Prediction

[Maestro]

In order to show that Iraq can defend itself and that we are able to come home, we will begin to send the new government tons of arms and weaponry. This will stimulate the defense contractors' business. This will show the 54 million that voted for * that we are defending democracy in the region. This will ensure that we are omnipresent in the region. We are never coming home. * has put us on a track so that even a democratic government here in the US will not be able to remove the troops without a tremendous vaccuum of violence ocurring.

[liberal N proud]

1. Didn't we give Saddam weapons before we took them away?

You are probably correct in your easement.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

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[LynnTheDem]

10. LOL!!!

We helped SADDAM HUSSEIN "defeat the threat of communism in Afghanistan."???

I don't think so! :D

[ramadoss]

13. We sure as shit did

When the soviets invaded Afghanistan.

[LynnTheDem]

17. Not Saddam Hussein

He never had one damn thing to do with Afghanistan.

[ramadoss]

19. Oops

I was thinking of Osama. Sorry bout that.

[LynnTheDem]

22. Yes you were.

Half of America does that, mixes Saddam Hussein with OBL.

[ramadoss]

26. Normally

I don't.

[ramadoss]

2. We couldn't

pull our tropps out without that before either. By sending weaponry to the Iraqi army and police don't you think that would help them defend themselves more often and more effectively. That should in theory allow us to remove our troops sooner.

[Maestro]

4. I'm not talking about sending arms to the police

I'm talking about building its military; all types of aviation, motorized weaponry, arms, etc...This will certainly allow them to defend themselves, yes. But what it amounts to is empire building something that this war was supposedly not about. Allawi is alreay saying that the US is going nowhere. * can always point to that and say, "See, the Iraqis want us there."

[ramadoss]

5. Allawi

Said that because the Iraqi people and the new government still need the help of our troops for security and to help provide basic utility services. Not necessarily empire building, just providing Iraq with the necessary items to protect itself.

[Maestro]

6. Well given the past record of this admin

I am extremely skeptical. And a massive build-up of military hardware in support of a government is empire building. What would empire building be to you?

[ramadoss]

7. Understood

I am skeptical of many things regarding this administration as well.

[LynnTheDem]

11. Allawi..."Saddam without the mustache"...the man Sistani's cleric just

called "the most corrupt government" Iraq has ever had.

bush's handpicked CIA-paid carbombing terrorist. And this is who you refer to. LOL!

[Name removed]

14. Deleted message

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[LynnTheDem]

18. Well gee...al Sistani's top cleric disagrees with you.

Now who should know better...him or you? Gee that's a toughie...

:eyes:

[ramadoss]

23. Does he?

BTW, he's not such a great man himself. That's just my opinion though.

[leftchick]

8. The USA is spending Billions on a Permanent Presence in Iraq

our soldiers are Not coming home in our lifetime if the neo-cons fulfill their insane wetdreams....Look at what they are doing Not what they are saying...

~snip~


Though the media ignored Kerry's statement and failed to do any substantive follow-up research, his comments were well-grounded in reality. On the day of the debate the Christian Science Monitor spotlighted the findings of defense specialist John Pike, whose website, GlobalSecurity.org, located twelve "enduring bases" in Iraq, including satellite photos and names. In March, the Chicago Tribune reported that US engineers were constructing fourteen such long-term encampments--the number Kerry referred to. The New York Times previously placed the number at four.


While the exact figure may change, suspicions of undisclosed US imperial plans--exemplified by permanent military bases--rightfully linger. Before the war, Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz suggested moving US troops stationed in Saudi Arabia into Iraq. In October, a survey by the University of Maryland's Program on International Policy Attitudes found that two-thirds of respondents disapproved of a permanent military presence, even though more than half thought the US would build the bases anyway.


Now comes a report in the New York Sun by Eli Lake revealing that the Pentagon (news - web sites) is building a permanent military communications system in Iraq, a necessary foundation for any lasting troop presence. The new network will comprise twelve communications towers throughout Iraq, linking Camp Victory in Baghdad to other existing (and future) bases across the country, eventually connecting with US bases in Qatar, the United Arab Emirates and Afghanistan (news - web sites).


"People need to get realistic and think in terms of our presence being in Iraq for a generation or until democratic stability in the region is reached," Dewey Clarridge, the CIA (news - web sites)'s former chief of Arab operations (and Iran-contra point man), told the Sun.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=2281&ncid=742&e=5&u=/thenation/20050118/cm_thenation/132132

[Maestro]

9. Thanks for this

and this again was not the reason for the invasion. Just think if we had tried to build up Afghanistan like this. Good communication links, fortified areas throughout the country to bring stability to the area, arming of police and troops. We would have or at least have a better chance at getting Usama Bin Forgotten. Instead we are spending billions in Iraq. Why? There are no WMD's. I can only think it is empire building.

[leftchick]

12. check out the Globalsecurity links...

there are some permanent bases in Afghanistan as well but no where near the billions of dollars worth we are spending in Iraq. Yep, that PNAC plan is coming to fruition.

Personally though I believe it is doomed and a Huge waste of our tax dollars and lives. The Iraqi resistance will just use those bases and towers as eternal targets until the US is booted out.

[shadowknows69]

15. Speaking of Afghanistan

Why is nobody questioning why we're still there. They had their elections quite a while ago and * constantly references them as a success. No exit strategy for those 10,000 troops? I figure that's at least what we'll leave in Iraq permanently when we finally do a "full" troop withdrawal.

