Why do you listen to and repeat the insults from the Right?

[Q]

- Every day I see threads about how mean and insulting RWingers have been to some candidate or Democrat.

- Many of you don't seem to realize that they taunt us with a purpose in mind: to distract us from our goals and redirect our discussions away from the important issues. Listeners remember the taunts and insults and little or nothing about what was actually said in the interview.

- That so much time is spent on discussing their taunts and insults means their tactics are working.

- We seem to spend more time talking about the latest insult from RWing Talking Head Pundits than why the Senate just voted for a renewal of nuclear testing and a new generation of 'usable' nuclear weapons.

- While we're discussing what the RWingers are saying about us...the Bushies are busy pushing through their far right agenda and getting little notice or rebuttal.

- Don't fall for it. Keep your eye on the ball.

[ShimokitaJer]

1. Good post!

I've always wondered why so many on DU seem to watch O'Reilly, listen to Limbaugh, and cruise the Free Republic. Usually, they claim they just want to know what the enemy is up to or want to know "which products to boycott," but they contribute to the perception that these hacks are mainstream.

These idiots are empowered only if we empower them.

[muchacho]

2. Know your enemy

I don't belive the "if we ignore them they'll go away" tactic will work with these goons.

Know your enemy I say. And learn why they succeed. When you listen to O'Reilly, et al we need to think about how they are selling their message and how successful they are as well as how to effectively counter it.

The right doesn't have a monopoly on "the truth" but they are damn good a persuading while they lie.

[ShimokitaJer]

12. But the enemy tactics DON'T work for real change

They manage to excite people and smear their enemies, but their fake stories change on a weekly basis. That's the nature of spin.

If our goal is to enact real change, then we need to deal with basic facts that won't constantly change, supporting the perception that the Dems are as corrupt as the Repubs are. And we sure as hell don't need to respond to every snide comment that's made by these pundits. That only forces us to play by their rules. I'm convinced that the divisive attacks between supporters of the various Dem candidates on DU is the DIRECT result of DUers trying to emulate the "success" of the pundits.

There's a post up right now about Limbaugh calling Clark "Conspiracy Clark." Immediately, there is a groundswell of posts wondering why he said it, what he has in mind, and how we can counter it. You may view this as a positive thing: a way of gathering our resources. But it's far more likely that it will degrade into swiping at shadows, digging up unimportant tidbits that Limbaugh might or might not be thinking of using, and eventually non-Clark supporters saying "actually, there's an element of truth in that." We're doing the pundits work for them.

Remember the ridiculous Dean as McGovern characterization that has colored many posts on DU. Whether the poster is confirming out denying Dean's liberal street cred, it has become a wedge between those of differing opinions and the debate devolves from reason into name-calling.

[Bandit]

13. I know the enemy and I don't listen to their BS

Ann Coulter says Clark isn't a patriot. Who gives a rat's ass what the fuck Ann Coulter says about anything. She has been proven wrong on everything she has said. The same goes for rush or any of them. You don't learn a thing from them and just boost their ratings and keep them on the air longer than should happen. We know they are going to badmouth any Liberal so what do you learn by hearing them say it? It is a bullshit argument without any merit.

[Q]

15. If you don't know your 'enemy' by now...you're not paying attention...

...We already know that RWingers hate us for our 'freedoms'. We know that they will distort the truth and call us 'anti-American' and 'unpatriotic' for not supporting THEIR president*. We know these things yet we still respond to their insults like a child to a schoolyard bully.

- Let's try harder to get out OUR message instead of perpetuating what they have to say about us.

[Q]

4. These are petty little distractions that keep us from...

...the important discussions.

- I see great threads on very serious issues fall like rocks while the 'light subject' threads stay alive for days. We've got some messed up priorities when we spend more time discussing what Tweety said about Dean that what Dean had to say in the interview.

- The RWingers use these tactics because they've found them to be successful. Let's show them that we have more relevant things to discuss.

[Forkboy]

3. I feel this way every time I see an Ann Coulter thread

get 60 responses.

[sistersofmercy]

5. For the most part I agree but someone did a post about freepers

debating the "un" patriot act, I thought it was useful b/c basically they're scared if it stays in place when dems win next year, they think the dems will use it against them.

