I was watching this hunting show and I am really disturbed

[cags]

First I'll say I love meat, and wouldn't hesitate to kill an animal(pets not included LOL) to feed my family.

But if you've ever watched a hunting show these guys are practically having orgasms while their hunting down things to kill. I find it quite disturbing. If I had to do it I would but I wouldn't enjoy it.

Does anyone else find it disturbing to enjoy killing animals.

[theboss]

1. Not really

Of course, I told everyone that my New Year's resolution was to kill a hobo.

I thought it sounded better than "lose weight."

[Dookus]

3. lol

good 'un.

I've never hunted, but I imagine like most hobbies or sports, being successful is a cause for celebration. I would simply suggest not watching hunting shows. I think it's unreasonable to expect a prayerful moment of silence after scoring a hit.

[idiosyncratic]

11. I've recently started Geocaching and the "hunt" is great fun.

Being successful at finding a well-hidden cache of goodies is a cause for celebration.

Geocaching


I agree . . . one should not watch hunting shows.

[stranger_with_candy]

60. all i ever find is caches full of crap

but it's still fun to find them

[ArkDem]

51. Good answer

[kimchi]

5. Hello Ed!

I always wondered if Helms, Colbert, et al were members of DU!

[theboss]

10. That's actually been one of my go-to joke for years

I was a little upset when the Daily Show used it, because people started thinking I stole it.

But I've found the idea of hunting and eating a drifter entertaining for quite a while.

I have issues.

[yella_dawg]

31. How strange...

I've determined that the ideal prey would be found outside vegetarian food stores. Young and tender. Grain fed. Mmmmm...

A hobo? Yuk!

[cags]

6. Well, as long as your willing to eat him and you don't waste him. JK

[gorbal]

26. I hate that joke

Why can't you hunt down an oil executive instead.

[cags]

27. Oooh, Thats much better, but he probably wouldn't taste as good

Being so rotten and all.

[madinmaryland]

48. That would be bad for my cholesterol level.

[The_Casual_Observer]

2. Personally, I would like just for once like to see the tables turned

on those "hunt for sport" bastards. Set them out in a forest full of grizzly bears with only a little camping gear.

[Dookus]

4. almost everybody who

goes camping is "out in a forest full of grizzly bears with only a little camping gear"

[LiberalUprising]

9. I agree TCO

Now that would make a great reality tv show. Hell I might even turn on the TV to watch that.

[livinginphotographs]

16. Or throw them in a pen full of bulls.

Might makes right, right? :shrug:

[Yupster]

20. Support the Right To Arm Bears

I just don't get the whole idea of hunting.

I get the go outdoors and see nature and watch it and live with it and spend time outdoors with your kids, but then take a camera.

I just see these animals in their own habitats minding their own business and people come and kill them.

I don't get it.

[Greylyn58]

22. That reminds me of a joke by Ellen DeGeneres

She said she went into a bar and saw a deer head mounted on the wall and the bar owner had put a party hat on it and Ellen said:

"Here was this poor deer, just going about his business...you know partying with his pals in the woods and having a good time...and some damn hunter came along and killed him. How unfair is that?"

I'm probably paraphrasing, but I always thought there was some truth in her joke.

:eyes:

[Yupster]

24. It bothers me because

when I'm in the wilderness. I'm always conscious of leaving things in good shape behind me because I'm visiting. The animals live there and there aren't many theres left for them.

If I visit, I try to disturb as little as I can. I just don't get the idea of visiting their habitat, killing stuff, and then going home.

I'd sure hate it if my relatives acted that way when they visit me.

