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Dr Dean's Agenda... Suggestions for our trip back from the brink

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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:38 PM
Original message
Dr Dean's Agenda... Suggestions for our trip back from the brink
Have a meeting with all democratic "leaders"...ASAP..

Clue THEM into the "no response to unattributed quotes" doctrine..and make them adhere to it..

Ask them to PLEASE avoid screaming head"talk shows" where they will undoubtedly be out-numbered,ignored, derided and interrupted.

Make sure that the ones who DO go on shows are PREPARED...and KNOW what they are talking about.. It;s like fingernails on a blackboard to see them reply.." I hadn't heard about.... or.... especially when ... has been on the news for DAYS..

Remind them that republicans are NOT our friends, our "colleagues across the aisle", our partners.. They are our ENEMIES, who seek to humiliate and destroy us. They have not been shy about admitting this. They have accused us, as a party...as a group, of being Godless, indecent, amoral, liars, cheats, and a multitude of other "sins". There is NO middle ground on this.

Pound home the idea that the media...ALL of it.. is NOT our friend. The smiling, well dressed man or woman with the microphone is only interested in getting a sound byte that can (and will be) used against us ad nauseum. The media is not interested in facts.. Facts are kryptonite to them. They want spin..pizzaz..confrontation.

Work hard on the language... People do not take time for policy renditions.. Modern marketing techniques have taught the public to listen for the "hook"..the buzzwords. Just look at the way ideas have been bastardized by the republicans:

Logging old growth forests has become " Healthy Forests"
Canceling a woman's right to choice has become "Pro Life" (as if we are Pro Death)
Testing children relentlessly, while subtracting real teaching time has become "Leave No Child Behind"
Destroying working public programs while funneling public money to fundamentalist church organizations has become "Faith-based Initiatives"
Removing taxes from super-wealthy inheritances became "Death Taxes"
Allowing polluters to self-regulate and swap credits became "Clear Skies"
Under-educated common people who vote against their own interests is "Heartland"

In the absence of our own buzzwords, the very least we SHOULD be doing is outing these scams in the loudest voice possible..NOT agreeing to them like a whipped stray dog.

Develop a "farm team" of TV savvy, photogenic, well-spoken young people who can "hit the road" and spread our message. Kennedy and some of our other leaders have become "radioactive" by the massive propaganda machine the republicans use, and almost anything said by these democrats is immediately "on the radar screen".

Use the media you have... Air America would certainly welcome regular visits and their audience is building. Sometimes preaching to the choir is a good thing. We need reassurance that you are still with us.

Use the "sugar daddies" we do have to good advantage. There are many small communities with REAL people doing their own radio shows.. They are not the "big time" radio guys, but they are often paying out of their own pockets to spread YOUR (and our) message. They need some financial help. A very small amount of help can mean the difference between them being on the air or not. Guy James down in the belly of the beast (Florida) is just such a person..

Make sure there is NEVER another unopposed republican running in ANY office. It has to start somewhere. The excuse often given is "Our candidate has no chance, so why "waste" the money?" Here's why we "waste" the money.... Never give the republican a free ride.. MAKE them spend money..OFFER the people a choice. How many democrats are eager to run out and vote when they do not even have a candidate to vote for?

Encourage the republicans amongst us to "hear their momma calling them" and to run along home..Lieberman comes to mind. We really won't miss them much. If we cannot count on their loyalty, and if they crave "face-time with Bush", they are a liability..not an asset.

Carve out a set of "rules".. Number one on that list should be "Do not give the enemy ammunition". When we form circular firing squads and embarrass our own, we might as well be writing the script for the next republican commercial against us. Our candidates should feel free to debate policy with each other, but if they cannot win without demonizing fellow dems, they do not deserve to be the candidate.