[Q]

7. I'm more interested in what the Left thinks about the USA PA...

...and how we can defeat it. I've never understood the fascination with FReepers. It's not as if they represent the Republican party in any meaningful way.

[sistersofmercy]

9. I don't pay much attention to them I read some of the posts here.

I personally have never listened to Rush et al. Faux news is unbearable, I only watch dem debate. But as far as the "un"patriot act, the comments from the right tell me we can definitely do away with it.

[uptohere]

6. excellent point

we seem to prefer to follow rather than lead. kind of explains why we're had so many setbacks recently.

Clinton led and largely ignored snipes. Worked out fine for him.

[Q]

8. And that's exactly what we're doing...following...

...the lead of the RWingers. They're LEADING us to talk about things that don't matter in the larger scheme of things.

- It's a great political tactic and it's working wonderfully to keep us from talking about everything from election fraud to the absense of investigations into the Bush* administration and 9-11.

[liberalnurse]

10. Folks are NOT doing their homework for one....

They just listen to the media whores and go with it. Shallow and topical in their knowledge base. Reactive is easy.....Accepting responsibility to become self-aware takes serious effort.

Thats what I think....:)

[Q]

11. This is one reason why the 'Democratic Message' is not getting out...

...to those who need to hear it.

- I used the example of 'Tweety' and Dean...but each day there are many examples of the 'news' being what the right wing talking head pundit says about the candidate instead of the candidate's position on the issues.

[liberalnurse]

16. The media whore's know this too.

Thats why the give democrats an occasional "worm bait" of valid preception of our stance then the "BAMB" rip us to shreds. Those who do not seek for themselves the truth of the issues, and elect to take the media snip-its tend to be the most obnoxious posters. They act just like their teachers, ie...Tweety.

Oh, yea, how many times do we see posters refer to Drudge or Foxx as their supportive data.....


See what I mean...O8)

[sangh0]

14. Q, you should practice what you preach

Unfortunately, I constantly see you repeating RNC-propoganda like "there's no difference", "Bush*-lite" (shades of "If you want to elect a conservative, then vote for a real one; A republican"), "Dems don't represent their constituents", etc

[Q]

18. I'm not surprised that you don't see the difference...

...I dont't spread 'right wing propaganda'....I give my feelings as a Democrat who has always voted for Dem candidates...for over 30 years now.

- Not to mention that you're misrepresenting what I've posted: I've never once said that there's 'no difference' between the parties. My major complaint has been that too many Democrats never challenge their OWN PARTY to do better and have blind faith that the leadership is doing their jobs.

- It's interesting how you've hijacked this thread using the same tactics as the RWingers...by bringing up topics irrelevant to the subject matter and distracting the flow of conversation.

[sangh0]

20. I would say the same

I dont't spread 'right wing propaganda'....I give my feelings as a Democrat who has always voted for Dem candidates...for over 30 years now

Correction - You don't spread it intentionally, but there is no doubt that ideas like "there's no difference" were spawned by the right-wing propogandists. And there's no doubt that you repeat them. The fact that your intentions are good does not dispel these facts.

So though you are correct to say that "I give my feelings as a Democrat who has always voted for Dem candidates", you fail to recognize that much of the right-wing propoganda is designed to appeal to Democrats like you. If their propoganda only appealed to the Freepers, then their propoganda would be nothing more than preaching to the choir.

Not to mention that you're misrepresenting what I've posted: I've never once said that there's 'no difference' between the parties. My major complaint has been that too many Democrats never challenge their OWN PARTY to do better and have blind faith that the leadership is doing their jobs.

I don't think I'm misrepresenting your postings. You have repeatedly accused Democrats of being "DINO's", "Bush*-lite", etc.

It's interesting how you've hijacked this thread using the same tactics as the RWingers...by bringing up topics irrelevant to the subject matter and distracting the flow of conversation.

And I would say the same. You are now using the same tactic. Instead of acknowledging how your postings mirror certain lines of rw-propoganda, you are instead bringing up irrelevant topics like "I give my feelings as a Democrat" as if your intentions and party affiliation refutes the fact that your arguments mirror those of the RNC.

