Why the Rethug's LIKE the Gannon story

[Sgent]

We deomcrats have fallen right into Rove's hands with our hang up involving Jeff Gannon/Gluckart. We are pursing a story which will amount to nothing -- the worst thing PROVED so far is that we have admitted someone to the WH pressroom who shouldn't be there. Even he worst allegation I've seen is that he *might* have had access to an individual who had access to classified information. However, there has been no substaniated allegation that Gannon actually had access to classified info.

So we pursue this story, which leads nowhere, and we wind up a pin cushion for republicans who point out our hypocracy re: gays, etc. At the same time, we ignore more important and far-reaching stories such as continued abuse at Al Grab(sp) and Gitmo -- which have actually potential to do harm to the administration.

Good job, way to choose your targets.

edited for grammer

[LisaLynne]

1. Yeah, that's what I'm afraid of.

However, I'm more afraid that we're going to get gun-shy.

[Obviousman]

2. Oh come on, this isn't some rove conspiracy

Listen, let's take a play from rove's book and blow this so out of proportion, regardless of the facts, that bush is impeached.

[Bouncy Ball]

5. Exactly. I don't normally EVER take my behavior cues

from the right, but on this, they would push it and push it and push it HARD until it BECAME a scandal.

Why shouldn't we? bush is an immoral warmonger and a destructive person to have in office.

[mogster]

52. Yeah,blow it up

But keep track of what's the important issue here; that a partisan nobody got a press pass, and access to the WH press room AND access to information he shouldn't have had.

Play down the gay prostitute thing. The way every Republican standing now defends a male gay prostitute shows that there's just no limits to their hippocrisy. We now know (if we didn't know before) that their 'gay scare' is just that: a scare. They're just as gay as we may be, so to speak :-D

Or why not split the reaction/action?

1. A nobody got (unauthorized?) access to the WH press room.
Action:
Demand a revision of ALL access to the WH PR - access grants should hereafter be handled by an independent body, opened up for the media to report on, filtered for opinated people and put on a turnaround list, to ensure that the same BOF's don't lay siege to the McClellan talking stand every day. Or the President's talking stand, for that matter.
Demand an investigation of the fact that an UNKNOWN man using a FALSE NAME got CLOSE TO THE PREZ. Goddammit - this could have been a terrorist? Under normal circumstances, McC. should be forced to either admit to sloppy routines OR the fact that they let him in because he's 'friendly'.

2. The Republican party has stepped up in defense of male gay prostitution. No less.
Action:
Well, how can they ever talk about gay people from a negative perspective again? I know that Gan...or Gurk.. or what's-his-name, probably has been filed under the handy category of 'ex-gays now leading a proper Christian life', and as such is viewed as a person of great conviction and moral for taking a stand (by the Repubs, mind!). But as all who live in the real world knows; it doesn't work that way. Once gay - always gay. So what's he gonna do know? Celibacy? Hardly. He'll ...um.. feel the need for some lovin', and that's when the bloggers will get him. Surveillance time!
And someone should peek into his customers records - how on earth did he get the cred he has...?

[davhill]

3. Did the Freepers have reservations like this

When they brought down Rather and CNN? No? Then we shouldn't either.

[Bouncy Ball]

4. You haven't really been following the Gannon story, have you?

Also, considering the fact that you mentioned Abu Ghraib and Gitmo, I don't think you've been following the past four plus years.

What's your motivation for saying what you said?

Also, you realize there is nothing lost here, right? And that there's a lot more than just an uncredentialed non-journalist. Seriously. What's all this "we" and "Democrats?" Do I need to explain yet again that DU is NOT the Democratic party????

[Sparkle]

6. Yeah, okay.

A gay prostitute, hired by right wing Texans, with no journalistic experience, gets to ask Bush and his press secretary softball questions the last two years is not newsworthy.

[car54whereareyou]

7. Pick your poison

there's plenty to go around. What's happened to the free press is as important as Abu Ghraib & Gitmo.

[theorist]

8. So you think Rove broke this story?

And I don't think there is a good basis for arguing hypocrisy. Maybe you could share you thoughts on that. I mean, Avarosis is a gay activist, and I don't think there's going to be a move by homosexuals to the Republican party.

I think most of the researchers into these stories see this as their chance to finally put a crack in the side of the right wing.

[Bouncy Ball]

9. P.S. I doubt you can speak for all rethugs

and I've talked to a few who have told me they are "glad the Gannon thing is going away." They did NOT like it. And the gay prostitute angle made them distinctly uncomfortable, considering their party's stance.

It is THEY who are the hypocrites. Not us. You have this all wrong.