[Jeff in Cincinnati]

47. Remember something...

with regard to deer. Not every live-born fawn can live to a ripe old age, otherwise deer herds would be increasing in an era when habitat is dwindling (you can thank Home Depot, Wal-Mart, and Bed Bath & Beyond for that). When deer herds rise to a level where the habitat can't sustain them, deer start to die off. Some of them through disease and starvation, and some of them through being struck by vehicles. In Hamilton County (Cincinnati and suburbs) we had 791 deer struck by vehicles in 2003, which is a nearly 20% increase from just a few years ago. Considering the significant pain and discomfort of a slow death from starvation or from being hit by a vehicle (some deer linger for days before dying), death by hunting is downright humane.

[RoeBear]

56. Mother Nature is a mean mutha

she has no gentle deaths for her charges. Starvation, being eaten alive, freezing to death... their is no gentle way out. Hunting is no more violent then Mother.

[norml]

7. You got to not watch that stuff.

I don't even want to see the programs that have injured creatures or humans getting surgical treatments.

[Systematic Chaos]

8. I'll turn this one over to Megadeth....

Countdown to Extinction Lyrics
Artist: Megadeth
Album: Countdown To Extinction


Mustaine/Menza/Ellefson/Friedman

Endangered species, caged in fright
Shot in cold blood, no chance to fight
The stage is set, now pay the price
An ego boost, don't think twice
Technology, the battle's unfair
You pull the hammer without a care
Squeeze the trigger that makes you Man
Pseudo-safari, the hunt is canned...
The hunt is canned


Chorus
All are gone, all but one
No contest, nowhere to run
No more left, only one
This is it, this is the Countdown to Extinction


Tell the truth, you wouldn't dare
The skin and trophy, oh so rare
Silence speaks louder than words
Ignore the guilt, and take your turn
Liars anagram is "lairs"
Man you were never even there
Killed a few feet from the cages
Point blank, you're so courageous...
So courageous


Chorus


One hour from now,
another species of life form
will disappear off the face of the planet
forever...and the rate is accelerating


Chorus

[illflem]

12. Used to hunt for years but quit

because I was afraid I might get something, that's when the work begins. Many hunters I know really don't care if they get anything, it's mostly an excuse to get out in nature.

[cags]

13. Hell, Who needs and excuse to get out in nature. I do it all the time

When you were hunting were you breathing heavy, panting, and saying "Oh my God, Oh my God" over and over again. I swear this guy had vibrating underwear. It was creepy

[Sal Minella]

19. I knew an elk-hunter who would sit down on a stump and say....

"Okay, the first elk who walks up here and knocks me off this stump is going to get shot at!"

He never killed an elk, but he enjoyed a lot of quiet woods time and sunshine and he enjoyed watching the elk. And, I presume, they enjoyed watching him.

[shrike]

42. Yeah, that's like my husband

He's at the point where he'd rather hunt with a camera than anything else. We've had deer in the past (delicious) and I don't mind that because the area's infested with them. We've killed off all the predators, so I suppose we're the predators now.

[NNN0LHI]

55. My grandfather used to always pack his best suits for his hunting...

...and fishing trips.

:think:

Don

[President Kerry]

14. I don't care much for hunting, but accept it for substistence.

Hunting for sport is a crime in my book.

[livinginphotographs]

15. Yes.

Killing for food is one thing (though I personally disagree, I don't think there's something psychologically wrong with someone who does so). Trophy killing is no different than a soldier bragging about how many "rag-heads" he killed in Iraq.

Flame away...

[Nordmadr]

17. I am about as liberal as you can find...

but I do believe in allowing the public to have firearms to an extent (how else do they give the 'threat' of being able to overthrow a corrupt government). I eat meat, and took up hunting a few years ago (I am 31). I do not enjoy killing anything. I do enjoy spending time out in nature. For me, hunting is a way to put myself more in touch with where my food can come from. It allows me to appreciate it more on a personal level. It also teaches me a valuable "real" world skill. Whenever I have personally killed an animal, or been with someone that has, I always offer up a bit of thanks to nature for it. I always have sadness for the loss of life.

I can understand the excitement of the hunt, but I do not understand the excitement of the kill. Unfortunately, in my experience, most hunters fit into the "kill" category.