And like the RWingers, you have engaged in overheated hyperbole. This thread has not been hijacked. There's a post from me, a response from you, and now this response from me. It's three posts. That's not a hijacking. You are over-reacting.

[Q]

23. This will be my last response to you because you're distracting...

...posters from discussing the TOPIC of the thread.

- I make it a point NOT to participate in Dem bashing threads. I HAVE called Lieberman a DINO in the past for obvious reasons: he supports Bush's* policies more than the Democratic agenda.

- You have accomplished your goal of attacking me instead of responding to the thread topic. Now...shoo.

[liberalnurse]

27. This may require an alert.....

We need to clean up this board.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Q]

29. You can't find a thread where I've said 'there is no difference'...

...because one doesn't exist. I've never even implied such a thing.

- I'm indeed sorry if you're insulted by my liberal point of view. You're so tied up in denial that you can't acknowledge that the Dem party has been 'complicit' in allowing the Bushies to get away with so many things harmful to a Democracy.

- Some within the Democratic party have become so 'conservative' in thought and action that they don't realize that we don't need to become like the 'enemy' in order to defeat them at the polls. Others are so distracted wth the thought of 'winning' that they're willing to overlook the fact that some Dems are actually WORKING WITH the Bushies and helping them cover up their misdeeds and criminal acts.

- You can continue with your pitiful excuses for why Dems aren't doing their jobs in representing the Democratic rank and file...or you can help to change the course of the party by insisting that ALL politicians are held to the same standards of truth and accountability.

[sangh0]

30. Your hiding behind quotation marks

I don't care if you haven't used that exact phrase. You have made the argument with "Bush*-lite", "pink tu-tus", etc.

I'm indeed sorry if you're insulted by my liberal point of view. You're so tied up in denial that you can't acknowledge that the Dem party has been 'complicit' in allowing the Bushies to get away with so many things harmful to a Democracy.

And there you go repeating the "there's no difference" argument. Re-wording it doesn't make it any less Republican.

And you're fooling yourself if you think "Dems are complicit" is a "liberal point of view". Many liberals disagree. You are just trying to misportray yourself as being in the majority position when the 50 million Gore voters prove that the majority (you know, the ones you criticize the Dems for not defending) disagree with you.

Some within the Democratic party have become so 'conservative' in thought and action that they don't realize that we don't need to become like the 'enemy' in order to defeat them at the polls. Others are so distracted wth the thought of 'winning' that they're willing to overlook the fact that some Dems are actually WORKING WITH the Bushies and helping them cover up their misdeeds and criminal acts.

And here we go with the "there's no difference". "The Dems say the same things as the Repukes, they "WORK WITH the Bushies", and they are covering up the Repukes crimes.

Why do you repeat the RNC's insults?

You can continue with your pitiful excuses for why Dems aren't doing their jobs in representing the Democratic rank and file...or you can help to change the course of the party by insisting that ALL politicians are held to the same standards of truth and accountability.

And again, instead of attacking the enemy (that would be Bush* and the Repukes, in case you forgot), you have retreated into defending yourself by expressing your hostility to the Democratic Party.

Karl Rove thanks you.

[Iverson]

32. what in the world?

If I understand your posting correctly, you have advanced these points, among others:

- "Complicity" is a rewording of "no difference."
- A liberal cannot, by definition, refer to the Democratic party as complicit on the basis that many liberals do not.
- A majority position is a valid way to determine whether or not a line of argument is liberal.
- The RNC insults Democrats by referring to their (Dems') "work with the Bushies" and covering up of Republican crimes.

All of the above are sheerest nonsense. They fail the test of reason.

[sangh0]

34. You do not understand correctly

and like Q, you are hiding behind quotation. In your case, it's the ones around "complicity"

Instead of looking at specific words and/or phrases, look at the "meta-message" that lies underneath the literal meanings. Then, you might start understanding (correctly) how propoganda works.

[Iverson]

45. friendly advice

Looking for clarity of meaning to some must be hiding behind quotation marks to others.

Be assured that I have more than begun to understand how propaganda works. Thank you for your concern, as well as for the fine example of an attack upon advocacy of left positions as a meta-message.

