My response to the "troop bashing" accusation...

[fooj]

I've been posting here for a while now and sure, there are jerks lurking around. I won't deny that. The majority of us, however, are spending our time here trying to figure out just exactly HOW we can protect and honor those freedoms you speak of. Many of us are angry at the way this administration has manipulated and used our military for their own personal gain. We have spent many an evening trying to coordinate e-mail blitzes so that our soldiers are properly equipped and protected. I hang my flag daily and take it down in the evening as a sign of respect for those who have fought for this country.


"Did you openly express your discontent with policy makers and have a debate and discussion about our changing world without fear of being shot or locked away? If you did, thank a Vet. That troop insured your freedom to do so in this United States of America."

Unfortunately, open discussion isn't on the administrations agenda this time around. Our president has done his best to erode all of the hard work and sacrifice that our troops have so unselfishly given to this country. Decades and decades of sacrifice.

I don't know what your experience's have been like here so I cannot question the validity of your complaint. All that I know is recently, the Veterans of this country have taken quite a hit. It hasn't been from DU. It has been from the 43rd Pres. of The United States of America. You will never find a group of patriots (aside from our servicemen and women) who love their country more than the people here at DU! Peace!
********************
I wrote this last night before going to bed. I actually slept rather well. I'm proud to be a part of a group that trys to honor and defend our Constitution. So- my question is...HAVE YOU HUGGED AND THANKED A DUer TODAY? After countless insults with demeaning and degrading comments, WE ARE ALL STILL HERE TRYING TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE. I, for one, am sick of the constant barrage of innuendos in regards to our PURPOSE and our PATRIOTISM! Soon, there will come a day when the light of truth will shine brightly upon us all. Until then, our work continues...

Peace!!!B-)

[ComerPerro]

1. Nobody supports the troops like Republicans

To Bush, they are just a means of generating political capital.

To Cheney and Bush Sr, they are just a revenue source to be exploited.

To the Republicans in Congress, they are just an intangible entity used to stir up patriotism, because they have no real ideas or solutions to run on.

To the mainstream media, they are just ratings, and an example of showing how much the station loves America.

To your average freeper, they are just pawns that are dropped in discussions to justify ignorance, arrogance, and lack of arguments.

To Corporate America, they are a sure-fire way to market products and bring in customers.

To Toby Keith, they are just a #1 song.

To the pundits, they are just a means of invoking moral superiority.


None of the Republicans give a shit about our soldiers in Iraq. If they did, they would have begun asking some tough questions a long time ago.

[philosophie_en_rose]

2. Comparative Powers: President v. Joe DUer

The President has the ability to instigate or end conflict, use trillions in resources, pay troops less or more, investigate war crimes, embrace or discriminate military members that service with honor (and happen to be gay), provide real food and protective gear to soldiers, and an infinite number of other powers.

Joe & Jane DUer have the power to speak out about injustices - to sometimes say provocative things. They could potentially hurt someone's feelings or change the minds of legislators.

DUers are not powerless, but it's simply ridiculous to compare even the worst that a DU post can do to that of the acts of disrespect perpetrated by the White House against the military.

[Demit]

3. There are a lot of groups throughout US history to thank--

a lot of people who came before us in this country whom we ought to thank, who helped make this country what it is--those who fought for better working conditions; those who fought for civil rights; those who exposed corruption in high places; policemen, firemen, teachers; writers and poets and inventors who sparked our imagination.

We walk around enjoying the stuff we enjoy because of a LOT of disparate effort on the part of a LOT of different groups, not just one. It's a shame that that former DUer you quoted champions one group so hard it has the effect of insulting all the others.

[fooj]

4. I certainly agree with you! Patriotism is not EXCLUSIVE- it is INCLUSIVE!

[Just Me]

5. Every so-called "liberal" group with which I am associated,...

,...offered support, prayers and best wishes to my recently activated youngest brother!!! Every single one!!! And, even though my post about the fact he had been activated was practically buried on a fairly long thread, several DUers sent their support and prayers and best wishes. Without that support, I honestly do not believe I would have been able to get through the long conversation I had with my weeping Mother this morning.

