Wow, what happened to DU?

[drdigi420]

I have been overwhelmed with a new project the last month or so and havent had time to keep up with DU. Came back in now, project done, curious to see what the inside word on Clark's announcement was and what people thought and ...

BOOM

It's bloody war!

I really did enjoy WillPitt's satire thread about starting a thread about starting a thread, but other than that, it's been pretty nasty reading.

I'm gonna go smoke a joint and chill. I suggest some of you guys do the same. I'm still undecided amongst the 10 dems and would love to read some informed, CIVIL, debates, but all I get is candidate bashing or hyping.

Can't we all just hit the bon...errr get along?

[Emboldened Chimp]

1. But before you smoke that joint

make sure to start a thread.

[drdigi420]

3. oh yeah

thats the sweet stuff

ROFL

[Carrion]

2. Agreed

It would appear that we have become THEM........

[drdigi420]

6. noooooo, not THEM!!!

that's dangerously close to being THEY

and THEY get blamed for EVERYTHING!

[joeybee12]

4. Go to Salon and read Joan Walsh's article

I think there's a lot of anger simply because the Dem leadership has started Clark's coronation already.

The article is titled "Wes Clark's bad day."

The basic point--he is not prepared for the campaign trail--I personally belive he was told it would be a cakewalk.

He might make a good nominee, however, I can see where the resentment is coming from.

[Fovea]

5. Why can't we be friends?

I know. I think it is a form of maddness.
I mean I am a Kucinich supporter, but the only Dem I don't want to be running is Lieberman. The rest of them are ok in my book. Even Gephardt would be an improvement on Bush.

[bowens43]

7. It's called politics.

we will all get along once the nominee is seleted....until then , well, you know...

[madrchsod]

8. it clark radio

tune in on the 9`s to get your new thread..clark radio

[Brian Sweat]

9. Why don't you start a thread about it?

Oh, nevermind.

[maggrwaggr]

10. what bothers me is nobody wants to debate, just attack

the posters for even QUESTIONING anyone.

Okay, this is for the clark supporters anyway. They're just all over you like a swarm of bees if you so much as question the man.

It's like if you're not 100% for Clark, you're an agent of Karl Rove and you're equated with Hannity, Limpballs, et al

Let's debate, and even argue, but just to attack somebody in this condescending patronizing and accusatory way is an anethema (sic?) to this forum

[WillyBrandt]

11. You can't be serious

Clark supporters can (or should) deal with accusations that Clark is too vague or has taken political missteps or that his particular positions are wrong.

What we find totally intolerable is are the claims that:

(1) He is really a Republican
(2) He is a PNACer, because he said that while he thought that Perle, et al are totally wrong, he could deal with them as colleagues
(3) He is a war criminal
(4) He is liked only because he is a General
(5) Because he is a General, he is a warmonger along the lines of Feith et al (this really boils my blood. I know a lot of good, liberal patriots in the military.)
(6) Because RIGHT AFTER Saddam fell he wrote something positive, that invalidates the far greater criticism he made of the war. (A LOT of anti-war people thought that, after Saddam's fall, "This was a bad idea, but Saddam's fall is good--perhaps a sliver of good can come out of this." But that cannot satisfy the righteousness of the rabid.)
(7) Because that lunatic anti-Democratic Clinton-hater Alistair Cockburn of Counterpunch wrote an article about him, he must be Satan's spawn
(8) He doesn't count as a "real" Democrat
(9) He is a DLC plant, and Clark supporters a mindless lemmings following Al From.

These are all just the sheerest nonsense. Clark supporters get so angry because of the sheer mindlessness of the smears above. We are angry because so many on this board confuse repetition with veracity: Clark is a progressive Democrat who fought about as just and multi-lateral a war as you could fight. But instead we have the drumbeat of "War Criminal" against a good man who can whoop Bush.

I like Clark as an individual, I like his chances of crushing Bush Jr, I like his writings and his speeches, and--the loony bin that is DU aside--I like the possibility that he will help expand and grow the Democratic party.

I like the fact that both grassroots--don't kid yourself, he DOES have real grassroots support--AND the Democratic Establishment like the guy. I wanted a united party, not one damaged by schism--or smear and slander and stupidity coming from the inside out.

[disgruntella]

16. Yeah, what he said.

If a Democratic candidate you supported got slammed with all 9 accusations listed above within 24 hours of announcing his candidacy (mostly based on single sources, quotes taken out of context, or just plain BS)... you might find yourself getting a bit impatient and rude.

I don't support Clark exclusively (I also like Kerry, and have some interest in Dean), but I don't like to see a potential Democratic candidate attacked, and the shitstorm of accusations by other "Democrats" was NOT initiated by Clark supporters.

Yes, there are valid criticisms of Clark in and among the threads, and yes, some Clark supporters are a bit much, but others respond to the criticism with different perspectives, corrections to misinformation, and other constructive types of posts.

I hope things will settle down soon. (They will for me, anyway.)

[sweetheart]

12. 11 september happened

again.

I have not posted in a while... the joint i smoke for peace out of 11 september takes a few days to smoke... In it i hope all the ill-will is burned up to goodwill, and it is a heavy smoke, as indeed, the wind of goodwill is rather still these days.

A dude big guy started a nasy divisive thread on this site a few days back on how people should now speak depending on where they post from... and other nationalist crap.... DU is indeed underground... and goodwill is underground over and again.

To converse with goodwill ( for my own self ) involved stacking heavy stones the past few days in nature... no internet, no wires. Death is the advisor when it gets thick. What if we're protesters in berlin in 1933... best to get to a safe hostel before the shooting war, yes? The corporatist criminals in the white house are going to take it to a fight... and then.... everyone loses. When elephants fight, mice find safe refuge.

America is going down... that is the truth, with the pilot of down'ness at the helm, the country could not be better destroyed... and some mice smoke some herb and claim things ain't so bad... and maybe them's lucky mice... but that don't change the upcoming standoff... as military force will not win this next war that they started that war of state terror... no sireee.. no.

[opihimoimoi]

13. The DU is growing and becoming more mature and strengthened.

The freeps who come here to divide us are trying but failing.

In the meantime the board is a prime example for lurkers to see the Pub Pysops in action. Its an education for the uninitiated.

Its good in a way.

[Pepperbelly]

14. Send lawyers, guns, and money ...

The shit has hit the fan.

[janekat]

15. I rarely see anything about "REAL" issues/policies on here n/t