You might also wish to begin using the term "subtext" for underlying meaning of a text. Note that I was able to tell you this without insulting your abilities at textual analysis or otherwise snarkily advising you that you might "start" to understand how to analyze a text. Setting a good example is so important.

[sangh0]

46. I will consider your suggestion

but you might want to consider that the use of "meta" is an appropriate way to denote that I am talking about the message conveyed by the messages.

However, you are right to point out that "meta" is not about what lies below. It is about what sits above the message.

[Name removed]

33. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sangh0]

35. You've been saying that from the beginning

but you've managed to stick to it just the same.

First...you're confusing the issue by suggesting that all I do post 'hostility' towards the Dem party. But to the contrary...MOST of my threads are about the corrupt Bush* administration. Strange...but you never seem to post to THEM. This leads me to believe that you only post on threads that give you an opportunity to attack and demean.

I did NOT suggest that is ALL you do. And I have posted to your other threads.

Sometimes we don't recognize that there is more than one enemy...or that we can be our own worse enemy. I think it's wrong, unethical and immoral to allow the Bushies to escape responsibility for what they've done to our country. Just recently...the Dem 'leadership' announced that they wouldn't 'pursue' Bush's* blatant lies about the need to 'shock and awe' and invade Iraq. This...after allowing so many other criminal and unethical acts by the Bushies to go unchallenged and unexamined.

So then criticize the Dems. Say what they did is wrong. But you shouldn't repeat the right-wings' propoganda. Use your own words.

Should we ask ourselves why this is happening? Or just take it for granted that political expediency and 'winning' is more important than honoring the Constitution and laws of the land? Our representatives don't have the option of ignoring the law. They've sworn an oath to protect and defend the Constitution. It seems a bit hypocritical to call Bush* on his unethical acts and not those who forsake their responsibility to uphold the law and prosecute wrongdoing.

So then criticize the Dems. Say what they're doing is wrong. But you shouldn't repeat the right-wings' propoganda. Use your own words.

Make no mistake...GWB and his cronies are the enemy of everything good about this country. But so are those who refuse to do their jobs in representing the interests and well-being of ALL the people. They're not representing these interests when they don't hold the Bushies accountable.

So then criticize the Dems. Say what they're doing is wrong. But you shouldn't repeat the right-wings' propoganda. Use your own words.


It's not a 'conspiracy theory' that the Bushies lied to rush this nation into war with a country that posed no immediate threat to our security. Nor is it a theory that they manipulated and tampered with the 2000 election and had ample advance knowledge of the 9-11 attacks. It's no secret that the real Enron criminals like Ken Lay were allowed to escape prosecution and punishment because he's a Friend of Bush*.

I agree, but I don't see the relevance to the issue of repeating rw propoganda.

Yet...the Dem party continues to back away from these scandals and their responsibility to the people to do something about them. I simply refuse to be a hypocrite about it. We're in no position to complain about the Bushies if we're not willing to act and set things right again.

And there ya go again. You speak of the Dems as if they were monolithically "caving in" to Bush*, which is what the RNC loves to brag about.

[Q]

48. Well...the Dems ARE "monolithically" caving in to Bush*...

...with VERY FEW exceptions. And let's be honest here: those who DO attack Bush* and his harmful policies are in return attacked by the right-leaning Dems of the party. The bravest among us are left swinging in the wind and labeled as 'extremists' by the conservatives in both the Dem and GOP.

- I won't allow you to frame my argument FOR me. What YOU call 'rw propaganda' is a critical examination of the direction and future of the Democratic party. Speaking of propaganda...that's exactly what the conservative 'new dems' are using in an attempt to move the party further to the right...into GWB* terror tory. They won't admit that this movement to the right is at the expense of the traditional base: unions and the working class poor.

- You might have a point if I complained about the Dem party and then voted for Republicans or third party candidates. But I've never deviated from voting Democrat. But in these times of great peril for our nation...I'm demanding MORE...not less...from our elected representatives. It's not enough just to 'win' elections. Drastic changes must take place within the party and GWB* must be prosecuted for his crimes. This can't wait until after the next election or when it's 'safe' to come out from the shadows. It must be done NOW or we risk losing even more credibility and the faith of the people.