Olaf

[flvegan]

18. Hunting to survive gets a pass in my book

Hunting for "sport" <snort...what sport, asshat?> or to "get close to nature" seem a little strange to me. Want to get closer to nature, buy a mountain bike and a Camelback.

I do understand the draw, though.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

21. Okay, I've got hunters among my relatives, but I've always agreed with

the wise guy who said, "Hunting would be a sport only if the deer could shoot back."

[Skittles]

23. I think hunters are cowards

it's not the eating meat thing - it's the fact that they think killing animals is ENTERTAINING. It is sickening.

[Nordmadr]

25. Eating meat slaughtered

in an assembly line at some factory where animals are living under inhumane conditions so that you can go buy a nice "package" of meat is the cowardly thing. I still do this as well, and if you want to call me a coward for anything, call me a coward for that, but frankly, I am not a good enough hunter yet to be able to supply all of my food requirements. If you are going to be a meat eater, which I am, it seems to me that the more noble thing is to at least own up, and have the courage to do it yourself. It is the more natural way to live within your environment. Should there come a time where I am required to provide my own food source, I am better prepared to do so. As a species, we are omnivores, partially programmed to be predators. I have the utmost respect for people that choose not to eat meat, either for health reasons or for personal reasons. If you read my post above, you will note that I hunt in spite of the sadness I feel for the loss of life, yet thankful for the sustenance that will be provided to me. It has seemed odd to me that so many people that are "green" or "nature" kind of people are strict vegetarians that have a great deal of animosity toward people that are also nature folks, but who choose to follow a path of hunting for food that has been used for thousands of years by humans.

Now if you want to get into the types of weapons used, that is again another matter. I would much prefer to be an efficient and skilled hunter that does not need a shotgun or rifle. Not there yet. As we have evolved into the beings we have become, it also seems we have lost a great deal of our "connection" with our natural environment. Our senses are not nearly as keen as many species. For example, a deer is faster and has far better senses of smell and hearing. Our lack of heightened senses is compensated for by our intelligence (well, maybe) and our ability to make "tools" that tilt things more in our favor (opposing thumbs helps).

Just some stuff to think about before you blanket statement a group of people as cowards.

Olaf

[cags]

33. Ok, I don't think I believe you

Just because you said you would like to hunt without using a shotgun or rifle. What would you use a bow and arrow or a hunting knife? Do you think that is more humane than a quick death with a shotgun? You have a choice whether or not to go out and kill, and the fact that you choose to do it tells me that you enjoy it more than you want to admit.

Now if your goal was to eventually hunt all your meat supply because you were against the inhumane practices of meat farmers, I might buy it. But you have not said that.

[Nordmadr]

38. Do I have a reason to lie to you...

that you should not believe me? So I have been classified in this thread now as both a coward and a liar. I did not say that the death from arrow or other more "primitive" hunting device would be MORE humane, though a skilled hunter could make these kills just as EQUALLY humane.

I have two reasons as to why I would prefer to hunt in this way:

1) It is more difficult, therefore more challenging, therefore requiring more skill and expertise...see the pattern?

2) It is simpler. I am all about simplicity. It is about living within a true environment rather than the false one we have created for ourselves in this country and throughout much of the world. Readings: "A Language Older Than Words" by Derrick Jensen and all of Daniel Quinn's writings (including "Ishmael" and "Story of B")got me started along this path.

I DO NOT enjoy the kill, you can not believe me if you choose to, that is your prerogative. I think I have adequately explained my reasons, but here is some more. I have a strong desire to live simple and sustainable. Not saying I am yet, but a strong desire to get there. Part of that strategy includes being able to provide my own food supplies. This includes foraging, harvesting (as in farming), and hunting. I would be just as happy to never have to set foot in a grocery store again. I do this for my own reasons of what I consider to be right, what puts me more in touch with my natural environment and spirituality (NOT RELIGION), and what teaches me a skill that could come in handy if this world truly goes to shit (have you heard of peak oil?)