Lacking the gazillion think tanks of the republican machine, USE the people you have. There might even be MORE advice available via the web, through the many left-leaning websites. They are full of REAL people with REAL ideas. Good ideas are not limited to well paid advisors in $1,000 suits. Where better to get public opinion, than from the public? These are FREE researchers, at the click of a mouse. They are there...use them...

Admit you use polls, BUT explain to the public how FEW people are actually polled, and how polls can be (and ARE) skewed by the kind of questions asked, the time of day people are called, the zipcode choice, and the political leanings of the pollsters. Lots of people do not know this..

Can the gobbledygook-speak. Use real language..Encourage our people on the ground to speak TO the people..not AT them.

The republican mantra, for decades has been "attack..attack..attack", and look what it's gotten them... The white house, the senate, the house, the supreme court, control of radio, tv, and newspapers.

Good Luck, Dr. Dean. We need your help, and are eager to have you make a real difference in our party.


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Us vs Them Donating Member (725 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. Develop a "farm team" of TV savvy, photogenic, well-spoken young people
I couldn't agree with this more, but how to go about it?
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Colleges are FULL of them..
We need to seek them out from ALL over the country. Especially in the southwest and the south..
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Us vs Them Donating Member (725 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Say Midwest too and we have a deal!
First, the Democratic party needs to show that they trust and care about the student movement. I have serious doubts that any well-versed, photogenic, young person could ever get that far. I'd be more than happy to try, though!
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Midwest.. Let's sign you up
:)

Remember.. most of those rightwing pundits you see on TV 24/7, started at the bottom.Their bios, if you start scrutinizing them are pretty thin.. They are NOT "experts". They just happened to look good on TV, and were zealously pro-republican. They were "the farm team"...and now they are in our faces constantly..

They are able to spout the party-line without causing "harm" to the elected republicans..

we need "some of that ":)
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Us vs Them Donating Member (725 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. I've spent a good deal of time contemplating punditry...
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 08:06 PM by Us vs Them
I think a good discussion should take the form of a closely matched chess game. The problem most Democratic pundits have - they are arguing, they are not playing. They answer questions seriously that should be at best offered with a humorous volley. They get angry when they should be smirking confidently. It doesn't take much to turn any conversation in your favour, if you wait for a proper hole and drive home your core points - with dignity and class, mind you.

This is all theory coming off my Public Relations and the Media class, but it's obvious to point out mistakes I've seen.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. You would be PERFECT.. That's an apt analysis
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 08:11 PM by SoCalDem
Our people are goaded into "serious" discussions when the host has NO INTENTION of letting them talk for more than 45 seconds, so they come off as looking foolish and sputtering.

Some just start talking faster, which doesn;t help one bit..

Derision WORKS.. We need to use it.. When Bush comes up with some lame-brain scheme.. CALL IT A LAME-BRAIN SCHEME, and then sneer :)

Our people seem to always fall into the little traps that are set for them.. the repubes have mastered "snare avoidance 101"..

We also need to toss the hand grenade back to them.. like "Why would you ask such a silly question?"

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Us vs Them Donating Member (725 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Turning the heat on the host.
Most talking head shows are nothing but a joke. The Democrats are the punchline. To those who take TV punditry as a venue by which to really get the word out, they're far off the mark. And their depressing results have all of us rank and file members frustrated. TV Punditry (as sad as it is to admit) is a contest of personality. One can appear on television with a message, but will easily be overpowered, ridiculed, or suffer the most humiliating threat "I'm going to turn your mic down!"

In order to A) survive, and B) actually get the audience to connect with your message takes ultimate media savvyness. And it can be obtained by simply playing it cool. There are no questions you, as a pundit, HAVE to answer. Despite the potential labels you might be slapped with, you are not a mouthpiece for all Liberals or Democrats. You are a person - no, make that personality. All you have to do is sell yourself. This is the easiest way to relieve the pressure from the hot seat, and place it back on the host whose show will ultimately be affected.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Most of the dems I see on TV now, have a desperate air about them
I know the opportunities are limited, but in most cases LESS is more.. I even advocate a "shunning" of certain shows altogether.Is there a single thinking person who believes that a dem can get ' a "fair shake" on O'Really?'s "show"???