- It really does concern me that you and so many other Dems think it's okay that the 'party' has no intention of pursuing the Bushies lies that rushed this nation to war on false pretenses. This is a criminal act. It's treason. Yet...so many are willing to overlook this and so many other scandals for the sake of political expediency. What a shame.

[sangh0]

53. There ya' go again!

with VERY FEW exceptions. And let's be honest here: those who DO attack Bush* and his harmful policies are in return attacked by the right-leaning Dems of the party. The bravest among us are left swinging in the wind and labeled as 'extremists' by the conservatives in both the Dem and GOP.

And don't forget the attacks from the left, from people like you.

I won't allow you to frame my argument FOR me. What YOU call 'rw propaganda' is a critical examination of the direction and future of the Democratic party. Speaking of propaganda...that's exactly what the conservative 'new dems' are using in an attempt to move the party further to the right...into GWB* terror tory. They won't admit that this movement to the right is at the expense of the traditional base: unions and the working class poor.

And what you call "a critical examination of the direction and future of the Democratic party", I call right-wing propoganda. And despite your crocodile tears for the unions and working class poor, they disagree with you, and agree with me, which is why they STILL strongly support the Dems.

You might have a point if I complained about the Dem party and then voted for Republicans or third party candidates. But I've never deviated from voting Democrat. But in these times of great peril for our nation...I'm demanding MORE...not less...from our elected representatives. It's not enough just to 'win' elections. Drastic changes must take place within the party and GWB* must be prosecuted for his crimes. This can't wait until after the next election or when it's 'safe' to come out from the shadows. It must be done NOW or we risk losing even more credibility and the faith of the people.

I dont care how you vote. If you repeat rw propoganda (and you do), then you are repeating rw propoganda, no matter how you vote. I vote Dem also, but that hasn't stopped YOU from saying I repeat rw propoganda. What's good for the goose is good for the Q.

And demand whatever you want. The DNC doesn't take requests. You can talk about losing faith until the cows come home. It still won't be true. But Rove is grateful, just the same.

It really does concern me that you and so many other Dems think it's okay that the 'party' has no intention of pursuing the Bushies lies that rushed this nation to war on false pretenses. This is a criminal act. It's treason. Yet...so many are willing to overlook this and so many other scandals for the sake of political expediency. What a shame.

And again, Karl Rove thanks you.

[UTUSN]

19. Kick

There are some parallel issues:

1) Our Dem conviction of freedoms of thought, speech, dissent.

2) Some of us doing intell on the enemy.

3) Disruptors preying on our #1, sowing dissention here.

In pursuit of #2, some of us post about what wingnuts are saying. Invariably, somebody responds, "Why do you even WATCH (LIMBO, "Dr" Laura, O'REILLY, Tweety, et al.)?" ----- What and NOT know, and be caught flat footed and suckerpunched?

None of us is an island. We are a confederation of islands. There is the Activist island, the Intell island, the Brainstorming island, the Whatever island, etc., and each one needs a bit of dipping into. Some of us have the instinct, the stomach, the LEANING, to stay MOSTLY on one island.

But about Trolls: After giving them the initial benefit of the doubt based on #1, when it becomes THAT they are actually being operatives against us, THOSE need to be helped out onto the road.

[stoystown]

17. The same reason we read the Weekly World News

it surprises us that people can come up with this stuff!

[blm]

21. The right wing talking points on a great candidate

have been adopted by many Democrats. Nixon era charges of John Kerry being a phony are newsroom staples now repeated by supporters of other candidates because it suits their agenda, not because it's true.

He is an empty suit who has done nothing to those who have no working memory of the importance of BCCI and IranContra and what they rervealed about the BFEE. Or the import of 10 years worth of work on the Kyoto Accord.

He is a pink tutu to those Democrats who find it easier to mouth the words "blank check" than to understand how government reall works, and that it is a solemn duty for Dem lawmakers to negotiate for the better bill and pay for it with their votes.

The media used Bradley's campaign to put forth their right wing talking points on Gore that dogged him throughout the 2000 campaign and now they are doing the same to Kerry. They also know that with a Kerry-Bush match up, their own cover ups for Bush's pitiful record will be forced into the light.

[realFedUp]

22. the Q ball?

your eye seems to be on third parties....