Now you can not agree with my reasons and you can not like my reasons, that is fair enough, but that does not mean that they are not true reasons.

Peace.

Olaf

[cags]

41. Ok I see where you are coming from

If that is truly your goal, to live simple and you are actively working towards self reliance then I can respect that point of view.

Sadly that is not the goal of most hunters and the original post was not directed at you.

I still find your desire to use "primitive tools" to kill a bit disturbing. If you truly didn't want an animal to suffer I would hope that you would make it as quick and painless as possible, instead of wanting to do it in away that is more "difficult and challenging" for you.

[Nordmadr]

44. I certainly wish to minimize any suffering

My desire to eventually work towards "primitive tools" is due to:

1) The potential that I would be able to make my own hunting devices. Again this teaches me another valuable skill, besides knowing how to spend money. Should modern day hunting devices and ammunition some day become difficult to come by, I am not S.O.L.

2) My end goal is not the challenge itself, but the gaining in skill. If there is something more difficult it requires research, knowledge, and skill. By looking into the option of primitive hunting tools, I have to look into the methodology, the techniques required to make it efficient, myself proficient, and ALWAYS with the thought of minimizing suffering. I for example, would not even consider going out to hunt with a bow, until I felt that I had achieved a certain degree of proficency with it on non-living targets. I'm already a VERY good shot with a standard pump action shotgun, rifle, and pistol...compliments of the United States Army National Guard and the United States Navy training I received.

I personally don't condone hunting for sport or trophies, killing for kicks or really ANY other non-utilitarian purpose for killing short of personal protection.

Peace.
Olaf

[Skittles]

53. go ahead, convince yourself

whatever

[RebelOne]

30. And it's called a "sport."

I say, how can it be a sport if the other side does not know there is a game going on?

[RebelOne]

28. I work for a hunting and fishing publication.

Since I am a copy editor, I must read every story word for word. And believe me, all of those hunters relate how they get a big thrill when they kill a deer. They all say that they have an adrenaline rush. I hate hunting, but it's a job and they are not all that easy to come by nowadays.

[ScaRBama]

29. I believe in one thing...

If you kill the animal or bird you should eat it or give the meat to someone who will eat it.
I've gone hunting with some who were not true sportsman and that was the last time I would ever go hunting with them.
I see nothing wrong with hunting if the meat is used.
If you eat meat then what is the difference in going to the Supermarket and picking out already slaughtered animals and birds well packaged in the Meat Department?

[cags]

34. The difference is the enjoyment you get from killing

Thats what I find so disturbing. That there are people who get high off of killing. Most hunters are not going out there because they need to feed thier families. They are doing it for fun.

[ScaRBama]

35. Do you hunt? Or....

have you ever hunted?

[cags]

37. Obviously I have not. I am the original poster

[ScaRBama]

39. All I can say ....

is stop watching the hunting shows if they offend you. You don't hunt and don't like seeing others hunt,so why watch something that you dislike?

[cags]

40. I was flipping through channels and all of a sudden there was this guy

who was about to burst, he was breathing hard, panting and saying "Oh my God, Oh my God" over and over. When I realized what I was watching I was disturbed by this guy, so I was just wondering if others were just as disturbed by this.

So I don't watch the stuff, just channel surfing

[Jeff in Cincinnati]

49. Depends on the circumstances...

Was this a buck with a particularly outstanding rack? Was it a hunter who had been tracking this particular animal all day and finally got a good shot? Was the show following a hunter who was taking his very first buck? There might be any number of reasons why the guy was unusually excited.

...or maybe he was just a pinhead.

