I wish the protestors wouldn't chant.

[King Coal]

It diminishes their true message.

[izzybeans]

1. agreed.

unnecessary, especially when not marching. The giggling person leading the chants seems very insincere.

[diamond14]

2. why aren't you down there protesting, so you can do it the way you want

IMO, the PROTESTORS are doing GREAT....true PATRIOTS...I love their chanting....it adds to OUR message....

[babylonsister]

7. Yep, they are doing GREAT! And it's

flipping cold, to boot. They are representing all of us here, props all over the place to them!

[King Coal]

8. We'll have to agree to disagree on that.

I have to make a living and was unable to attend. I wish I could have.

[el_gato]

16. well, we all have to make a living, but I'm not whining about others

who have made the scrifice of actually going down there to protest.

[diamond14]

17. then, why not get back to work, and stop bitching about protestors here?

thought you claimed you have to make a living....get busy...go back to work...

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LSK]

36. doesnt take long to post on a messageboard

Maybe a minute to click on DU
Another minute to read this post
Another minute to respond.


Versus
A Day to fly to Washington
A Day to protest
A Day to come back

[diamond14]

52. true, it doesn't take long to FLAME BAIT this board....it's easy

and reTHUGlicans do it all the time, especially TODAY...when they are OUT IN FORCE to DEGRADE PROTESTORS, DEGRADE PATRIOTS...and whine and bitch about EVERYTHING....Kerry, Protestors, PRO-PEACE, whatever 'little' nitpicking crum that they can grab....they have grabbed it here and FLAMED AWAY with hate, bigotry and vicious attacks.....

[knight_of_the_star]

80. I would be there

If I had the cash to get out there, regardless of that this is my first week back in school.

[izzybeans]

10. True...but

a movement already deligitimated by the MSM doesn't need to shoot its own foot. I love the speeches. I love the chanting. Chant away, but the point I thought being made was about how the public percieves them. The current chants are being led by a person who seems to be there for fun. It seems contrived and pointless. giggle giggle, "this is fun".

[King Coal]

15. Thanks for that, Izzy.

[izzybeans]

19. I thought your point was valid

because some organizers are seriously worried about the current activist paradigm. The notion of negative press is still good press doesn't work anymore because the press just ignores them. The notion that this is bitching and not something more practical is a bit myopic in my opinion. It's about when we do participate or some of us who organize local events decide how it is run. That's the point, I thought. Bitching rights, no one is complaining about their presence or their cause.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[izzybeans]

67. Nice and dignified aren't you

again read the freaking posts.

[Name removed]

48. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[kaintuck0001]

24. Yep. It's a perception thing...

looks juvenile, pointless, and insincere, but you gotta give 'em points for getting out in the cold!

[TryingToWarnYou]

34. For that matter, why arent you down there? NT

[ShinerTX]

3. What were they chanting? NT

[arwalden]

4. Anything But The "Hey-hey-ho-ho" Chant Is Fine With Me...

Hey Hey
Ho Ho
That Stupid Chant
Has Got To Go

[AngryAmish]

69. true

[KurtNYC]

5. Me too.

It is so conformist, looks like brainwashing and seems ironically un-democratic.

[el_gato]

6. I guess you know what their true message is?

since you are not there protesting for yourself I guess you feel content bitching about what you want people to say. If you want something to be said why don't you go down there and say it.

[King Coal]

9. I don't feel like I was bitching. Just expressing an opinion.

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[DrGonzoLives]

11. Some of us have "jobs"

You know, working for a living? Not to mention not all of us can just up and afford a plane ticket to D.C. for a day's worth of chanting.

People expressing opinions on a message board, what are the odds?

[Tyler Durden]

18. Sorry Gonzo. A Job is no excuse. For ME either.

Your Karma's screwed with the rest of us.

My new motto: I bought a bullet for Bush today (regarding the fact that I have not refused to pay any more taxes, and am therefore culpable for anything done with that money.)

Every penny you paid (and that includes withholding, medicare and SS) had blood on it. So did mine.

If we believe what we say, we should have been there: ONE MAN stopped a TANK in Tianemen; where were WE today?

I don't doubt our intentions, just our level of sincerity, and I include myself in that.

[jenn1977]

25. I think about that all the time...

I am all the way out here in California, but you know what? I know I should be there, we should be there. Why aren't we though? Because of our jobs? Because the plane ticket cost too much? Distance? Families? Why?

I'm not sure what my opinion is about the protestors chanting because I can't see or hear any of it yet. But I totally agree with EVERYTHING in your post.

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TryingToWarnYou]

35. You can support them and still feel that there is a better way.

Chanting, singing etc. was great back in the 60's, but this is the information age and stuff like chanting protesters is quickly ignored. There needs to be modernization to the movements we undertake.