So why not just refuse en masse to even attend the freak shows/ Sooner or later the few people who accidentally wander into the freak shows will realize that it's only republicans participating.:)
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Us vs Them Donating Member (725 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Desperate, frightened, confused...
I suggest two shots of vodka before appearing on TV. It could only help, right? As for Bill O'Reilly, I've never actually seen his show. (I suppose I should once, for research sake.) I don't think it'd be that difficult. I heard he lies a lot.

I would agree with the idea of boycotting those shows, however, I'm sure they'll always be able to find someone who is willing to claim they are a Democrat to carry on the charade. Better to find those who pundit well and send in a party approved opponent than misrepresentation by network hacks.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. i agree
'Better to find those who pundit well and send in a party approved opponent than misrepresentation by network hacks.'
the boxer battalion. really work on strategies to out them more than to fight them.
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Mend Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 07:54 PM
Response to Original message
4. Fantastic: send this to them.....eom
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graywarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
11. Kick the asses of the DEC's especially here in Florida
Round up the old dinosaurs and replace them with young people.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. There's a time when "elder statesman" is a liability
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 09:22 PM by SoCalDem
I am not a "youngster", but I know that people who "look good" are perceived better than others.. I LOVE Amy Goodwin, but she looks frazzled and outdated. She's a perfect "radio personality"..a nice voice, smart as a whip, and able to converse with anyone on anything, but on TV she is not taken seriously..

I wish it were not this way, but it IS :(
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graywarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 09:09 AM
Response to Reply #12
39. I'm talking "old ideas"
People who are afraid to change direction and try new things to attract members.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
13. air america
they are already using air america.
randi has told them a milion times, she says, that they need a rapid response team, and aar is armed and at attention. i think they are getting it.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Rightwing radio is more than 50% responsible for republican ascendance
Lots of 'Heartland' people like hunters, farmers,hairdressers, factory workers, office workers, restaurant workers (not the chi-chi restaurants),people who drive on vacations, truck drivers, military.. The one thing they all have in common, is a radio, tuned to usually one station all day long.. It's playing in the background (can you say 'subliminible'?)

One rightwinger after another 24/7...how could they NOT pick up the agenda and claim it as their own.. It's all they hear..
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. just ask randi
she says this all the time- q. how the heck can truck drivers be republicans? a. talk radio.
she'll get 'em. truck driver, air force mechanic, loud mouth girl. give her time.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 07:40 AM
Response to Reply #18
38. We need MORE people like Randi.. One Randi up against
hundreds of Bushbots is not a fair "fight"..
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #38
41. that's sure true
one randi to about 100 bots is about fair, i think.
fear not tho, aar will be in almost every decent sized market in this country by the end of the year. look how much they have already grown. and there are people out there in small markets that will get larger exposure once people see aar's success.
it is not so much red or blue that counts, but green.
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tomreedtoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #38
50. Randi Rhodes is the WRONG way to go!!!
Have you listened to her - REALLY listened to what she says? Everything she says is full of despair! She's constantly whining about how awful things are, and how there's no hope for progressive causes. I fully expect her to slash her wrists on the air any day now.

