to IRAN (raising his voice, somewhat)." Same answer. He just shook his head and moved on.

[Cleita]

20. Same way *w got his MBA, C-H-E-A-T-I-N-G.

Whether either one got someone else to do the work for them or if department heads were intimidated or bribed by them, they cheated. It's so obvious after one leaves the academic halls to know who cheated and who didn't.

I worked with many who had degrees at different level of achievement and often scratched my head at how dumb and uninformed, even in their field, some of them were. I had to come to the conclusion that they didn't get their degrees honestly. It really shows after you have to prove yourself in the world. No title or piece of paper can cover up for your lack of education.

Condi, I understand, is a Sovietologist and speaks fluent Russian. I have never heard her speak Russian and I don't know anyone who has said they heard her speak Russian. Even if she were an expert on the Soviet Union, it doesn't exist anymore and she really has no training or competency for worldwide diplomacy.

[wadestock]

24. The use of "DR" is being stretched every day....

When I was a kid, only people who were MDs were addressed as "doctors".

Since 30 years in R&D, I've seen the use of doctor as a "greeting" being more and more abused.

My personal experience is those that are content with their work and have any real respect in whatever field generally drop the designation most of the time. I think back, and many of the best people I've worked with I only find are PHDs AFTER I've known them for a while.

Although I'm obviously generalizing, it is those that are insecure with their work and/or themselves that seem to push the designation.

[theboss]

28. This is getting ridiculous

As I said before, I don't think she should be Secretary of State.

But if Freepers were attacking the credentials of a liberal black woman simply because they did not like her, we would rightly be up in arms over it.

So far this week, Rice has been called a token, has been called ugly, and has essentially been called a whore.

I'm glad we are progressives.

[ProfessorGAC]

30. Please Read One Of My Posts, Boss

I have read her papers. She's not a competent academic. I didn't use any epithets and didn't insult her. I honestly believe she's just an expert at playing "the game" and deserves NONE of the positions she's held.

Not all of us are shooting from the hip.
The Professor

[theboss]

32. That's fair

I'm from an Ivy-League background and certainly understand that there is a "game" at play when receiving doctorates or professorships. But a lot of these attacks on her seem based on little more than personal dislike.

[DistantWind88]

37. Professor

You did it again. In YOUR opinion she's not a "competent academic." The folks who granted her PhD, selected her for full professorship, and who selected her to be Provost of Stanford obviously have a different opinion.

[tishaLA]

31. I think Madeline Albright's father directed her dissertation

so if it was neither original nor significant, perhaps we should scold Prof. Albright for allowing a student to present and defend an inferior piece of scholarship. That said, I know nearly nothing about Sovietology or public policy nor do I know anything about Denver's reputation as a Ph.D. granting institution, and an inferior or derivative dissertation might have been the norm for Denver. Who knows?

But to suggest that she got her dissertation on her knees is out of bounds IMHO. Women in academia (and particularly "women of color") often get tarred with this slander and, while I am no fan of her ideas or policies, such as they are, the sexist underpinnings of those comments demean Rice's accusers more than Rice herself.

[nlik]

33. Sure...

"Condi Rice was born in Birmingham Alabama of Jamaican parents November 14, 1954. She entered University at age 15 with the intention of becoming a consort pianist. Condi Rice received her bachelor’s degree in political science cum laude and Phi Beta Kappa form the University of Denver in 1974. She earned a Masters degree from the University of Notre Dame in 1975, She earned a PhD from the Graduate School of International Studies from the University of Denver in 1981. Dr. Rice speaks English, Russian, French and Spanish. "


Ya, sounds like a real idiot. *rolls eyes*

[Tacos al Carbon]

35. I really, really hope that the writer meant

"conCERT pianist." I didn't even know that the other kind existed. Actually, "consort" does mean a musical group of similar instruments but I don't think that it applies to pianists.

As for the people who would suggest that Rice got ahead through "kneepads" or "got the gap in her teeth" that way, such people are loathesome mysoginists who are no credit to this board.

[GRLMGC]

42. She's very smart

Unfortunately, she's also evil

[daleo]

44. Her PhD may be from D.U.

But her post-doc work has been at Murder Inc.