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TryingToWarnYou]

74. Oh yeah, Im pro bush because I believe we need to have a more

effective message?

Dont change a thing.. keep banging bongos and chanting hey hey ho ho... Maybe when we lose again in 08, we will consider a different path.

[Tyler Durden]

13. Anyone not there getting busted has no bitching rights.

Sorry, King, sad but true.

I got no bitching rights either, and the tax I paid for lunch helped buy a bullet.

More power to 'em, I say.

[diamond14]

21. damn right...those protestors are 100 % American HEROES...

and they represent US...THOUSANDS of American Patriots have put together the structure for these protests, lawyers, media, volunteers for rooms, ride-sharing, coats/hats/gloves, banners, sign-painting, costumes....THOUSANDS have help to field these AMERICAN HEROES...and anything they want to do out there is fine with me...


it's damn cold in DC....19 F with the wind chill

there's already been a LOT of clubbing, arrests, beatings....violations of CIVIL RIGHTS and more...over 100 PROTESTS have taken place or are in progress in OUR Nation's Capital...

you can listen to it all on Pacifica Radio and web links....
http://indymedia.us/en/index.shtml



unless YOU want to go STAND UP against bush* and his empire-building wars....then QUIT YOUR BITCHING here...

[Southsideirish]

20. Hey , you want to make as much noise as possible - why be quiet?

You didn't travel all the way there to act like you're at the mall or waiting for the light to change or something.
Howl, scream, beat on a pot. Sing - I like singing the best.

[izzybeans]

22. You see that chant going on right now

that's a good one for me. It was spontaneous and led by a speaker. My beef was with the giggler who didn't really seem invested in the chant.

[PunkPop]

23. Do some of the chants seem kind of contrived?

Maybe.

Would I ever in a million years think of criticizing people who are standing out in the freezing cold trying to make a statement against the criminals running our country from the comfort of my office cubicle?

No way.

[UdoKier]

26. Oh, God, they're doing the Hey Hey Ho Ho chant.

"Hey Hey, ho ho, your racist war has got to go."

(sigh). Couldn't be better than if the GOP had hired them from Central Casting...

[Carni]

32. I would prefer screams of bush is a criminal, murdering, thieving, liar!

Not a big fan of the chants either--but at least they are addressing the topic of Bush and the war.

I was rather non-plussed by the ANSWER rally I watched earlier.
They were talking about everything BUT Bush and Iraq.

[knight_of_the_star]

82. Yeah, I'll agree with that

I feel that chanting is a good way BOTH to keep up momentum and clean up the message into something even a FReeper could comprehend, but ANSWER tends to be too diffuse in their rallies, I've had problems with how they do theirs because of that.

[tinonedown]

39. Chants are part of marches

But the hey hey ho ho is pathetic. Lyrical poetry - right, for 2nd graders.
But I don't agree that chants in general should be ditched. My gosh, getting the message out is why we march.

[UdoKier]

65. I agree with that.

But it shouldn't be singsong or cute. It should be strong, angry, clear and firm. NEVER childlike.

[ProfessorGAC]

27. It Bugs Me Too

The sing-songy nature seems to reduce the gravity of their presence.
The Professor

[Skidmore]

29. When that idiot goes by, they should all go silent and

turn away to shun him. It would speak volumes.

[knight_of_the_star]

83. Assuming the media would notice

Got to keep that part in mind

[DerekG]

30. You make a valid point, King Coal

I've attended several rallies in Buffalo, and I have to say, I find the giggly college crowd a bit off-putting (and I'm 22); the scorched children of Iraq are always in my mind when I take action--I just can't take part in the frivolity. My heart just isn't with protest-as-political-theater. But then, I'm an angry loner who draws inspiration from the Biblical rhetoric employed by the 19th century abolitionists. I'm the guy you see wearing a black suit.

[txaslftist]

31. They're there, I'm here. They're fighting my fight for me.

I'm too embarrassed to be critical.

[TryingToWarnYou]

33. I agree with you. Its a bit "hippy" and it gets tuned out quickly.

There needs to be a new approach to getting the message out. Whether its with advertising (actually not a bad idea, but costly) or some other means, but standing around chanting and singing absolutely diminishes the value of the message. The effects of such actions have been almost completely marginalized by the MSM as well as the conservatives. They are slowly choking off that voice.

[el_gato]

51. I see you are all out of suggestions

no surprise there

[TryingToWarnYou]

72. Out of suggestions? I just gave some, genius. NT

[Zinfandel]

37. Fucking clowns! " a bit Hippy" stopped a fucking war!!!!

[UdoKier]

40. Dorky chants like Hey Hey Ho Ho DID NOT stop a war.

If anything it was the sheer numbers and sheer passion of the people who opposed it, as well as opinion polls that showed a majority of Americans opposing the war. Also we had a crook as a president, but even Nixon, unlike Bush, had the sense and decency to get us the hell out. If Bush had been president then, we might STILL be there today!

