Right wing media is starting on Wesley Clark

[No Passaran]

The Real Wesley Clark
By Richard Cohen
Thursday, September 18, 2003; Page A23

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27039-2003Sep17.html

[liberalnurse]

1. Thay can't be as hateful to Clark as the Clarkies are to Dean

on this board.....

I'm actually almost rooting for them.....I never would of suspected my democratic peers could be the mirror image of a right wing pundant.

[CWebster]

11. Keep pointing it out

;-)

[Pepperbelly]

15. it depends on whose ox is being gored because for my money ...

the doctor's supporters have been as hateful and mendacious as any right wingers. I guess it's different for you when your guys do it, eh? And btw, I am not surprised that you are rooting for the right wing press, particularly after the deluge of lies that have been posted here since Clark's announcement.

[CWebster]

16. Don't like it when the shoe is on the other foot, huh?

Get used to it.

[Pepperbelly]

17. I have never trashed a single candidate, CWebster ...

which is one of the reasons I find the mendacity and viciousness of people I thought were enlightened to be so disturbing and disappointing.

pm edit: btw who are you supporting?

[CWebster]

18. Get off it pepperbelly

I've been following your posts---you are right there in the thick of it. Trashing is always what the other guy does. LOL.

I support taking back our party from the DLC.

[Pepperbelly]

20. but ...

which candidate have you selected? I also defy you to find a post in which I said bad things about Dean, Kucinich, Lieberman, Kerry, Sharpton, Braun, Gephardt, Edwards, or Graham.

[Bread and Circus]

23. Pepperbelly has been exemplary and has...

only called crackpots on their hit and run BS.

He doesn't need me defending him but I am tired
of the "Clark supporters are ______ " diatribes.
They just ring hollow and are just slurs that are
repeated, hoping for some ill deserved adherence.

[gulliver]

19. Don't be so hasty.

I'm for Clark, but I would not think of criticizing Dean. Remember, DU has no way of getting a statistical idea of what Clark supporter opinion is. DU is just a message board.

If you were to do the stats you would likely find that the vast majority of Clark supporters (say 95%) respect and admire Dean. But on DU, a vocal minority of alleged Clark supporters could give you the wrong impression.

Also, don't assume people who say they are for Clark really are for Clark. They may be freepers pretending to be for Clark in order to create division.

[Bread and Circus]

22. I think that is insane liberal nurse

I have read nearly all the Clark threads. I
follow what other Clark supporters say. Clark
supporters have not ripped Dean the way you
imply. Sure, there may be criticism here and there,
that goes for everyone. But I just don't see what
you are talking about. I even like Dean in some
respects. Can you provide links to Clark people
posting lies, slurs, smears, or unfair criticism.
I will post an apology if I stand corrected and my
disclosure here is that I have posted that I thought
Dean couldn't win the general election, but I have
since recinded that to "I don't know".

Clark supporters have gotten a crappy end of the name
calling stick around here. Yeah, many of us are neophytes
but maybe that just demonstrates how Clark is bringing
more quiet Dems out of the woodwork and making us active
Dems, which is good for the party.

[Walt Starr]

26. I was a Deanie

I am now a Clarkie.

Either candidate would be beyond acceptable to me as the nominee.

:D

[disgruntella]

2. I like Clark, however

I didn't see any sort of "right-wing attack" in this article. It's an opinion, so of course it's subjective. But as an opinion article, it's not telling lies or twisting facts -- which is what I expect from right-wing attacks. It's presenting an opinion.

I thought this bit was interesting:
<snip>
David Halberstam, in his book "War in a Time of Peace," writes of Clark that even his most steadfast champion in the army, Gen. John Shalikashvili, recognized that Clark was too brash, too cocky, too driven, too self-absorbed, too hard on subordinates, too dismissive of critics and criticism -- but also too brilliant and talented to be overlooked. Shali promoted him.

Shalikashvili's bottom line is precisely what I kept finding in the people I talked to. To a person, they acknowledged Clark's flaws but said they were minor compared with his assets.
</snip>

[Dookus]

3. I agree...

this wasn't a bad article for Clark by any means.

I do find Cohen's thesis a bit wrong: that Americans "like their presidents 'comfy'". I don't think George W. is in the least bit "comfy". Neither was his father. I disagree that Americans like their presidents the way they like their morning tv hosts.

I did laugh out loud at though: Besides, he is the governor of a virtual quilt -- a state (Vermont) with 114 covered bridges and fewer minorities than the DAR.


NOTE: i'm not laughing at Dean... I'm laughing at Vermont AND the DAR.

[phegger]

4. and that the campaign will be the test...

...as it will be.


-ph B-)

[liberalnurse]

5. I agree, it was giving a private, inside peek of Clark.

I didn't know he was fired from the Pentagon and I was surprise that Sec. Defense, Bill Cohen just plain disliked him and sometimes Clark just makes people bristle.

Whoo Gen. John Shalikashvili, one of my all time favorite Generals really did not mince word here...

Very eye-opening read. I will take it under advisement.

[CWebster]

13. Despite that

Clinton would rather back Clark and retain some standing in the power structure than be eclipsed by a political uncertainity should Dean sweep.

The Devil you know...