My brother knows, understands and appreciates the type of activism in which I have been heavily involved over the last 4 years. I know, understand and appreciate the sacrifice he is being forced to make. We love eachother, always will.

Moreover, we are nuanced people in a nuanced world, and those who continue to impose their black/white rendition are doing so much harm to all of us. It's as if every freakin' radical has been encouraged to crawl out of every crevice and to tear our people and our world apart.

I really wish we all had a Rosa and Martin to keep us centered and united against this ugliness, this dialogue of hatred, that has gripped our country and our world.

[fooj]

7. HE/She who does not divide us makes us stronger.

I am so sorry you have had such a heartwrenching morning with your mom. Again, our thoughts and prayers are with you. NGU! We are here for you. Peace.

[Just Me]

8. Thank you. I specifically recall your previous message of support.

It is that support which makes us strong. Is is your support which gave me the strength to be the pillar for my Mom this morning.

I am genuinely grateful. :hug: Thank you.

[seabeyond]

17. you give me chills justme

which has actually been my point. these soldiers are our brothers, they are fathers and sons and daughters and mothers. how do we not support these people. it is silliness to me to have someone, a party the media tell me i do not love these people. want them safe, want them home to unite with family. to stop the pain and the fear so many live

as i said on another thread. i feel the responsibility to the soldier across the sea, that is order to do the things they are, i feel the responsibility to know what is being demanded of them. adn i feel the responsibility to stand up for them herem in this country. for me that means going after bush adn his administration as they continually make poor and greedy decisions that hurt our troop. never would i want to look a man or woman in the eyes, knowing what they did and say i didnt fight her in the u.s. for them

never do i want to be one that turns my back on them

for me, this is supporting my troops

[BrklynLiberal]

6. Well said. I think the VAST Majority agree, and we should move forward

from here and let the "disruptions" end with the exit of the disruptor.

EDIT:
I am beginning to think that the entire point of that early morning post was to cause the divisiveness that resulted...and that was it. Kind of like a little parting time bomb. We should not allow ourselves to fall for the ploy.

[fooj]

9. I agree. That certainly may have been the intention.

If that was the case, it backfired. On a personal level, it made me truly realize all of the good that comes from the posters at DU. I know that we are not perfect. No one is. We love our country just as much as the next guy...

[HamstersFromHell]

10. Tossing bombs as you leave...

Is exactly what I saw (after the self-aggrandizing photo op intro) and it's exactly why my last paragraph in reply said what it said.

That said, I couldn't just sit and not "fall for the ploy". I don't post that much, but I felt for once that I had something to say that was worth the time to type. Too many good people here were painted with way too broad a brush to allow it to go unchallenged.

[fooj]

11. "Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter"

The broad generalizations prompted my response, as well! Peace!

[BrklynLiberal]

13. I certainly did not mean that we should not have responded to her

post, but that we should not continue the divisiveness past today.
Let her fade into the dim fog like most trolls do.
The truth is, as we all know, there is a lot more that unites us than divides us....no matter how hard Bush and his minions try to prove the opposite.

[fooj]

14. I was responding to Hamster in my post.

No worries.:toast:

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[fooj]

15. Isn't Skinner a mod here? Why were BouncyBall and Journeyman

singled out? I'm confused!

[seabeyond]

18. they use

du peoples name. such a creative lot. there whole mission is having been kicked off this board, they gather post here and ridicule. that is their sole goal. it is sad

[fooj]

20. Wow...thanks for the heads up! Unbelievable!

[baldguy]

16. The military has a job to do.

That job is to defend this country from its enemies. They must do that job without argument & without question. Period.

That being said, when the elected leadership uses the military for something other than to defend the nation, like promoting his political agenda or to get re-elected - and not to have that use questioned by the electorate in a representative republic?