[Q]

26. No...the 'ball' as in an orchestrated effort to debunk Bush* lies...

- I think we can all agree that the Bushies have something different than 'democracy' in mind as they turn our country into a banana republic. They have made congress irrelevant and have well-paid teams of propagandists that do nothing but attack and spread lies about any Democrat that adopts a leadership role.

- This shouldn't be news to anyone. A good example of this: before the 2000 election the Bushies thought they would lose the EC vote and win the popular vote. They planned to use their army of talking heads to argue that the electoral vote was a 'relic' of the past that didn't represent the will of the people.

- It's no accident that all these RWing talking heads work together to smear any Dem that appears to be showing leadership qualities and have wide popular support of the Democratic base. It's their JOB. It's what they're paid to do.

[jonoboy]

24. hear hear

and take a tip from any seasoned politician when confronted in
this manner..he just talks through it and stays on his own
thread to get HIS message across.
After all, there realy are people out there waiting to be
persuaded one way or the other, and it may as well be the
truthfull way.

[Terwilliger]

25. You'd better

because the war over the soul of the country is being fought in the media, and the Pukes are much better at it

[barbaraann]

31. Because only the truth will set us free.

I am starting to see that the truth about the rulers of this world is hideous and monstrous beyond anything I would have ever believed until the information explosion brought on by the invention of the internet.

I'm trying to piece it all together from personal experience, the media, art, intuition, etc.--from everywhere. It is truly monumental that a "news" channel can present a factoid about how often a Democratic candidate gets his hair cut as something worthy of negative notice. This is something that we need to ponder and try to grasp and then somehow try to figure out a way to deal with. I believe that many Americans have been mind-controlled and cannot be reached through reason and that this mind control starts in childhood.

Al Franken had to pay attention to Fox News, for example. He had to start to fight for humanity by exposing what Fox really is. It's just Step One but I believe that it is a necessary first step.

I'm also working on some major positive things I have never posted about. I do a lot more than peek at Fox News once in a while. :-)

[bitchkitty]

36. Probably for the same reason

that people will keep poking a sore tooth with their tongue - it hurts, but they just can't help it!

[ElsewheresDaughter]

43. LOL bitchkitty ...good analogy..thanks for the chuckle

[bitchkitty]

52. You're welcome!

I recently had an abscessed tooth so it was handy!

[gully]

37. Same reason folks listen to and repeat insults from Ralph Nader ?

Great topic BTW :thumbsup:

Whether Dems, Greens or any so called leftist repeats Naders mantra or the mantra on the right, it's just as harmful. In fact perhaps even more so? We are helping Nader advance his agenda which he has stated as such: "Democrats need to lose more elections." By the way, that sentiment included folks like Paul Wellstone and Russ Feingold.

We need to find opportunities to remember the many Dems that fight the good fight every day, but do not make the evening news.

Before I began reading truthout and many other online news sources, I thought Nader was right. However, I began digging and read many stories about Democrats fighting hard in congress etc... I then questioned why the F**k these Democrats are not making the evening news? Who does that serve? *BUSH and co. right? We have to make our own news here at DU. We have to shed light on the differences we have with Republicans because in the words of Paul Wellstone "The differences make a difference in the lives of ordinary Americans." I think after selection 2000, that point is abundantly clear.

I'm not suggesting we turn a blind eye to the Dems that are not representing our agenda. But, lets organize, when they don't and stand up together. Lets gather our lists of those that need a :kick: in the a$$ and start calling their offices demanding that they represent us! We have an activism section here, lets use it.

We have enough enemies, we have to do our best to eliminate spin no matter who's doing the 'spinning.'

[Q]

38. Good points...

...but I've never thought that Nader was much of an issue...especially when considered in the context of stolen elections and the absence of investigations into 9-11, etc.

- Nader is made 'relevant' only when we choose to discuss him and what he has to say. Is he more important than the SC's 'one time' decision to install Bush* as president?

- Nader was wrong when he suggested there's not much difference between the GOPers and Dems. But instead of repeating his words until the end of time...let's PROVE him wrong by demonstrating that WE ARE different with leading by example.

