Is the Pope on Death's Doorstep?

[HEyHEY]

The Italian news agency ANSA has reported that Pope John Paul, who is suffering from flu, has been taken to Rome's Gemelli Polyclinic Hospital.

[DrWeird]

1. I watched my grandfather slowly die of Parkinson's.

I personally believe that he's got maybe a couple of days.

[AwakeAtLast]

8. I did, too.

In the later stages, one minor illness can be the catalyst for a host of other problems. My grandfather ended up dying of a massive hemmorage in his brain after he contracted pneumonia.

I'm sorry you and your family had to go through this, too. It is a horrible condition, and I am hopeful that treatments will get better in the future.

[GardeningGal]

45. I agree

My father also had Parkinson's and he aspirated on something when eating which is common as the throat muscles get more and more rigid and makes swallowing more difficult. He then developed pnuemonia and passed away eight days later.

It's a tough time and I don't wish it upon anyone.

[SoCalDem]

2. No one lives forever..

He has had a pretty nifty life, and he's probably ready to go whnever the time comes.:)

[seabeyond]

46. i am with you n/t

[WindRavenX]

3. if he is

...I hope we can lay aside any political differences between the Vatican and DU.

[pres2032]

5. all i know is, if people start pissing on his grave

i may leave and never come back.

[HEyHEY]

7. Well, then...we'll see ya!

THere's bound to be a few assbags that will do just that.

[WindRavenX]

14. I don't blame you

Perhaps if he does pass on, it would be wise not to log onto DU tonight. It'll be nasty :(

[hunter]

21. Catholic bashing is a kind of smog on DU.

But for the most part it's an endless sunny day here.

Pope John Paul II has been pushing himself hard for a long time now. If this is the end, he will rest in peace, no matter what anyone says here on DU.

[pres2032]

28. that's true

if anything, i may take a very long vacation, or stick with the Catholic group. I'm just getting sick and tired of every time someone posts about Catholicism or faith in general, the aethists and anti-catholics must swarm in and attack it until its gone.

[superconnected]

38. don't let them run you off

I've not been too happy with how he's handled some things, but I believe he's done more good than bad.

He's been at deaths door for a long time.

When he does go, it gives the vatican an opportunity to try to bring in a young, bright, progressive and alert one. Hopefully as good as this one was before he got so far on in years.

[regnaD kciN]

50. Not from me...

...even though I got driven out of Roman Catholicism by the wave of conservatism he brought in with him.

He did a lot that was good (mainly outside the Church) and, IMHO, a lot that was objectively evil (mainly inside the Church), in particular by unleashing Cardinal Ratzinger (a.k.a. "The Grand Inquisitor"). But I have no doubt that whatever he did, even that which I think was wrong, was done out of a good-faith effort to follow God's will, and I have no doubt he will rest in peace and rise in glory on that account.

[AlCzervik]

4. I think he's got pnuemonia from the reports i've heard

thats not good.

[Zynx]

9. Pneumonia has claimed many of my elderly relatives.

Complications from Pneumonia are one of the most frequent proximate natural causes of death.

[DrWeird]

6. update

As per LBN thread. The pope is having a "breathing crisis."

Personal translation: he stopped breathing, he's on a respirator.

[AwakeAtLast]

11. Yup, see my reply above, post #8.

I believe your translation to be correct.

[HEyHEY]

10. AM I the only one a little upset about this for an unknown reason?

I'm not a religous person and never have been, my family isn't either.
Maybe it's just because he's been around as long as I can remember.

[DrWeird]

13. He's very old. He's led a relatively full life.

And he's suffering. Terribly.

[FarLeftRage]

15. I'm upset too

He's been around for a long time and people are used to him being the Pope.

If this is his time to go, I will be in mourning and not let it get to me....

[superconnected]

39. in these trying times

we're losing someone on the light side, when we need to offset the darkside so it matters a lot more than usual.

[Malva Zebrina]

12. Probably

I would not be surprised if he does not survive.

[burpsalot]

16. He looks like he's been knocking on death's door for the last 10 years.

IMHO

[MrSlayer]

17. I'm hoping for Cardinal Francis Arinze to be the next pope.

Not because I'm religious but because it will really bother all the racist Catholics that I know. I love throwing their hypocrisy in their faces.

[CatholicEdHead]

18. I don't care about his race

but his views. Will he be one to continue turing the clock back on Vatican II? Or will he moderate some of the far right Catholic wingnuts in the church that came out last year?

More on Cardinal Arinze:
http://www.beliefnet.com/story/48/story_4829.html

[MrSlayer]

25. I really don't care at all, I just want to bust balls.

It will really bother people.

[mitchum]

19. If Opus Dei tells him to be there

[LizW]

20. It sounds bad.

I wish him peace and comfort.

[Cuban_Liberal]

22. It's in God's hands.

:shrug:

[independentchristian]

23. If the Pope dies things are going to get very interesting

Especially in bible-believing circles.

[CatholicEdHead]

27. Yes it will

most Cardnials are on the conservative to very conservative side. Things will get very intresting inside the Catholic Church.