That's called fascism.

[flyarm]

22. you are 100% correct!! thank you!! n/t

[charles_nys]

19. If anyone is "troop bashing" ...

Its the damn bush admin, maybe not with words but in deeds... they send them to Iraq on a lie, not give the armor they need to protect themselves, they with hold their pay, force them to take extended tours and then when they get some mysterious illness they deny it !
The list of attrocities against troops by our gov't are endless!

[flyarm]

23. too dang bad the right is not supporting our troops...

and i have seen nothing to make me believe they will do so any time in the near future!!
the right is abusing and killing our troops, and wounding them for life, and the right ignors the abuse by this administration..and therefore in my mind they are committing treason to this nation..our troops are to only be used to defen this nation...well tell me rightys ..tell me now those who scan this post..what are our troops being used right now to defend us from??

come on trolls what are our troops beinf use dto defend us from..the invisable wmd??

the lies of saddam connection to 9/11??

tell us ,please, we await your reply!!
our troops were sent to war based on nothing but bold faced lies...so if you support that .,then you are committing treason to your nation when you do not speak out about it!!

fly

[flyarm]

21. as the wife of a vet...

and the daughter of a vet and a granddaughter of a vet ..i find all of this fishy!!

i have never seen anyone here bash vets..i read alot of posts i don't respond to and i can say i have never seen anyone bash a vet or our troops! and i find it disrespectful to all Americans to say one party or the other is more patriotic..i find that highly insulting..as most who went to Vietnam were poor to begin with and could not get the out the wealthier were able to with college deferments. and most of those poor were from democratic families!! but not exclusively!! there is no exclusiveness in the armed forces!

what i am seeing right now scares me so much..the * admin has so polarized this nation, and what is so frightening to me is they did it so easily and so quickly..

its all this crap of red and blue...when did i become a blue..i always thought i was american...
this red and blue crap was meant to divide us..

since when was my husband anything but a patriot..he served his country but after reading that CU thread..now i just wonder...who is American??

after just reading it i feel sick to my stomach...its like they talk about us at du like we were filth..well i resent that ..big time...my husband put his life on the line in nam..and my father died young because of the disease he got in WW22 in the south pacific ..and my grandfather lost his eye in WW11 on the USS Arizona..yes the very ship that was sunk first in Pearl Harbor..and when it was hit my grandpa tried to reup..and he wasn't accepted because he lost his eye on it the first time as a gunner on the ship..so he signed up his oldest son..my father ..at age 16 ( who turned 16 dec 29th)to fight in WW22..so i damn well resent those people telling anyone that they have exclusive rights to being a patriot! and my family is democratic and have been for a lifetime!
and my husband was drafted and he served his nation honorably, his mother was in the army and was an officer throughout ww2, and his father landed just north of Omaha beach on d-day in the army..and they are all proud democrats..so those people who would so like to divide us as Americans can go stuff it as far as i am concerned..i am American..i am not a blue.. i am not a red, i am American!!! and my family fought for the United States of America..not for republicans or democrats.. but for our United States Of America..seems to me many of those at that CU need to remember that the blood of many Americans was spilled with no regard to party ,(as they would so simple mindedly like to believe) and i resent to my soul what those people would like to do in dividing my country by their ignorance and their NewWorld Order!!! I am sure my father is rolling over in his grave today, and my 89 yr old father in law despises what Bush the deserter is doing to this nation!! my mother in law as well, as is my vet husband!
there are many on the rethug side who have been infiltrators..in fact this week i read about the payola of rethugs on blogs...i have my serious suspicions that many are getting cut off now...with the light many of du'ers and those of us who fight for our nation at this very trying time in our history...have exposed in the recent days...

nothing they do surprises me anymore!!

i just wonder about people who suddenly now jump to a conserv web site...hmmmm...like the old saying goes..leopards don't change their spots!!
unless they never were a leopard to begin with!!

fly

[fooj]

24. They attack us because they fear the TRUTH!

Peace!