Seriously, though. A mass of people shouting "NO WAR IN IRAQ!" is okay, but "hey hey ho ho" has always and will always sound stupid. It is NOT a hootenanny. It's serious.

[King Coal]

42. Will says they are shouting "Let us in",

Now that is different.

[Zinfandel]

45. Your fucking wrong!!! When protest started, the war was very popular!

People got their heads beat in, it took years and years of protesting and CHANTING to finally get the media and the rest of the country to finally look at us and only then did the tide slowly began to change.

This war is unpopular right now!

And Nixon didn't resign until almost two years after the war was over.

[UdoKier]

49. You can curse all you like...

But I didn't say anything contrary to what you're saying, except that CHANTS, ESPECIALLY weak-assed, pathetic ones like "hey hey ho ho" DID NOT end the war.

You're making about as much sense as the answer folks that think today is the day to gripe about Cuba policy of all things...

[Zinfandel]

53. So it's the "curse" that gets to you? And I'm saying that chant did.

help stop the war. Every little bit helped, if it got the most "dorkiest" of people involved and that's what they wanted to chant, so what, they were invovoled and doing something positive to stop the killing for corporate interest!

We weren't so media, MTV conscious of, Oh Gee, How do we look on TV! This is fucking real man, and it's not a television show for you to critique!

Lives are on the line, peoples lives, real lives dude are being fucked over by this regime, and those people are out there chanting and trying to make a difference!

Chant Loud!

[UdoKier]

54. You don't need to get all haughty. I've been to my share of protests.

And they have been very positive experiences - AND, I went along with the stupid chants - but it was embarrassing and silly, and I sensed that others felt the same.

Shouting in unison, with strength and conviction rocks. Childish singsong stuff is just silly.

[Kingshakabobo]

61. What about Hey, hey LBJ how many kids did you kill today?

I've read that chant drove LBJ nuts as he could hear it in the white house. Another oldie.

[UdoKier]

63. That's quite a bit better.

It's infused with righteous anger, it's personal and direct.

Adding the "ho ho" somehow defuses it.

[King Coal]

62. Country Joe and the Fish had it right.

And it's one, two, three
what are we fightin' four
Don't ask me
I don't give a damn
The next stop is prob'ly Iran

[G_j]

58. Every little bit helped

absolutely!!

& btw, chants are one of the few ways people can join together vocally to make their voices louder. Admittedly some chants could be more creative, but I believe anyone with a brain can understand the logistics of a public demo. The options are limited. No puppets or similar visual props were allowed in DC. But then again, I remember people here complaining about puppets too.

[Carni]

66. Look would go to work in a leisure suit and a big fro?

With platform shoes?

What may have played 30 years ago may not be the most effective tactic today.

We could all rally in Boston and throw tea in the harbor too, but I doubt it would do anything towards swaying the public against bush or the war in Iraq.

I think all some people here are saying (at least what I am saying) is that while many of the speakers are very powerful...the chanting is distracting and to me it sounds reminiscent of a highschool pep rally.

I commend the protesters but I think the chanting itself is not effective.

[TryingToWarnYou]

73. Which war was that?

We evacuated out of Viet Nam prior to S. Viet Nam being overrun by the NVA. Tell me again how the protesters "stopped" the war?

[rman]

38. Sure, the less attention protesters draw to themselves,

the better.
It would be better still if they'd protest at home.
That's the whole point of demonstrating; to not be noticed.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

43. excellent point!

[UdoKier]

44. There are ways of getting attention without looking silly and lightweight.

"Hey Hey Ho Ho" has got to go.

[Zinfandel]

57. Have YOU ever marched and protested?

Give us your chant, tell us what this protest means to you...is it real on is it television?

Are theSE people passionate about the killing for corporations and power or are they just not quite fasionable for prime time television?

HEY HEY Ho Ho hEY DUDE YOU GOT TO GO...TO A PROTEST! GET INVOLVED!

And I have to go now. There's a protest at the County building in my town at twelve noon! And I will be chanting everything even if it's "Hey Hey"

Check for a local protest in your area and give your best chant!

[UdoKier]

60. Yes, I have.

I have experienced the power of a simple slogan shouted in unison, as well as the embarrassment and weakness of having to recite the silly "hey hey ho ho" line.


There are A LOT of people who don't like it. The point of a chant is to express an idea in UNISON. How good is it when half the people are uncomfortable with the chant's silly wording?


That shit needs to be scrapped.

[Carni]

68. That pretty much sums up what I thought of hey hey ho ho

I felt like an asshole standing there chanting that and kept waiting for someone to yell "what does it spell"--to me it doesn't get it.