[SpiralHawk]

10. "...point out our hypocricy" on gays. BS

Any general reading of the posts on DU -- excluding those by people here with the intent of tossing chum in the waters of discussion -- reveal a thoughful posture toward the issue of homosexuality and the basic human rights and respect due to all human beings.

What DU posters tee off on -- with relish -- is the acual Republican hypocricy on corruption in general, and homosexuality in particular.

It's all painfully plain.

[Liberal In Texas]

11. Again...It's not about being gay. It's about hypocrisy.

And perhaps even deeper darker doings.

If you don't want to follow it, or wish to pay attention, please feel free to devote your time and energy to bring to light any other Bush evil-doings. Or whatever activism that you feel comfortable with.

It's not just one front.

[Sgent]

16. Response...

Is Carl Rove responsible for this?

No. That being said, he would rather something with no legal implications be the story of the moment for the Democrats than something much more serious.

Are we being hypocritical?

Maybe. Although I relize that DU is very gay friendly, and as someone who has supported an immediate family member through coming out, I am as well. That being said, we don't have to be hypocritcal -- we just have to provide enough ammunition for the rethugs to paint us as such. Take a look over at Freeperville, and they think we are being hypocritcal. Some gays here have expressed that they think its wrong to focus on the fact that he's gay, bush is gay, rove is gay (all topics in the last week). I agree

Why is Abu Grab more important?

Because the recent release by the ACLU has shown that there is continuing abuses in the prison, as well as throught the military (Gitmo, etc). This could lead to real reform, rather than the other which at most will lead to a tightening of white house press corp passes.

Why shouldn't I work on other issues?

I have and will. That being said, there is only so much that will "stick". Even if this story was well known to everyone, I just don't see it hurting Bush that much. Is the resignation of Scott McClellon worth sacrificing the reorganization of POWs, and the possible resignation of Rumsfield or various army generals who have allowed and encouraged ongoing torture?

[Bouncy Ball]

17. ...

You said:

"Take a look over at Freeperville, and they think we are being hypocritcal."

Since when do we care what freepers think????

[Sgent]

20. Its a little more complex than that

Obviously we don't care about freep's views.

That being said, if they take the position that we are attacking Gannon because he is gay, and that its hypocritcal, they will convince many who aren't intimately familiar with the story causing people who might otherwise be friendly to be driven away from the party.

[uppityperson]

23. sex sells news, is only a small part of it, hopefully they'll read more

Sex catches people's attention and sells newpapers and air time. However, most of us are in agreement that sex is not the issue here, only another showing of the rightwings hypocracy. They will say we attack this poor man because he's gay and doesn't he have a right to a private life because the best defense is a good offence. We have to make sure to answer that sex is just the hook, that the story is so much more and just let them whine if that is all they can do. Other, more reasoning people will listen and hear and it can be just one more nail in the coffin.

[Bouncy Ball]

24. Um, if they take the position that we are attacking Gannon for being

gay they must not EVER read this website. Anyone who wants to know for themselves can read this site and see that not EVER was Gannon attacked for being gay. It was ALWAYS about everything else.

No one here, quite frankly, CARES that he's gay.

People won't be likely to be "driven away" from the Democratic party because of one website.

If the inverse of that were true, anyone visiting freeperland would never vote republican again.

[Raksha]

37. If they take the position that we are attacking Gannon...

"because he's gay" they will be fooling exactly nobody. Not us, not even themselves! That kind of cheesy turn-the-tables put-down has become standard operating procedure. So far on another discussion board, I've been accused of being a racist because I objected to Condi's confirmation as Secretary of State, and then right after that I was accused of being "anti-Semitic" because I called Joe Lieberman a DINO. I thought that was especially funny because I'm Jewish!!! So if they want to accuse me of being a homophobe on top of that I'm not even going to bother getting mad...I'll just laugh in their stupid freeper faces AGAIN!

[Sparkle]

40. Fuck the Freepers!

[dansolo]

44. The gay issue includes the prostitution angle

If people know that he is gay, then they will also know about the prostitution part of the story. Gannon is not going to come off as a victim to most people.

[Liberal In Texas]

28. Response response

Who knows? Maybe Rove is responsible. Maybe not. If he is, it won't become know without digging and keeping the story alive.

As far as I'm concerned, the more information amassed, the better.

It's been mentioned that Rove/Bush/etc. are or may be gay/bi whatever, but it HAS NOT BEEN THE FOCUS.

If you think that, you haven't been reading all of the threads!

If nothing sticks, fine. But maybe, just maybe, if there is some truth to be brought to light, it might.

Please, don't tell me and a whole bunch of other DU'ers what to do. Take care of your own house.