For God's sake, cancel her show and put anyone else on in her place. Put the guys from Take Back The Media on. Put Bartcop on. Even Bob Boudelang at his rabid worst would be better than Rhodes.
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baron j Donating Member (434 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 04:34 AM
Response to Reply #50
52. That's why I enjoy listening to Fintan Dunne.
His website needs a bit of reorganization, but his personal messages during his broadcasts are upbeat and encouraging.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-15-05 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #52
55. Have never heard of him.. Can we listen online?
and i do agree that randi can be strident and whiny, BUT she's not one bit afraid of voicing an opinion.. We cannot rely on the "eishy-washies" that sometimes pass for "liberal radio hosts".. I always gag when people say.. Well... Alan Colmes is liberal and HE has a show"..:puke:... Sure..and his "day-job" is as punching bag for Hannity.. sorry.. no deal, Alan :)
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:56 PM
Response to Original message
16. About the talk shows
We have to do those. The talk shows is the hearts-and-minds battlefield. Most people get their news from TV; it is a medium we can't just leave to the GOP. Instead of avoiding them, we need to train and deploy people who can handle the lights, handle the hosts, and handle the debate on its own terms. We need to teach our spokespeople how to do this, and get them on the air. Right now, we're not very good at it.

Message discipline and an eye for the jugular, along with a solid grasp of the facts and figures. Go on TV. Kick ass.
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JohnOneillsMemory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 03:16 AM
Response to Reply #16
34. Calling to radio-NPR's 'Talk of the Town' is national air time every day!
Edited on Sun Feb-13-05 03:17 AM by JohnOneillsMemory
You have to make nice and sound 'on topic' with the call-screener before you go on the air.

Keep getting through and make it count. In summer of 2002 I got on the air for about two minutes and got out most of the info in 'Fahrenheit 911' AND dissed NPR for not giving us the news we need to be citizens of a democracy.

When the host interrupted me to say "now I realize you have an agenda..." I retorted "No! 'Having an agenda' is code-speak for having the facts that your corporate donors don't want said out loud!" So then the host let me keep going to show how 'public' they'd like us to think they are. HA!

With skill, you can be just enough 'on topic' to get in the bits you want the country to hear.

I recommend popping the cover story bubble around 9/11 by citing the Associated Press story on 8/21/02 that on the morning of 9/11 NORAD was running a 'live fly' exercise simulating multiple hijacked planes crashed into buildings that disabled our air cover. So Condi, Rummy, and Bush** have been lying for a long time and bungled national security in the worst way.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/news/archive/2002/08/21/national1518EDT0686.DTL

ttp://www.911review.org/Wget/www.oilempire.us/wargames.html
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 04:55 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. The same holds true for c-span.. I have gotten on-air many times
The secret is to look up who's going to be on, in case your call gets through when a guest is on..MAKE a list with keywords so you stay o message.. Speak plainly and do not run all the words together. People tend to rush through what they have to say, and talk too fast.

Go online and look up pertinent information..have the sources ready just in case.. More than once I have heard Brian or Steve actually ask the caller where they got the information.. If you give an internet address, leave out the www and the .com part (unless it's .net or .gov) ..Just the name will usually get you where you need to go.

If you are calling to talk to a guest, tell them hello and mention their name..Ask them an unexpected question and catch them off guard.. I once made a bushbot squirm when I asked him about some emails he had written, and whether they had been turned over yet.. they had been subpoaened, and I happened to read about it online.. Google helps A LOT.. His face turned beet-red and he squirmed A LOT..:)
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LibDemAlways Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 09:59 PM
Response to Original message
17. You are so right about the
Dems who show up on tv and respond "I haven't heard about that." A few days ago Maxine Waters was on Wash. Journal and a c-span caller asked her to talk about PNAC. Her response: "I'm sorry, but I haven't heard about that." Gave the host an easy out...."Next call on our line for supporters of the chimp..."

We can't get the message out if Dems are so uninformed. Dean should be insisting these people get up to speed on various repuke outrages. They exist in a bubble.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #17
24. That's incredible that Maxine Waters
doesn't know what pnac is.

As much as I like her..It would have been really nice if she could have expounded on that a little bit for the caller and the viewers.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:38 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. I think she "knows", but chose not to respond with that excuse given
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 11:18 PM by SoCalDem
Our leaders have GOT to stop shying away from the "uncomfortable" discussions. We have let the repubes define the argument for sooooo long, and ANY criticism of THEM, is portrayed as CONSPIRACY...LEFT-WING LOONIES..ETC..