[Pikku]

37. True independentchristian. The next pope is supposed to be the last...

... according to St. Malachy.

I'm not Catholic, but I too hope that DU won't get hateful when JPII dies.

[superconnected]

40. sorry, I don't know about St. Malachy

what's up with it? Is it another religious end of the world sign?

[CatholicEdHead]

41. Yes it is

Try these links:

http://www.jpdawson.com/lastpope.html

http://www.catholic-pages.com/grabbag/malachy.asp

[superconnected]

44. thank you, facinating reading

[KharmaTrain]

24. Pneumona...The Silent Killer

My mother suffered from Parkinsons and Altzheimers...going from a vibrant woman in her 70's to an invalid who couldn't walk or function without great difficulty. I see the same thing happening here with John Paul. His body is slowly turning off and it's a matter of time until he develops an infection that could be terminal.

During my mother's last days, doctors would tell me the "best scenario" for her would be to develop pneumonia...which they called the silent killer. Once the infection sets in such a weakened system, it can work very quickly.

I hope he's comfortable and that his suffering is minimal. He's lived a long and full life. Looking at the news reports, I can sense we're being set up for something big...they're already rolling the "morgue" footage (the stuff kept standing by when a famous person dies).

[Cleita]

30. I thought the same thing.

What people don't know is that chronic diseases of old age are seldom the cause of death, but they so weaken the patient that another disease like pneumonia can kill them because they can't fight it like a healthy person. Well, I hope he pulls through and if not that he doesn't suffer.

[TahitiNut]

26. Considering he has probably the best on-site medical care available.

... and they found it necessary to hospitalize him, and considering his Parkinson's, and considering they called it "respiration difficulties," I'd say it's only a matter of days.

Despite my respect for his personal history, I sure hope they pick a more liberal Pope the next time.

[Dookus]

29. Not very likely

this pope has picked almost the entire voting membership of the College of Cardinals - his successor is very likely to be conservative, too.

[AZCat]

31. Dumb Pope succession question

Why haven't they picked his successor yet? It seems like waiting until after he is gone would create continuity issues for the church.

Is this all part of some internal political dynamic, or is this just the way it is done?

[Dookus]

33. the successor is only picked

upon the death of the current Pope. The College of Cardinals convenes in the Sistine Chapel and chooses a replacement. It's always worked that way.

[AZCat]

34. Is that so there won't be an overlap?

I guess there could be a struggle for power if there was a successor picked early and the previous Pope didn't want to hand over the reins.

How long does it take for them to pick a new Pope? Is it a rapid process, or is there some set period when each candidate lobbies the Cardinals?

[Dookus]

35. it depends on how many ballots

they have to go through. In general, though, I think it takes a week or two. As to "why" they do it this way, I imagine that yes, it's to avoid a) power struggles and b) the current Pope choosing his successor. I certainly wouldn't want to have been a medeival Pope while my successor was waiting for me to kick off.

[AZCat]

36. Thank you for answering my questions, Dookus

I appreciate it. :)

[Sgent]

49. Succession

The Chaberlian of the Vatican (Popes personal assistant, usually a bishop), is in charge of the Catholic Church until a new pope is selected, usually a matter of a few days to a month or two.

One of the interesting things about this upcoming election is that it now only takes 50%+1 votes to elect the pope. It used to take 2/3. Many expect this to lead to a more conservative candidate than might otherwise be named.

[CatholicEdHead]

47. It will be one of

these guys when it eventually happens.

http://www.ewtn.com/HolySee/Interregnum/electors.asp

[TahitiNut]

48. It's not required that the one elected is a Cardinal, or even a Bishop.

If not at least a Bishop, the Pope-elect would be ordained a Bishop before he selected a name and received the Conclave.

While not required, I don't know the last time he wasn't.

[regnaD kciN]

51. I've heard rumors...

...that it's likely to be Cardinal Ratzinger, who has been responsible for virtually every move toward conservatism out of the Vatican during JPII's tenure, and who has a great love for setting positions in stone via "papal infallibility."

Up until recently, it was thought that Ratzinger was far too right-wing to be chosen, but he is now considered to have become more "moderate" (the evidence for which escapes me) in recent years.

:eyes:

[deadparrot]

32. Wouldn't it be interesting...

if he passed away during, or shortly before, *'s SOTU?

Though my belief system has changed significantly, I'm still a baptized Catholic. And although I disagree with MANY of his postions, at least he is consistent in his opinions. I wish him the best, in life or death.

[Bake]

42. He reportedly embraced and forgave his would-be assassin.

According to MSNBC. While I disagree with many of the Pope's positions (note, I'm a liberal Southern Baptist), this is ONE example, at least, of authentic Christianity. Practicing what one preaches.

I hope the bashers won't come out if this is the end of the line for John Paul. A little respect, please.

Bake

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

43. More importantly

"Is Death's Doorstep on the Pope?"


:freak:

[Blue Gardener]

52. Flu Shot?

You would think he would have received one. Maybe it's a different strain?