[Jim Sagle]

12. Chickenshit bullshit. POUND THEM ON EVERYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Bouncy Ball]

14. Thank you. Bravo.

I am HIGHLY suspicious of any message that tells us to STOP what we are doing. Like others have pointed out on this thread, it's not a one-front war.

Pound them with EVERYTHING. Everything.

[FreedomAngel82]

43. I agree

We all know they control the MSM. So I think their lack of "reporting" on this story is enough proof for me to still go after this. I don't care he's gay. Hear that? I don't. I want to know how he got there when his "news organization" was only open a few days when it takes a long time for a background check. I want to know how he knew very VERY specific information before anybody else in the House pool. I want to know how HE got invited to invite only House parties and if any other press people were there or just him and why HIM?

[norml]

13. Let a thousand flowers bloom! Let all threads be followed!

Let people decide for themselves what leads nowhere. I strongly differ with those here who are trying to suppress this story, and suppress the further investigation of this story. The more targets, the better. Do the right wing media whores worry about having more than one issue to hit on at a time? They like having lots of targets, and shooting at them all at once. The gay thing is like saying we can't go after Rice because she's black. Since when did we care what Republicans think? They will trash us no matter what we do.

[Bouncy Ball]

15. The republicans say "Oh no guys, let's not go after this

I mean, it'll just make us look bad and maybe they WANT us to go after this, plus guys we can't follow more than one thing at once!"

Then they wring their hands and shake their heads and decide to give up.

:eyes:

[uppityperson]

18. Our hypocracy regading gays is what?

The problem for us is not that he is gay. The irony is that the gay-hating whitehouse and repubs have been caught holding the bag, so to speak, with their hypocracy. So, by saying they are hypocrites is showing them that we are? I don't understand this logic.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

19. As the old joke goes, "whaddya mean 'we', Kemosabe?" n/t

[Bouncy Ball]

25. Hey! How are you doing?

:hi:

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

27. Hey hey! Did your daughter enjoy lunch, and the lion dancer/shakedown

artists?

Wife and I are finally getting over our cold/flu. Would like to get caught up and do something similar again, mebbe closer to your end of things this time.

(Official thread hijacking over)

[Bouncy Ball]

29. No it's not over! LOL!

Did you get a PM from me, or did I just imagine sending it?

I am STILL craving shrimp dim sum. And I haven't been able to find any anywhere, though I will confess I have only looked at Costco! LOL!

Daughter LOVED that afternoon. And so did we. My husband was even tempted to sign up on DU, but he spends too much time downloading music and playing violent computer games!

We already have an idea for a place to go to, in March, if possible. Do you like German food?

I was horribly sick this past week. Yuck.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

31. We're all good with the German food. I am having very temperamental

computer system until a new motherboard comes in. So my DU and computer gaming time has been seriously limited in between crashes. But I'm still following stuff.

[FreedomAngel82]

45. I just wanted to say

to Mayberry I like your little dog in your avatar. VERY cute.

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

48. She likes you too! Heh. Actually this thread probably deserved to be

hijacked, lol.

[Spiffarino]

21. Not going anywhere

Well, except maybe for the popcorn. This story is just too good to let drop.

Anything that gives Rove fits is worth pursuing. They are pulling out all the stops on this one: "Secret" tapes from Bush's friend; new "terra" warnings; and more. Nope, I'm staying right here and will help push the Gannon story as far as our little donkey can carry it.

Get real. This is our blue dress.

[Laurab]

22. "So we pursue this story, which leads nowhere,"

Huh? How can you say where it leads - it is only just starting to break into the corporate media now. 2 or 3 people I know who aren't all that interested in politics have mentioned it to me today, and weren't even aware of the gay prostitute part, just the fake journalist with the "softball questions". Where it leads, I'm not sure anyone knows, but I have a feeling it will lead somewhere.

I find it doubtful the rethugs like the story - as far as I know none of the RW pundits have mentioned it. If they liked it, you can be sure they'd be mentioning it. No, I don't agree with you at all. I'm just waiting to see where exactly it DOES end up - I'm sure we're not even close yet.

I'm a multitasker, I can follow more than one thing at a time. I don't see the hypocrisy re: gays, either. I see a gay male prostitute posing as a reporter, given easy access to the white house to disseminate anti-gay information, among other things. I think there's a bit of hypocrisy there, on the part of the "oh so moral, family valuing, God fearing, gay-hating" administration, but certainly not in anyone pursuing the how and the why of it.

[Skittles]

26. if you don't think GANNON is a REAL F***ING SCANDAL

REGARDLESS of how the corporate media treats it, YOU ARE IN A DREAM WORLD. The whole thing STINKS.