Look what happened to Cynthia mcKinney when she spoke "out of turn"..

There is REAL fear on Capitol Hill.. it's palpable.. This is why it will take a concentrated effort with MANY people participating in the "outing of the republican lie machine"... Maxine cannot do it alone, and she can be excused a little for not sticking her neck out on the chopping block.. There is safety in numbers, and our people must coordinate their efforts.

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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. I hear ya!
Maxine has been fearless in the past..we need to get behind her and all the others who are leaders and let them and the World know we ain't takin' it no mo'!
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LibDemAlways Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 12:51 AM
Response to Reply #25
32. I know it's difficult to be a lone voice of truth,
but if she did know about PNAC, all she really needed to do was tell the caller, "It sounds like you are already informed as to what the Project for a New American Century is all about. I'd suggest that if c-span viewers want to know more about why we went into Iraq, the Project for a New American Century website lays it all out. It's scary reading, but vital for understanding the agenda of this administration."

She wouldn't have been putting her head on the chopping block by sending people directly to the source. The information is at the fingertips of anyone with a computer. All they need is the url.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:09 PM
Response to Original message
19. Dumbest thing I heard yet on the local news.
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 10:10 PM by Cleita
"Howard Dean may take the Democratic Party to the left."

Duh? I thought that was supposed to be what we are, the party of the political left?
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Lindacooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
20. PLEASE send this to Dr. Dean!!
What you wrote is absolutely fabulous and right on.

I especially think Dems should start calling Repukes (often, loudly, and on every show) on these programs they so heartlessly name the exact opposite of the program's effect. I get so sick of hearing 'Healthy Forests Initiative' when it's anything but.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. I did send it to him
He's a smart cookie, though, and he probably already knew all of this :)
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Lindacooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #21
28. Good for you - thank you!!!
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Sparkly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:22 PM
Response to Original message
22. One more
"Hire SoCalDem." ;)

Great post!
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Thanks.. I can start tomorrow, and I don't charge much
:)
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:01 PM
Response to Original message
26. DAMN.. I forgot the MOST important point I wanted to make..
Edited on Sat Feb-12-05 11:02 PM by SoCalDem
STFU.. about your "strategery" and plans..

How many times have you seen opposing coaches exchange playbooks before the "big game"..???


RESIST..RESIST the temptation to spill your guts when the pundits ask their inane questions.

Have planning sessions with trusted people..IN PRIVATE.. When the pundits ask what the "plan" is, just tell them.. "You'll see", and change the subject. It might take a while though, because right now they are used to asking questions and having the Dem guest act like he's just been injected with sodium pentathol...and when the pundit says negative things about our party or candidate, DENY them and ask them just how many faxes a day the get from the White House...or if Karl Rove is hiding in the green room feeding their wire with nutty questions :)
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candy331 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #26
51. Very well said, STFU,has been my tirade a while with Dems. Why
give away your plans to the opposing side.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:44 PM
Response to Original message
29. We should buy you a ticket
And have you personally deliver that to every politician in DC. Excellent!!

:toast:
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Thanks..
They DO need a hearty dose of reality , don't they?
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HR_Pufnstuf Donating Member (782 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 12:01 AM
Response to Original message
31. Take to the airwaves.
Edited on Sun Feb-13-05 12:08 AM by HR_Pufnstuf
Everyone who has never done it, should begin calling in to talk radio, with your talking points well prepared.

Pin down some major city talk radio dj's at rush hour on your cell.

I once got out in Houston, at rush hour, that it's people like Limbaugh and Hannity that were driving the wedge in this country.

Classic day for me.

Call up.



Congrats Dr. Dean.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 01:33 AM
Response to Original message
33. GREAT post. On AirAmericaRadio today I heard one of the shows
discussing low power FM community radio stations that broadcast to reach very small areas..local areas. They are fighting via the Prometheus Project ( http://www.prometheusradio.org/ )
Granny D , among others, is involved with this project.
This might be a good place for us to get our message across to the locals as well.