[Kahuna]

12. Agreed. I didn't recall that Cohen is RWinger..

This column is, eh :shrug: Nothing to right home about.... :wow:

[imax2268]

6. I hope Clark

gives all them Repugs a nice juicy shitburger to eat...!

[bluestateguy]

7. Some valid concerns are raised

and in fact the column seems to suggest that Clark is actually more electable than Dean or other top tier candidates. There is no such thing as a perfect candidate. And Cohen is not a right wing media whore. I've met him before and did not get that impression at all.

[Julien Sorel]

8. It's not a bad piece at all.

It's constructive criticism, not a slam. This is an election, not a cakewalk -- Clark is going to have obstacles put in his way, and he's going to have to grow some to overcome them. That's a perfectly fair expectation from anyone. Chimp didn't grow at all -- he started out a spoiled idiot, and he's still a spoiled idiot. The only growth he's capable of is in the girth department. Clark isn't like that, and I wouldn't like him if he was. If he's going to succeed, he's going to have to allow some of his sharp corners to rub off, or at least make certain he's mastered the art of making it seem they have rubbed off. I believe he can and will do it.

My only concern at this point is money, not Clark, and not faux-hostile pieces like this one. If that's the worst piece titled something like 'The Truth About Clark' we see, then he will own the media. And I doubt he'll end up owning the media.

[Democat]

9. Imagine if they held Bush or Arnold to the same standard as any Democrat

The "liberal media" lie should finally be put to rest during the 2004 campaign and the California recall.

[westerby]

10. "warmth and affability": That is what WP expects from the next President?

"he lacks precisely those qualities that define a politician, particularly warmth and affability."

The WP does not seem to have big expectations of the next President.
What about honesty? Respect not only for the super-rich? Respect for international treaties, other nations, peace?
Not so many hidden agendas?
No oil buddies drafting laws?

And: Is Bush known for his warmth? As I understood, he may be conservative, but definitely not passionate.

[CWebster]

21. Gore ran at a tremendous disadvantage

in the wake of the Clinton scandals. He was vulnerable, under the circumstances, to poor political advice and failing DLC strategies that alienated many Democrats, who then searched for alternative choices. By the time Gore hit his stride and found his footing, the Right and the Left and the Centrist elites had already undermined his chances.

Why this is never figured into the equasion is deceptive analysis to say the least.

[union_maid]

24. Clark comes across just fine

I'll never know what it's like to be in a staff meeting with him, but he's telegenic as all get out and that's what counts in elections. He comes across the way you'd want a presidential candidate to.

[CWebster]

14. Richard Cohen is inconsistant

until it comes to Israel. Then he is always a hawk. And Israel's interests and present political extremism colors and controls US ME policy.

[LeahMira]

25. Clark Anti-War?

http://truthout.org/docs_03/091803A.shtml

    "After the fall of Baghdad, any remaining qualms Clark had about the wisdom of the war seemed to evaporate. "Liberation is at hand. Liberation-- the powerful balm that justifies painful sacrifice, erases lingering doubt and reinforces bold actions," Clark wrote in a London Times column (4/10/03). "Already the scent of victory is in the air." Though he had been critical of Pentagon tactics, Clark was exuberant about the results of "a lean plan, using only about a third of the ground combat power of the Gulf War. If the alternative to attacking in March with the equivalent of four divisions was to wait until late April to attack with five, they certainly made the right call."

    Clark made bold predictions about the effect the war would have on the region: "Many Gulf states will hustle to praise their liberation from a sense of insecurity they were previously loath even to express. Egypt and Saudi Arabia will move slightly but perceptibly towards Western standards of human rights." George W. Bush and British Prime Minister Tony Blair "should be proud of their resolve in the face of so much doubt," Clark explained. "Their opponents, those who questioned the necessity or wisdom of the operation, are temporarily silent, but probably unconvinced." The way Clark speaks of the "opponents" having been silenced is instructive, since he presumably does not include himself-- obviously not "temporarily silent"-- in that category. Clark closed the piece with visions of victory celebrations here at home: "Let's have those parades on the Mall and down Constitution Avenue."


I'm not so sure about Clark. No doubt he's bright and qualified to lead the nation, but where would he lead to?

[TryingToWarnYou]

27. Sorry, I dont see this article as all that bad....

Sure the guy is making some unflattering commentary, but if you read between the lines he is saying that even though a lot of people had negative experiences with Clark, they all supported him. Ultimately, thats what really matters.

I dont want my President to be warm and fuzzy or even 'comfy'. I want him to use his damn head and ensure that our actions, positions and stands are in the best interest of our nation and the world. Real leaders use diplomacy as their primary weapon.

Clark is everything Bush wishes *he* was. Clark is also a nightmare candidate second only to Hillary in disrupting the abnormal brain functions of the Right.

Its obvious he is no coward as a decorated combat vet...he has a masters in Politics which puts him far above * in that area. First in his class at WP which was no easy feat. Again, making * look like a beer swilling frat boy. While Bush was doing panty raids and buying liquor with a fake ID, Clark was doing things far more important.

Admittedly I dont know much about his 'politics' and where he stands, but I can promise you that if he was to get the nomination, he would definately give whistleass a run for his money.