[Charon]

32. Hunting

I hunted when going to college because it was economical for me to do so. Havnt hunted since then, because a supermarket is so much more
convenient. I do not have a problem with a person that hunts and consumes the kill. I do not like trophy hunting.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

36. yes , i do! especially Bush* and his Dove Hunting buddies.....

they actually love killing doves evey year in Texas!

http://www.qu.org/dove/main/pressreleases/press.cfm

<snip>










California
Immediate Action Needed
- (07/03)


(California) - The State Legislature is now considering three bills that would infringe on your rights as lawful owners of firearms. All three have been passed in their respective house of origin's Public Safety Committee. It is critical that sportsmen contact their own district Legislators and Members of the Appropriations Committees and the Assembly Floor to voice strong opposition to these bills. The bills are listed below and would do the following:

To find your legislators use the following link and type in your zip code. You will be given the names and contact information for both your Senator and Assembly Member depending on your zip code. http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/yourleg.html

SENATE APPROPRIATIONS COMMITTEE
AB 50 (Koretz) .50 Caliber BMG rifles would ban the sale and severely restrict the possession of .50 BMG caliber rifles by treating them the same as an "assault weapon". This means the rifles even bolt actions would have to be registered, could not be used on most public lands, and their future sale and transfer would be prohibited. If this passes, magnums of any kind will be next. The bill is now before the Senate Appropriations Committee.

ASSEMBLY APPROPRIATIONS COMMITTEE
SB 1152 (Scott) Ammunition. This bill would make firearms owners register to buy ammunition, including giving a thumbprint. It treats owners of firearms like criminals! The bill is now before the Assembly Appropriations Committee.

ASSEMBLY FLOOR
SB 1733 (Speier) Firearms: Sales at the Cow Palace. This bill would ban having a gun show at the Cow Palace, which is a state owned facility in the South San Francisco area. If it passes, it will be expanded to ban gun shows on any public property, like fairgrounds, throughout the State. It is a major attack on the right of sportsmen and other firearms owners to assemble, communicate with each other, and to purchase new, used and collectible firearms, accessories and sporting supplies. The bill is on the Assembly Floor.

Please take action immediately! A list of the members of the Appropriations Committees and Assembly Floor are enclosed. Let them know of your opposition to these three bills, AB 50, SB 1152 and SB 1733 and let your local legislators hear from you as well!!!

It is critical that all of these bills be stopped!!!




Michigan
Michigan Governor Signs Dove Bill
- (06/18)


(Lansing) - Today, with Gov. Jennifer Granholm's signature, Michigan became the 41st state to allow dove hunting.

"This is the culmination of an historic effort by sportsmen and sportswomen across Michigan,"said Rob Sexton, U.S. Sportsmen's Alliance vice president for government affairs. "The governor should be applauded for listening to sportsmen and disregarding anti-hunting rights rhetoric." In August 2003, House Bill 5029 was introduced by Rep. Susan Tabor, R-Delta Township. In November 2003, the House of Representatives passed the dove hunting measure by a margin of 64 to 44. On March 31, 2004, the Senate approved an amended version of the bill by a vote of 22 to 15.

The bill authorizes the Michigan Department of Natural Resources to establish a dove hunting season. Included is a provision that creates a $2 dove stamp with funds raised split equally between game and non-game programs.


<snip>


QU Executive VP and Other
Conservation Leaders Meet
with President Bush - (04/09)


(Crawford, TX) - For the second time in less than four months, President George W. Bush convened a private meeting with the country's major sportsmen's and conservation organization leaders to discuss his plans for conserving wildlife and natural resources. Rocky Evans, Executive Vice President of Quail Unlimited, has attended both meetings.

The meeting took place Thursday at President Bush's 1,600-acre ranch outside of Crawford, Texas. Before they convened, the conservation leaders enjoyed a tour of the President's home and ranch property, which includes a creek, canyon, waterfalls, meadows and a fishing lake stocked with bass.