[UTUSN]

30. It Ain't OUR Hypocrisy Not to Support WHOMEVER

who is being hypocritical---whether it is GONZALES/ESTRADA/THOMAS/MattPUDGE/AndrewSULLIVAN/etc.---betraying their home-group, claiming to be something other than they are, denigrating those like them while denying being LIKE them.

Members of whatever minority group, or majority group for that matter, have the right to their opinions and choices. By being Dems/Libs/Progs does NOT mean that we are supposed to support EVERY minority member BECAUSE of their minority identity. THAT would be racism/discrimination.

It is the Orrin HATCH RACIST argument that Dems are being anti-Hispanic or anti-Black by opposing GONZALES/ESTRADA/THOMAS. Extend this to GOOKert (KURTZ's pronunciation).

[Dr Fate]

32. Repubs LIKE having a Gay-Huslter/Pimp/media-insider w/ties to Bush??

"the sex" just gets our foot in the door- the real scandal is about media propaganda- like bribing pundits, etc...

Gannon's seamy world of pimps, GOP johns, journalists/insiders and drug addicts just makes it all that much more interesting & TV friendly...

[spanone]

33. Wrong.

..and how would you know how republicans think???? Oh, I see.

[LiberallyInclined]

34. Sgent?

that wouldn't be short for Sergeant Bulldog by any chance, would it? :bounce:

[Sgent]

35. The repugs would rather

have us focus on a sex story/minor scandle than a real one.

Sgent = Southern Gentleman, a screen name I adopted years ago (accurate or not) :)

[LiberallyInclined]

36. this is a REAL scandal...

when you consider the intellect of the average american- who couldn't even wrap their collective noodle around iran/contra- a sex scandal is all they'll pay attention to or even understand.

[FreedomAngel82]

46. Very true

All you have to do is look at their reaction with Clinton/Monica. :eyes: Very sad.

[Blue Wally]

50. The air went out of the Iran-Contra balloon

They immunized Poindexter in the committee thinking they were going to get Reagan. Poindexter then said he was the one who made the decision so we ended up getting Ollie North for cashing a government travellers check at Rite-Aid. You could just feel this gigantic exhale of oxygen from the Democratic side when Poindextere said that. Even the follow-up questions were half-hearted.

The same thing will happen here. We are so interested in finding out if Bush has a boy-toy that we and the MSM forget about the real substance here, using a fake-jounalist plant at a press conference (mot criminal, but surely unethical). How much investigative effort was pissed away trying to link Ollie north to his secretary Fawn hall in a sexual connection??

We canniot allow ourselves to be led down a salacious trail that has no productive end and be diverted from the basic truth of the case.

[LiberallyInclined]

53. i'm MUCH more concenred with the heart of the matter-

than with the boy-toy angle of it...but if it takes using the boy-toy angle to lead the public down the trail to the meat of the matter, then that's the way to go.

haven't we learned anything from their tactics?

[Eric J in MN]

38. If you're right, then why isn't Fox News talking about "Jeff Gannon"

around the clock?

Because the Republicans, DON'T like having the White House associated with a prostitute.

[Dr Fate]

39. Perhaps more than just a mere prostitute...

Web pornographer?

Pimp?

Involved with illegal drugs? Black mail?

"Point Man?"

Were his "tricks" any GOP or press insiders of note? I'll bet they were...

[Quixote1818]

41. I don't get too excited about anything any more but this seems like

it could turn into something major. It certainly needs to be pursued until we know how Gannon got his Press Passes. If you don't see that you need help.

[cry baby]

42. Abu Ghraib and Gitmo haven't gone anywhere - those stories have

been out there for a long time. Even Gonzales was confirmed with torture hanging over his head. That story isn't going anywhere in the U.S. It has legs internationally, however.

In my wildest dreams, these are all bricks in the wall!

[LiviaOlivia]

47. Yeah, you and the Rovian machine. Why isn't Ken Lay in jail?

The Texas Velvet Mafia. You don't get it.

[sendero]

49. Yeah, right.

The American public does not GIVE A DAMN ABOUT GITMO. They don't give a DAMN ABOUT TORTURE. As far as they are concerned, anyone getting sent to Gitmo or tortured had it coming.

But a homo sex scandal? That they can understand! Why can't you - you are thinking that America is not lying in the gutter right now, wake up.

If you think they aren't working overtime to make this thing go away before it gets even worse (and there is plenty of evidence to suggest it could get worse), you are really off the track.

edited: to be more moderate

[KayLaw]

51. Gay Schmay

The guys a hooker and it's not just something he did in the past--he did it until the bloggers called him (no pun intended) on it. Until very recently, you could see pictures of him on the internet spread-eagle or peeing. This guy got daily passes when someone like Maureen Dowd could not. He's a prostitute and propagandist. Are Bush's policies that horrible that he has to deal with such a person?