About Prometheus

The Prometheus Radio Project draws its name from the mythological Greek character who stole fire from the gods in order to share it with humans. We are a not-for-profit association dedicated to the democratization of the airwaves through the proliferation of non-commercial, community based, micropower radio stations. It is our belief that access to communications for all citizens is at the heart of a democratic society.

By the way, the gods were not exactly pleased with Prometheus so they chained him to the side of a mountain and then conspired with an eagle to ensure that the bird would visit Prometheus every day and rip out his liver. The liver would regenerate over night because of Prometheus' immortality.

Go figure...
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 03:29 AM
Response to Original message
35. Learn to play the game like Republicans
that means withdrawing or not soliciting grassroots support from candidates who repeatedly vote for the Republican agenda.

Above all, the Democrats need discipline and turncoats MUST learn that there will be consequences to betrayal.

Otherwise, why even bother-


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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 05:28 AM
Response to Original message
37. Kick ... 'cause this thread kicks ass!
:kick:
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
40. Awesome, now that's exactly what we need
good thread

:kick:
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
42. GREAT post, SoCalDem!!!
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cascadiance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
43. Don't take on the RW noise machine head on, find new creative ways...

Take a page out of the books of the Vietnamese and the Iraqis. They realized they couldn't take on our military might head on. Guerilla warfare is what has been and is giving us fits over there. As Hayden Fry used to say coaching Iowa football teams, "You scratch where it itches."

Michael Moore helped last year get the documentary wagon going at the theaters with Fahrenheit 9/11 which was a good weapon. This was a new way to get captive audiences where the Repubs weren't well armed.

You have a whole web full of internet bloggers that are recruiting many of our great minds out there thinking the same way. Collectively we could come up with new ways than just the mass media to help people get informed and to help out Democrats in other ways. Here's some ideas:

1) Perhaps do something like work with Starbucks (a blue company that is all over the map here) to perhaps put internet kiosks in their tables as inexpensively as possible, so that most franchises will put them in.

2) Come up with and refine blog/alternative press search engine that makes it easy for someone sitting down at Starbucks for a cup of coffee to read the non-mainstream news sites in a simple way that they can trust (perhaps an ebay-style rating system for different information sites, along with their profiles to help them find sites/news articles that match their interests and also that other fellow Dems like themselves like.

3) Allow individuals to build their own customized news clips to merge with their music streams that they get from internet radio streaming services out there now. This could also be perhaps made a feature of Satellite radio in people's cars if it over time becomes more "localized" to reach the non-internet connected folks as satellite radio (or other digital radio streams through consumer devices) become more popular.

4) In general, just find other ways to connect to the non-internet crowd to the alternative news and information space, and allow people to "take charge" and personalize the news more and get from sources they trust more in an easy way. There are ways I think if we think out of the box on how to draw more people in to what we're used to reading, etc. if we think outside of the box. Perhaps another thing would be to have customized carts with built-in electronic PDA's at Costco (another blue company) that would help shoppers "buy blue" at their stores when they scan in a barcode of a product they are looking at.

I think Dean has built a nucleus with his web-based organizations to get this creative alternative methodology working. He just needs to reach further into the blog space to grab the good ideas and make them happen. Money spent here up front that yields technologies that are cheaper in the long run to reach people with will help avoid us getting wasted by heavy spending by the Republican noise machine when the elections happen again. I'm hoping the organization he builds will be able to sift out the real bright and simple ideas and weed them out from the nerdy stuff that some of us might obsess on that might not be practical. This could be our "think tank" strategy for the coming years.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #43
44. Satellite radio is something that I have high hopes for
Years ago people bristled at the "very idea of having to PAY for TV", but now most people probably have cable and see it as a normal thing.. Satellite radio may be the same way soon, as more and more people get fed up with what passes for regular radio..