Joining Rocky Evans and Quail Unlimited at the meeting were leaders from organizations including;

US Sportsmen's Alliance, National Wild Turkey Federation, BASS, Coastal Conservation Alliance, Ducks Unlimited, National Rifle Association, National Shooting Sports Foundation, Pheasants Forever, Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation, Safari Club International and Theodore Roosevelt Conservation Partnership.

[GumboYaYa]

43. The only meat I will consider eating is wild meat.

In Missouri we have a deer overpoulation problem. While I haven't hunted myself in years, I will accept and eat meat that my friends give me from their kills. There is virtually no energy consumption required for meat that is gathered from the wild. Meat from feed lot cattle has more energy cost per calorie than virtually any other food. I'm no fan of sporthunters, but I hold no ill will to people who hunt and eat their kill.

[Nordmadr]

45. Not to mention

animals can provide far more than food. Hides, bones, and other parts of an animal can also be put to good use. I have recently begun researching hide tanning so that I might be able to further utilize, and not waste, parts of the animals that I would hunt.

Olaf

[Lydia Leftcoast]

46. I'm less opposed to hunting for meat than to hunting for sheer "sport"

For example, it's now legal to hunt mourning doves in Minnesota. This is one bill that our then-Republicanite dominated legislature was able to pass, despite being unable to do anything constructive.

Now I've seen mourning doves close up (two of them spent a whole morning on my window sill one day last summer, grooming each other), and there's not enough meat on one of them to make an appetizer, much less a meal.

If people want to shoot something out of the air just for target practice, they should stick to clay pigeons.

[RoeBear]

58. One question...

...how big is a shrimp?

[Acryliccalico]

50. It is called a

sexual fetish. Seems like it involves the death of an animal. The person is clearly psychopathic. This can lead to worse. Clearly NOT normal.

[cattleman22]

52. A couple of points I have not seen mentioned yet

1. You are watching a show so you are seeing people who are putting on a show for the camera.


2. I have taken classes at college that teach students how to properly stun and kill livestock. In doing so I felt a variety of emotions, including sadness, appreciation, and some enjoyment.

[Piperay]

54. Yes

if they want to kill...why haven't they enlisted. I guess they don't want to aim at something that might shot back. :scared:

[EstimatedProphet]

57. Read a book called "The Hunt"

It's a series of periodical articles on hunting-I think they were published in The New Yorker or Harper's, but don't quote me on that. One of the people interviewed in the book was Fred Bear, who started Bear Archery Co. and starred in a lot of "real man" short films in the 50's. When he was asked about the films, he talked about how terribly disappointed he was doing them, because, as he put it, "I always had to kill something". It got to him. I expect it gets to the guys who do those hunting shows too-well, maybe not Nugent, but it would everyone else. Those shows forget that the purpose of the hunt isn't just to kill something.

[HumblePiRSquared]

59. The simple solution

Heal thyself and change the channel.

[Dude_CalmDown]

61. I don't hunt - I don't own a gun - but IMHO all deer need to be shot dead.

Put a bullet between their eyes. I consider myself falling somewhere between being really liberal to really really liberal but when it comes to deer they should all be shot in the head just to hear the sound they make when they die. In case you're wondering the answer is yes - deer have cost me several immaculately kept cars in the past. They are the dumbest fucking animals to ever jump into 70 mph traffic for the hell of it. I've got the deer whistles on my car but all that seems to do is confuse them into stopping in the middle of the highway, cocking their head to the side and presenting you with that glorious dumbfuck look they always get when they're about to cause another accident. Of course one of the reason's they get hit is because we've invaded their habitat (sure) but there is no doubt that the main reason they cause accidents is because they are dumber than a box of dogshit.

Oh TV programmers please oh please air a show called "Killing Deer Just To Hear The Sound When They Hit The Ground" and you will have me glued to my TV.

[ailsagirl]

62. Because I love animals, I deplore hunting

I see a deer and am transfixed by its grace and beauty. Taking a gun to one is the last thing in the world I would think of doing.

But, to each his own.