[gully]

41. Let's do it together Q. Let's use our activism section and get active!

When we see a wrong, WE can help right it.

Look at the major success moveon.org has had because of internet activism. Look at our Democratic Senators who did a very importand and unprecidented thing by overturning the FCC. The FCC ruling means we may actually start getting real news! Perhaps then we will see our Democratic brothers and sisters that are fighting actually getting some airtime?

Regarding (s)election 2000. I have an interesting article I'd like people to read when they have a moment. We need to put to rest some of the rumors that are used against us on the so called left as well as those touted by the right.

http://www.buzzflash.com/contributors/2002/04/29_Stolen_Election.html

~Peace, and let's not be our own worst enemy. Let's use DU to get involved in the process.

[Q]

50. In playing the Devil's advocate...

...the FCC thing is a small victory when viewed in the context of what has happened since Reagan dumped the Fairness Doctrine. It's obvious that the Neocon media doesn't need a 45 percent share of any given market since they already own a majority of the media in America.

- Equally as important is that the FCC no longer requires that media represent any other than their own point of view. They're no longer required to serve the public...and can happily serve only themselves without restraint.

- The only way we can be are own 'worse enemy' is if we become what we claim to hate.

[Booberdawg]

63. Excellent article

Makes my blood boil all over again.:mad:

[Terwilliger]

44. and that's why he's right

cuz it aint happenin'

and you know it :hi:

[gully]

47. With friends like you Terwilliger, who needs enemy's???

You may continue your blind self rightous path, but the rest of us will get on with the business of taking back our country.

I'm curious which Democrat has your support in the coming election?

http://damnedbigdifference.org/

Heed the advice of Granny D, T or you'll have nothing left of your precious Green Party.

[Terwilliger]

54. heed yourself

we've had this discussion again and again

http://gpus.org/documents/spoiled.html

[gully]

55. My what a comprehensive and convincing argument...

NOT!

By the way I don't blame Ralph for running for president, I simply hold him accountable for his lies and hypocricy.

Nader is the Limbaugh of the "non-thinking" left. He speaks, you regurgitate. *yawn*

[Terwilliger]

56. I speak and you can't help but reply

what does that say about you?

[gully]

58. I felt you entered into a conversation that between Q and myself???

What's good for the goose is good for the gander...as they say? :*

I'll quit pestering you when you commit to ABB. Remember ;)

[Terwilliger]

59. I responded to Q

maybe YOU need to examine your own problems :freak:

[gully]

62. I have ... and my biggest problem is Bush in the OO

I'll rest when he's out.

~Peace, don't mean to single you out ok?

[ElsewheresDaughter]

39. Q correct, by reacting and repeating their docketed attacks we only add

to THE DARKNESS!!!!...i will not give them such power over my emotions...why would any Dem do such a thing??? DON't allow them control what we discuss ...they desire only to distract us...they fear TRUTH and the best way to silence it is, fear itself ...we need not ataack back ...we need ONLY speak Truth on LIBERAL ISSUES and they will think they are in HELL!!!

[Junkdrawer]

40. OK, I'll bite...

Why do I listen...
Because I want to know where they are taking us next. And make no mistake, the radical RW of the Repukes are in the driver's seat at the moment.

Why do I repeat their insults...
I normally don't. But "Conspiracy Clark" just seemed so off-the-wall that I started to wonder if Clark may know something that makes the RWers nervous. That was, if you read my post, the point of the thread. Unfortunately, only a few posters responded to my intent. Oh well.

[Q]

49. "They" shouldn't be 'taking us' anywhere....

...and that's part of the problem. We've allowed THEM to frame the debate and put us on the defensive. We're following instead of leading.

[Southsideirish]

42. Did you work for the Michael Dukakis campaign?

Lesson learned: Keep your enemies closer than your friends.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

51. Hell some are hell bent on committing mutiny with RW propaganda themselves

via the Kerry conspiracy theories.

[Terwilliger]

57. Didn't he shoot Kennedy?

I think he was in the Grassy Knoll with George Bush

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

61. Kerry killed Kenny

THAT BASTARD!

[carpetbagger]

64. You bastards!

n/t

[goobergunch]

60. Good post

In honor of it, I just kicked the Senate nukes thread.