[ramadoss]

16. What I know

As far as I know US troops have been sort of working with Pakistani troops on opposite sides of the border trying to rein in members of Al-Qaeda and other terrorists.

[shadowknows69]

21. and

haven't heard much news of us capturing any lately. Seems like anytime shrub references it he says we "defeated the taliban" so what's left to do? I know they can't still be looking for OBL because Bush said he wasn't concerned about him anymore. We're there to protect the new Afghani pipeline that will give us a straight shot to the sea once we secure Iraq and Iran. Let the black gold flow.

[leftchick]

24. another bush** LIE

the Taliban is still functioning in Afghanistan. Psst don't tell the sheeples though.

[ramadoss]

27. hmm

Remnants of the fundamentalist Taliban, whose regime was ousted by a US-led military campaign in late 2001, still attack foreign and government troops, mainly in the south and southeast along the Pakistan border.

McCann said his troops on Tuesday unearthed two weapons caches containing dozens of martors and rockets in Helmand and neighbouring Paktia province.

http://www.politicalgateway.com/news/read.html?id=2753

[leftchick]

29. Exactly my point, the aWol asshole lied again...

as he lies daily about, well, every fucking thing. In this case the "taliban are NOT gone" from Afghanistan.

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1535&u=/afp/20050117/wl_sthasia_afp/afghanistantaliban_050117090232&printer=1

<snip>
The move could propel a wider amnesty offer aimed at Taliban foot soldiers, some of whom have waged an insurgency from the hills and caves of Afghanistan since the Islamic regime was ousted by a US-led operation in late 2001.


Chief justice Fazel Hadi Shinwari said negotiations with militants from the fundamentalist movement were continuing and some more moderate Taliban were eyeing the olive branch.


"One category of Taliban want to come back and they have contacted us and the government... and the government is providing them the opportunity to come back," Shinwari said after the detainees were freed by the US military from Bagram air base near Kabul on Sunday before the Muslim festival of Eid.

[LynnTheDem]

20. We're still fighting in Afghanistan

The Forgotten War.

Still fighting the Taleban at the same time as trying to make up with them:

Reconciliation Effort with Taliban Picks Up Pace in Afghanistan

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1535&u=/afp/20050117/wl_sthasia_afp/afghanistantaliban_050117090232&printer=1

U.S. widens Afghan focus

http://www.washtimes.com/world/20041224-090129-2792r.htm

Other news this week:

02/02/05 Interfax:: Two Tajik hostages freed in Afghanistan
Tajik border guards and Afghan special services conducted an operation to release two Tajik citizens who were taken hostage by Afghan drug dealers, a high-ranking source in Tajikistan's border guard committee told Interfax on Wednesday.

02/02/05 AlJazeera:: Pakistan denies helping U.S. target suspects on border
Pakistan strongly rejected claims by a top American military official that its forces helped U.S. troops in Afghanistan direct artillery fire at suspects on the Pakistani side of the border.

01/31/05 New Kerala Media: : Two killed by bomb in Afghanistan
According to The News, the pair, who had Afghan identity papers, were killed while placing a bomb on a road which links the eastern city of Jalalabad to Kunar province, said interior ministry spokesman Lutfullah Mashal.

01/31/05 PakTribune:: Mine explosion kills five civilians in southern Afghanistan
Five civilians died and at least nine others were injured the other day when their pickup truck hit a mine apparently left over from Afghanistan's long wars, officials and witnesses said.

01/30/05 Reuters: Tribesmen bomb electricity towers in Pakistan
Tribesmen seeking regional autonomy set off bombs in the Pakistani province of Baluchistan on Saturday and Sunday, destroying electricity towers but causing no casualties, officials said.

01/30/05 Xinhuanet: Tanker carrying oil for US forces attacked near Pak-Afghan border
Unidentified men Sunday attacked a tanker carrying oil from southwestern Pakistan to US forces in Afghanistan, causing damage to the vehicle but there was no casualties, according to independent News Network International.

01/30/05 Reuters: Landmine blasts kill two in Afghanistan
Two separate landmine blasts in the south and east of Afghanistan killed at least two people and injured 15 others, police officials said.

01/29/05 News Limited:: Rockets, bombs rock Pakistan
TWO bombs and two rockets rocked the main city in troubled south-western Pakistan overnight but caused no casualties, police said today.

01/29/05 Reuters:: Attackers blow up Pakistan gas pipeline
Unidentified attackers have blown a natural gas pipeline in eastern Pakistan, disrupting supplies, officials say, the second such attack in less than a month.

01/29/05 KUNA: Landmine explosion kills nine Afghan soldiers
A landmine explosion, planted by suspected Taliban fighters, killed nine Afghans on Saturday in the southern Kandahar province of Afghanistan, bordering Pakistan, said a report.

http://icasualties.org/oef/

[shadowknows69]

25. why would we reconcile with someone we defeated?

do the sheeple even know how to read anymore? I think the only other thing I've ever seen with such glaring contradictions to itself is maybe the bible.

[leftchick]

28. hey ramadoss...

why no reply to my Post about the permanent US presence in Iraq?
Those neo-cons have big plans for the Mid-east and it is essential to have those bases and communications towers (aka: Iraqi targets!)

[bigtree]

30. funny

we just started an effort in afghanistan to collect the stinger missles we gave bin laden and the resistance when reagan was king.