Niche programming will be the way of the future, for TV and radio, so even though we may not "bridge the gap" and convert conservatives, at least we may finally hear news that is of interest to us.

Foreign countries actually have media that is deliberately biased toward a "side". The US has always pretended to be "middle of the road"..non-biased broadcasting.. We know that it is not true, though just because they tell us it is. As long as big-business corporations OWN media, and thos same companies have "business" before the congress and government, they can NEVER be truly unbiased.People need to understand this.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
45. you know what annoys me?
Edited on Sun Feb-13-05 04:12 PM by mitchtv
You have an R and a D, you ask the D a question, They try to answer earnestly; the R rudely interrpts with an accusation, The D then forgets what he's saying and trys to answer the R's rude accusation; completely losing his point. It happens ALL the time. They are so afraid to say "STFU, let me continue"
see:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1592845
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #45
46. This is NO accident. They are TAUGHT to do this
Edited on Sun Feb-13-05 03:47 PM by SoCalDem
It's just as important to keep your opponent from making a point, as it is to make YOUR point. Republicans are greedy pigs. They simply must control everything, even conversations or interviews..

If only a few did it, I might cut them some slack, but it's obvious...they are trained to do it.. and if you'll also notice, when a republican pundit is on TV, and is reluctant to butt in, you rarely see them again. The bold, pugnacious ones are the ones who "succeed".. With their "success" comes offers of MORE "performances" and speaking tours and books.. and maybe even their own show.

Sometimes I wonder if they really believe the crap they say, or if they are just doing what they "need" to do in order to make big bucks..
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. Meanwhile, the Dem comes off as whining,
that they get no respect. F'n demand it, goddamn it! refuse to play the straight man being ridiculed. Say: "I am leaving if you don't let me speak".FARM TEAM, that goes for local fights too. No respectfor cheap tricks; stay on point, same point, from everyone all week, every day, no exceptions- it's called discipline.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. That bugs the hell out of me too.. The Dem is always the one who
must somehow seem conciliatory and if they are not, THEY are made out to be the "bad sport". Republicans are THUGS...no wonder they use that word over and over.. they are familiar with it.

It's like being raped, and then finding out that the rapist is invited to have dinner with the family..and you have to be nice to them, or YOU are the "bad sport".. BAH !!!
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cascadiance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. Yes, changing the subject is something they always try to do
Edited on Sun Feb-13-05 05:32 PM by calipendence
It also happens if you at times get too much detail in talking to a R too. If you leave one "hole" that they can attack you with, they will respond with full force going after that hole (whether their argument is valid or not) and ignore everything else you say. You have to be adamant about pointing out how they aren't responding to your points, and keep your arguments brief and to the point to avoid giving them that "leeway". I'm convinced they are trained to do this too.
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apple_ridge Donating Member (406 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
53. You nailed it also on the approach to RW dems, in particular,
Joe Lieberman. Those repugs who feign being democrats should be told to get in line immediately or be totally cut off economically and ostracized by all members of the party.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #53
54. Are people from CT that conservative?? I cannot see why he
Edited on Mon Feb-14-05 03:34 PM by SoCalDem
keeps getting elected.. Surely there's someone in CT who could represent them dems without being available 24/7 for *²
I know that dems must occasionally vote for legislation that is not perfect, but to crow about it and pose with *², grinning from ear to ear, bust turns my stomach..

It's too bad that the dems were not united.. Think of how the history books would look if there were NO pictures of dems in any of the signing ceremonies...no dems being hugged, kissed etc..

Rove is planning this stuff so that the "archives will abound with pictures of this friendly out-going president and the members of the opposition".. Remember pics are worth more than columns of text.. The print may say that he was an egotistical, ignorant bully, but he'll be there in all his glory, giving "noogies" to every willing dem within arms' reach..

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