Or maybe I just hated highschool (A LOT)

[UdoKier]

71. My all time FAVORITE chant (props to RATM)

FUCK YOU I WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!
FUCK YOU I WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!
FUCK YOU I WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!
FUCK YOU I WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!
FUCK YOU I WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!
FUCK YOU I WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!
FUCK YOU I WON'T DO WHAT YOU TELL ME!

[Carni]

75. I know the song well

And would certainly prefer it to the hey hey ho ho deal--

Unfortunately they were tied up performing for Nader in 2000 :(

[Chovexani]

77. But...but...cursing makes us look bad!

This thread is ridiculous. Kudos to the protesters. I wish I could have been there reciting "dorky" chants with them.

[gorbal]

79. There was a chant I liked alot ...

I heard it in New York during the RNC. "One, we are the people, two, just a little bit louder, 3, we wan't justice four the third world...You kinda had to be their but the people who were singing it were very boisterours and they helped me keep walking.

I do secretly think some of those comically shrill folksingers are Republican plants somtimes. I'm not going to name names, I like most of them, but you know what I mean.

[sherilocks]

46. Chanting while actually marching helps keep up the pace

but just standing there like that, well it's kinda lame. It doesn't help much that don't agree with a lot of the ANSWER rhetoric either.

Sorry folks, I'm usually first on line for a good protest. But I have a cold and could't make this one.

[ClayZ]

47. Seattle CHANT at 2:00 left coast time

"GEORGE BUSH.....FUCK YOU....AND YOUR WHOLE AGENDA TOO!

"GEORGE BUSH.....FUCK YOU....AND YOUR WHOLE AGENDA TOO!

"GEORGE BUSH.....FUCK YOU....AND YOUR WHOLE AGENDA TOO!

"GEORGE BUSH.....FUCK YOU....AND YOUR WHOLE AGENDA TOO!

[UdoKier]

55. That's much better than hey hey ho ho.

nt

[Carni]

76. That I like...it sends a message

Hey hey Ho Ho says -Hey here I am a 60's throwback to get my ass kicked...

George Bush fuck you...profane?

Yes, but what sells?

It isn't hey hey ho ho

[JohnyCanuck]

56. Here are a couple of new chants that make for a nice change

from the tired and worn out, Hey Hey Ho Ho bit.

See bottom paragraph (sung out like a US military style drill cadence).

Mike Ferner: 'Marines stretching movement: Protesting urban warfare in Toledo'

<snip>

For two hours late Friday night, as the Marines set up their weekend command post in (believe it or not) an abandoned center for selling blood plasma, 30 peace activists stood with banners, signs, photos, and "War," Goff's message and cadence chants alternating over the P.A. Negotiations with the Toledo police got us only as close as the opposite side of the street, so an artificial gulf kept us from reading soldiers' expressions or hearing their responses that would have only been whispered under doubtless orders against "fraternizing" with us. One of our band, chafed by the order not to use a public sidewalk on a public street, crossed the thoroughfare to make a point and was promptly arrested.

The next day a dozen activists returned with signs, photos, banners, "War," and a bullhorn for Goff's letter, ready to peacefully engage squads of Marines who had come to engage "enemies" in parking garages and alleys.

With the mobile "War" unit circling the blocks, broadcasting the song to the Marines, the activists on foot followed one detachment past the main library, singing out a whole list of VFP cadences.

The most familiar chant was: "Hey, hey Uncle Sam/We remember Viet Nam/We don't want your I-raq war/Peace is what we're marchin' for. Am I right or wrong (You're right!). Am I right or wrong? (You're right!)" But the most popular was: "Dubya's lies should make him choke/He must still be snortin' coke/Saddam's secret poison gas/Must be something Rumsfeld passed."

www.smirkingchimp.com/article.php?sid=19568&mode=&order=0

[Az]

59. The alternative is standing their declaring their concerns

In a polite and nonconfrontational manner. Unfortunately the goal of protests is not to simply read a press release. It is confrontation. It is a yowl. It is boisterous and designed to force people to pay heed to the fact that not all agree on a matter. It is demanding to be heard and seen. Seldom a polite and quite course.

[Skidmore]

64. What about shouting "Shame, shame, shame"....

[izzybeans]

70. wow this whole

thing took on a "you don't support our troops" ring too it. I guess the quelling debate is an endless and nonpartisan affair when it comes to political action and how to do it.

[ChildEyedOneMan]

78. Hey hey, Ho ho

If they want to chant then let them go!

[RBHam]

81. You mean like chanting "We Shall Overcome?"...

God forbid they should make you "uncomfortable"...

[fooj]

84. Honestly! " For deep in my heart, I do believe"

:hi: Good one!